| Subject: |
Sodalitas |
| From: |
BenBorgo@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 23 Apr 1999 00:12:09 EDT |
|
Salve Romanii!!!
I was thinking about trying to organize a 'Sodalitas' for the study
and discussion of literature. It would of course encompass both the
literature of Ancient Rome and also that of Nova Roma. I figure this could be
a valuable part of Nova Roma in the future. Most of us probably read plenty
of Roman lit. and would be happy to open and participate in discussions
focused on the current work being enjoyed.The promotion of our own literature
may be a way to bring Nova Roma into the publics eye and would contribute
greatly to the advancement of our primarily electronic society. If there are
any interested parties, please contact me. I was thinking of creating a
website specifically for this purpose consisting of monthly reviews, poetry
and prose from NR's aspiring writers, a 'book of the month' which a group of
us could read and discuss......& the ideas are still coming. For now I'm
basically curious how many citizens might be interested in participating,
then I'll get down to the details. Hope to hear from you!
Respectfully yours,
Gnaeus Tarquinius Caesar
|
| Subject: |
Re: Having Fun? |
| From: |
BenBorgo@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 23 Apr 1999 00:17:02 EDT |
|
By the way, I'm still having fun:)........
I think.
Of course I am!!!
G. Tarquinius Caesar
|
| Subject: |
Literature Sodalist |
| From: |
jmath669642reng@--------) |
| Date: |
Fri, 23 Apr 1999 00:51:39 -0400 (EDT) |
|
I think it a great idea. All of your points are well made, and it would
not be covered by any existing area. I am not sure how I personnally
could be of assistance, as my interests and efforts are pretty much
taken up with Military Engineering and Cartography. However, should you
happen on Roman Literature from authors having written about Military or
Civil Engineering and Architechture, I may well be interested.
Marcus Minucius Audens
Fair Winds and Following Seas!!!
|
| Subject: |
Cries and shouts in my last postings... |
| From: |
"Antonio Grilo" <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=243232178003185091033082" >amg@--------</a> |
| Date: |
Fri, 23 Apr 1999 10:04:30 +0100 |
|
Salvete omnes
In two of my recent postings (about animal sacrifice and Comitia Populi)
some friends and other citizens interpreted my uppercase words (LIKE THIS)
to be shouts or cries. Nevertheless, this is not the correct interpretation.
I usually employ uppercase to give more relevance to certain parts of the
text and it serves simply as an underline. When I am shouting I usually add:
!!!!!!!!
=)
And can also show I'm angry like this: =|
(you can almost hear me saying GRRR!)
As for my last postings I was not angry with anybody. I apologize to those
who thought I was.
Valete
Antonius Gryllus Graecus
|
| Subject: |
The Egg of Columbus...or The Assemblies |
| From: |
"Antonio Grilo" amg@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 23 Apr 1999 10:28:40 +0100 |
|
Salvete omnes
I thought on the problem of our assemblies this evening, and I have a
solution that respects the Constitution.
The constitution says:
I.4
"This Constitution may be altered by law passed by one of the comitia; such
alterations to this Constitution must be ratified by a vote of two-thirds of
the entire Senate before it shall take effect."
Ok, it is the people, with the Senate's approval, who has the right to
change the Constitution. Until then, institutions must stick to the present
version of the Constitution. There is no way out. Any other solution is a
violation of the Constitution and will bring more long and aggressive
discussions to Nova Roma. Thus WE MUST IMPLEMENT (at least in a first stage
before any change to the Constitution os approved) the THREE COMITIAE:
IV.1
"The comitia populi is convened by either a Consul or Praetor Urbanis. Its
functions are to vote upon those laws that are be presented to it for
consideration by a Consul; elect the Curule Aediles and Quaestors;
participate in certain religious rites; ceremonially invest magistrates of
Quaestor rank or above with Imperium to formally ratify the magisterial
appointments of the Senate; and approve or disapprove the recommendations of
the Censors to elevate Plebian gentes to Patrician status. It shall be made
up of thirty tribes, the composition of which shall be determined by the
Censors, but shall be made up of all Citizens of Nova Roma, regardless of
class. Each tribe shall elect one of its members to speak for it in those
matters that shall be refered to the comitia populi; such speakers shall be
appointed for life."
IV.2
"The comitia centuriata is convened by a Consul. Its functions are to vote
upon those laws that are presented to it for consideration by a Consul;
elect Consuls, Praetores Urbanii, and Censors; and act as a court of final
appeal in cases of civil and criminal law. It shall be made up of one
hundred and eighteen centuries, the composition of which shall be determined
by the Censors, but shall be made up of all Citizens of Nova Roma,
regardless of class. Each century shall elect one of its members to speak
for it in those matters that shall be refered to the comitia centuriata;
such speakers shall be appointed until the comitia is released by a Consul."
IV.3
"The comitia plebis is convened by a Tribune of the Plebs. Its functions are
to vote upon those laws that are presented to it for consideration by a
Tribune of the Plebs; elect Tribunes of the Plebs and Plebian Aediles; and
hear trials of civil and criminal cases according to the leges Novae Romae,
as administered by the Quaestors. It shall be made up of thirty five tribes,
the composition of which shall be determined by the Censors, but which shall
be made up exclusively of all Citizens from the Plebian class. Each tribe
shall elect one of its members to speak for it in those matters that shall
be refered to the comitia plebis; such speakers shall be appointed until the
comitia is released by a Tribune of the Plebs."
I don't see why this system shouldn't work as is written. Each citizen will
have 2 (if patrician) or 3 (if plebeian) voting keys.
The only issue is how to determine the composition of Tribes and Centuries,
and to perform ellection of speakers... BUT ISN'T THAT UP TO THE CENSORS?
Paraphrasing someone: Aren't they the ellected magistrates of Nova Roma?
Valete omnes
Antonius Gryllus Graecus
Aedilis Plebis et Propraetor Provinciae Lusitaniae
|
| Subject: |
Re: The Egg of Columbus...or The Assemblies |
| From: |
Lucius Cornelius Sulla alexious@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 23 Apr 1999 03:15:23 -0700 |
|
Salvete Omnes.
I have been speaking to the Praetor Graecus and we both have some thoughts in
regards to the Comitea and the Centuries.
The Comitea: 30 tribes, 16 Patrician Tribes and 14 Plebeian Tribes. The reason
we both decided that ratio is because if the Tribes were mixed why do we need
the Tribune of the Plebs. This way we weight the assembly gently, yet still
have the need for a Tribune of the Plebs. The Censors would draw lots for the
appropriate Tribes. Regardless of class. Since we have the Class division,
even symbolically, lets at least use it in conjunction with Ancient Rome. Not
to the extreme ancient Rome did, but modified realistically, as we have done in
other areas of Nova Roma.
Second: The Centuries. We have 30 Patrician Gens. According to the Citizens
list we have 84 Plebeian Gens (keep in mind it's 3 am I hope I didn't
miscount). That equals 114 Gens total. According to the Constitution, we need
118 Centuries. Why doesn't each Gens equal one Century? That would make the
job of the Censors easier, in the sense that they wont have to do so much extra
work.
I hope this is satisfactory, Please e-mail Graecus or myself in regards to
this. Thank you Citizens!
Lucius Cornelius Sulla
Praetor Urbanus
Antonio Grilo wrote:
> From: "Antonio Grilo" <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=243232178003185091033082" >amg@--------</a>
>
> Salvete omnes
>
> I thought on the problem of our assemblies this evening, and I have a
> solution that respects the Constitution.
> The constitution says:
>
> I.4
> "This Constitution may be altered by law passed by one of the comitia; such
> alterations to this Constitution must be ratified by a vote of two-thirds of
> the entire Senate before it shall take effect."
>
> Ok, it is the people, with the Senate's approval, who has the right to
> change the Constitution. Until then, institutions must stick to the present
> version of the Constitution. There is no way out. Any other solution is a
> violation of the Constitution and will bring more long and aggressive
> discussions to Nova Roma. Thus WE MUST IMPLEMENT (at least in a first stage
> before any change to the Constitution os approved) the THREE COMITIAE:
>
> IV.1
> "The comitia populi is convened by either a Consul or Praetor Urbanis. Its
> functions are to vote upon those laws that are be presented to it for
> consideration by a Consul; elect the Curule Aediles and Quaestors;
> participate in certain religious rites; ceremonially invest magistrates of
> Quaestor rank or above with Imperium to formally ratify the magisterial
> appointments of the Senate; and approve or disapprove the recommendations of
> the Censors to elevate Plebian gentes to Patrician status. It shall be made
> up of thirty tribes, the composition of which shall be determined by the
> Censors, but shall be made up of all Citizens of Nova Roma, regardless of
> class. Each tribe shall elect one of its members to speak for it in those
> matters that shall be refered to the comitia populi; such speakers shall be
> appointed for life."
>
> IV.2
> "The comitia centuriata is convened by a Consul. Its functions are to vote
> upon those laws that are presented to it for consideration by a Consul;
> elect Consuls, Praetores Urbanii, and Censors; and act as a court of final
> appeal in cases of civil and criminal law. It shall be made up of one
> hundred and eighteen centuries, the composition of which shall be determined
> by the Censors, but shall be made up of all Citizens of Nova Roma,
> regardless of class. Each century shall elect one of its members to speak
> for it in those matters that shall be refered to the comitia centuriata;
> such speakers shall be appointed until the comitia is released by a Consul."
>
> IV.3
> "The comitia plebis is convened by a Tribune of the Plebs. Its functions are
> to vote upon those laws that are presented to it for consideration by a
> Tribune of the Plebs; elect Tribunes of the Plebs and Plebian Aediles; and
> hear trials of civil and criminal cases according to the leges Novae Romae,
> as administered by the Quaestors. It shall be made up of thirty five tribes,
> the composition of which shall be determined by the Censors, but which shall
> be made up exclusively of all Citizens from the Plebian class. Each tribe
> shall elect one of its members to speak for it in those matters that shall
> be refered to the comitia plebis; such speakers shall be appointed until the
> comitia is released by a Tribune of the Plebs."
>
> I don't see why this system shouldn't work as is written. Each citizen will
> have 2 (if patrician) or 3 (if plebeian) voting keys.
> The only issue is how to determine the composition of Tribes and Centuries,
> and to perform ellection of speakers... BUT ISN'T THAT UP TO THE CENSORS?
> Paraphrasing someone: Aren't they the ellected magistrates of Nova Roma?
>
> Valete omnes
>
> Antonius Gryllus Graecus
> Aedilis Plebis et Propraetor Provinciae Lusitaniae
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Tired of empty chat rooms and out of date bulletin boards?
> <a href="http://www.ONElist.com" target="_top" >http://www.ONElist.com</a>
> ONElist: Making the Internet Intimate
|
| Subject: |
Re: co-founders |
| From: |
Dexippus@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 23 Apr 1999 09:52:19 EDT |
|
In a message dated 4/22/99 5:36:10 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
<a --------="/post/novaroma?protectID=189176234185056182213038203004129208071" >tinnekke@--------</a> writes:
<< Unfortunately, I don't think anyone else except maybe our honored
Augur is. I know I'm not. I'm sick to death of the bickering. >>
I'm sick of the bickering too...but hey, if you can't beat 'em...join 'em!
--Dexippus
Bickering Queen
|
| Subject: |
Re: Having Fun? |
| From: |
"RMerullo" rmerullo@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 23 Apr 1999 10:05:47 -0400 |
|
Salvete Dexippe et alii
>From: <--------ef="/post/nov----------------otectID=132056131009152219130232203140129208071" >Dexippus@--------</--------;
>
But we have had almost as many (if not more) civil wars here
>than Rome ever did during her 1200 year reign.
>
>Perhaps if we focused more on the Religio and not the politics (hint hint)
we
>would be better off!
Discussion of religion can be even more passionate and lead to just as much
polemics (think about some of the recent threads). But so what? So what if
we disagree about politics, religion and everything else that we discuss?
As long as we are all civil and try to be open to each other's arguments,
where is the harm?
The only posts that generally don't touch off debate are trivial and
humorous ones. For instance, noone flamed me for posting about a B horror
movie that was going to be on television. Because who cares? The movie and
the post were silly distractions, nothing more.
So, probably the only sure way to avoid debates that can heat up would be to
post only humor and trivia.
>
>--Dexippus
>
Valete
Gaius Marius Merullus
|
| Subject: |
Re: Sodalitas |
| From: |
"RMerullo" rmerullo@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 23 Apr 1999 12:02:45 -0400 |
|
Salvete Gnaee Tarquini et alii
>From: <--------ef="/post/nov----------------otectID=023056234037193209048149203140129208071" >BenBorgo@--------</--------;
>
> I was thinking about trying to organize a 'Sodalitas' for the
study
>and discussion of literature.
Excellent idea!
It would of course encompass both the
>literature of Ancient Rome and also that of Nova Roma. I figure this could
be
>a valuable part of Nova Roma in the future. Most of us probably read plenty
>of Roman lit. and would be happy to open and participate in discussions
>focused on the current work being enjoyed.--deletion--
>any interested parties, please contact me. I was thinking of creating a
>website specifically for this purpose consisting of monthly reviews, poetry
>and prose from NR's aspiring writers, a 'book of the month' which a group
of
>us could read and discuss......& the ideas are still coming---Hope to hear
from you!
I don't write much, but I do have a couple of Latin poems somewhere that I
wrote years ago. That was actually the last creative writing I did.
I guess that if I could find these poems, I wouldn't know whether to submit
them to the literature sodalitas, to the Eagle or to both. Do you think
that the two could cooperate somehow?
Anyway, I think that I would enjoy reading and discussing classical stuff;
I was planning to read and discuss De Gallico Bello with other Novoromani,
as soon as I finish translating the constitution. Does that sound like
something that you would like to do Gnaee Tarquini? Anyone else? I know
that Marcus Minucius Audens expressed interest.
>
> Respectfully yours,
> Gnaeus Tarquinius Caesar
>
Valete
Gaius Marius Merullus
|
| Subject: |
Re: The Egg of Columbus...or The Assemblies |
| From: |
"RMerullo" rmerullo@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 23 Apr 1999 12:36:15 -0400 |
|
Salvete Luci Corneli et alii
First off, let me explain why I am responding in the forum rather than
direct e-mail, despite your explicit request: the comitia, the constiution
are public matters. Ideas on their implementation have relevance for all of
us, and I think that it's beneficial to get input from other Novoromani.
Furthermore, I have no intention and see no need to say anything personal in
regard to your proposal; if, having read my response, you do think that it
is personal and inappropriate for public posting, please let me know. But
bear in mind that we recently have had passionate calls to discuss nothing
but this very topic in public, and realize that, well, one has to steer a
middle course somehow...
>From: Lucius Corn--------s Sulla <a hr--------/post/novaroma?prot--------D=243128192154082190130232203077129208071" >al--------us@--------</a>
>
>I have been speaking to the Praetor Graecus and we both have some thoughts
in
>regards to the Comitea and the Centuries.
Thank you for sharing this with us, Praetores.
>
>The Comitea: 30 tribes, 16 Patrician Tribes and 14 Plebeian Tribes. The
reason
>we both decided that ratio is because if the Tribes were mixed why do we
need
>the Tribune of the Plebs.
That makes sense to me. But is it desirable to weight any of the assemblies
based on class, in light of the desire of some citizens to do away with
classes altogether? Wouldn't weighting any of the assemblies strengthen the
anti-class sentiment of those citizens?
This way we weight the assembly gently, yet still
>have the need for a Tribune of the Plebs. The Censors would draw lots for
the
>appropriate Tribes. Regardless of class.
Do you or Graecus have any specific ideas on how the censors would draw
lots? Do you think that a spreadsheet would be used, as has been mentioned
before?
--deletion--
>
>Second: The Centuries. We have 30 Patrician Gens. According to the
Citizens
>list we have 84 Plebeian Gens (keep in mind it's 3 am I hope I didn't
>miscount). That equals 114 Gens total. According to the Constitution, we
need
>118 Centuries. Why doesn't each Gens equal one Century? That would make
the
>job of the Censors easier, in the sense that they wont have to do so much
extra
>work.
That sounds like it would work. One thing to keep in mind is that
perfection in this endeavor, like any other, may be impossible to achieve.
If we implement assemblies in the way that you propose and aspects of them
prove to be somehow inadequate (not a prediction, just hypothetical),
modifications can be made, by putting leges before the Senate and Comitia.
>
>I hope this is satisfactory, Please e-mail Graecus or myself in regards to
>this. Thank you Citizens!
I like these ideas and hope that my public response is not offensive.
>
>Lucius Cornelius Sulla
>Praetor Urbanus
>
>Antonio Grilo wrote:
>
>> From: "Antonio Grilo" <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=243232178003185091033082" >amg@--------</a>
>>
>> Antonius Gryllus Graecus
>> Aedilis Plebis et Propraetor Provinciae Lusitaniae
>>
Valete
Gaius Marius Merullus
|
| Subject: |
Re: Having Fun? |
| From: |
Dexippus@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 23 Apr 1999 13:09:09 EDT |
|
In a message dated 4/23/99 10:12:43 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
<a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=194232192180194153138149203043129208071" >rmerullo@--------</a> writes:
<< Discussion of religion can be even more passionate and lead to just as much
polemics (think about some of the recent threads). But so what? So what if
we disagree about politics, religion and everything else that we discuss?
As long as we are all civil and try to be open to each other's arguments,
where is the harm?
>>
My point only was in saying that the past year has focused more so on
politics and governement and not the Religio. And from a spiritual
perspective, I wouldn't be surprised if it was the Gods telling us to pay
more attention to them.
But hey, what do I know...I'm just the Augur.
--Dexippus
P.S. Keep up the posts on the B-movies! I love 'em!
|
| Subject: |
Re: The Egg of Columbus...or The Assemblies |
| From: |
"Antonio Grilo" amg@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 23 Apr 1999 18:41:32 +0100 |
|
Salve Merulle et alii
>>The Comitea: 30 tribes, 16 Patrician Tribes and 14 Plebeian Tribes. The
>reason
>>we both decided that ratio is because if the Tribes were mixed why do we
>need
>>the Tribune of the Plebs.
>
>That makes sense to me. But is it desirable to weight any of the
assemblies
>based on class, in light of the desire of some citizens to do away with
>classes altogether? Wouldn't weighting any of the assemblies strengthen
the
>anti-class sentiment of those citizens?
Well, if there are citizens that want do do away with classes, they should
continue defending their position, and there is plenty of space todo so. Our
assemblies will be working in order to further adapt NR government and law,
according to the wishes of the people and the approval of the Senate. But
first we need assemblies...
My point is that any solution for the assemblies that does not follow the
Constitution will be defended by the supporters, but easily defeated by the
others, as these can claim (with reason) that the solution is a violation of
the Constitution. So we will be eternally discussing how to set-up the
assemblies, and there shall be no assemblies formed.
My proposal and Sulla's (and we are also waiting for our most honourable
Tribunus Plebis's opinion) fits within the Constitution (well, if you are
able to see any violation, please advise us). The Constitution defines
Classes, and so, we use Classes according to the Constitution.
After these assemblies are set-up, there can be more debate, and maybe we
approve a change to the Constitution. But first, before changing the
Constitution, we need lets say a Constitutional 'raw' assembly, where the
people can measures, laws, and changes.
Hope this answers...
Valete
Antonius Gryllus Graecus
Aedilis et Propraetor
|
| Subject: |
Sodalitas |
| From: |
"Martins-Esteves" esteves@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 23 Apr 1999 15:16:38 -0300 |
|
Ave Gai Mari amice
Ave Gnaee Tarquini
Avete Quirites
Cordial greetings to all and specially to some friends, like Merullus and
Graecus, who hopefully will remember me after these months of distance. I
am happy to be back from Pontus and already excited ( not to say amused )
with the everlasting political discussions.
The ground of this message was the great idea brought by Gnaeus Tarquinius:
>From: <--------ef="/post/nov----------------otectID=023056234037193209048149203140129208071" >BenBorgo@--------</--------;
> I was thinking about trying to organize a 'Sodalitas' for the
study
>and discussion of literature.
I don't even know if I am still in the list of gentes, as I am not able to
get to NR site and check it up, but anyway I would like to express my humble
support to this Sodalitas. I valuate this idea as one of the most fertile I
have seen on this list.
As to the discussion of De Bello Gallico, I think it would be a great
beginning, for:
primo: it would attract the attention of the many cives who are
interested in military issues and/or Roman history;
secundo: as known, it is written grosso modo in a simple language (both
grammar and vocabulary), and most passages are easily understood by any
person, who just started to learn latin. And besides, there are lots of very
accessible introductory books in the main european languages, focusing DBG's
vocabulary and grammar.
Valete
Titus Horatius Atticus
|
| Subject: |
Diem Perdidi |
| From: |
Gail and Thomas Gangale gangale@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 23 Apr 1999 22:37:58 -0700 (PDT) |
|
Salve Patricia Cassia, et alii.
Well said, Patricia!
Every day, let us pause to reflect on the words of Imperator Titus, who
having passed an entire day without performing a good deed, is reported to
have said, "Diem perdidi."
"I have lost a day."
Vale,
Marcus Martianus Gangalius
At 09:32 PM 4/22/99 -0000, jane wrote:
>From: -------- <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=197063113185056135042082190036" >p--------@--------</a>
>
>It sometimes seems that those who put their time and effort into our
>micronation earn nothing but carping for their efforts. This atmosphere
>has probably already scared off many who might otherwise have become
>knowledgable and thoughtful leaders.
>
>Before you post something critical of another Nova Roman, ask yourself,
>"Have I done something today that furthers Nova Roma's interests in a
>positive way?"
>
>If the answer is no, volunteer to help with the Web site, write a piece
>for the Eagle, publicize Nova Roma at your local college or elsewhere on
>the Web, pray to the Gods of Rome if that is consistent with your
>beliefs, or post something supportive of those who are working to make
>our micronation succeed.
>
>If you notice a problem, don't whine about it - offer a solution.
>
>Patricia Cassia
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>New hobbies? New curiosities? New enthusiasms?
><a href="http://www.ONElist.com" target="_top" >http://www.ONElist.com</a>
>Sign up for a new e-mail list today!
>
>
-------------
Tom and Gail Gangale
<a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=123166234108158153184218249036129208" >gangale@--------</a>
<a href="http://www.jps.net/gangale/homepage.htm" target="_top" >http://www.jps.net/gangale/homepage.htm</a>
Mars Society California
The Martian Time Web Site
The Martian Ministry of Culture
Bunny Hill (and Catsville Too)
The National Primary System
World GenWeb Calabria
|
| Subject: |
Re: The Egg of Columbus...or The Assemblies |
| From: |
Masterofhistory masterofhistory@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 23 Apr 1999 14:17:46 -0700 (PDT) |
|
Salvete Nova Roma,
Last week I noted that I was forwarding the proposal
for the assemblies to the Senate. To my knowledge, it
is there and not in anyway frozen. Along with it went
several ideas raised by the citizens who took the time
to constructively respond.
This in no way halts Assembly discussion on this, the
main list, however I suggested that those interested
take the discussion to the Concilium Plebis or another
private channel due to the unsavory topics and
accusations clogging the list as of late. I make it
an habit in these instances to keep my eyes on the
task at hand while people introduce inflammatory
topics aimed at derailing progress, so our work has
continued unchecked. Still, I'd like to thank the
Plebeian Aedile and many others whose calls for more
discussion restored some purpose back to the list.
I'll keep all of you posted on the work that is
beginning on the assemblies.
Out here in the list now is yet another plan for the
major assembly of Nova Roma. Rather than working
together on this most important issue, the Praetor
Urbanus just went ahead and drew up yet another
version of the Comitia Populi Tributa to add to the
pile of material on the subject. If something
constructive had been proposed, I would have welcomed
it, as it stands now this is basically another attempt
by the Praetor at personal aggrandizement.
As my time is short now, I'll be brief. 1)His plan for
the major Assembly weighs the votes in favor of the
Patrician Order. 2)Equal or near-equal voting
strength for the Patricians and the Plebeians has no
bearing on whether or not there should be a Tribune of
the Plebeians - the strategy of 'if you seek equal
voting strength - you lose the Tribunate' does not
wash. It is merely an attempt by this Praetor to
eliminate a constitutional safeguard. 3)My proposal
for the Assembly is an organic one, that is, it can
grow and expand to the point where it fits into the
Constitution securely while at the same time allowing
Nova Roma room to expand and make any necessary
adjustments that might be required. This latest
proposal, while trying to hammer out the 'chapter and
verse' routine, actually is calling for rewriting the
Constitution. It is inflexible and if implamented
will likely reduce the Comitia Populi Tributa to a
quagmire.
===
Respectfully,
Avidius Tullius Callidus
Paterfamilias, gens Tullia
Tribune of the People
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| Subject: |
Great Lakes Provincial activity |
| From: |
dean6886@--------) |
| Date: |
Fri, 23 Apr 1999 16:23:50 -0500 (CDT) |
|
Salvete,
I am happy to see that a couple of people have
written back about the Great Lakes Province. At least there is some
interest. I do know that we all have the problem with being great
distances for the most part with each other and even when not often have
very different views on how each of us would like to participate in Nova
Roma ( not everyone is in our micronation for reenactment or religion,
etc. etc.).
Well, here is a suggestion and I would like your help
(anyone???)::
First, I would like to establish a list of all area pagan,
historical, or otherwise promising newsletters/papers, publications,
literature, and larger local groups, pagan friendly bookstores, pagan
festivals, websights, etc. and ALL relevent CONTACT information that we
can keep for our own records/database.
Secondly, after we start such a list I would like to discuss the
possibilities and best use of advertisement either with flyer inserts or
an advertisement using a copy of our tri-fold flyer in any of these
publications.
Third, when we have a list of other pagan/historical/reenactment
or other groups and festivals or organizations we will have the ability
as we wish later in time to do things such as organize a Nova Roma
presence at a festival or contact a group to help co-sponsor an event or
what have you. It would be nice to establish such a list for further
reference in the future.
Granted, advertisement is expensive!!! One step at a time though
I believe in time we can build a strong, healthy, and large community
base here in the midwest that would cover a wide range of interests. Not
to just wastefully spend money on a randomly selected advertisement but
to make the best use of any existing funds and plan a little. Perhaps at
some point our Nova Roma government could alot us some funds out of our
micronational budget after a serious proposal and of course I will
contribute to this personally as my funds allow.. Perhaps this is what
we should think of doing micronationally (internationally). Instead of
adding just 100-300 hundred citizens in a given year we can double or
triple that and actually establish vibrant community in Nova Roma at a
more local level (not relying solely on the internet for everything).
You can help in forwarding this sort of info to me through
private e-mail or at <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=132233014009175132169158203102129208071" >Domitian@--------</a>
Some publications may overlap certain provincia or have a more
national or international outreach. I would be happy to volunteer my
time in organizing such information as it comes in and then forwarding
the complete? list to the consuls, senate, and censors along with lists
of bookstores, websights,etc.etc---A roloedex. Do I need official
approval to volunteer in this way at the national level??? Nova Roma can
decide what to do with this information if anything at all at any time
in the future in our further planning.
I think everyone sees the possibilities that go with this. I
would also ad that some advertisement is cheaper and more effective than
other forms and we should have people later on getting involved in
discussing this after we get this informational base.
Just giving my thoughts on how we can jumpstart Nova Roma into
something more than what it is already.
Gaius Drusus Domitianus
|
| Subject: |
Re: Sodalitas |
| From: |
dean6886@--------) |
| Date: |
Fri, 23 Apr 1999 16:40:57 -0500 (CDT) |
|
Yup, count me in as interested in this one. Book of the month--- how
about starting out with some of the literature already online archived
away to go through first???
Gaius Drusus Domitianus
|
| Subject: |
Re: Having Fun? |
| From: |
"Tinnekke Bebout" tinnekke@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 23 Apr 1999 15:13:23 PDT |
|
Salve
I meant that I wanted to do stuff with the others in the midwest as
far as maybe meet them and stuff like thos eeast coast people do.
I've volunteered to help with web page stuff other than that My New
Job... (in caps cuz I'm so excited!) is keeping me pretty busy.
Vale
Cypria
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| Subject: |
Re: Having Fun? |
| From: |
"Lucius" vergil@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 23 Apr 1999 18:27:54 -0400 |
|
Ave et Salvete
>
>....other than that My New Job... (in caps cuz I'm so excited!) is keeping
>me pretty busy.
>
>Vale, Cypria
>
Congratulations on your job! I wish you continued good fortune.
Vale, L Equitius
|
| Subject: |
Re: Sodalitas |
| From: |
"Lucius" vergil@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 23 Apr 1999 18:28:07 -0400 |
|
Salvete Romani
>
> I was thinking about trying to organize a 'Sodalitas' for the
study
>and discussion of literature. It would of course encompass both the
>literature of Ancient Rome and also that of Nova Roma.<SNIP> . For now I'm
>basically curious how many citizens might be interested in participating,
>then I'll get down to the details. Hope to hear from you!
>
> Respectfully yours,Gnaeus Tarquinius Caesar
Yes, this is a great idea.
BTW, Curule Aedile M Martianus has done a wonderful job on the Camenaeum
<a href="http://www.novaroma.org/camenaeum/index.html" target="_top" >http://www.novaroma.org/camenaeum/index.html</a>
Please check it out as a fine source of literature.
I have been reading Ovid's Fasti ,again, to gain a better understanding of
Roman tradition and religion. I hope to turn to the Metamorphoses soon.
Valete, L Equitius
|
| Subject: |
Re: Having Fun? |
| From: |
"Tinnekke Bebout" tinnekke@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 23 Apr 1999 19:57:45 PDT |
|
Salve
There's a difference between debate and bickering. Debating is a
discussion, no matter how heated, of issues and ideas. Bickering is a
pointless petty bout of name calling and character assassination
which turns the stomach. Frankly the bickering of the past week or so
has burnt me out.
Cypria
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| Subject: |
Re: Having Fun? |
| From: |
"Tinnekke Bebout" tinnekke@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 23 Apr 1999 20:04:23 PDT |
|
>From: "Lucius" <a hr--------/post/novaroma?prot--------D=081056091108082153015038190036129" >v--------l@--------</a>
>
>Ave et Salvete
>Congratulations on your job! I wish you continued good fortune.
>
>Vale, L Equitius
Salve
Thank you :) I'm finally working again in my field at a schedule that
accounts in my personal life and still pays well. :) I love the
vagaries of web design.
Vale
Cypria
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| Subject: |
Address |
| From: |
jmath669642reng@--------) |
| Date: |
Fri, 23 Apr 1999 23:17:12 -0400 (EDT) |
|
Salve, Senator Flavia Claudia;
If you will send me your mailing address again, I will send you the
black line drawings I promised that go with the Roman Road articles.
These drawings are small enough to go almost anywhere in the magazine
and makes the verbage very clear.
I don't remember if I told you or not (if I didn't I do apologize) about
the advertisement on the back of the Eagle. It is quite striking and
eye catching. If I ever get a web site put up, I would like to use it
there as well, with your agreement of course.
Vale, Senator Flavia Claudia;
Very Respectfully;
Marcus Mincius Audens
Fair Winds and Following Seas!!!
|
| Subject: |
Re: Sodalitas |
| From: |
BenBorgo@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 23 Apr 1999 23:30:17 EDT |
|
Salve Romanii!!!
All right!!! This is great, there's already a few of us interested,
and we're ready to begin! Just so you all are aware, the website for the
literature Sodalitas is a little ways off (I'm giving myself a deadline of
July the first.) However I'm more than willing to begin the discussion groups
before that if everyone else wants to, and what better place to start than De
Gallico Bello! It (as Atticus said) embraces several major fields of
interest, military,general history, and the fact that it is an extremely
eloquent peice of Ancient Roman prose, that is written rather simplisticly
(grammatically speaking.) The book is also available in its entire length to
download from the Camenaeum section of the Nova Roma homepage, which makes it
easily accessable to any citizens who wish to participate. Do we want to set
a date for the discussions or should we just play it by ear? Until I can get
a website up and running, our functioning is going to be a little loose, but
we can meet in the forum and pass letters back and forth on this list until
then. As I said before this is still in the planning stage and I'll post a
list of all the things I'd like to include in the Sodalitas (probably
tomorrow or Sunday) and everyone can add what I'm missing, and help me out
with initial forming of this Sodalitas, (then I can get started!)
(Oh,Merullus, of course we could cooperate with the Eagle, once the Sodalitas
is more official, I'll get in contact with whomever runs the newsletter, and
inquire about sharing materials.)
Excited AND having fun,
G.Tarquinius Caesar
(((My thanks to all citizens that have been hospitable during my first month
as a citizen of Nova Roma, you have my prayers and gratitude.)))
|
| Subject: |
FoxNews |
| From: |
"Tinnekke Bebout" tinnekke@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 23 Apr 1999 20:37:35 PDT |
|
I thought I would pass this along. It just shows you to what level
bigots are willing to go. Makes me ill.
Walk in Beauty,
Tinnekke
I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for
everything I do.
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Well FOX New's right-wing bigotry is showing through again. This
time,
during Brett Hume's special latenight show on the Littleton, CO high
school shootings, his guests attributed the killings to non-christian
religions. (Aprox. 2AM EST April 22nd)
Fred Barnes of the Weekly Standard (do a web search) blamed the
massacre
on "the rise of paganism". Then, he and Jeff Bl-Somebody from
Fortune
magazine likened pagan religions to Satan worship. Total ignorance
and total bigotry-- standard FOX News operation. The email for the
show
is: <a hre--------post/novaroma?protectID=246154192098082031138218061036129208" >Special@--------</a>
mailto:<a hre--------post/novaroma?protectID=246154192098082031138218061036129208" >Special@--------</a>
Also, goto <a href="http://www.fcc.gov" target="_top" >http://www.fcc.gov</a> and learn how to file a formal
complain
with the Federal Communications Commission.
Call your cable companies and ask that FOX News be removed from the
channels they carry. Spread the word and this message.
I'm not a pagan, but have an ex who is, and am sympathetic to many
of
the
ethos of respecting life and the earth. To blame wanton slaughter on
one
of the more harmless belief systems, is to me, a serious hate crime
in
and
of itself. Bigots like Rupert Murdoch have to be taken off the air.
I tried to post this to alt.religion.wicca.moderated but couldn't.
Regards,
Boing Meat Is Murder Amiga ROCKS! Wintel Sucks!
-----END FORWARDED MESSAGE-----
--
Modkin for soc.religion.paganism,
Modstaff for alt.religion.wicca.moderated
"We, the Person" <<a href="http://newstaffinc.com/person" target="_top" >http://newstaffinc.com/person</a>>
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|
| Subject: |
Re: The Egg of Columbus...or The Assemblies |
| From: |
"Gaius Marius Merullus" rmerullo@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 23 Apr 1999 23:45:10 -0400 |
|
Salvete Antoni Grylle et alii
:From: "Antonio Grilo" <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=243232178003185091033082" >amg@--------</a>
:
:Well, if there are citizens that want do do away with classes, they should
:continue defending their position, and there is plenty of space todo so.
Our
:assemblies will be working in order to further adapt NR government and law,
:according to the wishes of the people and the approval of the Senate. But
:first we need assemblies...
I agree.
:My point is that any solution for the assemblies that does not follow the
:Constitution will be defended by the supporters, but easily defeated by the
:others, as these can claim (with reason) that the solution is a violation
of
:the Constitution. So we will be eternally discussing how to set-up the
:assemblies, and there shall be no assemblies formed.
The solution: the senate approves a proposal that doesn't violate the
constitution. I hope for that outcome.
:My proposal and Sulla's (and we are also waiting for our most honourable
:Tribunus Plebis's opinion) fits within the Constitution (well, if you are
:able to see any violation, please advise us).
I don't see any violation whatsoever.
The Constitution defines
:Classes, and so, we use Classes according to the Constitution.
The constitution calls for two assemblies, centuriata and populi, to be made
up of both classes. The other, plebis, is made up of the plebs only. It
does not say that patricians should enjoy weighted representation in any
assembly. Of course, it does not say that patricians should not enjoy
weighted represenation either.
And so, we have reached a point on which the constiution does not tell us
exactly what to do. Now, you and Lucius Cornelius have come up with, to my
mind, a workable solution. I mean only to point out that the weighted
representation in favor of the patricians is likely to draw some resentment.
Maybe not, in which case I apologize for worrying too much.
Thank you both again for posting this. Now what is the Egg of Columbus?
Valete
Gaius Marius Merullus
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