Subject:	Camulod Chronicles
From:	Decius Iunius Palladius amcgrath@--------
Date:	Mon, 9 Aug 1999 00:35:07 -0400 (EDT)

Salvete! I was wondering if anyone here has read a series of historical
novels (or perhaps they are fantasy) called the Camulod Chronicles by
Jack Whyte, which take place right at the end of the Roman era in Britain,
as things were starting to fall apart. It's another telling of the King
Arthur tale, starting with his grandfather in the story, the Roman Pulius
Varrus.

I was wondering if they were worth reading. Somebody just gave me the
first two, The Skystone and The Singing Sword.

Valete,

Decius Iunius Palladius


----------------------------------------------------------------------------


Non scholae sed vitae discimus.

Seneca


----------------------------------------------------------------------------

"Such things have often happened and still happen,
and how can these be signs of the end of the world?"

Julian, Emperor of Rome 361-363 A.D.
Extant 331-363 A.D.

Subject:	Re: Camulod Chronicles
From:	Decius Iunius Palladius amcgrath@--------
Date:	Mon, 9 Aug 1999 00:36:55 -0400 (EDT)

Replying to my own message. It Publius Varrus, not Pulius.

On Mon, 9 Aug 1999, Decius Iunius Palladius wrote:

> From: Decius Iunius Palladius <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=243232219108127031050199203252129208071" >amcgrath@--------</a>
>
>
>
> Salvete! I was wondering if anyone here has read a series of historical
> novels (or perhaps they are fantasy) called the Camulod Chronicles by
> Jack Whyte, which take place right at the end of the Roman era in Britain,
> as things were starting to fall apart. It's another telling of the King
> Arthur tale, starting with his grandfather in the story, the Roman Pulius
> Varrus.
>
> I was wondering if they were worth reading. Somebody just gave me the
> first two, The Skystone and The Singing Sword.
>
> Valete,
>
> Decius Iunius Palladius
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> Non scholae sed vitae discimus.
>
> Seneca
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> "Such things have often happened and still happen,
> and how can these be signs of the end of the world?"
>
> Julian, Emperor of Rome 361-363 A.D.
> Extant 331-363 A.D.
>
>
> --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ----------------------------
>
> ONElist users: YOU can win a $100 gift certificate to Amazon.com.
> Check out the FRIENDS & FAMILY program to find out how.
> For details, go to <a href="http://www.onelist.com/info/onereachsplash3.html" target="_top" >http://www.onelist.com/info/onereachsplash3.html</a>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>

Subject:	Re: Camulod Chronicles
From:
Date:	Mon, 9 Aug 1999 08:49:35 EDT

Salve,

Since somebody GAVE you the first two Camulod Chronicle novels, they might be
worth at least having a look at. I found them infuriating myself. At their
foundation they were quite anti-Roman... and quite unbelievable. The main
character who's living in about 450 AD "invents" a whole raft of improbable
things that come from much later eras - such as books with pages and spines,
movable press type, and, if memory serves me correctly, (and it may not, I've
been *trying* to forget these books) gunpowder.

Sprinkled over all this is are several heartwarming Christian messages, such
as the fact that all ancient religions were wrong and corrupt... with the
exception of Druidism, which the author has decided was pretty much the same
thing as Christianity so it was OK. In fact, I believe that most of the
Druids in the story just sort of become Christian priests by "osmosis".

I really wanted these books to be better, since I find the time of late
antiquity in Britain really interesting. I was able to get over the author's
religious/cultural attitudes, but when all the "out of time period" stuff
kept getting invented it became more of a fantasy novel than anything based
on history. If the charachters had at least been trying to hang on to some
Romanitas in a barbarian age I probably would have kept reading... but they
decide early in the first book that everything about Rome was corrupt anyway,
so it was better abandoned and forgotten. :P

Vale,

Marcus Cassius Julianus

In a message dated 8/8/1999 9:35:27 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
<a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=243232219108127031050199203252129208071" >amcgrath@--------</a> writes:

<< Salvete! I was wondering if anyone here has read a series of historical
novels (or perhaps they are fantasy) called the Camulod Chronicles by
Jack Whyte, which take place right at the end of the Roman era in Britain,
as things were starting to fall apart. It's another telling of the King
Arthur tale, starting with his grandfather in the story, the Roman Pulius
Varrus.

I was wondering if they were worth reading. Somebody just gave me the
first two, The Skystone and The Singing Sword.
>>

Subject:	More on alt.politics.micronations...
From:	Cassius622@--------
Date:	Mon, 9 Aug 1999 09:37:16 EDT

Salvete,

Hope nobody minds a brief return to this thread! Flavius Vedius Germanicus
was quite right that there is NOTHING going on with the perfectly usable
newsgroup "alt.politics.micronations". When I checked it out for the first
time I found that there were only 17 messages... and 16 of them were SPAM.

While that newsgroup might not be the best place to air out discussions and
debates of "internal" Nova Roma politics, this newsgroup seems like a forum
with *great* potential. It seems that it's carried by most if not all
servers, and Germanicus was correct that most of the other Micronations are
probably subscribed to the thing even if they're not using it.

If any Citizens out there are interested in the concept of Micronations, it's
a place worth bringing up some topics. I've just posted a general question
about Micronational literature there... with a kind of offbeat book
suggestion just to get some of the other Micronations talking. At the very
least Nova Roma can get some promotion, and at the best we might find some
interesting friends. Hope to see some folks there!

Vale,

Marcus Cassius Julianus

Subject:	Re: Newsgroup
From:	"Tinnekke Bebout" tinnekke@--------
Date:	Mon, 09 Aug 1999 13:34:37 GMT

Salve

Right now I have no access to that newsgroup. I rarely frequent newsgroups
as a rule because most of the alt class have no moderation and I really
dislike spam.

Vale

Cypria

Subject:	Re: Camulod Chronicles
From:	"Lucius" vergil@--------
Date:	Mon, 9 Aug 1999 11:00:07 -0400

Salvete,

I recommend Rosemary Sutcliff for historical fiction based on late
Roman Britian. Eagle of the Ninth, The Silver Branch and The Lantern
Bearers. I got them from Amazon.com.
I believe that they were recommended to me by someone on the list last year.
Also, Lindsey Davis' The Silver Pigs is situated in Britian for the most
part.
I just finished reading a wonderful fiction based on an
"autobiography" of Augustus by Alan Massie titled Augustus. I got this one
either from B&N or Amazon.
Bonam Fortunam


Valete, L Equitius


>From: <--------ef="/post/nov----------------otectID=137166066112082162090021200165114253071048139" >C--------us622@--------</--------;
>Since somebody GAVE you the first two Camulod Chronicle novels, they might
be worth at least having a look at. I found them infuriating myself. ... but
they
>decide early in the first book that everything about Rome was corrupt
anyway,
>so it was better abandoned and forgotten. :P
>
>Vale, Marcus Cassius Julianus
>
>In a message dated 8/8/1999 9:35:27 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
><a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=243232219108127031050199203252129208071" >amcgrath@--------</a> writes:
><< Salvete! I was wondering if anyone here has read a series of historical
> novels (or perhaps they are fantasy) called the Camulod Chronicles by
> Jack Whyte, > I was wondering if they were worth reading. Somebody just
gave me the first two, The Skystone and The Singing Sword.

Subject:	Re: Camulod Chronicles
From:	Cassius622@--------
Date:	Mon, 9 Aug 1999 11:05:15 EDT

In a message dated 8/9/1999 7:59:14 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
<a hr--------/post/novaroma?prot--------D=081056091108082153015038190036129" >v--------l@--------</a> writ--------br>
<<
I recommend Rosemary Sutcliff for historical fiction based on late
Roman Britian. Eagle of the Ninth, The Silver Branch and The Lantern
Bearers. I got them from Amazon.com. >>

LOL! There was just a discussion of these books on the Mithras list! Rosemary
Sutcliff IS a great author. I've got all her Roman fiction and wish there was
more. Her works are available through Amazon.com. (best to surf there through
the Nova Roma Macellum link so that some of that $$ gets kicked back to the
treasury!) We'd get 15% if the books were added in as direct links, but even
if you just surf in generally the treasury gets 10%.

Vale,

Marcus Cassius Julianus

Subject:	Re: "Augustus"
From:	SFP55@--------
Date:	Mon, 9 Aug 1999 12:33:27 EDT

In a message dated 8/9/1999 7:59:13 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
<a hr--------/post/novaroma?prot--------D=081056091108082153015038190036129" >v--------l@--------</a> writ--------br>
<< I just finished reading a wonderful fiction based on an "autobiography"
of Augustus by Alan Massie titled Augustus. >>

Alan Massie's "Augustus" has problems, but for the most part it is
historically correct.
I recommend it.
I do not recommend "the Camulod Chronicles" series as they are for the most
part anti-Roman and we are promoting Rome.
Q. Fabius Maximus.

Subject:	Re: More on alt.politics.micronations...
From:	Trekroner trekroner@--------
Date:	Mon, 09 Aug 1999 19:48:43 +0200

Please allow a hostis (original sense) to offer a bit of past experience.

>From: <--------ef="/post/nov----------------otectID=137166066112082162090021200165114253071048139" >C--------us622@--------</--------;
>
>Salvete,
>
>Hope nobody minds a brief return to this thread! Flavius Vedius
Germanicus
>was quite right that there is NOTHING going on with the perfectly usable
>newsgroup "alt.politics.micronations". When I checked it out for the
first
>time I found that there were only 17 messages... and 16 of them were
SPAM.

My sincerest hopes are that you're not referring to my posts forwarded from

the moderated Comity mailing list dedicated to micronational discussion,
but
rather the usual "send me money and you'll get rich" trash.

My experience with this group, (which I've watched for well over a year) is

that there is very little spam going on there and not much in other
alt-groups either.

I suspect that the different ISP's filter spam out themselves with varying
success. At my end spam has (almost) disappeared from Usenet.

>While that newsgroup might not be the best place to air out discussions
and
>debates of "internal" Nova Roma politics, this newsgroup seems like a
forum
>with *great* potential. It seems that it's carried by most if not all
>servers, and Germanicus was correct that most of the other Micronations
are
>probably subscribed to the thing even if they're not using it.
>If any Citizens out there are interested in the concept of Micronations,
it's
>a place worth bringing up some topics. I've just posted a general
question
>about Micronational literature there... with a kind of offbeat book
>suggestion just to get some of the other Micronations talking. At the
very
>least Nova Roma can get some promotion, and at the best we might find
some
>interesting friends. Hope to see some folks there!

The micronational community has to my knowledge retracted into internal
affairs of each respective micronation. Several nations have been dissolved

and others are on the brink. Moreover, some former micronations have
embraced a new vision and now no longer considers themselves micronations
but rather something more "real". In consequence they look upon their own
past and any remaining micronations with what looks like disdain. In short,

they're not much fun to talk with. Of the remaining, some are located in
LOSS, which suffers from gross inertia, still others (like my own
micronation) are located in the Comity of Peoples, which is also quite
comatose at the moment, but counts at least two currently very active
micronations (as well as some apparently more dozing ones).

Initially, this post was intended to correct a few misconceptions about
a.p.m. but the rest sums up to that I know of a few dedicated
micronationalists, who'd love to talk with some Nova Romans. The main
problem with a.p.m. would probably not be the spam but rather that it's
unmoderated. I don't know if any of you ever followed Microworld when it
was
in existence in 1998, but that was really ugly at times...

With friendly regards


Lars Erik, Duke of Trekroner
Sovereign Principality of Corvinia

<a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=189212192163127190172038109248062208071048" >trekroner@--------</a>
www.corvinia.org
ICQ: 22 62 76 01

Sentio aliquos togatos contra me conspirare.

Subject:	Re: "Augustus"
From:	DTibbe2926@--------
Date:	Mon, 9 Aug 1999 15:48:39 EDT

<< << I just finished reading a wonderful fiction based on an
"autobiography"
of Augustus by Alan Massie titled Augustus. >>
>>

I enjoyed Massie's 'Augustus' far more than his 'Caesar'. Haven't read his
'Tiberius' yet.

Severus

Subject:	Lindsey Davis novels (was Re: Camulod Chronicles)
From:	Jenni Hunt moonloon@--------
Date:	Mon, 09 Aug 1999 15:56:53 -0400

At 11:00 AM 8/9/99 -0400, Lucius wrote:
>I believe that they were recommended to me by someone on the list last year.
>Also, Lindsey Davis' The Silver Pigs is situated in Britian for the most
>part.

I've been reading the M. Didius Falco detective novels in succession (I'm
up to _Last Act in Palmyra_ now). I'm not much of a mystery reader, but
I'd say they're about average as far as mysteries go. Falco is a pretty
well-developed character and quite amusing, though. The attention to
detail is pretty good -- Davis obviously did a lot of research for each
novel and did a good job of reconstructing life in 72 A.D. (which is the
setting for the novel I'm in right now). Each one has a different
geographical setting, too, which makes them especially interesting -- some
are in Rome itself; The _Silver Pigs_ doesn't quite make it to Britain, but
heads through Germania and deep in Celtic territory; while _Last Act in
Palmyra_ heads off past the edge of the empire into the Middle East. Once
I've made my way through them all, I plan to write a review of them so
folks can choose the one(s) that match their interests most closely. They
really are quite interesting, even if you're not a mystery fan (which I'm
not, especially).

Enjoy!

I. Ov-------- Luna <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=029233253185018190112158203026129208071" >moonloon@--------</a>
(Jenni Hunt)

Subject:	Re: More on alt.politics.micronations...
From:	Cassius622@--------
Date:	Mon, 9 Aug 1999 16:47:46 EDT

In a message dated 8/9/99 12:37:20 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
<a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=189212192163127190172038109248062208071048" >trekroner@--------</a> writes:

Cassius:
>time I found that there were only 17 messages... and 16 of them were
SPAM.

Lars Erik:
My sincerest hopes are that you're not referring to my posts forwarded from
the moderated Comity mailing list dedicated to micronational discussion,
but rather the usual "send me money and you'll get rich" trash.

Cassius:
Certainly not! The few posts I saw were either multi-level marketing ads or
adult ads. There was only one post related to Micronations. I'm sure the list
is just unusually quiet just now.

Lars Erik:
> My experience with this group, (which I've watched for well over a year) is
that there is very little spam going on there and not much in other
alt-groups either.

I suspect that the different ISP's filter spam out themselves with varying
success. At my end spam has (almost) disappeared from Usenet.

Cassius:
It didn't really seem that this list was "overflooded" with such messages by
any means. There were a few batch postings that had made it through but such
things would be easily drowned out by normal on-topic post traffic.

Lars Erik:
> The micronational community has to my knowledge retracted into internal
affairs of each respective micronation. Several nations have been dissolved
and others are on the brink.

Cassius:
That's *very* interesting, considered that Nova Roma just went through it's
own crisis. Maybe there's something in the water... :P How deep has this
general shakeup among other Micronations gone??

Lars Erik:
>Moreover, some former micronations have
embraced a new vision and now no longer considers themselves micronations
but rather something more "real". In consequence they look upon their own
past and any remaining micronations with what looks like disdain. In short,
they're not much fun to talk with.

Cassius:
Nova Roma has always had hopes of being fairly real... something along the
lines of the Knights of Malta. Our site has always posted such intent. Still,
culture and religion are far more important to most of us than politics.
Hopefully we're not TOO bad to deal with! ;)

Lars Erik:
>Of the remaining, some are located in
LOSS, which suffers from gross inertia, still others (like my own
micronation) are located in the Comity of Peoples, which is also quite
comatose at the moment, but counts at least two currently very active
micronations (as well as some apparently more dozing ones).

Cassius:
Has this inertia been going on for some time, or is it just the usual "Summer
Internet Slump"?

Lars Erik:
>Initially, this post was intended to correct a few misconceptions about
a.p.m. but the rest sums up to that I know of a few dedicated
micronationalists, who'd love to talk with some Nova Romans. The main
problem with a.p.m. would probably not be the spam but rather that it's
unmoderated. I don't know if any of you ever followed Microworld when it
was in existence in 1998, but that was really ugly at times...

Cassius:
We'd be more than happy to talk with anyone, but our Senate has been fairly
conservative about formal alliances and relations. I do believe that Corvinia
is the only micronation we have "official" relations with! No matter what
we're pretty easy to deal with officially though and many of us are
interested in the Micronational phenomenon as a whole.

In any case, many thanks for your post. It's great to get some news from the
"outside Micronational world"!

Vale,

Marcus Cassius Julianus
Senator

Subject:	Re: Re: More on alt.politics.micronations...
From:	"Flavius Vedius Germanicus" germanicus@--------
Date:	Mon, 9 Aug 1999 21:33:28 -0400

Salve,

> From: <--------ef="/post/nov----------------otectID=137166066112082162090021200165114253071048139" >C--------us622@--------</--------;
>
> We'd be more than happy to talk with anyone, but our Senate has been
fairly
> conservative about formal alliances and relations. I do believe that
Corvinia
> is the only micronation we have "official" relations with! No matter what
> we're pretty easy to deal with officially though and many of us are
> interested in the Micronational phenomenon as a whole.
>
> In any case, many thanks for your post. It's great to get some news from
the
> "outside Micronational world"!

Actually, we enjoy joint formal recognition with both Corvinia and the
Republic of Porto Claro. I know that Corvinia is still active, but the Porto
Claro web site is down. I wonder if they're still around...?

Vale,

Flavius Vedius Germanicus

Subject:	Re: More on alt.politics.micronations...
From:	"Flavius Vedius Germanicus" germanicus@--------
Date:	Mon, 9 Aug 1999 21:47:05 -0400

Salve,

> From: Trekroner <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=189212192163127190172038109248062208071048" >trekroner@--------</a>
>
> >newsgroup "alt.politics.micronations". When I checked it out for the
> first
> >time I found that there were only 17 messages... and 16 of them were
> SPAM.
>
> My sincerest hopes are that you're not referring to my posts forwarded
from
> the moderated Comity mailing list dedicated to micronational discussion,
> but rather the usual "send me money and you'll get rich" trash.

In my own experience, I would think that most of the posts that Cassius is
referring to are crossposted to all groups that begin with alt.politics.*.
After all, it's easier for someone promoting liberation for East Timor to
post something to all the alt.politics groups, rather than picking and
choosing which ones might actually be appropriate. (Then again, there are
the "get rich quick" messages, but I think every newsgroup has them...)

Vale,

Germanicus

Subject:	Re: Re: Lost Property (was Has the Dictator Stepped Down?)
From:	"Flavius Vedius Germanicus" germanicus@--------
Date:	Mon, 9 Aug 1999 22:03:45 -0400

Salve,

> From: "Nicolaus Moravius" <a --------="/post/novaroma?protectID=091089014007127031215056228219114187071048139" >n_moravius@--------</a>
>
> Et ubi dignitas in iste, Germanice? Quaeristi:
>
> >Oh ye Gods! What ever happened to dignitas?
>
> - It took a pratfall when it slipped on the banana-skin of Comitas. No
> offence meant, and I hope none taken :-)

Apology accepted, and no offense taken. But remember the definition of
Comitas: "Ease of manner, courtesy, openness, and friendliness." It ain't
"comedy" ;-)

Germanicus