| Subject: |
Topic, please |
| From: |
jmath669642reng@--------) |
| Date: |
Fri, 2 Apr 1999 09:59:53 -0500 (EST) |
|
Since there are so many of you who wish to speak on the topic of the
current strife over an older section of the Empire, why don't you create
a new list for Current Events similar to the Back Alley, where these
kinds of topics can be discussed with your NR friends. Post the new
list on line and appoint a moderator , as necessary, and off you go. I
would be a subscriber to such, but primarily as a military historian the
current events do not interest me as much as some of the wonders of the
ancient world, such as the road cut into the cliffs along the Danube
River. Apparently the chisel marks are still visible on that project,
and I have had some recent experience with stone work so I know the work
entailed.
Marcus Minucius Audens
Fair Winds and Following Seas!!!
|
| Subject: |
Re: Macedonia |
| From: |
"RMerullo" rmerullo@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 2 Apr 1999 09:54:56 -0500 |
|
Salvete Marce Martiane et alii
Thanks for that interesting excerpt from L Aemilius Paullus.
I think that it would be very relevant as an answer to anyone who were to
step forward and say "If I were NATO's supreme commander in Europe, I could
teach those Serbs a thing or two in short order! I'd wipe out their forces
in one hour..." et cetera et cetera. Paullus' comments were aimed at
backseat-driver types who were boasting of their military knowledge, without
actually having to do anything.
Now, neither Asiaticus, nor our esteemed Consuls nor anyone else whom I've
seen in this forum has engaged in this sort of irritating backseat-driving
about Kosovo/NATO. Some of us (well, I for one) expressed an opinion that
NATO should not have undertaken military action in Yugoslavia. That's
another thing entirely.
By all means, if someone here steps forward and declares himself/herself
generalissimus, let's call their bluff. Thus far, no such one has stepped
forward.
Valete
Gaius Marius Merullus
-----Original Message-----
From: Gail and Thomas Gangale <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=123166234108158153184218249036129208" >gangale@--------</a>
To: <a href="mailto:novaroma@--------" >novaroma@--------</a> <a href="mailto:novaroma@--------" >novaroma@--------</a>
Date: Thursday, April 01, 1999 10:59 PM
Subject: [novaroma] Macedonia
>From: Gail and Thomas Gangale <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=123166234108158153184218249036129208" >gangale@--------</a>
>
>Salvete, omnes.
>
>I thank Macedonius, Asiaticus, Merullus, and our esteemed consuls for their
>remarks today.
>
>Vale, Gangalius
>
>***************
>
>In all the taverns and even -- heaven help us! -- at dinner parties, there
>confine his loquacity to such topics; I should like him to know that I
>shall be quite satisfied with the advice I receive in the camp.
>
> -- Lucius Aemilius Paullus, Consul
> II Kal Aprilis DLXXXVI A.U.C. (31 March 168 B.C.E.)
|
| Subject: |
Re: Macedonia |
| From: |
Gail and Thomas Gangale gangale@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 2 Apr 1999 08:26:27 -0800 (PST) |
|
Salve, Gaius Marius Merullus.
I believe that you have completely misunderstood my previous post. It has
now been agreed that the current situation in the Balkans is not to be
discussed on this list. But surely the history of Roma Antiqua's
experiences in the Balkans always has been a legitimate topic for
discussion, and has not suddenly ceased to be so. Meanwhile, you appear to
be arguing a case that has already been closed.
Vale.
Marcus Martianus Gangalius
At 09:54 AM 4/2/99 -0500, RMerullo wrote:
>From: "RMerullo" <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=194232192180194153138149203043129208071" >rmerullo@--------</a>
>
>Salvete Marce Martiane et alii
>
>Thanks for that interesting excerpt from L Aemilius Paullus.
>
>I think that it would be very relevant as an answer to anyone who were to
>step forward and say "If I were NATO's supreme commander in Europe, I could
>teach those Serbs a thing or two in short order! I'd wipe out their forces
>in one hour..." et cetera et cetera. Paullus' comments were aimed at
>backseat-driver types who were boasting of their military knowledge, without
>actually having to do anything.
>
>Now, neither Asiaticus, nor our esteemed Consuls nor anyone else whom I've
>seen in this forum has engaged in this sort of irritating backseat-driving
>about Kosovo/NATO. Some of us (well, I for one) expressed an opinion that
>NATO should not have undertaken military action in Yugoslavia. That's
>another thing entirely.
>
>By all means, if someone here steps forward and declares himself/herself
>generalissimus, let's call their bluff. Thus far, no such one has stepped
>forward.
>
>Valete
>
>Gaius Marius Merullus
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Gail and Thomas Gangale <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=123166234108158153184218249036129208" >gangale@--------</a>
>To: <a href="mailto:novaroma@--------" >novaroma@--------</a> <a href="mailto:novaroma@--------" >novaroma@--------</a>
>Date: Thursday, April 01, 1999 10:59 PM
>Subject: [novaroma] Macedonia
>
>
>>From: Gail and Thomas Gangale <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=123166234108158153184218249036129208" >gangale@--------</a>
>>
>>Salvete, omnes.
>>
>>I thank Macedonius, Asiaticus, Merullus, and our esteemed consuls for their
>>remarks today.
>>
>>Vale, Gangalius
>>
>>***************
>>
>>In all the taverns and even -- heaven help us! -- at dinner parties, there
>>confine his loquacity to such topics; I should like him to know that I
>>shall be quite satisfied with the advice I receive in the camp.
>>
>> -- Lucius Aemilius Paullus, Consul
>> II Kal Aprilis DLXXXVI A.U.C. (31 March 168 B.C.E.)
>
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Ideas on how we can improve ONElist?
><a href="http://www.onelist.com" target="_top" >http://www.onelist.com</a>
>Check out the Suggestion Box feature on our new web site
>
>
-------------
Tom and Gail Gangale
<a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=123166234108158153184218249036129208" >gangale@--------</a>
<a href="http://www.jps.net/gangale/homepage.htm" target="_top" >http://www.jps.net/gangale/homepage.htm</a>
Mars Society California
The Martian Time Web Site
The Martian Ministry of Culture
Bunny Hill (and Catsville Too)
The National Primary System
World GenWeb Calabria
|
| Subject: |
Re: Macedonia |
| From: |
Ira Adams iadams@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 2 Apr 1999 11:33:42 -0600 |
|
>From: Raz-------- <a hr--------/post/novaroma?prot--------D=194166216056078116169218163036129208" >raz--------@--------</a>
>
>Please, Quirites. Do not get me wrong. Please do not take this wrong.
>I thought it had been agreed that this topic would not be discussed on this
>list.
>While I talk on the events of the day, particularly when the concern Mars,
>Minerva and America, I am doing my best to not bring this set of events up on
>the Nova Roma List.
>Perhaps I am wrong about this. If so,... Well.... Carry on.
>
>C. Aelius Ericius
>Propraetor of California Provincia
>Pontiff
>paterfamilias gens Aelia.
While I don't think such an agreement was ever reached, I must point out
that there has been a lot more said about _whether_ we should talk about
this war here than there has been about the war itself. There seems to be
less interest in talking about it than there is interest in talking about
talking about it. THAT seems a tremendous waste of time. And dull.
And what could possibly be more relevant to Mars than the most direct and
traditional form of his worship -- making war.
I assert that as long as they are not disrupting public business,
citizens have the right to make speeches in the forum. If other citizens
find their speeches obnoxious or distasteful, they have the right to say
so, but the most effective way to silence such speech is to ignore it. As
others have pointed out before me, the [delete] key is always close at
hand.
L. Sergius Aust.
|
| Subject: |
Re: Let's talk about Peace for a minute, shall we? -G- |
| From: |
"Tinnekke Bebout" tinnekke@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 02 Apr 1999 11:16:06 PST |
|
Happy Birthday and Ave Prima Iunia Terrelina
L. Iunia Cypria
Get Your Private, Free Email at <a href="http://www.hotmail.com" target="_top" >http://www.hotmail.com</a>
|
| Subject: |
Mars |
| From: |
Gail and Thomas Gangale gangale@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 2 Apr 1999 11:20:24 -0800 (PST) |
|
Salve, Lucius Sergius Australicus.
Palladius:
"I do *recommend* though that the topic not be discussed here for the sake
of the unity of our nascent state."
Cincinnatus:
"Ita consentio."
Patricia Claudia:
"While I deplore any action that puts any of Nova Roma's Citizens in
danger, we MUST keep this list on-topic if it is to be a valuable
resource for our Citizens.
"The topic is anything to do with ancient Rome, or with our efforts to
recreate some of its best qualities within ourselves and our organization.
"If you cannot post on this topic, please direct your remarks to private
e-mail or to another forum. The Back Alley list is one such forum; there
are many other places online where you can comment on the events of the
day."
Surely these very clear statements by our Consuls and our List Domina could
not have escaped your notice!
>And what could possibly be more relevant to Mars than the most direct and
>traditional form of his worship -- making war.
>
There is a hymn called, "Onward Christian Soldiers", but this does certain
not mean that the Prince of Peace is a maker of war!
Unfortunately, this idea that the worship of Mars centered around the making
of war has become a very common misconception since the supression of Roman
Polytheism beginning in the 4th c. B.C.E. A detailed discussion of the
character of Mars and his cult can be found in the Temple of Mars.
Naturally, I defer to the Flamen Martialis on this topic.
Vale,
Marcus Martianus Gangale
-------------
Tom and Gail Gangale
<a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=123166234108158153184218249036129208" >gangale@--------</a>
<a href="http://www.jps.net/gangale/homepage.htm" target="_top" >http://www.jps.net/gangale/homepage.htm</a>
Mars Society California
The Martian Time Web Site
The Martian Ministry of Culture
Bunny Hill (and Catsville Too)
The National Primary System
World GenWeb Calabria
|
| Subject: |
Re: Hi,there |
| From: |
"Tinnekke Bebout" tinnekke@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 02 Apr 1999 11:26:21 PST |
|
Ave Lucius Metellus and welcome.
Lucina Iunia Cypria
Get Your Private, Free Email at <a href="http://www.hotmail.com" target="_top" >http://www.hotmail.com</a>
|
| Subject: |
Re: Ludi Romani |
| From: |
SFP55@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 2 Apr 1999 18:56:09 EST |
|
In a message dated 3/30/99 7:06:55 AM Pacific Standard Time,
<a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=194232192180194153138149203043129208071" >rmerullo@--------</a> writes:
>> As a 1st approach to the 1st part (online games), our citizens shall be
able to watch the progress of the games through a textual description (in a
chat
room) performed by our honourable citizen and friend Q. F. Maximus.>>
>>Question: how do we observe? Is there a url to which we should point our
browsers in order to read the textual description of the action? >>
Salvete
As the contributor to the lanista who will supply the fighters, I should
reply.
The pair will be fought using my Gladiator miniature game rules (Habet).
Two players will fight using miniatures, I'll call the action, and my friend
will type the description to all of Nova Roma who wishes to attend. The
action will take place at chat room,
<a href="http://venus.beseen.com/chat/rooms/d/439123/Login.html" target="_top" >http://venus.beseen.com/chat/rooms/d/439123/Login.html</a>
You will need to use your Nova Roma Tavern password to enter.
I expect some bugs at first, but I think it will go fine as the evening will
wear on.
Back to getting ready for Celebrate History.
Valete
Q. Fabius.
|
| Subject: |
Re: Mars |
| From: |
LSergAust@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 2 Apr 1999 20:20:44 EST |
|
>From: Gail and Thomas Gangale <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=123166234108158153184218249036129208" >gangale@--------</a>
>
[SNIP]
>
>>And what could possibly be more relevant to Mars than the most direct and
>>traditional form of his worship -- making war.
>>
>There is a hymn called, "Onward Christian Soldiers", but this does certain
>not mean that the Prince of Peace is a maker of war!
>
>Unfortunately, this idea that the worship of Mars centered around the making
>of war has become a very common misconception since the supression of Roman
>Polytheism beginning in the 4th c. B.C.E. A detailed discussion of the
>character of Mars and his cult can be found in the Temple of Mars.
>Naturally, I defer to the Flamen Martialis on this topic.
>
>Vale,
>
>Marcus Martianus Gangale
I learned this "misconception" from a variety of antique Romans who refer
to Mars as a god of war, and from modern authorities on Roman religion. I
am cognizent of the fact that he was originally associated with
agriculture and country life. As I recall, he has been asserted to have
originally been a god associated with mice! I will go back to your Temple
and look up what you have there. Gratii.
L. Sergius Aust.
|
| Subject: |
Re: Macedonia |
| From: |
"Nathan Hicks" moman@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 2 Apr 1999 20:28:02 -0500 |
|
>I thank Macedonius, Asiaticus, Merullus, and our esteemed consuls for their
>remarks today.
>
>Vale, Gangalius
>
>***************
>
>In all the taverns and even -- heaven help us! -- at dinner parties, there
>are strategists who take armies into Macedonia, who know where camps should
>be sited, which places should be held with garrisons; ...
I think the speaker's advice for conducting a campaign is very apt,
and I wish it had been heeded during the Korean, Vietnam, and
Gulf Wars. But the people of a nation will always complain about
their government, so long as it always gives them their own mind
in the great issues of policy.
So, every time their counsel is sought, doesn't it run in such a vein:
a matter wherein they advise with judgement and gravity, therein
they will be found lacking the resolution; or, wherein they show the
resolve, therein they won't have steered the impulse with adequate
deliberation and judgement. Democratic nations, in bowing to such
an infirm and inconstant monarch, breed within the populace, at best,
a kind of feckless and specious wisdom that spoils the fruits won by
the truly wise and the bolder of action--those cringing subjects who
must enact the whimsy of the sovereign People. For this reason, the
US should avoid war--not only in Yugoslavia, but also in whatever
other place a battle may be offered to our forces. Bring our soldiers
home, then; let them earn their college tuitions and pensions by
sitting in their barracks: a democracy has no skill for world leadership.
Furthermore, since war is of no consequence to the US and its army,
it can be no consequential matter for any discussions of the US. If we
Romans must be idle in our conversations, let's speak of other things...
like ships and shoes and sealing wax, cabbages and kings.
Rusticus, Mus Navifugiens
_
@ @=-=--===--______/
/96 ) ( )=----
=Y=-- __===-\_^\_=
////
'"'"'
(In-Action ASCII Portrait thanks to Maria Fimbria)
|
| Subject: |
Relevant to Nova Roma (was "Mars") |
| From: |
LSergAust@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 2 Apr 1999 20:20:42 EST |
|
Salve Marcus Martianus Gangale
Apparently what has escaped my notice has been a Senatus Consultum
Ultimum which has evidently been promulgated to authorize our magistrates
to act as dictators and to silence orderly discussions by citizens in the
public forum of Nova Roma. If you can direct me to where it is published,
I will hurry to read it.
Palladius stated a **recommendation.**
Cincinnatus concurred with Palladius' thinking.
AFTER I had already posted the message to which you respond, Patricia
Cassia (the only one of the three with any legal authority to act in this
matter) made a strong request for participants to restrict themselves to
topics she considers related to Nova Roma.
Some other citizens, you included, have made numerous posts on the topic
of _not_ discussing the topic in question. That the proponents of one
side of an issue are in agreement with one another hardly constitutes a
general agreement on the issue.
Absent the aforementioned Senatus Consultum Ultimum, the consuls have no
more say in this matter than you or I. Many citizens have posted cogent
comments on the opposite side of the issue. No matter. I will bow to the
request of the Quaestor responsible for this list, although I wish she
had been as vocal in stopping some other, much less appropriate goings on
here on other occasions.
Would also that our magistrates were exercising similar leadership in
arranging the establishment of the organs of government without which the
nation continues to be improperly governed. The comitiae which are
necessary for the passage of legislation and ordinances are still not
functioning. The tribes and centuries required for voting still don't
exist. Is there something I can do to facilitate this (I ask this at
large and not of you, Marcus Martianus).
Or is the Senate going to be the governing body of Nova Roma, with the
consuls as its enforcers? (And how could such a constitutional change be
made when there is no Comitia to approve it?)
I think it a topic relevant to Nova Roma that Nova Roma is not working as
it is supposed to. I do not seek to belittle those who have been active
in getting done those things that have been done, and I am certain that
they have been dealing with many obstacles and limitations. What can be
done to help them get it going?
Vale
L. Sergius Aust.
postscriptum: you might want to be careful about confusing a Cassia with
a Claudia ;-)
>From: Gail and Thomas Gangale <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=123166234108158153184218249036129208" >gangale@--------</a>
>
>Salve, Lucius Sergius Australicus.
>
>Palladius:
>"I do *recommend* though that the topic not be discussed here for the sake
>of the unity of our nascent state."
>
>Cincinnatus:
>"Ita consentio."
>
>Patricia Claudia:
>"While I deplore any action that puts any of Nova Roma's Citizens in
>danger, we MUST keep this list on-topic if it is to be a valuable
>resource for our Citizens.
>
>"The topic is anything to do with ancient Rome, or with our efforts to
>recreate some of its best qualities within ourselves and our organization.
>
>"If you cannot post on this topic, please direct your remarks to private
>e-mail or to another forum. The Back Alley list is one such forum; there
>are many other places online where you can comment on the events of the
>day."
>
>Surely these very clear statements by our Consuls and our List Domina could
>not have escaped your notice!
[SNIP]
|
