Subject:	Explorator dixit
From:	"M. Papirius Justus" papirius@--------
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 08:04:29 -0400

News from abroad, borne by one of my Exploratores:

***LIVE EVENT***

ABCNews is going to be hosting a live (moderated) chat with Roger Bagnall,
who will be answering questions about the Bahariya Oasis discoveries. The
chat begins at 2.30 p.m. (Eastern) and can be accessed via the following link:

<a href="http://chat.abcnews.go.com/chat/chat.dll?room=mummyexpert082699" target="_top" >http://chat.abcnews.go.com/chat/chat.dll?room=mummyexpert082699</a>
<url:<a href="http://chat.abcnews.go.com/chat/chat.dll?room=mummyexpert082699" target="_top" >http://chat.abcnews.go.com/chat/chat.dll?room=mummyexpert082699</a>>


It was a busy day for the Times (as will be seen) ... the first report from
them is on the discovery of a Roman gem in the Thames:

<a href="http://www.sunday-times.co.uk/news/pages/Times/timnwsnws01034.html?2177977" target="_top" >http://www.sunday-times.co.uk/news/pages/Times/timnwsnws01034.html?2177977</a>
<url:<a href="http://www.sunday-times.co.uk/news/pages/Times/timnwsnws01034.html?2177" target="_top" >http://www.sunday-times.co.uk/news/pages/Times/timnwsnws01034.html?2177</a>
977>




mpj
]|[ M. Papirius Justus ]|[ <a href="http://web.idirect.com/~atrium" target="_top" >http://web.idirect.com/~atrium</a> ]|[

Subject:	Re: Which Gods preside over Auto Body Repair?
From:	"Nicolaus Moravius" n_moravius@--------
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 05:34:02 PDT

Salve, Californi! (What's a 'Sith' , anyway?) Scripsisti:


>friends romans and country me, lend me your browsers.
>i just need to vent. today when i got home from my martial arts lessons
>i smashed my car into (brand new just bought it a month ago) a parked
>car to give some one else room to get around me when he came wide around
>a corner.
>
>so my question is what gods cover this area. and what kind of rituals
>are out there for me to perform?

- to prevent this sort of thing happening again in future, a prayer to the
Lares Viales (tutelary road spirits) is advisable (see prayers from Plautus
in the Pantheon). Mercurius, of course, protects travellers (and thieves and
therefore, by extension, garage proprietors :-) - so you might make an
offering to Mercurius so that your repair bill won't be too inflated. If you
already had an estimate for the work, I'd offer Mercurius a tenth of any
saving you make if the actual bill turns out to be less. Then there's
Vulcanus, patron of metalworkers (thus panel-beaters) - you could offer him
the same deal. Hope this helps.

Vale bene,

Vado.

>

Subject:	Re: A note of History I found out
From:	"Nicolaus Moravius" n_moravius@--------
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 05:48:55 PDT

Salvete! Scripsit Sulla:


>Today marks the 1,674th anniversary of the Nicene Creed. Which the
>Emperor Constantine presided over. If you are interested in seeing the
>article posted at about.com Here is the URL.
><a href="http://ancienthistory.about.com/library/weekly/mcurrent.htm?pid=2765&cob=home" target="_top" >http://ancienthistory.about.com/library/weekly/mcurrent.htm?pid=2765&cob=home</a>

- I think that what is meant here is the Ecumenical Council of Nicaea, at
which the Nicene Creed is popularly supposed to have been formulated
(incorrectly, as its present form originated in the late 11thC. CE).

It was at this Council that my holy namesake Nicolaus, orthodox Bishop of
Smyrna (aka Santa Claus), reputedly gave Arius, the heretic Bishop of the
Goths, a broken jaw during one of the debates.

Compared with the early Church Fathers, we don't do too badly here with our
differences!

Valete bene,

Nicolaus Moravius Vado.

Subject:	Re: Re: Some Horse's Ass may be to Blame (rebut)
From:	"M. Papirius Justus" papirius@--------
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 08:13:33 -0400

Salvete!

I'm not sure that levitas has been repelled at all. It's a good tale
whether it is true or not (which it isn't). The problem is that this has
become one of the biggest pieces of misinformation about ancient Rome and
regularly pops up in scholarly discussion groups (and not-so-scholarly
ones). Very often it appears word for word, but without the horse's rear
reference (and so does appear 'serious').

I firmly believe it is my duty as an academic and our duty as Novaromani
novaromanaeque to dispel any misinformation about Rome whenever possible.

mpj




]|[ M. Papirius Justus ]|[ <a href="http://web.idirect.com/~atrium" target="_top" >http://web.idirect.com/~atrium</a> ]|[

Subject:	Re: which gods preside over auto body repair?
From:	Steven Robinson amgunn@--------
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 08:26:07 -0700

Ave Darth Californius!

I would venture to guess that Vulcan (Hephaestos) and Minerva (Athene) as
the numinous beings involved with things of metal and craft.

Vale - Venator

Subject:	Re: Re: Ancestors
From:	George VanDeWater VanDeWGe@--------
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 08:18:48 -0600

Salve,

I too, descend from Clan Murray through the Sept Fleming. The Sept originated when King David I recruited 30 knights from Flanders who came with their enterouge and settled in an area near Aberdeen. Your comments are interesting.

Vale, G. Africanus Secundus

>>> JSA <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=081166091180193192130061163101147165026048139046" >varromurena@--------</a> 08/24 7:33 AM >>>
From: JSA <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=081166091180193192130061163101147165026048139046" >varromurena@--------</a>



--- Nicolaus Moravius <a --------="/post/novaroma?protectID=091089014007127031215056228219114187071048139" >n_moravius@--------</a> wrote:

> The doings of Clan Murray are obviously off-topic
> and I only mention it here
> because this is one of the lines I do definitely
> descend from. And from a
> number of Gauls who may or may not have come from
> Bibracte and environs a
> few centuries earlier. Now some would say that to
> claim descent from the
> Boii because I'm a Murray is extremely
> suppostitious, and I agree. But then,
> if Caesar Augustus can claim descent from the
> goddess Venus through Aeneas
> (and his isn't the only tenuous, mythologised Roman
> pedigree by a long way),
> then I reckon I can claim what I just did too. It
> might even be true. Not
> that it would make me a different person, would it?

Salve!

Of course it wouldn't! It just strikes me as curious
that the attribution of Murray is to a slavic people,
and a particular region. Certainly the Czechs, though
they occupied Bohemia (really the lands of the
Marcomanii), aren't Boii. And the Czechs and
Moravians, though they share a common language, have
very different folk customs and traditions. I suppose
this is a question for a different list.

Vale.
L. Licinius Varro Murena


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Subject:	Re: De civitate et sententiis
From:	George VanDeWater <a href="/po--------ovaroma?protectID=251166234193056045244038203219129208071" >VanDeWGe@--------</a>
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 08:22:06 -0600

Salvete omnes
I echo RMerullo's cocern. Let's get on with the business at hand. Either be a citizen and work for the advancement of Nova Roma or go play some where else.
Valete

>>> "RMerullo" <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=194232192180194153138149203043129208071" >rmerullo@--------</a> 08/24 8:26 AM >>>
From: "RMerullo" <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=194232192180194153138149203043129208071" >rmerullo@--------</a>

Salvete omnes

Everyone has an opinion (especially me :)) and that's great.

But if someone gives up on Nova Roma (relinquishing citizenship), I think
that we should hesitate to address that person here in this forum. Hey, if
they wanted to express opinions on Nova Roma and listen to the opinions of
citizens, and maybe do something with Nova Roma, they could have kept their
citizenship.

Life's too short, and there's too much to do, to argue with ghosts in this
forum.

Vale

Gaius Marius Merullus


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Subject:	Re: which gods preside over auto body repair?
From:	JSA <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=081166091180193192130061163101147165026048139046" >varromurena@--------</a>
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 07:44:24 -0700 (PDT)

> so my question is what gods cover this area. and
> what kind of rituals
> are out there for me to perform?
> well anyways
> take it easy
> californius
>

Well, you can always turn to one of our oldest gods,
if most obscure, Opifex. As to the ritual, it WILL
involve a sacrifice. Cut out the injured parts, and
place them on a grease-covered wooden bench. Then,
pour a libation of 10W40 while invoking the aid of
Opifex (or Mechanicus if you so wish). Sprinkle a meal
of nuts and bolts over the damaged parts. Then, Opifex
will deliver, as if by magic, replacement parts to you
which come in paper boxes of varying sizes and
thicknesses. Continue reciting praises to Opifex while
you attach the new parts. Lo and behold! your chariot
will be resurrected from the grave!

Or, alternatively, take it to one of those
chariot-repair places, you know, the ones that worship
the god Mechanicus. They will invoke the proper
rituals and resurrect your chariot for you, all for a
mere few hundred sestertii (a donation to the god, of
course).

Vale.
Lucius Licinius Varro Murena



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Subject:	Re: De civitate et sententiis-Olivia finally reads a post
From:
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 11:27:57 EDT

In a message dated 8/26/99 9:16:35 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
<a href="/po--------ovaroma?protectID=251166234193056045244038203219129208071" >VanDeWGe@--------</a> write--------r>
<< Salvete omnes
I echo RMerullo's cocern. Let's get on with the business at hand. Either be
a citizen and work for the advancement of Nova Roma or go play some where
else.
Valete
>>
Salve!
I have recently returned from Pennsic wars and feel that I must finally post
on this subject as well. I have come to feel that our list and the manner
that many have posted in the past hurts us greatly.
I have had two friends who tried to read posts in the past. I fear that
their (the posts) were at their worst. They have decided that it would be
better to be alone in their worship than risk some of the harsh words they
read on line.
I am glad to see that this has come to an end I hope.
I had even stopped reading the digests since they were filled with personal
post or post that should have been private or silly one liners (sorry if that
offends anyone). I am however glad to go back to full service and read all
the posts.
I have come to consider the belief that the Internet has hurt us more than
helped us. Well, I am more ready to be a use full member as I can at least as
a contact person if possible.

Oh well I wonder if I should even post all as I suspect that I invite some
hurtful response. But as I often spout "no guts no glory"

Prima Olivia Anncinna

Janet in Indiana

Subject:	Collegium Pontificum
From:	"Antonio Grilo" <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=243232178003185091033082" >amg@--------</a>
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 17:11:15 +0100

Salvete omnes

All of us are marvelled with the way our governmental institutions seem to
be working. The reform in the Senate finally allowed active people to take
important decisions such as the approval of a new and workable Constitution.
But in my view, the Senate is not the only institution that needs a reform.
A long time elapsed since the last relevant decision was taken in the field
of the Religio and priesthoods. The Collegium Pontificum needs a reform
similar to the one that happenned in the Senate. Romans, we need more people
in the Collegium Pontificum. We also need the Collegium to perform meetings
and take decisions. Many a citizen have applied for a priesthood and
received no answer. With time they became unmotivated and left. Nova Roma
needs politicians, yes. But politics are not the motivation of many citizens
who hoped to see the religious institutions of our nation grow. Politics are
going well, and I see many good magistrates around us. But how many good
priests are there in our nation? There are a few, but not enough. Many
priesthoods are still empty.
Nova Roma cannot forget one its greater objectives, the Religio Romana.

After the elections take place and we are certain that the Centuries and
Tribes are correctly setup, we must IMMEDIATELY start to care about the
Religio. This is not a thing for after the next elections. This is a thing
for now, for now we are not being able to correspond to the aspirations of
many good romans.

Valete

Antonius Gryllus Graecus
Tribunus Plebis et coetera

Subject:	Re: Collegium Pontificum
From:	George VanDeWater <a href="/po--------ovaroma?protectID=251166234193056045244038203219129208071" >VanDeWGe@--------</a>
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 10:57:09 -0600

Salve Antonio Grilo,

Politics without Religio makes for a poorer Nova Roma. I would also encourage those who have applied or who might apply for the priesthood not to be discouraged. NR is moving in the right direction. Let's us get pass this election then address these issues with the same gusto.

G. Africanus Sceundus

>>> "Antonio Grilo" <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=243232178003185091033082" >amg@--------</a> 08/26 10:11 AM >>>
From: "Antonio Grilo" <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=243232178003185091033082" >amg@--------</a>

Salvete omnes

All of us are marvelled with the way our governmental institutions seem to
be working. The reform in the Senate finally allowed active people to take
important decisions such as the approval of a new and workable Constitution.
But in my view, the Senate is not the only institution that needs a reform.
A long time elapsed since the last relevant decision was taken in the field
of the Religio and priesthoods. The Collegium Pontificum needs a reform
similar to the one that happenned in the Senate. Romans, we need more people
in the Collegium Pontificum. We also need the Collegium to perform meetings
and take decisions. Many a citizen have applied for a priesthood and
received no answer. With time they became unmotivated and left. Nova Roma
needs politicians, yes. But politics are not the motivation of many citizens
who hoped to see the religious institutions of our nation grow. Politics are
going well, and I see many good magistrates around us. But how many good
priests are there in our nation? There are a few, but not enough. Many
priesthoods are still empty.
Nova Roma cannot forget one its greater objectives, the Religio Romana.

After the elections take place and we are certain that the Centuries and
Tribes are correctly setup, we must IMMEDIATELY start to care about the
Religio. This is not a thing for after the next elections. This is a thing
for now, for now we are not being able to correspond to the aspirations of
many good romans.

Valete

Antonius Gryllus Graecus
Tribunus Plebis et coetera



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Subject:	Re: which gods preside over auto body repair?
From:
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 13:20:01 EDT

In a message dated 8/26/99 2:41:31 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
<a hre--------post/novaroma?protectID=114166091165042237215056001163243012136219139046209" >darth_vilmur@--------</a> writes:

<< so my question is what gods cover this area. and what kind of rituals
are out there for me to perform? >>

Howabout Mercury who guards travelers...

--Dexippus

Subject:	Fwd: Item of Historical Interest
From:	"Nicolaus Moravius" <a --------="/post/novaroma?protectID=091089014007127031215056228219114187071048139" >n_moravius@--------</a>
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 11:02:09 PDT

>Salvete!
>
>Forwarded for the serious IT historians among us:-
>
> >(KQ9 is a very elderly newsreader program)
> >
> >
> >I--------ticle <a href="/post/--------roma?protectID=007123245106241191162248035026075191134143015196039130152150" >8E2ABDA1Cizzard@--------</a> > > <a href="/--------/novaroma?--------ectID=197071214003152091033082" >----------------</a> "P Nielsen Hayden" writes:
> >
> > > <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=029233091108158116015223190036129" >morgan@--------</a> (Morgan) wrote in
> > > <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=021200194161235005024138082219006191136100139046209" >935357188snz@--------</a>:
> >
> > > >KQ9 thingy is so historical that _Jo_ uses it! ;-)
> > >
> > > Well of course. It was good enough for the Roman Britons, so it's
> > > certainly good enough for her.
> >
> >That's right, consider what the Romans achieved, using only DOS! Cicero,
> >Horace, Virgil, an Empire stretching from the Sahara to Scotland, Livy,
> >Tacitus, Sallust, aqueducts, bridges, theatres, mosaics, usenet such
> >as we can barely imagine.
> >
> >It was Marcus Aurelius' introduction of Windows that caused the collapse
> >of the Empire, well, combined with The Year 1000 AUC problems (247 in
> >our dating) as Gibbon so eloquently demonstrates. "They turned away from
> >the rigours of their fathers and in place of dignity, discipline and DOS
> >they took to wine, wenches and Windows." The hieroglyphic system spread
> >rapidly and just as rapidly caused degeneration throughout the whole
> >of society.
> >
> >The final crash didn't come rapidly, there wasn't any one moment marked
> >an ending, but with the use of the graphical interface, and "point and
> >click" icons came the death of literacy, the end of striving, and when
> >the barbarians came into the Empire it was almost a relief.
> >
> >It's hard to imagine those Irish monks preserving a little knowledge
> >with their hand-carved CP/M systems, until once again DOS spread
> >across Europe, bringing a common language of discourse to the educated
> >and eventually, after a thousand years, a new rise of science and
> >literature and learning.
> >
> >But do we learn from the errors of our ancestors? We do not!
> >
> >The same thing will happen here, you mark my words. Like Ammianus (where
> >the hell is my Ammianus - who would borrow it? There's a gap where it
> >belongs, between Alcott and Anderson, but it's not on the desk) recording
> >the defeat at Adrianople I will stick with my DOS and see the new Dark
> >Age come upon the rest of you.
>
>- Cato would have been proud of him, don't you think? (I can see him
>writing
>'De Agricultura' on a PS/2 :-)
>
>Valete bene,
>
>Vado.

Subject:	ATTN: Speech of Tribunus Plebis Antonius Gryllus Graecus in the Forum
From:	"Antonio Grilo" <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=243232178003185091033082" >amg@--------</a>
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 19:05:03 +0100

Cives,

In my opinion, one of the most important causes for the inefficiency and
ineffectiveness or our institutions, either political or religious, is the
unrulled accumulation of offices. For example, I believe that the Collegium
Pontificum would have worked better if the Pontifices were fully dedicated
people not having to care about the political intricacies of our nation. In
the near future I am planning to present legislation to the Comitia Plebis
in order to limit the accumulation of offices. Such legislation will also
open the Cursus Honorum to an higher number of dedicated citizens.

(From a speech in the Forum by Antonius Gryllus Graecus, Tribunus Plebis)

Subject:	Re: Re: Some Horse's Ass may be to Blame (rebut)
From:
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 14:52:52 EDT

In a message dated 8/26/1999 6:13:25 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
<a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=197166104009127132130232203026129208071" >pap--------s@--------</a> wr--------:

<< I firmly believe it is my duty as an academic and our duty as Novaromani
novaromanaeque to dispel any misinformation about Rome whenever possible.>>
Salve M. Papirius Justus
I quite agree. And you save me from having to respond in defense. As I
wrote in my preamble, this is how fast facts get misrepresented.
Vale
Q. Fabius.

Subject:	ATTN: Comitia Plebis
From:	"Antonio Grilo" <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=243232178003185091033082" >amg@--------</a>
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 20:03:30 +0100

Salvete cives

Due to my location (Lusitania) I won't be here today when the Comitia Plebis
is setup. I am posting this message to appeal once again to your
participation, as Nova Roman is no one but ourselves, Her people. Please
vote. The vote is your word, the vote is your power.

Valete

Antonius Gryllus Graecus
Tribunus Plebis

Subject:	Re: ATTN: Comitia Plebis
From:	K--------e Ariadne <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=200028091056078198169061186140081090177098100046209130" >k--------eariadne@--------</a>
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 12:50:47 -0700 (PDT)

How does one vote? I got an email about it, but I'm very confused.



Vale,


-Kyrinia

--- Antonio Grilo <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=243232178003185091033082" >amg@--------</a> wrote:
> From: "Antonio Grilo" <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=243232178003185091033082" >amg@--------</a>
>
> Salvete cives
>
> Due to my location (Lusitania) I won't be here today when the Comitia Plebis
> is setup. I am posting this message to appeal once again to your
> participation, as Nova Roman is no one but ourselves, Her people. Please
> vote. The vote is your word, the vote is your power.
>
> Valete
>
> Antonius Gryllus Graecus
> Tribunus Plebis
>
>
>
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Subject:	Greetings
From:	Mike Ma--------r <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=174176211056207031025158175026172165098048139046" >MikeMa--------r@--------</a>
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 16:53:20 -0400

Salvete omnes,

I just got back a few days ago from holiday & forgot to set my sub to
digest, so I've missed various stuff. I've been in the Venice area, and I
can recommend very strongly the opera in the Arena (roman amphitheatre,
mostly standing) in Verona. It gives you some idea what it must have been
like to attend the roman Games, with the amphitheatre absolutely packed!
Venice itself is medieval/ early modern, but the Museo Archeologico has
some excellent statues both of gods and of public figures and emperors.

Also a recommendation for those interested in constitutional matters:
Andrew Lintott, The Constitution of the Roman Republic, published by
Clarendon Press, 1999 (ISBN 0-19-815068-7). It's a really thorough study
with some interesting details - for instance, I bet Germanicus didn't know
that the Dictator, under roman constitutional practice, was required seek
approval before he could ride a horse ...

Valete,

M. Mucius Scaevola Magister

Subject:	De Romana Religione was re: Collegium Pontificum
From:	"RMerullo" <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=194232192180194153138149203043129208071" >rmerullo@--------</a>
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 17:26:38 -0400

Salvete Pontifices et Antoni Grylle et Cnaee Tarquini et alii

I think that you both have good points. Religio romana is the defining
aspect of Nova Roma, and so we must develop it in earnest or we'll achieve
nothing.

Since it's true that we cannot rush the appointment of pontifices, the
question may linger, what to do? A while ago, M Mucius Scaevola Magister
mentioned the importance of public rituals led by magistrates. Can the
collegium pontificum, or members thereof, comment on their research into
such public rituals?

The Cassii have tried to organize live public rituals. Hopefully, they and
others will try again. Since geography for the time being will always
prevent anything beyond a small fraction of our citizens attending live
public rituals, perhaps the pontifices can develop virtual analogues.
Thanks to Q Fabius Maximus and others we have had virtual games via the chat
room. Why then can we not have a magistrate offer something appropriately
to the correct deity on a given holiday, and "broadcast" a textual
description of the ritual? And/or, images and verses appropriate to
holidays could be uploaded to the "Pantheon" section of the website.
Pontifices could collaborate to research and prepare the content, then
forward it to the curator araneae to post. Announcements of these holidays,
and the url's to view these holiday web pages, could be announced on this
list (and in other appropriate fora maybe).

I am sure that it won't be the same, nor as good, as doing it live, but it
would be better than not doing it at all, I think. And "participating" in
these virtual exercises may give some of us ideas on how to proceed with
live rituals, as well as encourage us to do so. I think that the effects
could be very healthy for us.

Too, such exercises, I think, will have much, much more positive effect than
an attempt to "legislate spirituality" by drafting a larger body of law
about pontifices and rituals. I think that the Germanican legal framework
for these things is quite adequate for us at this time.

And I hate to sit here and say "why don't YOU do this, why don't YOU do
that"; I feel that I'm begging for someone to say "well why don't YOU do it
then, Merulle, instead of just talking about it!" I would take an active
role, but I simply am not qualified to be any sort of pontifex. My own
household rituals are all that I can undertake, and even in these I am so
far groping around in the dark.

I therefore would ask the pontifices Novae Romae to consider doing some of
these things, or similar endeavors, to honor the Gods and instruct us in
their worship.

Valete

Gaius Marius Merullus
in admission to not being too knowledgeable in spiritual matters



>From: <a href="/--------/novaroma?--------ectID=137166192112158209015147190036129" >Caesar@--------</a>
>
>Salve,
>
>While I do agree, Graecus, that we need to fill the positions in the
Religio that are now empty, I can not agree that we should approach this as
a political problem, nor compare it to one. Do we need to fill the
Priesthoods? Yes; but it is not something that we, the People and Senate,
can do.
>Let the Religio and it's priesthoods be filled, but not in a hurry, not
immediatly...It takes time to rebuild a Religion, so we should try to have
patience, and hope that it is done right, rather than quickly.
>
> Vale,
> Gn. Tarquinius Caesar
> Paterfamilias
> Promotor Fidei
>

Subject:	Voter Codes?
From:
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 15:38:40 -0700

Salvete Omnes,

I was wondering when the voter codes will be sent out? I have not recieved mine yet.....Just wanted to know...

Valete Omnes.

L. Cornelius Sulla
Praetor Urbanus et Senator

Subject:	Re: Re: Which Gods preside over Auto Body Repair?
From:	Jenn--------nt <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=029233253185018190112158203026129208071" >moonloon@--------</a>
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 18:40:36 -0400

When all else fails, use one of the common "outs" used in Roman prayer for
when the identity of a particular god/dess is unknown. For example, Romans
had a shrine to Aius Locutius ("announcing speaker") in gratitude for an
unidentified voice which warned Marcus Caedicius of an impending attack by
the Gauls in 391 BCE. Other stock phrases were "to the responsible deity,"
"whether thou be God or Goddess," "or by whatever name you would like to be
called," and "all ye gods whom piety bids summon."

When I took my car in the shop for a terrible, unidentified sound it
suddenly began making and I dreaded replacing the exhaust, I made such a
prayer (with a suitable vow attached) to Vulcanus, Mercurius, and any other
god or goddess who might be willing and able to intervene on my behalf. It
worked -- my mechanic called to tell me a spark plug had simply worked
loose and there was no charge for the repair. Yes, Virginia, the gods are
alive and well, and they will heed your prayers if you show the proper
piety. :-)

Good luck!

At 05:34 AM 8/26/99 PDT, you wrote:
>From: "Nicolaus Moravius" <a --------="/post/novaroma?protectID=091089014007127031215056228219114187071048139" >n_moravius@--------</a>
>
>Salve, Californi! (What's a 'Sith' , anyway?) Scripsisti:
>
>
>>friends romans and country me, lend me your browsers.
>>i just need to vent. today when i got home from my martial arts lessons
>>i smashed my car into (brand new just bought it a month ago) a parked
>>car to give some one else room to get around me when he came wide around
>>a corner.
>>
>>so my question is what gods cover this area. and what kind of rituals
>>are out there for me to perform?
>
>- to prevent this sort of thing happening again in future, a prayer to the
>Lares Viales (tutelary road spirits) is advisable (see prayers from Plautus
>in the Pantheon). Mercurius, of course, protects travellers (and thieves and
>therefore, by extension, garage proprietors :-) - so you might make an
>offering to Mercurius so that your repair bill won't be too inflated. If you
>already had an estimate for the work, I'd offer Mercurius a tenth of any
>saving you make if the actual bill turns out to be less. Then there's
>Vulcanus, patron of metalworkers (thus panel-beaters) - you could offer him
>the same deal. Hope this helps.
>
>Vale bene,
>
>Vado.
>
>>
>
>
>--------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ----------------------------
>
>ATTN ONELIST USERS: stay current on the latest activities,
>programs, & features at ONElist by joining our member newsletter at
><a href=" <a href="http://www.onelist.com/subscribe/onelist_announce" target="_top" >http://www.onelist.com/subscribe/onelist_announce</a> ">Click</a>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
Jenn--------nt <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=029233253185018190112158203026129208071" >moonloon@--------</a>
Teacher, writer, secretary, and *still* Friend of Cows

Subject:	Re: Collegium Pontificum
From:
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 19:06:38 EDT

In a message dated 8/26/99 12:08:42 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
<a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=243232178003185091033082" >amg@--------</a> writes:

Graecus:
All of us are marvelled with the way our governmental institutions seem to
be working. The reform in the Senate finally allowed active people to take
important decisions such as the approval of a new and workable Constitution.
But in my view, the Senate is not the only institution that needs a reform.
A long time elapsed since the last relevant decision was taken in the field
of the Religio and priesthoods.

Cassius:
And just what decisions do you wish to see made, Antonius Gryllus Graecus? If
you have an agenda to introduce I politely ask you to submit it directly to
the Pontificial College itself rather than to the Nova Roma list.

Gryllus:
>The Collegium Pontificum needs a reform
similar to the one that happenned in the Senate. Romans, we need more people
in the Collegium Pontificum.

Cassius:
If you had bothered to inquire to the Pontificial College, you would know
that there are two new applications that have been placed for Pontificial
position. The first will be formally voted on when C. Aelius Ericius returns
from his vacation, and the second will be formally introduced at that time.

Graecus:
> We also need the Collegium to perform meetings
and take decisions.

Cassius:
Graecus, I must respectfully ask you to check your facts before you make
public posts. The Pontificial College has set up its own Internet list and
meets regularly. The only lack of "action" has been due to the fact that the
Collegia has been *recieving* very few priesthood applications. Even with the
brand new online priesthood application form and priesthood criteria that
have just been set up in the Pantheon section of the NR site we've had only
four applicants since the um, Social Wars.

Graecus:
Many a citizen have applied for a priesthood and
received no answer. With time they became unmotivated and left.

Cassius:
We have actually had fewer Priesthood applicants than you may think...
perhaps seven in the past year. Four of those were in fact refused priesthood
on the grounds that they didn't actually believe in the existence of the
Gods, and just wanted to "reenact" the Priesthood in show form. Hopefully the
criteria that have been posted to the Pantheon pages will help eliminate that
sort of situation. There also *was* a difficulty with the application process
itself on two occasions. Originally the Pontifical College was using a
message board from Beseen.com to store and review applications for
priesthood. That board crashed twice, and there *were* at least two
priesthood applications which were lost as a result. (The Collegia is now on
a much more stable online system.) If you know who these folks are, Graecus,
please do have them reapply using the handy online form on the NR site.

I'll recap recent Religio Romana events here for everyone just in case:

1. Crystallina was appointed as Priestess of Juno by the Dictator, a well
deserved appointment which the Pontificial College was happy to ratify.
(Note, Crys had NOT made a formal application for the position before that so
the Collegia had no chance to make the appointment by usual channels.) Crys
volunteered to undergo a six-month trial period as a Camilla or "apprentice"
to learn more about the priesthood. In the recent spat on the Internet list
she resigned, and her status is as yet unclear.

2. Kyrene Aradne applied for the position of Chief Vestal. She was formally
accepted as a Camilla, although she may well choose a different Priestess
position at the end of her apprentice period.

3. Lucina Iunia Cypria applied for the position of Flamen Cerealis.
Discussion of her application was almost complete, but she formally removed
her application during the latest Nova Roma list spat. Her status is as yet
unclear.

4. Two applications for the position of Pontiff have been made. As mentioned
above they will be dealt with as soon as it is possible for the entire
Collegia to convene. (Note, unlike the Senate, so far the Pontificial College
has been making sure that input from all Pontiffs is available. Priesthood
decisions are for life unless someone voluntarily quits, after all!)

5. Many new Religio Romana updates have been made. These include the new
Priesthood info and online form on the NR site, the new Camillia program so
that people can Apprentice and learn more about the Religio and Priesthood
itself, and the Pontificial College online system has been improved so that
applications are stored securely. All that's needed now is for more people to
apply for priesthood itself.

Graecus:
>Nova Roma
needs politicians, yes. But politics are not the motivation of many citizens
who hoped to see the religious institutions of our nation grow. Politics are
going well, and I see many good magistrates around us. But how many good
priests are there in our nation? There are a few, but not enough. Many
priesthoods are still empty.
Nova Roma cannot forget one its greater objectives, the Religio Romana.

Cassius:
As has been posted here several times already, applications for Priesthood
are wanted! If there is anyone out there interested in holding Priesthood
within Nova Roma, they should make an official application without delay.
There are indeed many important priesthoods vacant... and this is NOT because
people clamoring at the temple doors for admission have been turned away. Nor
has it been from any lack of effort on behalf of the Pontificial College.

Graecus:
After the elections take place and we are certain that the Centuries and
Tribes are correctly setup, we must IMMEDIATELY start to care about the
Religio. This is not a thing for after the next elections. This is a thing
for now, for now we are not being able to correspond to the aspirations of
many good romans.

Cassius:

I don't believe those among us who worship the ancient Goddesses and Gods
have somehow ceased to care about the Religio. If anything, the Religio
became more important as political instability rocked Nova Roma to it's very
foundations. It is most likely that applications for Priesthood and other
improvements to the Religio will pick up as things settle back to a more
normal and congenial state.

Valete,

Marcus Cassius Julianus
Pontifex Maximus

Subject:	Re: De Romana Religione
From:
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 19:25:42 EDT

In a message dated 8/26/99 5:29:09 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
<a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=194232192180194153138149203043129208071" >rmerullo@--------</a> writes:

<< And I hate to sit here and say "why don't YOU do this, why don't YOU do
that"; I feel that I'm begging for someone to say "well why don't YOU do it
then, Merulle, instead of just talking about it!" I would take an active
role, but I simply am not qualified to be any sort of pontifex. My own
household rituals are all that I can undertake, and even in these I am so
far groping around in the dark.
>>

Why don't YOU do it, Merulle... apply for a Priesthood!! There are *plenty*
of open religious offices to be filled. Have a look at the "priesthoods"
section of the Pantheon pages, and fill in a blank! ;)

Vale,

Marcus Cassius Julianus

Subject:	Re: Re: Collegium Pontificum
From:	Jenn--------nt <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=029233253185018190112158203026129208071" >moonloon@--------</a>
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 19:30:43 -0400

At 07:06 PM 8/26/99 EDT, <--------ef="/post/nov----------------otectID=137166066112082162090021200165114253071048139" >C--------us622@--------</--------; wrote:

>I don't believe those among us who worship the ancient Goddesses and Gods
>have somehow ceased to care about the Religio. If anything, the Religio
>became more important as political instability rocked Nova Roma to it's very
>foundations. It is most likely that applications for Priesthood and other
>improvements to the Religio will pick up as things settle back to a more
>normal and congenial state.

I, for one, took a sabbatical during the "social wars" and delayed my
citizenship and priesthood application until an end seemed to be in sight.
I'm not interested in the politics of NR or reading flame wars among her
citizens -- I delete most of the posts to the list I receive. What I *am*
interested in is reviving the best of Roman culture and worship and
discussing Religio Romano with people who are interested and informed.

BTW, did my post regarding Ianus ever make it to the list several weeks
ago? I was really hoping to get some resopnse from someone who may have
heard of Ianus's possible association with water, and was rewarded with a
deafening silence.

I. Ov-------- Luna <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=029233253185018190112158203026129208071" >moonloon@--------</a>
(Jenni Hunt)

Subject:	Re: Collegium Pontificum
From:	LSergAust@--------
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 20:23:47 EDT

>From: "Antonio Grilo" <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=243232178003185091033082" >amg@--------</a>
>
>Salvete omnes
>
>All of us are marvelled with the way our governmental institutions seem to
>be working. The reform in the Senate finally allowed active people to take
>important decisions such as the approval of a new and workable Constitution.
[SNIP]

Odd statement for you to make, Tribune, when you are the very person who
declined to advance the right of the citizens to vote their approval or
disapproval of these changes over which you "marvel."

I believe you have stated that it is not in the best interests of the
citizens to allow them to vote on these matters.

>After careful reasoning I decided not to include the ratification of the new
>Constitution in order of works of the Comitia Plebis. Although some citizens
>have requested some action for the sake of the people, I have taken my
>decision precisely for the sake of the people.

Where did you get your political education -- in Beijing?

Changes are (paradoxically) a constant in all aspects of life, political
and otherwise. We all must learn to live with changes. But we'll get
along better if you don't try to serve them garnished with such
bald-faced hypocrisy.

Vedius' new constitution may prove more workable than his old one, and it
is certainly laudable that he finally completed the allocation of
citizens to tribes and centuries (thanks in no small measure to Lucius
Equitius Cinncinatus). But it doesn't bode well that no-one in office
seems inclined to submit any of this to the judgement of the citizens of
this Republic. So has it _really_ been fixed?

And while I'm speaking up, I for one welcome participation by Flavia
Claudia. She may be quick-tempered and quarrelsome at times (who here
isn't?), but at least she's an honest, outspoken, literate and worthy
adversary. Apparently there are some here who recognize that they're not
in her league?

Vale,

Lucius Sergius Australicus
(still waiting to see if there is to be a nova Nova Roma)


sequella numquam tam bona est quam origo.

(The sequel is never as good as the original.)

Subject:	Book Review found on Usenet
From:	"RCW" alexious@--------
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 17:34:08 -0700

Found this book review on soc.history.ancient. I thought it would be good to post that review here. Hope you all enjoy it. :)

L. Cornelius Sulla
Praetor Urbanus et Senator


<The Beginnings of Rome. Italy and Rome from the Bronze Age to the
Punic Wars (c. 1000-264 BC)>. T. J. Cornell. A volume in the
'Routledge History of the Ancient World', Fergus Millar, general
editor. London and New York: Routledge, [1995]. xx+402+105 pp.

This is a strange and wonderful book. It does not tell the story
of the rise of Rome; rather, it analyses that story. I wish the
results of that analysis had been distilled out into a new story,
but respect the reasons they were not.

The book is organised more or less chronologically, beginning with
the usual chapter on the sources, which, however, is *considerably*
more argumentative than usual and refers to quite a few sources I
had not previously encountered, and proceeding to fourteen chapters
on particular topics. Although a few chapters have something of a
rag-bag character ("The Pre-Roman Background", "Traditional History:
Kings, Queens, Events and Dates", or "Wars and External Relations,
509-345 BC", "Rome in the Age of the Italian Wars"), most are fairly
specifically focused on their main concern: "The Origins of Rome",
"The Rise of the City-State", "The Myth of 'Etruscan Rome'", "The
Reforms of Servius Tullius", "The Power of Rome in the Sixth Century",
"The Beginnings of the Roman Republic", "Patricians and Plebeians",
"The Twelve Tables", "The Emancipation of the <Plebs>", "The Roman
Conquest of Italy". In turn, most of these chapters follow a similar
format, the same format followed (in smaller compass) in most of
the unrelated sections of the less unified chapters.

First, Cornell tells us what the ancient sources offer on the topic.
While his retelling of the traditional narrative (or narratives) is
usually not full, it sometimes does include more detail than other
one-volume works such as H. H. Scullard's.

Second, he lays out what seems problematic about the account.

Third, he describes, and usually rips to pieces some of, the views of
previous scholars on the subject.

In the course of this last stage, he usually assembles a set of
contentions of his own. Sometimes, he offers a fourth stage,
summarising these views, but not usually.

Cornell is *very* smart. I do not know the evidence on early Rome
much at all, let alone as well as Cornell does; I'm in no position
to challenge his facts. (They rarely disagree significantly with
those offered by Scullard or Massimo Pallottino, though.) I *am*
a good judge of argumentation, and Cornell's arguments rarely strike
me as strained or improbable; moreover, he usually (though not always)
knows when they are, and admits that what he's saying is speculative.
And I am consistently impressed by the breadth and by the, um, daring,
if you will, of his ideas; and impressed also by some consistencies
they have themselves.

These consistencies are well enough foreshadowed in his preface.
There he notes that he trusts the traditional narrative a great
deal more than a more cautious writer might. Much of the opening
half of the book in fact involves his efforts to show where, and
why, such a trust might not be misplaced, along with, I must
emphasise, efforts to show where the traditional narrative might
be even less trustworthy than had previously been assumed. But
Cornell still comes across, over all, as a redeemer of Livy,
Dionysius, and their crowd.

Another consistency is that he is very concerned with assessing
the real importance of Rome. This makes him sometimes an ally of
Livy and other celebrants of Roman power, sometimes contrarily
allied with Pallottino and others who are interested in seeing
Rome as simply one element in the Italian picture. In any event,
Cornell does not want to be blinded by prior assumptions in
tackling what, for him, is an extremely momentous question: how
did this state that conquered much of its known world become capable
of *doing* that?

I find Cornell's reconstructions usually plausible, and I regret
that he did not see fit, in the end, to write a narrative of his
own. But at some level, I come away from the book with a sense
that for Cornell, the sheer challenge of constructing a history
out of often unreliable or incomplete evidence is the real point,
and the history constructed much less interesting. It is
characteristic in the extreme that the book ends with an endnote
in which he confidently corrects a previous scholar's argument:
an argument, in fact, he made in a publication of his own a few
years before!

The book includes maps, as usual - ten of them, and they are
reasonably though not perfectly useful for tracking the endless
series of wars, buildings, and alliances the topic consists of;
also and less usually, ten tables, ranging from names or roles
of officers, to census figures (which he repudiates en bloc)
or areas of cities. All notes are endnotes, regrettably, but
their 69 pages constitute a formidable guide to the scholarship
of early Rome and for that matter early Italy (where Pallottino's
<History of Earliest Italy> fails badly); Cornell religiously
cites the main discussions of almost any argument, piece of
evidence, or controversy he deals with, reaching back usually
to the early 19th century. There is also a bibliography, which
does not include everything in the notes but rather is apparently
intended as a large selective bibliography of the topic (twenty
pages). And finally an index, which I didn't use much.

One could reasonably use this as a first book on early Rome, although
it would be a somewhat peculiar choice, and it's a good deal more
demanding than first books usually are. It is certainly an excellent
second or third book.

Joe Bernstein

--
Joe Bernstein, writer
<a href="/po--------ovaroma?protectID=045233192003099091033082" >joe@--------</a>, <a href="/po--------ovaroma?protectID=045233066056152125180218031036129208" >jo--------b@t...</a>, and other recently unreliable addre--------

Subject:	Re: Re: De Romana Religione
From:	"M. Papirius Justus" papirius@--------
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 21:14:25 -0400

Salvete,

So how does one apply to be a priest? Given my knowledge of Greco-Roman
religion in general (plus my own 'calendar' site which will be reviving on
the kalends), I'd be interested in being a pontifex, augur, and even the
mystagogos for the Eleusinian mysteries (which rites, by my calculation of
the Athenian calendar, would be beginning tomorrow ... the initiation, that
is ... some preliminary rites have been taking place yesterday and today),
although I can't, as a Roman, claim to be descended from either the
Eumolpidai or Kerykes ...

mpj




At 07:25 PM 26/08/1999 EDT, you wrote:
From: <--------ef="/post/nov----------------otectID=137166066112082162090021200165114253071048139" >C--------us622@--------</--------;

In a message dated 8/26/99 5:29:09 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
<a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=194232192180194153138149203043129208071" >rmerullo@--------</a> writes:

<< And I hate to sit here and say "why don't YOU do this, why don't YOU do
that"; I feel that I'm begging for someone to say "well why don't YOU do it
then, Merulle, instead of just talking about it!" I would take an active
role, but I simply am not qualified to be any sort of pontifex. My own
household rituals are all that I can undertake, and even in these I am so
far groping around in the dark.
>>

Why don't YOU do it, Merulle... apply for a Priesthood!! There are *plenty*
of open religious offices to be filled. Have a look at the "priesthoods"
section of the Pantheon pages, and fill in a blank! ;)

Vale,

Marcus Cassius Julianus

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------------------------------------------------------------------------

]|[ M. Papirius Justus ]|[ <a href="http://web.idirect.com/~atrium" target="_top" >http://web.idirect.com/~atrium</a> ]|[

Subject:	Re: De Romana Religione
From:	Cassius622@--------
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 21:31:10 EDT

In a message dated 8/26/99 9:18:38 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
<a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=197166104009127132130232203026129208071" >pap--------s@--------</a> wr--------:

<< So how does one apply to be a priest? Given my knowledge of Greco-Roman
religion in general (plus my own 'calendar' site which will be reviving on
the kalends), I'd be interested in being a pontifex, augur, and even the
mystagogos for the Eleusinian mysteries (which rites, by my calculation of
the Athenian calendar, would be beginning tomorrow ... the initiation, that
is ... some preliminary rites have been taking place yesterday and today),
although I can't, as a Roman, claim to be descended from either the
Eumolpidai or Kerykes ...
>>

Salve,

Applying for a priesthood position is quite simple. Go to the "Pantheon"
section of the Nova Roma homepage, and look in the section on "Priesthoods".
There you will find the basic requirements for Priesthood. The requirements
are straightforward... you must actually have religious feeling for the
deities, have time to maintain a Priesthood, etc.

If you're okay with the criteria for Priesthood, there is a handy application
form right there in the Priesthood section. You can answer the questions and
submit a Priesthood application right online. Once that application reaches
the Pontificial College you will likely be asked further questions, and then
your application will be evaluated.

Vale,

Marcus Cassius Julianus
Pontifex Maximus

Subject:	Re: Voter Codes?
From:	"Flavius Vedius Germanicus" germanicus@--------
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 22:23:02 -0400

Salve,

The final batch of voter codes went out last night. If you've not gotten
yours yet, just email <a href="/post/--------roma?protectID=219056234112193209090218066036129208" >ce--------s@--------</a>; it mea--------he email address we
had for you wasn't working.

(Sulla, I'll email you yours privately, obviously.)

Vale,

Germanicus

----- Original Message -----
From: RCW <a hr--------/post/novaroma?prot--------D=243128192154082190130232203077129208071" >al--------us@--------</a>
To: <a href="mailto:novaroma@--------" >novaroma@--------</a>
Sent: Thursday, August 26, 1999 6:38 PM
Subject: [novaroma] Voter Codes?


> From: "RCW" <a hr--------/post/novaroma?prot--------D=243128192154082190130232203077129208071" >al--------us@--------</a>
>
> Salvete Omnes,
>
> I was wondering when the voter codes will be sent out? I have not
recieved mine yet.....Just wanted to know...
>
> Valete Omnes.
>
> L. Cornelius Sulla
> Praetor Urbanus et Senator
>
> [Attachments have been removed from this message]
>
> --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ----------------------------
>
> Transfer your big list to ONElist and earn $500!
> For program details, go to
> <a href=" <a href="http://clickme.onelist.com/ad/biglist1" target="_top" >http://clickme.onelist.com/ad/biglist1</a> ">Click Here</a>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>

Subject:	Have You Seen Me?
From:	"Flavius Vedius Germanicus" germanicus@--------
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 22:20:57 -0400

Salvete!

The following citizens' email addresses are no longer valid. If you are one
of them, or k--------o--------f them, please se--------mail to <a href="/post/--------roma?protectID=219056234112193209090218066036129208" >ce--------s@--------</a> with
your correct email address! (And for the rest of you, remember to let us
know when you change email addresses-- I know I change mine pretty often,
but we do communicate primarily by email, so it's really important we remain
apprised of any changes. Thanks!

Scipio Africanus
Gaius Africanus Secundus Germanicus
Lucian Ambrosius Neptunius
Secundia Ancinna Octavia
Marcus Aurelius
Josephus Aurelianus Pannonicus
Lilia Avita Verina
Dionysius Bellio
Flavius Claudius Tertius Julianus
Livia Cornelia
Oppius Dexius Felix
Livia Drusilla Severa Anotonina
Tiberius Equilius Liberius
Gaius Equus Annaeus
Gersius Esmeradli
Flavius Eutropius
Gaius Brutius Fabricius
Iulius Fennicus Angelos
Tiberius Flaminius Mercator
Gnaeus Flavius Tacitus
Caius Trajanus
Artus Galicianus Jacobus
Lucius Gellius Severus
Marcellus Hyeanus Vindictus
Nostrus Hyeanus Maximus
Optimus Hyeanus Primus
Gaius Iulius Iulianus
Tiberius Iunius
Amethysta Iunia Crystallina
Gaius Justinianus
Tertia Libertania Regina
Gaius Marius Merullus
Gaius Marius Oppidifinis Orator
Marcus Minucius Audens
Natalia Minucia Bactricia
Quintus Mucius Scaevola Rufus
Gaius Olivarius Mezentius
Secundia Olivaria Raina
Claudius Olivarius Cassivellaunus Tigrus
Marisia Olivaria Felicita
Paulus Olympius Gallus
Prisca Paulina
Ceres Planincolia Cornelia Delphina
Tiberius Portius Sarno
Pulchra Dea
Lucilius Remulius
Marcus Salix Vigilius
Sentius Saturninus
Cassius Septimus Moguntius
Claudius Silvanius Firmus
Sabinilla Silvania Panthea
Silvania Flora
Accpiter Sitheius Thracius
Flavius Vallerius
Augustus Vellius Natalis
Gregorius Verus Stoicum
Marcus Vinicius Terentius
Marcus Julius Virginianus

Valete,

Flavius Vedius Germanicus,
Censor

Subject:	Re: Re: De Romana Religione
From:	jmath669642reng@--------)
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 22:25:26 -0400 (EDT)

To Merrule;

I second Cassius' proposal. Oh I know about your being not to involved
in religio and it is the last thing that I should be talking about, but
you have demonstrated some very clear thinking over the last few weeks
and an obvious devotion to your Gods. It seems to me that
clear-thinking, polite observation, determinatin to stick with what you
are sure is right, fighting only the battles that you have a chance to
win, all qualify you for a stab at the priesthood. In addition you are
popular and the other priesthoods will bend over backward to help you
learn the ropes in a minimum of time.

Another thing that I admire about you, is that you tend to share your
knowledge and have a very good grasp of the onscept of two-way
communication. As far as I am concerned, when I go to a minister for
advice, I want somebody who listen to my problem and has the ability to
communicate to me something helpful. I think you have hose attributes,
and I am sure you would do a great job.

To NR-----The above are my opinions only, as my gods are not the Roman
Gods even though I respet them and the Religio highly. I do not think
however from the past week or so that the methodology of Gods or their
rquirements differ greatly. If I am wrong you may simply note that I am
a Christian and do not understand.

Marcus Minucius Audens
.

Fair Winds and Following Seas!!!

Subject:	Social War Site update
From:	"RCW" alexious@--------
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 19:23:44 -0700

The final tentative updates have been completed. Come and check out the site. It is located at home.earthlink.net/~alexious All of the spelling errors and such have been corrected.

L. Cornelius Sulla
Praetor Urbanus et Senator

Subject:	Voting has begun
From:	Decius Iunius Palladius amcgrath@--------
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 23:29:22 -0400 (EDT)

Salvete! This is to announce that voting has officially begun in the
Comitia Centuriatia for the two items on the ballot:

1. Election of consul

2. Lex Iunia de Temporum Definitione Consulatuum.


In order to stay within the guidelines of the Lex Vedia de Ratione
Centuriatorum Comitiorum, I hereby extend the voting period to September
15, which specifies that 3 market days must pass for discussion and
voting. When I initially announced the vote, I was referring only to the
Lex Vedia de Ratione Eligium, which specified a two market day interval.
My apologies for the confusion, this is a first time out for all of us
with this system. I did not discover my error until last night when I was
referring to the law last night in refernce to a citizen's question.

This entire period is both a discussion and a voting period as specified
in the law. Unfortunately, with only one candidate for consul, there will
be little discussion of that. The only item that is in question is the
Lex Iunia de Temporum Definitione Consulatuum. One reason I added laws to
the ballot was so that *something* in this vote would be question and to
encourage people to vote.

Valete,

In Service to Rome,

Decius Iunius Palladius,

Consul


-------------------------------------------------------------------------


"Quis ita familiaris est barbaris,
ut aram Victoriae non requirat!"

Quintus Aurelius Symmachus

Subject:	Re: Re: Collegium Pontificum
From:	JSA varromurena@--------
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 21:51:49 -0700 (PDT)

> BTW, did my post regarding Ianus ever make it to the
> list several weeks
> ago? I was really hoping to get some resopnse from
> someone who may have
> heard of Ianus's possible association with water,
> and was rewarded with a
> deafening silence.
>
> I. Ov-------- Luna <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=029233253185018190112158203026129208071" >moonloon@--------</a>
> (Jenni Hunt)

No, but I'd LOVE to hear of it. Tell us more!

L. Licinius Varro Murena

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Bid and sell for free at <a href="http://auctions.yahoo.com" target="_top" >http://auctions.yahoo.com</a>

Subject:	Resignation of the Praetor Urbanus position
From:	"RCW" alexious@--------
Date:	Thu, 26 Aug 1999 22:42:47 -0700

Salvete Omnes!

Given the ongoing election for the vacant position of Consul, and the fact that I am running unopposed, I hereby resign my office of Praetor Urbanus. I have tried to serve the People of Nova Roma to the best of my abilities and have tried to open the Senate to the Curule Magistrates. Despite my short comings I have tried to honorable serve the People of Nova Roma. And, as Consul I will work with my Consular colleague, Decius Iunius Palladius, to make Nova Roma a greater and more respectable Nation. As of midnight tonight (Pacific Time), I will no longer be Praetor Urbanus, and that office will be open to candidates who wish to run for that position.

As per discussion with Consul Palladius, the election for this office will occur sometime in September, when the Comitia Centuritia will be convened again. Good luck to all the future candidates.

May all our Gods Bless and Protect the Res Publica.

L. Cornelius Sulla
Paterfamilias of the Gens Cornelia
Praetor Urbanus et Senator
Lictor