Forum Romanum


Subject:	Re: "Senior Consul"?
From:	Decius Iunius Palladius amcgrath@--------
Date:	Thu, 2 Sep 1999 00:36:40 -0400 (EDT)

On Wed, 1 Sep 1999, Flavius Vedius Germanicus wrote:

> From: "Flavius Vedius Germa--------s" <a href="/post/--------roma?protectID=123056091213158116036102228219114090071048139" >germa--------s@--------</a> >
> Salvete,
Salve,

> I was just wondering where the notion that one of the two consuls holds the
> position of "senior consul" came from. While it might have been a
> distinction made in Roma Antiqua (and may be something we might want to
> incorporate eventually), our system doesn't distinguish between senior and
> junior consuls or any other sort of magistrate. Is he senior because he is
> more forceful in the expression of his wishes? Because he has a bigger
> mouth? Because he's older than the other consul? Because he calls himself
> senior consul? I think we're better off not embellishing any titles...

It's a tradition adopted from Roma Antiqua, started last year I believe
during your brief hiatus to distinguish Cassius and Metellus (though I
don't know if they themselves used it). It was then carried on by
Cincinnatus and myself when we held those positions as a result of
the now nullified election. I believe it is a tradition that Sulla and I
were going to carry on together as consuls though I will rarely sign my
name with the title next to it. Generally, the senior consul
was the person who garnered the most votes or when one was a mid-term
replacement (consul suffectus), he who held the position longest. The
position holds no more power than junior; it is merely an honorary title
added by tradition. (Roma Antiqua and so far, Nova Roman)

I do not know if such a distinction was done for other magistracies such
as Praetor or censor. I do not believe so.

Valete,

Decius Iunius Palladius,
Consul (Senior and Junior for the moment)

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

"Quis ita familiaris est barbaris,
ut aram Victoriae non requirat!"

Quintus Aurelius Symmachus


Subject:	"Senior Consul"?
From:	Mike Macnair MikeMacnair@--------
Date:	Thu, 2 Sep 1999 02:52:45 -0400

Salvete omnes!

Germanicus wrote,

>I was just wondering where the notion that one of the two consuls holds
the
>position of "senior consul" came from. While it might have been a
>distinction made in Roma Antiqua ...

"In the early and middle Republic consuls spent much of their time away
from Rome campaigning, but, when they were both at Rome, it was the rule
that they displayed the fasces and were responsible for political
leadership in alternate months. The consul who undertook this in the first
month of the year is generally held to have been the consul prior or maior.
This honour might have been granted him through seniority in years, in rank
as a former consul, or because he received the necessary majority of votes
earlier in the election than his colleague: we do not know the exact rules
under the Republic. ... {FN 29: Cicero 'Republic' 2.55, Valerius Maximus
4.1.1, and Plutarch 'Poplicola' 12.5 all suggest that the "prior consul" is
the older; Festus, 154L, that the maior consul is the man elected prior;
Gellius 2.15.4-8 that seniority in either age or status was the criterion
under the Republic. ...}"

Lintott, The Constitution of the Roman Republic (Oxford, 1999) 100.

Whether or not we choose to have consul prior or maior, the alternation of
the fasces on a monthly seems to me to be a good idea to organise the
division of labour between the consuls.

Valete,

M. Mucius Scaevola Magister


Subject:	Re: "Senior Consul"?
From:
Date:	Thu, 2 Sep 1999 03:25:06 EDT

In a message dated 9/1/1999 7:55:47 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
<a href="/post/--------roma?protectID=123056091213158116036102228219114090071048139" >germa--------s@--------</a> writes:

<< Salvete,

I was just wondering where the notion that one of the two consuls holds the
position of "senior consul" came from. >>
Salve Flavius Vedius
Actually it came from Marcus Cassius' chairmanship I believe. Then Iunius
and Equitius used it until the blow-up. It does come from the middle republic
as you guessed. One Consul was usually away fighting Rome's many enemies but,
if they were both at Rome, one would hold the fasces and responsible for as
Senior consul for that month. There were several ways to do this, if both
Patricians the greatest vote gather would hold the fasces at the start of the
new political year. He would be senior. If one was Patrician and one
Plebeian then the Patrician would be senior. I see nothing wrong with
giving the greator vote gather the distinction.
Vale
Q Fabius


Subject:	List Language
From:	"Nicolaus Moravius" n_moravius@--------
Date:	Thu, 02 Sep 1999 03:51:14 PDT

Salvete, Quiritibus Latitoribusque!
("Health to you all, Roman citizens and lurkers!")

In response to the good M. Minucius Audens' post, thoughtfully suggesting we
make more effort to make ourselves understood...

As one of the major offenders (using untranslated Latin) I apologise for any
frustration I may unthinkingly have caused. I promise in future to translate
even the punchlines of my apalling Latin jokes (yes, there are plenty more
where the last one came from >:-D

Now, before the Late Social Unpleasantness, when Audens last raised the
topic, I posted a suggestion that our Spanish- and Portuguese-speaking cives
(citizens) might find Latin less difficult than English (indeed, I've
translated Lusitanian posts before now with the aid only of my latin
dictionary).

Latin, and its revival, is to me as central to the long-term ideals of Nova
Roma as the Religio is to the Constitution. True, the vast majority of cives
are presently native Anglophones but that may well change as we grow and
become truly global. Then, the adoption of Latin as NR's official language
would have one enormous advantage over all so-called 'living' languages: it
will be universally fair, as no one is brought up to speak it - it's another
language we all have to make the same effort to learn. And it helps oneto
use primary sources in research (believe me, there are some really dubious
translations about, at least as far as religious texts are concerned).

I'll repeat a story I posted before the Late Mutual Misunderstanding, which
my old History teacher once told me at school...

Towards the end of the Second World War he was the officer commanding a
small town in Germany as part of the Allied forces of occupation. He was
responsible for running the place, along with the new, security-vetted
Burgomeister. The problem was, my teacher couldn't speak German and the
Burgomeister didn't know any English. Interpreters were very scarce.

They hit on a happy solution. Both had learned Latin previously at college.
So for part of mid-1945, the civil administration of a town in Europe was
done entirely in Latin (probably for the first time in 1,500 years). I rest
my case. If it worked for them, it could work for us (woth the help of a
dictionary apiece).

Valete bene in pace deorum,
("Be strong in the peace of the gods"),

Vado
("I wade", "I rush", or "at the ford" - take your pick!)(I chose it for the
last meaning).


Subject:	This day in ancient history
From:	"M. Papirius Justus" papirius@--------
Date:	Thu, 02 Sep 1999 07:12:32 -0400

THIS DAY IN ANCIENT HISTORY

The Battle of Actium:

<a href="http://web.idirect.com/~atrium/thisday.html" target="_top" >http://web.idirect.com/~atrium/thisday.html</a>
<url:<a href="http://web.idirect.com/~atrium/thisday.html" target="_top" >http://web.idirect.com/~atrium/thisday.html</a>>

]|[ M. Papirius Justus ]|[ <a href="http://web.idirect.com/~atrium" target="_top" >http://web.idirect.com/~atrium</a> ]|[


Subject:	Re: Cairns & Gauls
From:	"Nicolaus Moravius" n_moravius@--------
Date:	Thu, 02 Sep 1999 06:11:52 PDT

Salvete!

Sic scripsisti (thus wrote) Ericius:

>Marius Fimbria wrote:
>
> > BTW, Rudi's not an only pooch anymore...his new roommate as of last
> > week is a 4-year-old male Cairn Terrier whom I adopted from a rescue
> > person. They're getting along splendidly--! >({|:-D ...now all he
> > needs is a name; anyone got any suggestions...?
> >
>
>Caledonicus (-a), since the "Cairn" part is Scottish.

- et respondeo (and I reply): Murray (Moravi) is a nice name ;-)

Post haec (after this) scripsit (wrote) Vercingetorix:

>None of
>us
> > have done this before: hence we're hanging around other micronations,
>watching
> > how they're organized. Not that we Gauls care for organization, mind
>you,
>but
> > a semblance of it would be good.

- well, Vercingetorix, you could always do what your illustrious namesake
used to do, and threaten to mutilate all the other tribal leaders who
decline to accept your supremacy. "Firm but fair", y'know?

I believe that unsoundness or incompleteness in any bodily part
automatically disqualifies a Celt from tribal kingship >:->

Valete,

Vado.


Subject:	Re: "Senior Consul"?
From:	jmath669642reng@--------)
Date:	Thu, 2 Sep 1999 09:59:41 -0400 (EDT)

Salve Censor Germanicus;

Sir; I was led to believe in the early days of my belonging to NR that
the "senor" and "junior" for the Consuls resulted from from which one
got the most votes. I have not heard of any physical or social
attributes, that applied to such. I am glad to hear your views on the
matter, as I agree that the Consuls should be equal in all respects in a
normal election. I would most respectfully ask your ideas about a
special election in which one Consul has held office significantly
longer than the other. Does your previous belief still hold true, or is
this a special situation and should have some special consideration?

Vale Censor Germanicus;
Very Respectfully;
Marcus Muniicius Audens

Fair Winds and Following Seas!!!


Subject:	Re: [Barbarians]
From:	Steven Robinson amgunn@--------
Date:	Thu, 02 Sep 1999 09:08:03 -0700

Ave Lucius Licinius Varro Murena,

JSA wrote:
>
>
> So what is it with the Awakening and the new
> Millenium? First, it doesn't even start until
> 1/1/2001. Second, if you base it on Jesus, he was born
> before 4 BC, so the millenium came and went a few
> years ago. Third, according to the Olympiads and the
> Roman calendar (not to mention the Islamic, Jewish,
> and Chinese calendars--among others), we're not even
> close to a new millenium.
>

I don't think the Reawakening has anything to do with Millenialism.
According to the sacral calender used by convention amongst many of the
Asatruars with whom I hold community, this is the 2249th year of the Runic
Era. This dates from an archaeological find from northern Europe which is
thought to be the first inscription identified as runes. As Odin is
chieftain of our gods and discovered the runes, it appertains. So, we're 52
years from a new millenium.

I do think the Reawakening has to do with people all over the world becoming
more aware of their ancestral heritage. I am of predominantly Celtic and
Germanic ancestry, with some Italic, Nordic, Slavic, Hellenic and Iroqoian.
In the main I am descended from peoples who spoke languages of the
Indo-European family. So, for me, the gods of these ancestors speak to me
much more than the voices of the Middle Eastern gods and prophets.

After a journey starting in Catholic Sunday school in 1975, I plighted my
Troth to the Aesir and Vanir of the North. I am here in Nova Roma because I
do honor and respect the Olympians as cousins german to the Asgardians. I
strongly believe that those who adhere to the Olympians (and to the Virtue
of Romanitas) need to build Community. I have many Asatru places I can go,
I'm here to help the Romans have at least one.

In Amicus - Piperbarbus Ullerius Venator


Subject:	Re: List Language
From:	jmath669642reng@--------)
Date:	Thu, 2 Sep 1999 10:21:39 -0400 (EDT)

Greetings Vado;

I am very pleased to hear your response and I am in agreemnt with you
about the necessity of latin as a second language to bring NR to the
different countries of the world and to people who have no English.

I understand from my son (a computer hacker par excellence!!) that there
is a site on the internet that is able to translate a message into
English. Does anyone know that site address? If the site does exist,
My feeling is that we should make every effort to get that information
to all of those who are in foriegn countries (Brazil and Hungary springs
immediately to mind) so that they may join us on the list in additional
numbers.

As I have said, I have a great dfficulty with languages, but I work a
little bit each day with latin, and am beginning to get a glimmer. The
English translation do in fact help greatly.

Marcus Minucius Audens

Fair Winds and Following Seas!!!


Subject:	Re: "Senior Consul"?
From:	"RMerullo" rmerullo@--------
Date:	Thu, 2 Sep 1999 10:25:58 -0400

Salvete Flavi Vedi et alii

My understanding is that the consul who gets the most votes is termed
"senior". There is not, and should not in my view, be any distinction in
honor or responsibility on the basis of senior/junior status.

Incidentally, the notion of senior vs. junior consuls supports the notion
that people should not run in blocs or teams for the consulship.

Valete

Gaius Marius Merullus


Subject:	Re: Latin
From:	"Sacro Barese Impero sbi" sacro_barese_imp@--------
Date:	Thu, 02 Sep 1999 07:37:08 PDT

Answer to the message of Marcus Minucius Audens

Salve,
But you are sure to be a citizen of Nova Roma. I'm a citizen because I thing
that this State have the rescue and the return to the Roman ideologies. It
means the recovery of the political forms, the religions, the ancient
society, and of the language too.

So, you wrote that the latin is too slowly and hard for you, because (I
suppose) the english is a german language. But you don't thing that the
english is too hard for us ... I'm italian: my language is the latin!
I remember you that the latin is most ancient of "the good old english"!

I propose this way: the citizens that know the latin continue to write in
latin, and the consules build a page with a latin vocabulary in the official
site of Nova Roma.
What do you thing?

Bye,
Franciscus Apulus Caesar
Consul of S.B.I.


Subject:	Re: Re: [Barbarians]
From:	JSA varromurena@--------
Date:	Thu, 2 Sep 1999 09:05:28 -0700 (PDT)

--- Steven Rob--------n <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=243232178182078116015056190036129" >amgunn@--------</a> wrote:
> From: Steven Rob--------n <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=243232178182078116015056190036129" >amgunn@--------</a>
>
> Ave Lucius Licinius Varro Murena,
>
> JSA wrote:
> >
> >
> > So what is it with the Awakening and the new
> > Millenium? First, it doesn't even start until
> > 1/1/2001. Second, if you base it on Jesus, he was
> born
> > before 4 BC, so the millenium came and went a few
> > years ago. Third, according to the Olympiads and
> the
> > Roman calendar (not to mention the Islamic,
> Jewish,
> > and Chinese calendars--among others), we're not
> even
> > close to a new millenium.
> >
>
> I don't think the Reawakening has anything to do
> with Millenialism.
> According to the sacral calender used by convention
> amongst many of the
> Asatruars with whom I hold community, this is the
> 2249th year of the Runic
> Era. This dates from an archaeological find from
> northern Europe which is
> thought to be the first inscription identified as
> runes. As Odin is
> chieftain of our gods and discovered the runes, it
> appertains. So, we're 52
> years from a new millenium.

Um, no, you're 52 years from a new century. You're 752
years from the 3d millennium (i.e., your year 3001).
Just out of curiousity, do you say 2259 R.E. (I'm not
making fun here, I'd just like to know).

>
> I do think the Reawakening has to do with people all
> over the world becoming
> more aware of their ancestral heritage. I am of
> predominantly Celtic and
> Germanic ancestry, with some Italic, Nordic, Slavic,
> Hellenic and Iroqoian.
> In the main I am descended from peoples who spoke
> languages of the
> Indo-European family. So, for me, the gods of these
> ancestors speak to me
> much more than the voices of the Middle Eastern gods
> and prophets.

And I applaud you for this. But, does your beliefs
include the gods of Persia and India too?

>
> After a journey starting in Catholic Sunday school
> in 1975, I plighted my
> Troth to the Aesir and Vanir of the North. I am
> here in Nova Roma because I
> do honor and respect the Olympians as cousins german
> to the Asgardians. I
> strongly believe that those who adhere to the
> Olympians (and to the Virtue
> of Romanitas) need to build Community. I have many
> Asatru places I can go,
> I'm here to help the Romans have at least one.
>
> In Amicus - Piperbarbus Ullerius Venator
>
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Bid and sell for free at <a href="http://auctions.yahoo.com" target="_top" >http://auctions.yahoo.com</a>


Subject:	Fasces et "Senior Consul"?
From:	"RMerullo" rmerullo@--------
Date:	Thu, 2 Sep 1999 12:06:53 -0400

Salvete Marce Muci et alii

But Marce Muci, we don't even have any fasces, do we? How can the consuls
pass back and forth what we don't even have :)?

Now, we could make or somehow acquire some fasces I'm sure. But then, how
will Sulla and Palladius pass them back and forth? Airborne Express? And
who is going to pay for all that shipping? Are you proposing to introduce a
tax to cover it? I'll be damned if I'm going to pay taxes to ship fasces
across North America once a month!

(please note that this is an attempt at humor)

On a more serious note, the thought of having the consuls alternate in
executing their duties is interesting, chiefly from my point of view because
it would tend to encourage full participation of both consuls and prevent
one from crowding the other out (whether by accident or intentionally).
That there was precedent for the practice in Roma Antiqua makes the idea
even more appealing.

Back to fasces for a moment: if we need the comitia curiata, I don't see
how we can do without fasces. After all, what good is imperium granted by
the comitia curiata if you don't have the totem that carries the imperium?

Valete

Gaius Marius Merullus

>From: Mike Ma--------r <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=174176211056207031025158175026172165098048139046" >MikeMa--------r@--------</a>
>

>Whether or not we choose to have consul prior or maior, the alternation of
>the fasces on a monthly seems to me to be a good idea to organise the
>division of labour between the consuls.
>


Subject:	Re: List Language
From:	"RMerullo" rmerullo@--------
Date:	Thu, 2 Sep 1999 12:38:50 -0400

Salvete Marce Minuci et Nicolaue Moravi et alii

>Latin, and its revival, is to me as central to the long-term ideals of Nova
>Roma as the Religio is to the Constitution.

Ita vero est (it is truly so)

True, the vast majority of cives
>are presently native Anglophones but that may well change as we grow and
>become truly global. Then, the adoption of Latin as NR's official language
>would have one enormous advantage over all so-called 'living' languages: it
>will be universally fair, as no one is brought up to speak it - it's
another
>language we all have to make the same effort to learn. And it helps oneto
>use primary sources in research (believe me, there are some really dubious
>translations about, at least as far as religious texts are concerned).
>
Were Nova Roma a worldwide organization with more limited scope (only
military re-enacting, or only uniting religio practitioners, or some other
"only"), I think that it might make arguably make sense not to bother much
with Latin, since it is certainly an effort for any of us (except perhaps
for Fimbria :)) to communicate in Latin. Nova Roma, however, strives to be
a nation re-building Roma of the Republic. Given that unique mission, there
are some corollaries

-A nation needs a state and laws. Laws written in any language other than
Latin in my view must be sort of "forgiven" for applying to Romans, and by
extension, to Nova Romans.
-The Roman legacy does not belong to any single modern country or language,
and so, in the long run, favoring a modern language as the universal
language of the organization is just not fair or right.
-As Vado says, it will help our research to learn and use Latin. This
applies, I think, to research of any institution from Roma Antiqua, whether
it's a particular flaminate or the introduction of the maniple.

Now again I feel that someone is about to ask "So what the hell are you
doing about it?". So I'll answer that question in the Nova Roman tradition:
not much at present. The constitution translation project, in which M
Mucius Scaevola Magister was providing Roman law expertise and editing my
translation, was the best thing that I could think of to do, and that died
with the old constitution.

My next Latin composition project, a little more limited in scope, will be a
summary of Fortunatus' and my work as rogatores (there will be an English
version too, and both Fortunatus and I shall produce the content for both).

I cannot commit to any more than that right now, but I would encourage
people with some Latin skills to think about undertaking translations of
Nova Roma documents, and other ways to contribute to some Latin revival
here. Do we have any language teachers on this list?

Also, Cn Tarquinius Caesar is developing a sodalitas litterarum that may
become the focal point for activities in this area.

Valete

Gaius Marius Merullus


Subject:	Don't Tread on Us !
From:	"LegionXXIV" LegionXXIV@--------
Date:	Thu, 2 Sep 1999 13:09:11 -0400

VICESIMA - QUARTA
LEGION XXIV - MEDIA - ATLANTIA

* PROVINCIA PENNSYLVANIA *
* MEDIA - ATLANTICA * AMERICIA *

Defending the Frontiers of Ancient Rome
in the Mid - Atlantic Province
of North America

September 2, 1999
Year of Rome 2752

Avete et Salutatio... Commilito? Vercingetorix

Hello and Greetings? from Gallio Velius Marsallas,
Praefectus, Legio XXIV-Media-Atlantia;
Tribune Militaris - NovaRoma - Gens Velia
aka George W. Metz
13 Post Run Newtown Square, PA 19073-3014
<a h--------"/post/nova--------?p--------ctID=034056178009193116001195151189114012071048139" >legionXXIV@--------</a> 610-353-4982
<a href="http://www.legionXXIV.org" target="_top" >http://www.legionXXIV.org</a>

Barbarians in our midst ?. . . and fierce ones at that !

The legionaries of Legion XXIV can be equally fierce !

Don't tread on Us ! We stand ready to defend our
Provincia and the NovaRoma Nation.
Your waod is no defense against Rome.
You may want to capitulate Now.

We can offer you Roman citizenship in return for your
allegiance to Rome. Legion XXIV and NovaRoma
can always use some fierce warriors in her cause.

Think about it. . . We make this offer only once.


Subject:	Re: Re: List Language
From:	"M. Papirius Justus" papirius@--------
Date:	Thu, 02 Sep 1999 12:46:49 -0400

Cives who want to learn Latin might be interested in a low cost course I
offer via the internet; drop me a line offline and I'll send you the
'brochure'.

MPJ

]|[ M. Papirius Justus ]|[ <a href="http://web.idirect.com/~atrium" target="_top" >http://web.idirect.com/~atrium</a> ]|[


Subject:	Re: List Language
From:	"RMerullo" rmerullo@--------
Date:	Thu, 2 Sep 1999 13:37:23 -0400

Salvete M Papiri et alii

Perhaps you could join the ordo equestris. Then your course could be
advertised in the macellum.

Valete

Gaius Marius Merullus

>From: "M. Pap--------s Justus" <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=197166104009127132130232203026129208071" >pap--------s@--------</a>
>
>Cives who want to learn Latin might be interested in a low cost course I
>offer via the internet; drop me a line offline and I'll send you the
>'brochure'.
-----------


Subject:	Re: Re: List Language
From:	dean6886@--------)
Date:	Thu, 2 Sep 1999 13:24:29 -0500 (CDT)

Yes, I agree! Join the equestrian order and if need be raise the
prices accordingly to compensate--- I don't think anyone would mind
paying a little more if it goes toward the Nova Roma treasury.

Gaius Drusus Domitianus


Subject:	Priorities
From:	dean6886@--------)
Date:	Thu, 2 Sep 1999 13:42:48 -0500 (CDT)

For the sake of conversation, what do the citizens believe
should be the priorities for Nova Roma to accomplish--- a realistic
gameplan in order of importance to build a better community. I think
this would make an excellent debate for the list and bring some new
ideas out in a brainstorming session. Long and short term I ask what it
is you believe we need to do and how?

Including:

Fundraising

Religio Romana--- the future

Breaking the language barriers

Just about anything else any of you can think of.

Gaius Drusus Domitianus


Subject:	Re: Priorities
From:	"RMerullo" rmerullo@--------
Date:	Thu, 2 Sep 1999 17:31:26 -0400

Salvete Caie Druse et alii

That's a hard question. But then you have quite a large inventory of those,
don't you :)?

First, we have to consider what we want to do vs. what we can do. Then, we
have to consider the "we" -- there are going to be about as many sets of
priorities as there are active citizens. Hopefully, the Senate and
magistrates structures will help to organize the varied sets of priorities
into actions over time.

Leaving aside that complexity, I would say that I would like in my lifetime
to see Nova Roma functioning as a community, meaning -

- holiday celebrations for its citizens meeting in various parts of the
world. Whether there will be ten such holidays a year, or three, I have no
idea.
- rule of law
- strong enough institutions that allow people to contribute actively in
various ways without causing panic about subversion of law or intrusion into
other people's sphere of influence.
- a collegium pontificum full of dedicated pontifices, and a dedicated
flamen for every flaminate
- all the public rites of all the holidays of the Roman calendar being
performed by groups of Nova Roman citizens meeting in various places around
the world
- general proficiency in Latin rising enough to allow citizens of all
languages to greet each other and carry on at least simple conversations in
Latin in the chat forum, and to allow Latin to supersede English as the
language of edicts and leges
- massive enough population growth that citizens begin to crop up all over
the place such that I can actually see some citizens face-to-face with
monthly or greater frequency, and to allow frequent, easy in-person
attendance of sodalitas meetings for the sodalitas militarium (sp?),
sodalitas coquor et coquus (sp?), sodalitas litterarum and others (via local
chapters of course - I'm not suggesting that Venator et alii are going to
become ubiquitous).

I hope that within a century or so of my death, there may be

- that piece of land somewhere with Nova Roma's capital on it
- a full legion of re-enactors
- worldwide general acceptance of Nova Roma as a nation-state and Religio
Romana as a living religion

Now, as to prioritizing, I won't be so bold as to say that I know how to do
it all and here's how. But...

> Fundraising

At this point, I see the ordo equester as the main vehicle by which we'll
bring in money. As we grow, and we accumulate more and more entrepreneurial
people (along with a lot of dead weight like you and me :)), we'll have more
and more people tying business interests to Nova Roma. We'll all buy each
other's stuff.

If we could just recruit some Hollywood people and get them to hire Nova
Roma-affiliated re-enactors and technical consultants to do a series of big
blockbuster movies about the end of the Republic and the early Principate...

Heh, don't look at me like that. You asked for brainstorming, so I'm
drizzling at you.
>
> Religio Romana--- the future

I'm suddenly more optimistic about this. Not too long ago, I was suggesting
some online rituals and more web-pages with deity- and holiday-specific
content, including graphics and poetry (neither of which can I produce, by
the way - the last poem that I wrote happened to be in Latin, but that was
about a decade ago). The idea is to give all of us more ideas-

i) on how to do more in private, home rituals
ii) on how/what public rites to conduct in (hopefully numerically large
someday) groups

As Scaevola had pointed out, the first step (and it's a biggie) in this
process is research. Hopefully, the collegium pontificum will continue to
fill itself with dedicated people who will accelerate and amplify this
research.

I should point out that I have a found the Pantheon section of the website
very good and helpful to me personally. Ago gratias pontificibus et
curatoribus et omnibus vobis qui eum fecerunt (Thank you pontifices,
webmasters and everyone who made it)
>
> Breaking the language barriers

Let's all be as open-minded as we can. For the time being, we're using
English, which is fine. We should try, I think, to be receptive and
responsive to ideas expressed in any sort of English, and not take offense
when/if people resort to other languages (this happened before with someone
from Brazil I think). We can all make whatever effort we can afford to
learn Latin. I'm not advocating imposing Latin, though; just suggesting
that we learn and teach it to each other for reasons that Audens, Vado and
others have pointed out.

I can do a lot more about this than I can about other areas and needs. I'll
be writing the liber rogatorum (the first chapter anyway), and other things
as time goes on. I already say my prayers in Latin, and am going to
continue to share those with others. Another idea that I floated around and
then forgot was the joint reading of Ceasar's De Gallico Bello, in English
and Latin (sorry Audens, Caesar and Atticus, mea culpa for never moving on
that one).

I have been thinking that, if some other people with Latin proficiency could
join me, we could-

-with some guidance from someone with a language teaching background, offer
some kind of Latin course. Maybe we could use Graecus' praetorium or
something like it to do oral drills. I am interested in learning more about
Iustus' online course.
-translate everything (constitution, laws, declarations)

And all of us who can compose Latin to any extent should submit something to
Audens for the Eagle.
>
> Just about anything else any of you can think of.
>
>
> Gaius Drusus Domitianus
>
That's it for now.

Valete

Gaius Marius Merullus


Subject:	Re: Latin
From:	jmath669642reng@--------)
Date:	Thu, 2 Sep 1999 17:49:57 -0400 (EDT)

Salve Sacro Barese Impero sbi;

Hmmmmmmm!!! I am not sure if I have been agreed with or not. Your
comments regarding Nova Roma are all true and those are the things that
NR is pursuing.

I wrote that Latin is very difficult for me. All languages, not just
Latin. The reason for my post was to ask Latin users on the net to add
English sub-titles to make it easier to determine what is being said
here. I am well aware that English is one of the hardest languages in
the world to learn, nearly as bad as Russian. So I am aware that any
person striving to learn English is going to have a harder time than
someone trying to learn say Spanish, or Esperanto. I think that is a
given in regard to effort expended.

I completely agree that a movement toward Latin usage should be
maintained and strengthened. All I wish to see happen is that it
doesn't not go so fast that those of us who have little or no Latin now
can't keep up, and new people can still join NR with some idea of being
able to correspond with others of like mind.

My friend, I have nothing against using Latin on this net. I just asked
that the users add english sub-titles. If you can't do that because you
have little English I certainly understand. If you will remember I
asked about a translation site on the Internet, and have not yet
recieved an answer. I'm not sure that the Consuls have the
responsibility for building a Latin Vocabulary Page, or that it would
not be much simpler just to get a good Latin--English Dictionary.

My thrust is to open up the net to all NR ciitizens, it always has been
and always will be. Most Americans have receieved a lot of bad press
about this, but I assure you from having visited a good share of
countries of theis world (Italy included) I know that there are some
very good people out there, with some very good ideas, and the sooner
that we can make arrangements for them to be fluent on this net the
better it will be for all of us.

Vale, Respectfully;
Marcus Minucius Audens.

Fair Winds and Following Seas!!!


Subject:	Re: Nundina proxima Event Dates (Posted in the Forum)
From:	SFP55@--------
Date:	Thu, 2 Sep 1999 17:54:32 EDT

In a message dated 8/14/1999 8:21:07 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
<a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=197166104009127132130232203026129208071" >pap--------s@--------</a> wr--------:

<< I'm wondering if Nova Roma will be doing anything special for
the ludi Romani next month (and remember there is a 'mercatus' after the
games).<<
Salvete!
The Aediles planned to hold a contest between 2 pairs. I was fortunate in
getting 4 Pairs for two days. A morning pair and one pair in the afternoon
for both days. I need editors for both days, a different one for each bout,
if I have to.
Technically I'm sponsoring both days, but I'm willing to split credit with
the editor for Service to Rome century points I can't be editor, as I oversee
the games and act as announcer.
There will be also a chariot race. Four factions vying for the God's Honor
The 13th was the sacred day but the holiday could run from the 5th to the 19,
in Imperial times. So right now these are the tentative dates.
Friday the 10th Morning show, 9 AM PDT, 12 PM EDT.
Afternoon show 4 PM PDT, 7 PM EDT
No show Sat. Ancient Religio High Holy Day.
Sunday The 12th Morning show, 9 AM PDT, 12 PM EDT.
Afternoon show 4 PM PDT, 7 PM EDT
Chariot Race: Blues, Reds, Greens, Whites, Wed. 15. 10 AM PDT 1 EDT.
These dates are not firm yet. As we get closer to the events there will be
additional annoucements

The Arena, <a href="http://venus.beseen.com/chat/rooms/u/440638" target="_top" >http://venus.beseen.com/chat/rooms/u/440638</a> is under construction,
but we can still hold events there. I'm involved in an outside court case so
my work on the temples and Arena have fallen to a stand still. As soon as my
work load eases, I'll get back to it.
Valete
Q. Fabius Maximus
Curule Aedile


Subject:	Re: Fasces et "Senior Consul"?
From:	George VanDeWater VanDeWGe@--------
Date:	Thu, 02 Sep 1999 16:05:18 -0600

I too applaude the concept of having the consuls alternate in
executing their duties For much the same reasons as stated.

That there was precedent for the practice in Roma Antiqua makes the idea even more appealing.

As for the fasces perhaps they can be in the form of an icon attached to their correspondence. {!!!}

On a lighter note can any one give me some background on the tribe Galeria?
G. Africanus Secundus


Subject:	Re: [Barbarians]
From:	Steven Rob--------n <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=243232178182078116015056190036129" >amgunn@--------</a>
Date:	Thu, 02 Sep 1999 19:05:35 -0700

Ave Lucius Licinius Varro Murena,

Venator scripsit:

>
> JSA wrote:
>
> > Venator wrote: (snip)
> > So, we're 52 years from a new millenium.
>
> Um, no, you're 52 years from a new century. You're 752
> years from the 3d millennium (i.e., your year 3001).
> Just out of curiousity, do you say 2249 R.E. (I'm not
> making fun here, I'd just like to know).
>

Doh! Boy, I can count. <LOL>
Yes, I do use 2248 RE in place of 1998 CE, 2249 RE - 1999 CE, 2250 RE - 2000
CE, and so forth. (CE referring to the Common Era, AKA the Gregorian
calender.)
> >
> > I do think the Reawakening has to do with people all
> > over the world becoming more aware of their ancestral heritage.
> > (snip)
>
> And I applaud you for this. But, does your beliefs
> include the gods of Persia and India too?
>

I have had many good discussions with other Asatruar on the common origins
in all Indo-European (Indo-Aryan) religious beliefs. Most have centered
around the Vedic era Indian deities, but some attention has been paid to the
Holy Ones of the Persian peoples. Many do know that the Indo-Euro-Aryan
family is broad based indeed, having traveled widely from the ancient
homelands in the Caucasian region of central, western Asia. So, yes, I do
believe in the gods of all peoples.

As I have stated elsewhere, basic human nature in how we observe the
universe around us doesn't change. All peoples come up with some way of
trying to ponder imponderables and to explain the inexplicable. Most tribal
peoples have a god of thunder, a god of rain, a goddess of fruitfulness,
etceteras. Some deific entities will have more or less imporatance based on
the tribe's habitat. In the desert, a god of rain might be seen as a stingy
deity, but of prime importance because water is scarce. In the forest, a
hunting god may be more important because of the method used to obtain food
for the tribe.

We could go on endlessly, so I won't.

Suffice it to say: I am professed to the Aesir and Vanir of the Northern
Mythos, to UllR in particular. I am next most familiar with the Olympian
and Celtic Holy Ones. I have a passing acquaintence with the Mighty Ones of
the further flung branches of the Indo-Euro-Aryan peoples. I try not to be
narrow minded, just fairly narrow in focus.

In Amicus - Venator