Forum Romanum


Subject:	Re: Get Together @Caesar's,N.J.
From:	JusticeCMO@--------
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 00:49:01 EDT

Salve,

If enough lead time is given, cost is less of a factor for us. I *believe*
that is most likely true for most citizens. Not that money falls off of
trees (would be nice eh? LOL) but the more lead time the more saving time as
far as I see it. For Germanicus and I, looking at the weekend of/right
before Valentine's Day seems the earliest we could feasibly consider the cost
of weekend accommodations at Caesar's. Let us also not forget that *if* we
can book a certain number of rooms we *may* be eligible for a discount of
some sort.

Bottom line.....that weekend looks to be best for the two of us, and we await
word on what works best for others.

:) Priscilla Vedia Serena


Subject:	Re: Elections, the Constitution, Tribes, Centuries, et al...
From:	SFP55@--------
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 02:32:32 EDT

In a message dated 8/19/1999 8:47:22 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
<a hr--------/post/novaroma?prot--------D=194166216056078116169218163036129208" >raz--------@--------</a> writ--------br>
<< Another is that all those struggles for reforming the government were
really about one self centered faction trying what it could to stick it to
the faction closest to it. And that the People did not get much more than a
sop, if that. I'm talking about ancient Rome here, kiddies! Relax. >>

Sure you are, Caius Aelius, sure you are...<G>
Actually a lot of what he says makes sense. So hop to it you stalling
magistrates!
The people will feel better when we have our centuries composed and their
voting codes issued.
Valete
Q. Fabius
Curule Aedile et al.


Subject:	Re: Re: Mixing It (was Undiluted Irish)
From:	JSA varromurena@--------
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 00:01:28 -0700 (PDT)

> >I do remember hearing something about a Roman trade
> center being discovered
> >on the eastern coast of Ireland. Did anything ever
> come of that excavation?
>

As far as I know, such Roman trade settlements have
been found in many places far from the frontiers of
empire, guarded by Roman soldiers (presumably
ex-soldiers or private mercs), in Ireland,
Scandinavia, down the coast of Africa, Aden, India,
perhaps even as far as China.

JSA
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Subject:	Re: Mixing It. (Irish, barbarians, trousers)... . and some more mixing from me
From:	hadji <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=180166080058082135130082190036" >hadji@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 09:21:49 +0200

Salvete Moravius et Ariadna,

Please, appologize me for joining into your discussion. It was qiute
interesting to listen to it and not so tireing as in the case of
Constitution's one. On the other side I find your discussion to be
useful as it affect on some basic aspect of human existention.
As for barbarians and barbarious, I do not think the problem is in the
way this terms are explained. Simply thier origin and the modern meaning
are quite different things and if one uses these terms and join them in
a sentence where is mentioned any ethnic, it does not seems to be
correct (I think).
I often hear this or that ethnic to be barbarious or not civilized (the
milder version with the same meaning) and always the given opinion
depends on a stereotypes which given person grew up with. So, I do not
thing "barbariousity" depends on ethnicity, place of birth, kind of
clothes which one wear or traditions in his family, but on values which
this person believe in. And I do not mean the values, proclaimed
officialy and repeated repeated repeated by medias (slogans without real
meaning), but those one, which determinate the one's behaviour. Nothing
than my humble opinion.
I think that a "primitive" indian from Amazona's jungle can be more
human - understand civilized, than one who is living in world city and
uses all the posibilities of modern technology. Technology is not the
same as civilization.

Valete

Alex. I.C. Probus

P.S. Dear, Moravius, I was very pleased to know, you had got ancestors
from the lands of Boioi. As it is in fact not so far away from here, I
would be very glad to hear something more about. By the way the Morava
river (the norther one) is about 10 km from the city I live in. The
"southern" Morava river is 600 km to the south from here.


Subject:	Comments; Mist. Iden.
From:	Decius Iunius Palladius amcgrath@--------
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 03:59:51 -0400 (EDT)

On Thu, 19 Aug 1999, Nicolaus Moravius wrote:

> From: "Nicolaus Moravius" <a --------="/post/novaroma?protectID=091089014007127031215056228219114187071048139" >n_moravius@--------</a>
>
> Salvete! Scripsit Cincinnatus:
>
> > > (How appropriate that a picture of Augustus up on the website since we
> >are
> > > not a Republic anymore).
>
> - post haec respondit Palladius:
>
> >Augustus, eh? I appreciate the attempt at flattery, truly I do, Lucius
> >Equitius, but I am not Augustus.
>
> - Ohh. I thought it was a statue of Germanicus :-^).

That's because you have never see us, it's me, really! :) I guess I got
carried away in the moment. You mean it wasn't an attempt at flattering
me? :) Seriously though, the picture on the site was a return to Nova
Roman tradition. When Nova Roma first started, and for a long time
afterwards, that picture and the accompanying saying were the first thing
one saw when going to the site. I for one am glad it is back; it is a
daily reminder of why we are here.

> Et sic Palladius iterum:
>
> >We had an expression in the
> >Marine Corps, Lucius Equitius: "Lead, Follow, or get the hell out of the
> >way." Right now, you're just in the way.
>
> - thank you, Palladi, for sharing that maxim with us. I'm sure it works
> splendidly in the Marine Corps. This is Nova Roma, however, a
> rather more voluntary (and discursively democratic) organisation. Please
> take off that Marines hat -it really doesn't match your toga praetexta :-).

On the contrary, it certainly does. Principles of leadership are the same
anywhere you go. The difference is simply in how one applies it. In the
Marines, it would have been more direct, believe me (and being a former
Navy diver himself, Equitius knows this). I was simply pointing out to
Lucius Equitius that he was neither leading nor following but attempting
to obstruct the system by quoting clause after clause of a document that
was of no further relevance. The tone was firm, yes, but not I think rude.

Yes, Nova Roma is voluntary (so is the Marines, BTW, at least to enter)
and has a few democratic elements to it, but it is not a democracy. It is
a Republic, an organization with magistrates (officers) that carry out the
duties of their offices and make decisions based on the laws, the
constitution and their judgement. They then carry out their decisions to
the best of their ability, with input from the citizens. We are carrying
out the stipulation in the Constitution that elections for empty
magistrates positions be filled within 30 days of a vacancy. Last week,
the Senate (a much larger, more diverse and representative body than
before) carried out the requirement laid out in the Constitution that
the Senate ratify the actions of the dictator. That was done.

As for the point that the requirement for ratification in the old
constitution be followed, it is the legal interpretation of the only
current serving consul (who helped write the old and the new
constitution) that the old constitution is null and void, as are any
requirements laid out in it. It is the legal interpretation of the
Co-Founder of Nova Roma, Flavius Vedius Germanicus, who wrote the old
constitution and the current Constitution, that the old Constitution is
null and void, as are any requirements laid out in it. It is the legal
interpretation of the Co-Founder of Nova Roma, Marcus Cassius Iulianus,
who helped to write the old constitution and the current Constitution,
that the old Constitution is null and void, as are any requirements laid
out in it. It is the legal interpretation of Praetor Urbanus Lucius
Cornelius Sulla--who was very familiar with the old constitution and whose
input on the new constitution was invaluable--that the old Constitution is
null and void, as are any requirements laid out in it. In other words, the
main Nova Roman legal authorities (those who have worked the longest with
our system, both in creating it and defining it) have given their
legal interpretation that any requirement in the old system is null
and void. That interpretation is being acted on. Any ratification by a
legislative body would be superflous and illegal according to the legal
system now in place and would not be recognized by the government of Nova
Roma. No matter what decision was made on this issue, someone would not be
happy for one reason or another--and more than likely, not for reasons of
legality. So be it. A decision was made and is being carried out.

Based on the ongoing advice of the people I have mentioned, and others,
the government of Nova is carrying out its duties. Currently, it is
preparing to hold an election next week for the empty position of consul.
Sometime this weekend, the centuries will be ready for perusal. By the
beginning of the week, the voter codes and exact voting instructions will
be issued.

The cries that have been heard about an imperial system now being in place
and the end of the Republic are groundless. Nova Roma could have been
reconstituted after the Interregnum on an actual imperial model (and
there actually was a fair amount of support from citizens for just this
idea), or at the very least, a much more autocratic system. It was not.
It was reconstituted along the lines of what has been our dream all
along in Nova Roma: the revival of the Roman Republic. We shall continue
our work.

In Service to Rome,

Decius Iunius Palladius,
Consul of Nova Roma

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

"Quis ita familiaris est barbaris,
ut aram Victoriae non requirat!"

Quintus Aurelius Symmachus


Subject:	Re: Re: Marcus Agrippa
From:	JSA varromurena@--------
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 01:53:17 -0700 (PDT)

> > On a more serious note though, can anyone tell me
> where I can find some info
> > on Marcus Agrippa, the right hand of Augustus?
> Everything about him seems to
> > be out of print...
>
> Wasn't he the same guy that was so honored by having
> his name put on the
> Pantheon after it was built, something to the effect
> of "Marcus Agrippa built
> this"? He didn't actually, but it was to honor him,
> as if to say, "I couldn't
> have done this without him," or some such.

The first place to look is Ronald Syme's _The Roman
Revolution_ which IS still in print. You might also
try T. Wiedemann's _The Julio-Claudian Emperors_
(1989), though I don't have a copy of it here to check
out.

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Subject:	JBL Statues
From:	dean6886@--------)
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 04:01:26 -0500 (CDT)

I was wondering if we could have a repost on the price of Lar
statues--- I was going to order one and it occured to me that I didn't
know how much $$$ to send as I accidentally must have deleted the
original post. Perhaps they would be interested in selling the mold and
rights thereof to Nova Roma or an interested individual???

Gaius Drusus Domitianus


Subject:	Re: JBL Statues
From:	Cassius622@--------
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 08:15:12 EDT

Salvete,

I was the one who posted the original info on the Lar statues sale from JBL.
I've finally managed to get hold of a second copy of that discount flyer.

The Lar statues are on the next to the last page. They're described as 8"
Lars (set of 2) a terrific bargain except finish variation Item #LAS Were:
$46 Now: $19

I wasn't able to post the Item number before, so hopefully this will help. As
far as the finish variation, JBL does that sort of thing all the time. The
one I got from them was a nice bronze color but the actual statues could show
up in almost any finish. Best to ask them what they have on hand when you
call, so you get two that match!

As far as selling the rest of their stock, JBL would *definitely* do that in
a heartbeat. He probably wouldn't go down below $15 for a Lar set though, and
would expect the buyer to buy fifty or sixty SETS of statues. More than the
entire contents of the NR treasury I expect. Freeman Alan would probably also
sell the mold... but one one would have to talk to him directly.

Valete,

Marcus Cassius Julianus

In a message dated 8/20/99 2:01:33 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
<a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=114056113185089095081021203102129208071" >dean6886@--------</a> --------es:

<<
I was wondering if we could have a repost on the price of Lar
statues--- I was going to order one and it occured to me that I didn't
know how much $$$ to send as I accidentally must have deleted the
original post. Perhaps they would be interested in selling the mold and
rights thereof to Nova Roma or an interested individual???
>>


Subject:	Re: Undeluted Irish!!?**!!
From:	Kyrene Ariadne kyreneariadne@--------
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 06:08:58 -0700 (PDT)

--- <a --------="/post/novaroma?protectID=219044020185078198015199190036129" >cfinne@--------</a> wrote:
> Croeso,Kyrene a Vercingetorex! Dewch i mewn!
> Merlinia yma!
> What DO a scotti from Eire and a poor Gaul know
> about a lovely place in Britain? (I know,your own
> lands were never so verdant as ours,silly me!)
> Lo, see that the Chieftain,Bladud ap Lludd was a
> Briton,(now squeezed into Cymru{wales}by Sasinach)
> And Lo,read Archaeology Mag,also Athena Review for
> lots of good stuff. Their website addresses are:
> www.archaeology.org AND www.athenapub.com
> By the Way,Vercengetorex,the 1998Vol.I#4 is
> dedicated to "Sites and Museums in Roman Gaul,Pt.I"
> Kyrene,I cannot spell it in your Gaelic tounge,
> but my friend,Calum mac Connal mac Osin(mac cetra)
> says there is a saying in your land,"A Man is better
> than his birth". It is so in my land, too. A child
> can be anything she puts her mind to.
> I am Done with this Machine.
> Rydw'in well ar o^l pum peint. Nos da. --M.

Salvete.... *blinks*

Could you, um, translate the above somewhat? I'm finding difficulty
understanding what point you're trying to get across....

A Scotti from Eire? Would that be me? Actually, the *Scottish* are displaced
Irishmen. ;)

Valete et khairete,

-a very confused Kyrinia

===
-=* Kyrene Ariadne/Lolandrea Psikine'Aelanar *=-
-=* O'mra AirgeadFaol/Andrea Gladia Kyrinia *=-
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
-=* <a href="http://pagan.drak.net/lolandrea/" target="_top" >http://pagan.drak.net/lolandrea/</a> *=-
-=* ~Amber's Domain~ *=-
-=* ICQ:6663573 Yahoo:KyreneAriadne AIM:KyreneAria *=-
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Subject:	Kalendars
From:	JSA varromurena@--------
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 06:50:14 -0700 (PDT)

FYI:

> ATHENIAN
> Year began midJuly
> Hekatombaion = July/August
>
> Boedromion or Demetrion =Sept/Oct
> Puanepsion = Oct/Nov
> Maimakterion = Nov./Dec.
> Poseideon = Dec/Jan
> Gamelion = Jan/Feb
> Lenaia = extra late January?
> Anthesterion = Feb/Mar
> Elaphebolion =Mar/Apr
> Mounukhion = Apr/May?
> Thargelion = May/June
> Skiraphorion =June/July.
>
> EGYPTIAN
>
> EGYPTIAN CALENDAR:
> STILL IN USE BY THE COPTIC CHRISTIAN CHURCHES IN
> EGYPT.
>
> The Egyptian and Coptic Calendars are both divided
> into twelve equal
> months, each and every one of which has thirty days.
> In addition,
> there is a small month of five or six days,
> according to the type of
> year, in order that twelve months of thirty days (12
> x 30 = 360) can
> reach the 365 days of the solar year. The Latin
> calendar days given
> are those for the late twentieth century as used in
> the Coptic
> Christian Liturgical community.
>
> The Copts have a calendar website:
>
<a href="http://pharos.bu.edu/cn/articles/CopticLectionary.txt" target="_top" >http://pharos.bu.edu/cn/articles/CopticLectionary.txt</a>
>
> The first month: THOTH (Coptic "Thuout") = September
> 11 or 12 to
> October 10 or 11. [The Roman rulers of Egypt renamed
> this month
> Augustus] [The season from the modern Latin months
> of mid-July to
> mid-November was called the "inundation season".
> From modern Latin
> July, when the fields were flooded with Nile water,
> farm work halted:
> just as it did during deep snows in North Europe.
> Yet outdoor work
> continued.]
>
> The second month: PHAOPHI (Coptic "Paopi") =
> October 11 or 12 to
> November 9 or 10. [The Roman rulers of Egypt renamed
> this month
> Domitian] [The season from the modern Latin months
> of mid-July to
> mid-November was called the "inundation season".
> Until modern Latin
> November, when the flooded fields subsided, farm
> work halted: just as
> it did during deep snows in North Europe. Yet
> outdoor work
> continued.]
>
> The third month: HATHYR (Coptic "Athor") = November
> 10 or 11 to
> December 9 or 10. [The growing season of Ancient
> Egypt lasted from the
> modern Latin months of mid-November to mid-March,
> the `winter season'
> of North Europe. Ploughing while the soil was damp
> and relatively
> cool, seeding,, weeding, and watering of crops all
> happened in these
> months.]
>
> The fourth month: ? (Coptic "Khoiak") =
> December 10 or 11
> to January 8 or 9. [The growing season of Ancient
> Egypt lasted from
> the modern Latin months of mid-November to
> mid-March, the `winter
> season' of North Europe. Ploughing while the soil
> was damp and
> relatively cool, seeding,, weeding, and watering of
> crops all happened
> in these months.]
>
> The fifth month: TYBI (Coptic "Tobi") = January 9
> or 10 to February 7
> or 8. [The growing season of Ancient Egypt lasted
> from the modern
> Latin months of mid-November to mid-March, the
> `winter season' of
> North Europe. Ploughing while the soil was damp and
> relatively cool,
> seeding,, weeding, and watering of crops all
> happened in these
> months.]
>
> The sixth month: ? (Coptic "Mekhir") =
> February 8 or 9 to
> March 9 [The growing season of Ancient Egypt lasted
> from the modern
> Latin months of mid-November to mid-March, the
> `winter season' of
> North Europe. Ploughing while the soil was damp and
> relatively cool,
> seeding,, weeding, and watering of crops all
> happened in these
> months.]
>
> The seventh month: PHAMENOTH (Coptic "Fameno") =
> March 10 to April 8
> [the harvest in Egypt was in the modern Latin months
> of March to
> April] [the early summer in Egypt, the brief time
> before the summer
> heat dried out the soil and made it too hard to dig,
> was a time of
> irrigation channel repairs and digging of new
> ditches. This work was
> done in the modern Latin months of mid-March to
> mid-July]
>
>
>
> The eighth month: PHARMOUTHI or PHARMUTHI (Coptic
> "Farmou") = April 9
> to May 8 [the harvest in Egypt was in the modern
> Latin months of March
> to April] [the early summer in Egypt, the brief time
> before the summer
> heat dried out the soil and made it too hard to dig,
> was a time of
> irrigation channel repairs and digging of new
> ditches. This work was
> done in the modern Latin months of mid-March to
> mid-July]
>
>
> The ninth month: PACHON (Coptic "Pakhon") = May 9 to
> June 7
> [The Roman rulers of Egypt renamed this month
> Germanicaeus Claudius]
> [the early summer in Egypt, the brief time before
> the summer heat
> dried out the soil and made it too hard to dig, was
> a time of
> irrigation channel repairs and digging of new
> ditches. This work was
> done in the modern Latin months of mid-March to
> mid-July]
>
>
> The tenth month: PAYNI (Coptic "Paony") = June 8 to
> July 7
> [the early summer in Egypt, the brief time before
> the summer heat
> dried out the soil and made it too hard to dig, was
> a time of
> irrigation channel repairs and digging of new
> ditches. This work was
> done in the modern Latin months of mid-March to
> mid-July] ----This
> month was the height of the harvest season in the
> first century AD
> ---
>
>
> The eleventh month: EPEIPH (Coptic "Epep") = July 8
> to August 6
> [The season from the modern Latin months of mid-July
> to mid-November
> was called the "inundation season". From modern
> Latin July, when the
> fields were flooded with Nile water, farm work
> halted: just as it did
> during deep snows in North Europe. Yet outdoor work
> continued.]
>
> The twelfth month: MESORE (Coptic "Mesori") = August
> 7 to September 5
> [The Roman rulers of Egypt renamed this month
> Augustus Caesareus] [The
> season from the modern Latin months of mid-July to
> mid-November was
> called the "inundation season". From modern Latin
> July, when the
> fields were flooded with Nile water, farm work
> halted: just as it did
> during deep snows in North Europe. Yet outdoor work
> continued.]
>
> The Intercalary Days (Coptic "Nasie", English
> "Little Month")
> September 6 to September 11
>
>
> CAUTION: The Egyptian civil calendar "drifts" in
> time --- it is not
> strictly anchored in the year. Therefore, in the
> first centuries AD,
> the beginnings of each month in the Latin calendar
> would have been in
> the mid or late twenties of the preceding modern
> Latin month. Be
> very careful in using Egyptian sources not to
> confuse modern Latin
> months, ancient Latin months, modern Coptic months,
> and ancient
> Egyptian months.
>

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Subject:	Where's my Daddy?
From:	"Don and Crys Meaker" famromo@--------
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 09:04:05 -0500

Salvete,

Has anyone seen Palliadius? Don wrote him an email regarding
the bride price (somehow we thought it would be nice to agree to it
BEFORE our marriage was used as a political tool -- oh well) and
we haven't heard word one back.

Just to let everyone here know, Sullas email regarding the merging
of the two gens in marriage insulted both of us. Believe it or not,
that is NOT why we got married. Merging NR gens was (for some
strange reason) the furthest thing from our minds. If we had known
that was going to happen we never would have let NR know it was
happening. Ours was NOT a political marriage to make Gens Iunia
OR Gens Cornelius more powerful. I'm afraid my husband and I do
not play that game nor do we appreciate being dragged INTO the
game.

So if no one knows where my Pater is would someone who may
know tell us what a good bride price may be so my husband and I
can get on with the rest of our lives? It would be best if we sent the
money to Palliadus, but if he cannot be found the NR treasury will
work too.

Amethystia Iunia-Cornelia Crystallina (not very happy right now)


Subject:	Re: Where's my Daddy?
From:	"M. Papirius Justus" papirius@--------
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 10:12:18 -0400

"Bride prices" are not at all part of the Roman heritage and to label
dowries as such is extremely misleading. If a paterfamilias is unwilling or
incapable of providing a suitable dowry, Roman case law provides numerous
examples of hubbies-to-be providing a dowry themselves. Otherwise, a mother
can also provide a suitable dowry. A paterfamilias does have to consent to
the marriage, however, although non-dissent in such matters is usually
taken to be the equivalent of consent.

As for a 'fair' dowry, keep in mind that the dowry is theoretically her
family's contribution to the joint expenses of the household; for upper
class types, it should comprise a piece of land or other income-producing
commodity. For the course of the marriage the hubby will be able to use the
income from the dowry, but he is not the legal owner of same (unless there
is some dowry contract which specifies this).

MPJ

At 09:04 AM 20/08/1999 -0500, you wrote:
From: "Don an--------ys Meaker" <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=230166014180193192112218004036129208" >famromo@--------</a>

Salvete,

Has anyone seen Palliadius? Don wrote him an email regarding
the bride price (somehow we thought it would be nice to agree to it
BEFORE our marriage was used as a political tool -- oh well) and
we haven't heard word one back.

Just to let everyone here know, Sullas email regarding the merging
of the two gens in marriage insulted both of us. Believe it or not,
that is NOT why we got married. Merging NR gens was (for some
strange reason) the furthest thing from our minds. If we had known
that was going to happen we never would have let NR know it was
happening. Ours was NOT a political marriage to make Gens Iunia
OR Gens Cornelius more powerful. I'm afraid my husband and I do
not play that game nor do we appreciate being dragged INTO the
game.

So if no one knows where my Pater is would someone who may
know tell us what a good bride price may be so my husband and I
can get on with the rest of our lives? It would be best if we sent the
money to Palliadus, but if he cannot be found the NR treasury will
work too.

Amethystia Iunia-Cornelia Crystallina (not very happy right now)

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Subject:	Re: Re: Election Announcment
From:	"Tinnekke Bebout" tinnekke@--------
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 14:19:01 GMT

Salve

I agree with Sulla on this matter. It's time to stop acting like spoiled
children and get back to business. One of the hallmarks of Roma Mater was
pragmatism and practicality. Let us follow in the footsteps of our spiritual
ancestors, please. I ask you one and all, Honored Conscript Fathers, to
unite for the good of Nova Roma.

Vale

Lucina Iunia Cypria


Subject:	Re: Undeluted Irish!!?**!!
From:	jmath669642reng@--------)
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 11:02:10 -0400 (EDT)

Kyrinia wrote:

"--------Scottish are just displaced irishmen"

Yeah, about like Irishmen are displaced Welch!!
I most respectfully also point out my dear that the word to use is
"Scots" not Scottish. I honor your discussions and beliefs Irish, and
it might even be said that I too have "a tiny bit O' Blarney in me
tongue having kissed the stone" but it is Scots and Welsh that I am from
my anchestors and it is from the Clan McKay that I am decended in direct
line. So much so that my re-enactment involves the first person
character of Ian McKay, Adjutant of the 42nd Regiment of Foot (Black
Watch). We are a proud clan and a warlike one as well. It would not
surprise me in the least to find out that it was my Pictish forefathers
who pursuaded Hadrian to build his great wall, since the Antonine wall
could not hold us to the lands that the Romans dictated.

As for Hadrian's great effort, what self respecting Scot would go any
further South into the lowlands except for the raiding, and spols of
war????

Marcus Minucius Audens

Fair Winds and Following Seas!!!


Subject:	Re: Elections
From:	George VanDeWater VanDeWGe@--------
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 10:01:22 -0600

Salve,

I apologize if I offended you. That was not my intention. I want this to work as much as anyone. I am frustrated that it all seems to be falling apart just as I am getting involved. It took me three tries to even get citizenship only to find out I was accepted last August (98). I was notified just this month.

I would like to part of the solution, not the problem.

Vale,

G. Africanus


Subject:	College papers was Re: Mixing It
From:	"RMerullo" rmerullo@--------
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 11:56:15 -0400

Salvete Jason et alii

Nice to see you back on the list. Was it you that said many moons ago that
you knew of a couple of college or university newspapers that you thought
would be receptive to NR advertisements?

Please jog my memory, either via the list or direct e-mail.

Valete

Gaius Marius Merullus

>From: "Jason Kopeny" <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=045202253115056116187218141036129208" >jkopeny@--------</a>
>


Subject:	De barbaris was Re: Mixing It
From:	"RMerullo" rmerullo@--------
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 12:38:08 -0400

Salvete Alexander ICM Probe et alii

Bene dictum Ita est

It seems to me that words like barbarus are generally used to mean "those
other" people, reflecting a certain amount of xenophobia that I believe to
be part of human nature.

To the Romans, the Celts were barbarians...and to the Celts, the Romans were
probably barbarians too. Since Nova Roma seeks to emulate Roma, it is often
tempting to refer to peoples living outside the Roman orbis terrarum as
"barbarian" (I know that I've seen plenty of posts calling English lingua
barbara, and references to Russians, Central Asians and all sorts of people
as barbarians). But, these claims that "someone else" is a barbarus, are
just bad jokes. If for no other reason than because the orbis terrarum was
surrounded and overrun by various barbari centuries ago, and so, even if any
ethnic group could have claimed at any time to be above barbarity (and I
don't think that such a claim ever could have been valid, given the
relativity of barbarity), no such ethnic group has existed for many
centuries.

So, Probus is right. We choose to be civilized or barbaric based on our
values and how we treat each other. How collective behavior, shared beliefs
(including religion and philosophy) impact these individual choices is
really fascinating to ponder. In a way, pursuing immersion in the Roman
virtues is a way of minimizing barbarity in one's life, and, to the extent
that Nova Roma succeeds in its stated goal of furthering Roman virtues
("These Virtues are what gave a small city on the banks of the Tiber the
moral and practical strength to govern much of the world, and are most
sorely lacking in our society today. By promoting Roman culture, we are in
effect promoting nothing less than the revitalization of Western society"),
our micronation is a collective attempt at minimizing barbarity.

Num rex barbarorum fuit Romulus

Quis hoc dixit Senecane

Valete

Gaius Marius Merullus

>From: hadji <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=180166080058082135130082190036" >hadji@--------</a>
>

>I often hear this or that ethnic to be barbarious or not civilized (the
>milder version with the same meaning) and always the given opinion
>depends on a stereotypes which given person grew up with. So, I do not
>thing "barbariousity" depends on ethnicity, place of birth, kind of
>clothes which one wear or traditions in his family, but on values which
>this person believe in. And I do not mean the values, proclaimed
>officialy and repeated repeated repeated by medias (slogans without real
>meaning), but those one, which determinate the one's behaviour. Nothing
>than my humble opinion.
>I think that a "primitive" indian from Amazona's jungle can be more
>human - understand civilized, than one who is living in world city and
>uses all the posibilities of modern technology. Technology is not the
>same as civilization.
>
>Valete
>
>Alex. I.C. Probus


Subject:	re Where's my Daddy?
From:	"RMerullo" rmerullo@--------
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 13:14:39 -0400

Salvete Iunia et alii

He can't be too far away. He just posted several messages here. If he
sends me any direct e-mail, I'll reply to him that you're looking for him.

Now, it's none of my business about your marriage, bride price, et cetera,
but, since you sent it to me via the list...

WOW! I never would have thought, and still don't believe, that anyone would
try to play a political game with the marriage of two people who happen to
be citizens of Nova Roma. Iunia, you don't really believe that, do you? If
you do, why? I have not seen any post by Sulla that tells me anything of
that sort. It doesn't sound the least bit sensible or plausible that anyone
would be trying to profit from your marriage politically. And even if they
were trying to do that....?

Please feel free to reply to me at <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=194232192180194153138149203043129208071" >rmerullo@--------</a> if you like. Or
not, as you prefer :).

Valete

Gaius Marius Merullus

>From: "Don an--------ys Meaker" <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=230166014180193192112218004036129208" >famromo@--------</a>
>
>
>Has anyone seen Palliadius? Don wrote him an email regarding
>the bride price (somehow we thought it would be nice to agree to it
>BEFORE our marriage was used as a political tool -- oh well) and
>we haven't heard word one back.
>
>Amethystia Iunia-Cornelia Crystallina (not very happy right now)
>


Subject:	Re: Where's my Daddy?
From:	Decius Iunius Palladius amcgrath@--------
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 13:32:52 -0400 (EDT)

On Fri, 20 Aug 1999, Don and Crys Meaker wrote:

> From: "Don an--------ys Meaker" <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=230166014180193192112218004036129208" >famromo@--------</a>
>
> Salvete,

> Just to let everyone here know, Sullas email regarding the merging
> of the two gens in marriage insulted both of us. Believe it or not,
> that is NOT why we got married. Merging NR gens was (for some
> strange reason) the furthest thing from our minds. If we had known
> that was going to happen we never would have let NR know it was
> happening. Ours was NOT a political marriage to make Gens Iunia
> OR Gens Cornelius more powerful. I'm afraid my husband and I do
> not play that game nor do we appreciate being dragged INTO the
> game.

Crys,

I don't think Sulla meant to imply that was the reason for the marriage.
Sulla and I were talking one day and I said something to the effect that
our two gentes were the only ones in Nova Roma linked by marriage (though
I doubt we will be the last gentes so linked. It is the sign of a
community being built). He simply pointed that out in his message.
Frankly, I don't think much political mileage would come out of your
marriage.

We had been discussing Amicitia, formal friendship between our gentes (a
tradition I think worth reviving). Your marriage came up as an
afterthought to that discussion. Obviously everyone knows your marriage
originated outside of Nova Roma.

Vale,

Decius Iunius Palladius,
who is very easy to get in touch with.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

"Quis ita familiaris est barbaris,
ut aram Victoriae non requirat!"

Quintus Aurelius Symmachus


Subject:	Re: Mistaken Identity Re: Lucius Equitius
From:	"Helena Equitia" gretagoring@--------
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 11:04:19 PDT

Salvete,

I apologize on behalf of Mr. Woolwine (Sulla) for his
post yesterday. As might be expected, the continued posts
of Mr. Woolwine against my Paterfamilias have put me in a
difficult position.

I am trying to stay out of this but...

Valete, Helena Equitia


Subject:	Re: Comments; Mist. Iden.
From:	RexMarcius@--------
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 14:15:38 EDT

Salve Consul Palladius!

First: A Forum for a nation like Nova Roma with no political contents would
be a sorry affair. Apart from my love for Ancient Rome, these kind of things
have made me decide to apply for citizenship and it shows that people care
about it.

Second and more important: Being from Europe (Austria, yes, the great
dictator was a born Austrian), where we are used to frequent constitutional
changes and revolutions, civil wars etc., I would have to admit that what
you, dear Consul, say about the effectiveness of the New Constitution is
probably correct and the old constitution really is null and void (I think
the Constitutional Law prodigy Hans Kelsen from Berkeley, an Austrian who had
to go to exile because of the great dictator, would have agreed).

The only question for me remaining is:
Did we have a "revolution" in constitutional terms or is there still a link
to the old constitution.

If you want that link, you will have to call a vote because as Papirius
(iuris consultus elegans!) in my eyes absolutely persuasive has pointed out:
No dictator can overstep the mandate given to him without losing the legality
within the old system.

As even the recital for the senatus consultum empowering Germanicus itself
seems to imply, there must be basic constitutional principles not even a
dictator can change ....and the ratification process for dictatorial acts
seems to have been one of those basic principles in the old Constitution
(which obviously was effective for some time, no matter how it came into
existence).

But as in the world of real nations: if you have an effective system of
government, people willing to follow the rules and something we could call
cyber-sovereignty (or ownership of the web-site), you have a nation.

And that is that...I was enscribed into the citizen lists during the
dictatorship and I have to state that, unlike real life dictators, Germanicus
deserves respect for his work.

I do not doubt the effectiveness of the new constitution and I shall no
further raise my voice here, because unlike others I feel no particular
emotions for the First Republic of Nova Roma. But I sincerely hope the
second Republic of Nova Roma will prosper and can soon be called a "Roma
aeterna" ....

Marcus Marcius Rex,
no NR titles

Post scriptum: Thank you Audens, your kind words help, you have no idea how
difficult it is for me to overcome the fear of making mistakes in foreign
languages...


Subject:	The Social War of 90 BCE. An online campaign for NR
From:	SFP55@--------
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 15:29:08 EDT

Salvete!

One of the reasons I think we squabble so much here in NR is because we don't
fight anybody for real. After all we are Romans. Commanding the Legiones is
in our genes. So this is about to change. I announce that there is an
online game to allow citizens to take part in the Social War of 90 BCE. It
is open to all citizens on a first come, first served basis. The Website is
<a href="http://home.earthlink.net/~alexious/" target="_top" >http://home.earthlink.net/~alexious/</a>
I designed the game system, L. Cornelius Sulla, the Website. Look it over.
If you want a command, please e-mail me at
<--------ef="/post/nov----------------otectID=061044104089235135169082190036" >sfp55@--------</--------;. The C--------ign will commence, Mond--------he 6th of Sept.
Just another diversion from your hard working Curule Aedile. Bread and
Circuses to all.
Valete.
Q. Fabius Maximus
Curule Aedile et al.


Subject:	De historic re was Comments; Mist. Iden.
From:	"RMerullo" rmerullo@--------
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 15:52:29 -0400

Salvete Marce Marci et alii

>
>The only question for me remaining is:
>Did we have a "revolution" in constitutional terms or is there still a link
>to the old constitution.

No one person's answer on this is authoritative, but, as usual, I'll answer
anyway :).

If one accepts the definition (from Webster's Dictionary) for revolution "an
unconstitutional overthrow of an established government", then what we had
can probably be called a revolution. "Revolution" is easier to write than
"Impeachment/Interregnum" and is neater; on the other hand,
"Impeachment/Interregnum" is more descriptive of what seems actually to have
happened.

The practical decision of what term(s) to use will probably fall to the
citizen(s) who prepare the record of this year for the annals of Nova Roma,
a document that was begun by Aedilis Curulis Marcus Martianus Gangalius.
When Gangalius undertook that work, or roughly around that time, he said
that he felt that he was well qualified to do it as a newcomer to Nova Roma:
he had no personal stake or office to defend in presenting what had taken
place here. That being the case, he probably would prefer that someone else
newer to Nova Roma continue his work in preparing the annals.

Would you and/or Marcus Papirius consider consulting Gangalius about working
on the annals for this year? I think that you would be good at it.
>
>If you want that link, you will have to call a vote because as Papirius
>(iuris consultus elegans!) in my eyes absolutely persuasive has pointed
out:
>No dictator can overstep the mandate given to him without losing the
legality
>within the old system.

For better or worse, the old system is dead.
>
>As even the recital for the senatus consultum empowering Germanicus itself
>seems to imply, there must be basic constitutional principles not even a
>dictator can change ..

Well, both the old and new constitutions have their inspiration and much of
their "meat" from institutions of the Roman Republic, so there are such
principles. Unfortunately, those principles do not exist in a very clear or
concise form, since the Romans had no written constitution, and their system
evolved a lot during the Republic. And so, to some extent, Germanicus has
had to "make it up as he goes along". I am sure that we all agree that we
want to implement one system and have it apply to everyone all the time
uniformly.

..and the ratification process for dictatorial acts
>seems to have been one of those basic principles in the old Constitution
>(which obviously was effective for some time, no matter how it came into
>existence).

Although the old constitution was in effect for just over a year (is that
right? When was it passed? Anyone?), its very important Article IV was
NEVER implemented. I'd say that for that reason it was not very effective,
despite the best intentions of its authors, as well as of the magistrates,
senators and citizens, to make it work.
>
>But as in the world of real nations: if you have an effective system of
>government, people willing to follow the rules and something we could call
>cyber-sovereignty (or ownership of the web-site), you have a nation.

Here I come splitting hairs again. I would say that you're describing a
state more than you are a nation. A nation, to me, stems from common
language, history and cultural identity. There are supranational states,
like the United States to a degree, or the Soviet Union (was) an even better
example.

Sorry, I studied Political Science for a while. Not long enough to do
anything useful, just long enough to contribute these volumes to Nova Roma's
constitutional debates :).
>
>And that is that...I was enscribed into the citizen lists during the
>dictatorship and I have to state that, unlike real life dictators,
Germanicus
>deserves respect for his work.

What, you don't respect Lucius Cornelius Sulla of the Roman Republic (not to
be confused with the Novoromanus of the same name :))? I think that one has
to respect him, even if one doesn't approve of many of his actions, because,
I think, he pulled the Republic together and made it work again. To be a
dictator is not evil, if the dictator's actions have a positive effect.
That doesn't mean that I'll be celebrating Ludi Sullani anytime soon of
course...
>
>But I sincerely hope the
>second Republic of Nova Roma will prosper and can soon be called a "Roma
>aeterna" ....

Me too.
>
>Marcus Marcius Rex,
>no NR titles
>
>Post scriptum: Thank you Audens, your kind words help, you have no idea how
>difficult it is for me to overcome the fear of making mistakes in foreign
>languages...

Audens was right, your command of the language is impressive.

Valete

Gaius Marius Merullus


Subject:	Re: Undeluted Irish!!?**!!
From:	K--------e Ariadne <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=200028091056078198169061186140081090177098100046209130" >k--------eariadne@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 13:38:56 -0700 (PDT)

Salvete!

--- James Mathe--------lt;a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=045232113165042200148200112241225012177026038196249130152150" >jmath669642reng@--------</a> --------e:
> Kyrinia wrote:
> "--------Scottish are just displaced irishmen"
> Yeah, about like Irishmen are displaced Welch!!
> I most respectfully also point out my dear that the word to use is
> "Scots" not Scottish. I honor your discussions and beliefs Irish, and
> it might even be said that I too have "a tiny bit O' Blarney in me
> tongue having kissed the stone" but it is Scots and Welsh that I am from
> my anchestors and it is from the Clan McKay that I am decended in direct
> line.

Whoa! Whoa! *time*! Four points must be made here.

First of all, *relax*. Take a deep breath. Computers don't bite, and neither
do my emails! I included one of these: ";)". In common Netiquette, this
means that I'm simply poking at you!

Secondly, it really doesn't matter to me *what* your nationality is! I am also
part Scots or Scottish or whatever word people are choosing this week, and I am
also Irish. I'm in fact a distant relation of the Kennedys--shh, please don't
spread that around; Big Brother might find me. ;) <--- included to insure
that people take this as *humor*! :)

Thirdly, the word is *Welsh*, not Welch... while we're nitpicking each other.

Fourthly, this whole conversation started over *beer*. Surely this must've
clicked into your head that maybe, just maybe, we're not supposed to get bent
out of shape over the small stuff?

I respectfully request you to re-read the email in the spirit in was intended
in: lighthearted humor. Which we DESPERATELY need, I might add!!!

Valete et khairete,

Andrea Gladia Kyrinia

===
-=* Kyrene Ariadne/Lolandrea Psikine'Aelanar *=-
-=* O'mra AirgeadFaol/Andrea Gladia Kyrinia *=-
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
-=* <a href="http://pagan.drak.net/lolandrea/" target="_top" >http://pagan.drak.net/lolandrea/</a> *=-
-=* ~Amber's Domain~ *=-
-=* ICQ:6663573 Yahoo:KyreneAriadne AIM:KyreneAria *=-
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Bid and sell for free at <a href="http://auctions.yahoo.com" target="_top" >http://auctions.yahoo.com</a>


Subject:	Re: Comments; Mist. Iden.
From:
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 16:46:21 -0400

Salvete,

From: <--------ef="/post/nov----------------otectID=085056131063158209025056228219114253071048139" >RexM--------us@--------</--------;
Salve Consul Palladius!

First: A Forum for a nation like Nova Roma with no political contents would
be a sorry affair. Apart from my love for Ancient Rome, these kind of things
have made me decide to apply for citizenship and it shows that people care
about it.<SNIP>
Marcus Marcius Rex,
no NR titles (citizen)

Post scriptum: Thank you Audens, your kind words help, you have no idea how
difficult it is for me to overcome the fear of making mistakes in foreign
languages...

M. Marcius Rex, I would that all English speakers were as eloquent. Well
done!

>> Et sic Palladius iterum:
>> >We had an expression in the
>> >Marine Corps, Lucius Equitius: "Lead, Follow, or get the hell out of the
>> >way." Right now, you're just in the way.

Yes, we've heard that in the Navy and we had this one too,
"If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with bullshit."
That's what your trying to do but people aren't buying it.

>> - thank you, Palladi, for sharing that maxim with us. <SNIP>
>
>On the contrary, it certainly does. Principles of leadership are the same
>anywhere you go. The difference is simply in how one applies it. In the
>Marines, it would have been more direct, believe me (and being a former
>Navy diver himself, Equitius knows this). I was simply pointing out to
>Lucius Equitius that he was neither leading nor following but attempting
>to obstruct the system by quoting clause after clause of a document that
>was of no further relevance. The tone was firm, yes, but not I think rude.

Yes, it was rude and personal too, but that's OK, maybe well see each other
in person one day. If you really were the leader you would like to think
yourself, then why didn't you get the comitae done LAST YEAR!? Why did we
have to go through all this to get this far? (and we still haven't seen the
Tribes and Centuries). Why did you have to (to use your word) be sneaky to
appoint a Dictator over my veto?
I was being prevented from leading because of the inaction of the Censores.
So blame me for trying to do something about it.

>Yes, Nova Roma is voluntary (so is the Marines, BTW, at least to enter)
>and has a few democratic elements to it, but it is not a democracy. <snip>
>
>As for the point that the requirement for ratification in the old
>constitution be followed, it is the legal interpretation of the only
>current serving consul <snip>

This is a matter of interpretation too.

>Based on the ongoing advice of the people I have mentioned, and
others,<snip>
>
>The cries that have been heard about an imperial system now being in place
>and the end of the Republic are groundless. <snip>
>In Service to Rome, Decius Iunius Palladius...

Until we SEE the Centuries and Tribes, and have an election to elect
magistrateS rather than have those who are appointed by one person, people
will still wonder.

Now, if I am not bringing up invalid points, then why are there so many
responses to them? If what I have to say is not relevant then just ignore
it.

Otherwise, "Don't piss on us and tell us it's raining."
(another well known Navy maxim)

Bene Valete,
Lucius Equitius Cincinnatus...
Everyone have a nice end of summer. We are going to the beach :-) Ibamus!

PS Helena, Ita nos di bene ament, meamque mihi servssint filiam.
(Helena, may the gods love us well and preserve my daughter to me)


Subject:	Re: De historic re was Comments; Mist. Iden.
From:
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 17:37:35 EDT

Marcus Marcius Rex Gaio Mario Merullo salutem!

Thank you for your comments (and your remarks about my English). I have said
I will not raise my voice again in this matter and I won�t. But you are of
course right with regard to the semantics of the term "nation". I used that
term as everyone seems to call Nova Roma a "nation", while at the same time
describing it in terms normally reserved for states (nation-states have of
course become the norm in the real world and in colloquial German "nation"
and "state" have essentially become the same word)

I myself have unfortunately not studied Political Science and my main field
of work as a lawyer has not a lot to do with Constitutional Law (I used to
teach Criminal Law at university and practice Competition Law now) so please
forgive the inexactidude of my wording. it was written in a hurry anyway....

With regard to the Annals....well tempting, I would have to say I�d be
interested in helping to compile the facts (together with Papirius who seems
to know the digestes by heart, something I could never even hope to achieve).
But I think Marcus Gangalius can be trusted to write these Annals "sine ira
et studio". His work was my only source for Nova Roma history and I found it
very well written and to the point. That I don�t know much about the
Interregnum/Impeachment is simply due to the fact, that it is not covered by
the Annals. No one would talk to me about it......

But I have to say I have a deeply felt distaste for ALL real life dictators
(including Sulla Felix) as I know of no dictator whose record on human rights
could even be called moderate... and the worst of all came from Austria ....

Per aspera ad astra!

Marcus Marcius Rex


Subject:	Undelighted Irish
From:	"Nicolaus Moravius" <a --------="/post/novaroma?protectID=091089014007127031215056228219114187071048139" >n_moravius@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 15:07:28 PDT

Salvete!
Scripsit Kyrene:

>Being rather new here, I don't pretend to understand the politics that goes
>on
>here... I've been in ADF for two years,

- O my gods! An Draoideacht Feinn! Erm, well... some of my best friends are
Druids, er - honest. Especially since they've stopped sacrificing
non-druids.

The way things are going, I think I'd better apologise right now, before
Germanicus finds that Roman settlement on the east coast of Hibernia for
me...

Ta bron orm!

Vado.


Subject:	Re: JBL Statues
From:	"RMerullo" rmerullo@--------
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 18:09:32 -0400

Salvete Caie Druse et alii

JBL statuary can be reached by e-mail at <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=045181235112175031050168163248155208071048" >--------tatue@--------</a>. They also
have a toll-free number, 1-800-290-6203.

When I e-mailed them, I was quoted a higher price for the Lar statuettes. I
got the pair for the $19 by calling the 800 number and referring to the
flyer, thank you Marce Cassi for your help. I never thought about asking to
buy the mould, I suspect that it would be pretty expensive.

Maybe if a few more of us order these, they'll keep the mould and keep the
Lar statuette in their inventory. I don't know.

Valete

Gaius Marius Merullus

>From: <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=114056113185089095081021203102129208071" >dean6886@--------</a> (Dean Troy)
>
Perhaps they would be interested in selling the mold and
>rights thereof to Nova Roma or an interested individual???
>
> Gaius Drusus Domitianus
>
>


Subject:	Broken British
From:	"Nicolaus Moravius" n_moravius@--------
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 15:17:10 PDT

Salutem!

Sic Merlinia:

>Rydw'in well ar o^l pum peint. Nos da. --M.

Hmm. I thought there was a typo in my phrasebook, but having consulted the
dictionary (yr Geiriadur Mawr), I see you'd rather _not_ have 5 pints of oil
after all.

Pa beth ydych'i'n well ar o^l yfed pum peint, nawr, Merlinia?

Pob hwyl,

Vado the Mildly Confused


Subject:	meaning of the word civilization.
From:	william wheeler wuffa@--------
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 15:37:23 -0700

salve

OED: civilization ( latin) word means " the art of lifeing in citys!


Subject:	Re: De historic re was Comments; Mist. Iden.
From:	"RCW" alexious@--------
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 15:33:01 -0700

Salvete Omnes

I know currently that Q.Fabius Maximus has saved all correspondence
regarding this issue and is in preparation of writing a synoposis of this.
I dont know if it is for the Ann-------- but ple--------cont--------him --------lt;--------ef="/post/nov----------------otectID=246157057089235135169082190036" >SFP55@--------</--------;
He will have all the information about it.

L. Cornelius Sulla
Praetor Urbanus et Senator

> With regard to the Annals....well tempting, I would have to say I�d be
> interested in helping to compile the facts (together with Papirius who
seems
> to know the digestes by heart, something I could never even hope to
achieve).
> But I think Marcus Gangalius can be trusted to write these Annals "sine
ira
> et studio". His work was my only source for Nova Roma history and I found
it
> very well written and to the point. That I don�t know much about the
> Interregnum/Impeachment is simply due to the fact, that it is not covered
by
> the Annals. No one would talk to me about it......


Subject:	Re: Kalendars
From:	Steven Robinson amgunn@--------
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 19:39:02 -0700

Hailsa JSA - <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=081166091180193192130061163101147165026048139046" >varromurena@--------</a>,

Thanks for the info. I find it interesting to see how various cultures
marked the passage of time and the procession of the seasons.

In Amicus - Venator


Subject:	Re: Undeluted Irish!!?**!!
From:	Steven Robinson amgunn@--------
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 20:02:34 -0700

Ave et Bona Fortuna!

Piperbarbus Ullerius Venator here:

Kyrene Ariadne wrote (a nice post which is excised to the cogent sentence)
>
> Fourthly, this whole conversation started over *beer*.
>
> Valete et khairete,
>
> Andrea Gladia Kyrinia

As head of the Nova Roma Society for Brewers and Cooks (Sodalis pro Coqueror
et Coquus) and a home brewer & vinter since 1974, I should like to remind
one and all that I have loads of information.

And, getting back to the original line of conversation; I like the
Mackeson's Triple Stout, Samuel Smith's Oatmeal Stout and Pilsner Urquel,
you can keep any Belgian Lambics - thank you very much. For U.S. domestics,
I like Grant's I.P.A., Grey's Oatmeal Stout and Pete's Wicked Ale the best
(though any full bodied, hoppy brew from a micro or regional will do in a
pinch). I do also admit to liking Ballentine XXX I.P.A., when I can find it.

In Amicus - Venator (Who takes care of Sodalis mail on Thursdays, or tries
to ~(({;-{)


Subject:	interesting reading
From:	"RCW" alexious@--------
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 20:27:57 -0700

Salvete Omnes

While here between calls at EarthLink, I found an article of interest if you are interested in Roman Law. Here is the link. <a href="ftp://history.cc.ukans.edu/pub/history/general/articles/drummon1.art" target="_top" >ftp://history.cc.ukans.edu/pub/history/general/articles/drummon1.art</a> Hope you enjoy its about international law and military law. Here is the title LOOKING TO THE NEXT WAR: LAWS OF WAR IN THE ROMAN EMPIRE, 350 TO 380 AD

Hope you enjoy.

L. Cornelius Sulla
Praetor Urbanus et Senator


Subject:	Another Link
From:	"RCW" alexious@--------
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 20:40:25 -0700

As you can guess its kinda slow tonight...LOL and well I have been browsing. I know many of you enjoy virtual temples, well I found one about ancient Egypt. Here is the link <a href="http://www.netins.net/showcase/ankh/" target="_top" >http://www.netins.net/showcase/ankh/</a> Hope you enjoy it.

L. Cornelius Sulla
Praetor Urbanus et Senator


Subject:	Re: Re: Election Announcment
From:	"Flavius Vedius Germanicus" germanicus@--------
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 23:55:30 -0400

Salve,

> From: "Don an--------ys Meaker" <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=230166014180193192112218004036129208" >famromo@--------</a>
>
> My personal opinions:
>
> The dictatorship was not, being vetoed by Cincinnatus.
> The acts of the dictatorship have no standing.
> The closing down of the web page by Cassius was not legal.
> The old constitution is still be in force, without the tribes and
> centuries needed to give it any reality.
> My paterfamilias, Sulla is no Senator.
> The Censors ane still delinquent.
> Government being a monopoly on the use of force over a particular
> geographical area, Nova Roma is no government 'cause it owns no
> dirt and pretends to no monopoly.

Let's not forget: "Crystalina isn't Iunonis Templique Sacerdotes any more."

Brave words from you, considering one Sunday morning you came to me and
asked me to move her application to the priesthood through. At the time, you
seemed to think I had some authority. But now... I guess now that there's
nothing more I can do for you, you're changing your tune. You liked the
dictatorship well enough when you benefitted from it; you show your true
mettle now that you think you can gain something from bashing me.

Vale,

Flavius Vedius Germanicus


Subject:	Re: De historic re was Comments; Mist. Iden.
From:	"Gaius Marius Merullus" rmerullo@--------
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 21:59:46 -0400

Salvete Marce Marci et Luci Corneli et alii

I have saved everything that has been posted publically, and would always be
happy to send it to whichever citizen undertakes the task of writing up the
events of this year.

Valete

CMM

:From: "RCW" <a hr--------/post/novaroma?prot--------D=243128192154082190130232203077129208071" >al--------us@--------</a>
:
:I know currently that Q.Fabius Maximus has saved all correspondence
:regarding this issue and is in preparation of writing a synoposis of this.
:I dont know if it is for the Annals, but please contact him at
<--------ef="/post/nov----------------otectID=246157057089235135169082190036" >SFP55@--------</--------;
:He will have all the information about it.
:
:L. Cornelius Sulla
:Praetor Urbanus et Senator
:
:> With regard to the Annals....well tempting, I would have to say I�d be
:> interested in helping to compile the facts (together with Papirius who
:seems
:> to know the digestes by heart, something I could never even hope to
:achieve).
:> But I think Marcus Gangalius can be trusted to write these Annals "sine
:ira
:> et studio". His work was my only source for Nova Roma history and I found
:it
:> very well written and to the point. That I don�t know much about the
:> Interregnum/Impeachment is simply due to the fact, that it is not covered
:by
:> the Annals. No one would talk to me about it......
:
:
:
:--------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ----------------------------
:
:ONElist: your connection to online communities.
:
:------------------------------------------------------------------------
:


Subject:	Map of the Forum Romanum
From:	"RCW" alexious@--------
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 21:38:37 -0700

I found this map of the Forum Romanum. Thought some of you folks might find it interesting. Here is the link: <a href="http://www2.trincoll.edu/~mzimmerm/zimmerman/Chapter2/preaugie.html" target="_top" >http://www2.trincoll.edu/~mzimmerm/zimmerman/Chapter2/preaugie.html</a> Hope you enjoy it.

L. Cornelius Sulla
Praetor Urbanus et Senator


Subject:	Re: Re: Mixing It. (Irish, barbarians, trousers)... . and some more mixing from me
From:	JSA varromurena@--------
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 22:30:24 -0700 (PDT)

>
> P.S. Dear, Moravius, I was very pleased to know, you
> had got ancestors
> from the lands of Boioi. As it is in fact not so far
> away from here, I
> would be very glad to hear something more about. By
> the way the Morava
> river (the norther one) is about 10 km from the city
> I live in. The
> "southern" Morava river is 600 km to the south from
> here.

Yes, there is a recent scholarly study of the "Great
Moravia" kingdom of c. 500 AD (I believe) which
locates it not in the current Czech Rep., but around
the southern river. This has gained scholarly
acceptance.

Jerome

__________________________________________________
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Bid and sell for free at <a href="http://auctions.yahoo.com" target="_top" >http://auctions.yahoo.com</a>


Subject:	Social War Update
From:	"RCW" alexious@--------
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 22:58:33 -0700

The website has been updated for the Social War. Please visit www.earthlink.net/~alexious
I am also in process of creating a mailing list for it. Once that is complete please contact either Q.Fabius Maximus or myself to be added.

Hope you enjoy.

L. Cornelius Sulla
Praetor Urbanus et Senator


Subject:	Re: Undeluted Irish!!?**!!
From:	JSA varromurena@--------
Date:	Fri, 20 Aug 1999 23:24:31 -0700 (PDT)

--- Steven Rob--------n <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=243232178182078116015056190036129" >amgunn@--------</a> wrote:
> From: Steven Rob--------n <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=243232178182078116015056190036129" >amgunn@--------</a>
>
> Ave et Bona Fortuna!
>
> Piperbarbus Ullerius Venator here:
>
> Kyrene Ariadne wrote (a nice post which is excised
> to the cogent sentence)
> >
> > Fourthly, this whole conversation started over
> *beer*.
> >
> > Valete et khairete,
> >
> > Andrea Gladia Kyrinia
>
> As head of the Nova Roma Society for Brewers and
> Cooks (Sodalis pro Coqueror
> et Coquus) and a home brewer & vinter since 1974, I
> should like to remind
> one and all that I have loads of information.
>
> And, getting back to the original line of
> conversation; I like the
> Mackeson's Triple Stout, Samuel Smith's Oatmeal
> Stout and Pilsner Urquel,
> you can keep any Belgian Lambics - thank you very
> much. For U.S. domestics,
> I like Grant's I.P.A., Grey's Oatmeal Stout and
> Pete's Wicked Ale the best
> (though any full bodied, hoppy brew from a micro or
> regional will do in a
> pinch). I do also admit to liking Ballentine XXX
> I.P.A., when I can find it.

But isn't this barbarous brew the color of urine,
which all good Romans should avoid? Try for a good
amphora of Falernian....

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Bid and sell for free at <a href="http://auctions.yahoo.com" target="_top" >http://auctions.yahoo.com</a>