| Subject: |
Latin Humour(?) II |
| From: |
"Nicolaus Moravius" n_moravius@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 03 Sep 1999 01:22:24 PDT |
|
Salvete! (As threatened):
Horace, Virgil and Maecenas were enjoying a convivial evening getting drunk
at Maecenas' house. His wife was out of town, and Maecenas (who suffered
from gout and was under strict instructions from the doctor not to drink
anything stronger than barley-water) was taking fulladvantage of his wife's
absence, since being a rather dominant woman she enforced this abstemious
regimen absolutely). The small amphora of Falernian Virgil and Horace had
brought with them had been drunk dry, and the night was still (relatively)
young.
Horace sent his manservant, nicknamed Vox),* out to purchase another couple
of jugs from a nearby caupona.**
Minutes passed, and Vox and wine did not materialise. The poet companions
fretted and fumed. All Maecenas' slaves had been given the night off so that
his indulgence with his friends might remain a secret, so there was no one
else to send out after him. Half an hour passed, and still Vox had not
returned.
"Where in Hades is he?" growled Maecenas.
"Vox dimissa nescit reverti," quipped Horace.***
Virgil snapped (always a stickler for correct nominative case gender
declensions):
"Dimissus!"****
"Where?!" Screamed Maecenas, hiding guiltily with the empty amphora under
the table.
Valete,
Vado.
Footnotes: * Vox = 'Voice' (feminine noun) ** bar *** 'Vox [the voice'] sent
forth, does not know the way back' (old Latin proverb).
**** 'Vox' as a feminine noun should therefore be declined 'dimissa', as
Horace had it, but the slave Vox, as a male, would have to be declined as
'dimissus'. This sounds rather like: "The Mrs." (Eheu!)
|
| Subject: |
Translation on the Web |
| From: |
"Nicolaus Moravius" n_moravius@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 03 Sep 1999 05:36:21 PDT |
|
Salvete! (Health to you all!)
Scripsit Audens:('The Bold' wrote:)
>I understand from my son (a computer hacker par excellence!!) that there
>is a site on the internet that is able to translate a message into
>English. Does anyone know that site address? If the site does exist,
>My feeling is that we should make every effort to get that information
>to all of those who are in foriegn countries (Brazil and Hungary springs
>immediately to mind) so that they may join us on the list in additional
>numbers.
- ita! There's <a href="http://babelfish.altavista.digital.com" target="_top" >http://babelfish.altavista.digital.com</a>
- this engine allows translation by word or text block from English to
Portuguese, Spanish, French, German and Italian, and vice versa (the other
way around).
- I've used it myself (for translating fairly technical stuff from German)
(medical reports) and while it certainly helps I'm not sure I'd recommend it
without at least some basic knowledge of the language you need to translate
from or to. But then, maybe it's very good for basic correspondence.
Loan-words do tend to confuse it.
- for a bit of fun, try translating one of your own posts from your native
language into one of the others, and then back again, and see what happens!
(This is where the 'Babel' bit comes in!). I'd be interested to learn what
other citizens think of it.
- does anyone know of any other translation engines?
Valete (Strength to you all),
Vado.
|
| Subject: |
Re: Fierce Gauls |
| From: |
"Nicolaus Moravius" n_moravius@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 03 Sep 1999 05:46:38 PDT |
|
Salvete iterum! (again!)
Rescripsit Gallio ad Vercingetorix:
>We can offer you Roman citizenship in return for your
>allegiance to Rome. Legion XXIV and NovaRoma
>can always use some fierce warriors in her cause.
>
>Think about it. . . We make this offer only once.
- Hmm. Yes. Vercingetorix - we're a tad short of good auxiliary cavalry at
the moment (I mean, there are a limited number of vacancies in this
prestigious Ala (wing) of the Exercitus (Army) for the right kind of
applicant.
Have you ever considered the advantages of cavalry enlistment? Good pay
(double that of the infantry!), free medical care, contributory pension and
funeral plan, then - after only 25 years' service - the coveted prize of
Roman citizenship, the right to marry your concubine and have legitimate
offspring, an allotment of your very own and even a chance to join the
Equestrian Order and die a respected town-councillor.
Gallio is right. Fortuna knocks at your hut. Go for it, chum!
Valete,
Vado.
|
| Subject: |
Religio Romana -- the future |
| From: |
"Don and Crys Meaker" famromo@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 3 Sep 1999 08:03:04 -0500 |
|
On 3 Sep 99, at 7:13, <a href="mailto:novaroma@--------" >novaroma@--------</a> wrote:
> >
> > Religio Romana--- the future
>
> I'm suddenly more optimistic about this. Not too long ago, I was
> suggesting some online rituals and more web-pages with deity- and
> holiday-specific content, including graphics and poetry (neither of which
> can I produce, by the way - the last poem that I wrote happened to be in
> Latin, but that was about a decade ago). The idea is to give all of us
> more ideas-
>
> i) on how to do more in private, home rituals
> ii) on how/what public rites to conduct in (hopefully numerically large
> someday) groups
>
There are some Saturnalia ideas on the Sodalis Pro Infantia
website ( <a href="http://famromo.wiccan.net" target="_top" >http://famromo.wiccan.net</a> ) and I will be reopening the
Temple of Iuno page as soon as I possibly can (I have a packed
weekend ahead of me, taking our children to meet some civies --
the first and third born Nova Romans will be meeting for the first
time [arranged marriage anyone?] and will not have a bunch of time
to read the digests). I have done a great deal of research on both,
but I cannot take credit for too much. Most of it must go to Q.
Fabius and Vado. Anyway I am working on it.
> I should point out that I have a found the Pantheon section of the website
> very good and helpful to me personally. Ago gratias pontificibus et
> curatoribus et omnibus vobis qui eum fecerunt (Thank you pontifices,
> webmasters and everyone who made it)
Amethystia Crystallina
|
| Subject: |
Lapis' Bulla |
| From: |
"Don and Crys Meaker" famromo@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 3 Sep 1999 09:20:18 -0500 |
|
Salvete,
Lapis and I will be meeting several NR in Dallas/Fort Worth this
weekend and I was wondering if anyone could tell me if it was OK
for Lapis to wear his Bulla? His OdinUncle Venii gave it to him and
he hasn't had occasion to wear it yet. Granted, he is teething now
(2 teeth in the front -- the other one just gave up for later I guess)
and it would likely be used more as a teething toy but it's all he
has in the spirit of NR. Any suggestions?
BTW, we will also be bringing his favorite toy -- his stuffed moose
(thanks again Gens Cassii), which is also being loved half to death
(but it's CLEAN -- baby spit is a wonderful cleanser LOL)
Crys
|
| Subject: |
Translators |
| From: |
"Lucius" vergil@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 3 Sep 1999 10:50:07 -0400 |
|
Salvete,
<a href="http://humanum.arts.cuhk.edu.hk/Lexis/Latin/" target="_top" >http://humanum.arts.cuhk.edu.hk/Lexis/Latin/</a>
<a href="http://babelfish.altavista.digital.com/" target="_top" >http://babelfish.altavista.digital.com/</a>
Message: 7
Date: Thu, 2 Sep 1999 10:21:39 -0400 (EDT)
From: <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=045232113165042200148200112241225012177026038196249130152150" >jmath669642reng@--------</a> (James Mathe--------br>
Subject: Re: List Language
Greetings Vado;
I am very pleased to hear your response and I am in agreemnt with you
about the necessity of latin as a second language to bring NR to the
different countries of the world and to people who have no English.
I understand from my son (a computer hacker par excellence!!) that there
is a site on the internet that is able to translate a message into
English. Does anyone know that site address?
<a href="http://humanum.arts.cuhk.edu.hk/Lexis/Latin/" target="_top" >http://humanum.arts.cuhk.edu.hk/Lexis/Latin/</a>
If the site does exist,
My feeling is that we should make every effort to get that information
to all of those who are in foriegn countries (Brazil and Hungary springs
immediately to mind) so that they may join us on the list in additional
numbers.
As I have said, I have a great dfficulty with languages, but I work a
little bit each day with latin, and am beginning to get a glimmer. The
English translation do in fact help greatly.
Marcus Minucius Audens Fair Winds and Following Seas!!!
Bonam Fortunam
Valete, Lucius Equitius
|
| Subject: |
Re: Latin Humour(?) II |
| From: |
"RMerullo" rmerullo@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 3 Sep 1999 12:40:16 -0400 |
|
Salvete Nicolaue Moravi et alii
Please keep these jokes coming. Every time I read one, I feel more secure
about my own normalcy, knowing that there is at least one person out there
nerdier than I am (does the word nerdy mean anything to British people?) :).
Valete
CMM
>From: "Nicolaus Moravius" <a --------="/post/novaroma?protectID=091089014007127031215056228219114187071048139" >n_moravius@--------</a>
>
>
>"Dimissus!"****
>
>"Where?!" Screamed Maecenas, hiding guiltily with the empty amphora under
>the table.
>
>Valete,
>
>Vado.
>
>Footnotes: * Vox = 'Voice' (feminine noun) ** bar *** 'Vox [the voice']
sent
>forth, does not know the way back' (old Latin proverb).
>**** 'Vox' as a feminine noun should therefore be declined 'dimissa', as
>Horace had it, but the slave Vox, as a male, would have to be declined as
>'dimissus'. This sounds rather like: "The Mrs." (Eheu!)
|
| Subject: |
Announcement from the rogatores |
| From: |
SDmtwi@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 3 Sep 1999 18:02:31 EDT |
|
Salvete omnes.
Tribunus Plebis Antonius Gryllus Graecus recently asked the rogatores to
release some statistics concerning the voter turnout so far. It is my
pleasure to fulfill his request.
As of noon, a.d. III Non. Sep. (Friday, September 03), 53 votes had been cast
in the Comitia Centuriata; nearly 17% of the voting population of 316.
At the same time, 35 votes had been cast in the Comitia Populis Tributa;
slightly more than 15% of the voting population of 227.
Not included in these figures were 6 votes, which were not considered for the
following reasons:
2 votes were cast with no voter identification whatsoever.
3 votes were cast with improper voter codes ("bob", "sex", and one that
was probably a typo).
1 vote was cast using the citizen's tribe, century, and accumulated
points rather than the voter code provided by the censors. If you are the
person who cast that vote, I suggest that you resubmit it using the proper
voter code this time. If you have lost your code, you can ask the censors
for it via email at <a href="/post/--------roma?protectID=219056234112193209090218066036129208" >ce--------s@--------</a>.
I strongly urge those of you who have not yet voted to do so. Freedom, like
muscle, increases with exercise and wanes with neglect.
Valete,
T Labienus Fortunatus
|
| Subject: |
translations on the web |
| From: |
Joan Lansberry or Julia Cachia gallae@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 03 Sep 1999 17:25:54 -0700 |
|
Iulia responds to the question which good Audens has asked about
translation software on the web...
<<a href="http://babelfish.altavista.digital.com/" target="_top" >http://babelfish.altavista.digital.com/</a>> is one I played with in
attempting a Portuguese translation of my page on Cybele. Results: well, it
needs a little work! Something easy might be translated without serious
errors but a specialized text really requires a little collaborative review
by a native speaker, at least to spot and correct any absurdities. I would
venture to say that it accomplishes 90% of the translation for you, so yes,
theoretically one could create all the Nova Roma pages in Portuguese and
Italian versions, subject to correction by one of our cives who speaks the
language perfectly. Alas, no Latin translation software available ... yet!
......................
Colloquy: <<a href="http://www.casagrande.com/~gallae/colloquy.htm" target="_top" >http://www.casagrande.com/~gallae/colloquy.htm</a>>
Joan's "Weighty Matters": <<a href="http://www.casagrande.com/~gallae/dietlog.htm" target="_top" >http://www.casagrande.com/~gallae/dietlog.htm</a>>
Julia: <<a href="http://www.casagrande.com/~gallae/julia.htm" target="_top" >http://www.casagrande.com/~gallae/julia.htm</a>>
Joan's "Out On a Limb":<<a href="http://www.casagrande.com/~gallae/joanalll.html" target="_top" >http://www.casagrande.com/~gallae/joanalll.html</a>>
|
| Subject: |
Seeking citizenship |
| From: |
Richard Persky ouroboros@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 3 Sep 1999 20:58:15 -0500 |
|
Salvete, omnes!
I intend to apply for Nova Roman citizenship once such
applications are once again being accepted, and have some questions
about the process. In particular, is there an established protocol
for choosing or being chosen by a gens?
I suppose that a brief self-introduction is also in order;
I'm a student in my fourth year (of five, and hopefully no longer) at
the University of Texas at Austin, majoring in Classics; my chief
academic interest is history and historiography, and I'm trying to
put off the decision to specialize in Greece or Rome as long as
possible. :) I discovered Nova Roma while searching for Classical
Pagan resources on the WWW.
Valete,
Richard
|
| Subject: |
Re: Seeking citizenship |
| From: |
"RCW" alexious@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 3 Sep 1999 19:18:51 -0700 |
|
----- Original Message -----
Fro--------ichard Persky <a href="/post/novaro--------rotectID=165075091007093190218149000248124208071048" >ouroboros@--------</a>
To: <a href="mailto:novaroma@--------" >novaroma@--------</a>
Sent: Friday, September 03, 1999 6:58 PM
Subject: [novaroma] Seeking citizenship
> Fro--------ichard Persky <a href="/post/novaro--------rotectID=165075091007093190218149000248124208071048" >ouroboros@--------</a>
>
> Salvete, omnes!
>
> I intend to apply for Nova Roman citizenship once such
> applications are once again being accepted, and have some questions
> about the process. In particular, is there an established protocol
> for choosing or being chosen by a gens?
No, what you can do is you can either contact a Paterfamilias if you are
interested in joining a Gens...or you can start your own Gens. Most of our
Gens pater's are very response. :)
> I suppose that a brief self-introduction is also in order;
> I'm a student in my fourth year (of five, and hopefully no longer) at
> the University of Texas at Austin, majoring in Classics; my chief
> academic interest is history and historiography, and I'm trying to
> put off the decision to specialize in Greece or Rome as long as
> possible. :) I discovered Nova Roma while searching for Classical
> Pagan resources on the WWW.
Great....also, visit the Taverna, someone is almost always there. Also you
can e-mail anyone of us...for more info.
L. Cornelius Sulla
Consul Elect et Senator
Paterfamilias of the Gens Cornelia
> Valete,
> Richard
>
> --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ----------------------------
>
> Congratulations to THE_COALITION. Our latest ONElist of the week.
> For full story and to submit yours, go to
> <a href=" <a href="http://clickme.onelist.com/ad/ootw24" target="_top" >http://clickme.onelist.com/ad/ootw24</a> ">Click Here</a>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
|
| Subject: |
Fwd: Not so "Noble" After All! |
| From: |
Steven Robinson amgunn@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 03 Sep 1999 22:12:31 -0700 |
|
Avete Omnes;
Venator scripsit:
For you onophiles out there, thought you might appreciate this article I
found on one of the winemaking newsgroups.
In Amicus - Venator
"Freedom is a religious matter." - Stephen McNallen
========================================================
>
> Subject: Not so "Noble" After All!
> Newsgroups: rec.crafts.winemaking
>
> DNA traces humble origins of noble wines
>
> Sacre bleu! Scorned grape spawned French vintages
>
> ASSOCIATED PRESS
>
> WASHINGTON, Sept. 2 - Grapes that make some of the noblest wines
> of France - from such places as Champagne and Burgundy - originated from a
> peasant grape variety so humble that it once was banned, according to a
> genetic researcher
> CAROLE MEREDITH, a professor at the University of California at Davis, said a
> study shows that 16 premier wines of France were originally produced by the genetic
> pairing of the classic Pinot variety with the obscure Gouais blanc, a grape that has
> been scorned by most winemakers for centuries and banned from France.
> "It is shocking that all of those varieties did spring from the same two
> parents, and ... that one of the parents is a mediocre grape with such a bad
> reputation that it was abandoned," said Meredith. She is the senior author of a study
> appearing in Friday's issue of the journal Science.
> Wine experts were surprised and amused that wines held in such high regard,
> such as Chardonnay and Gamay noir, had such humble origins.
> In looking for the genetic ancestors, the researchers analyzed DNA taken from
> the leaves of 300 varieties of grapes, including some that are no longer commonly
> grown. The sample for Gouais blanc was obtained from a botanical archive maintained
> near Montpellier, France, by the Institut National de la Recherche Agronomique.
> They used the classic DNA profiling techniques now widely used to link parents
> and children, or to connect a suspect with specimens from a crime scene.
> Meredith said the surprising result was that Pinot and the humble Gouais blanc
> were the parents of all the grape varieties used to make 16 of the most popular wines
> from northeast France, an area that includes Burgundy and Champagne.
>
> © 1999 Associated Press. All rights reserved.
> ---------------------------------------
|
| Subject: |
Fwd: Book Web Sites |
| From: |
"Dr. J. S. Arkenberg" varromurena@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 3 Sep 1999 20:57:17 -0700 (PDT) |
|
I thought most of you might appreciate having a list
of book sites.
L. Licinius Varro Murena
> Here is the latest list of book web sites.
>
> US, UK, Canada, Australia
> www.abebooks.com Individual sellers/stores post
> here
> www.academicbooks.com Theology and philosophy books
> www.academy-bookstore.com Christian/theological
> books
> www.allchristianbooks.com Christian/theological
> books
> www.acses.com Excellent comparative site
> www.alibris.com Formerly interloc.com;
> out-of-prints
> www.barnesandnoble.com
> www.berkelouw.com.au Large Australian site
> www.bibliocity.com
> www.bibliofind.com Large new an used site--I
> usually start here
> www.bookcloseouts.com Discontinued titles--some
> real bargains here
> www.books.com Medium sized new and used site
> www.booksforscholars.com Excellent site for Irish
> and Welsh academic
> works
> bookshop.blackwells.co.uk Large UK book service
> www.bookshop.co.uk The Internet Bookshop
> www.borders.com
> www2.buy.com/book/buybooks.html Large site for newer
> books
> www.catholicbooks.org Non-profit religious site
> with many links
> www.coop-bookshop.com.au Australian academic site
> www.dillons.co.uk Large UK site
> www.gutenbergholdings.com Used, out-of-prints and
> rare books
> www.heffers.co.uk UK shop--offers free searches
> www.indigo.ca Large Canadian site
> www.kingbooks.com Mid-sized Seattle-based site
> www.powells.com Large used book chain
> www.ramsaybooks.com Canadian antiquarian
> www.spree.com Large (annoying) new book site
> www.thebookplace.com Mid-sized UK site
> www.thebookweb.com
> www.waterstones.co.uk UK shop--offers free searches
> www.whallenbooks.com
> www.wordsworth.com Very large site, mostly new
> www.zubal.com Antiquarian, used and rare
>
> Germany and the Netherlands
> www.antiqbook.com Dutch out-of-print site
> www.antiqnet.de German antiquarian
> www.books.de Excellent German site
> www.libri.de Smaller German site
> www.zvab.com German anitquarian
> www1.uni-bremen.de/~phil/www4.htm
> One of the best sites! Contains search forms for
> German, Italian, US,
> UK, and French sites.
>
> Italy and France
> www.aab.it American bookshop in Rome
> www.alapage.com Large French site
> www.bol.com UK, German and French offerings
> www.casalini.it Large Italian site, mostly new
> www.galaxidion.com French antiquarian
> www.internetbookshop.it Excellent site for Italian
> used and
> out-of-prints
> www.loescher.it Hard to use combination of several
> Italian shops
> www.edisons.it
>
> Greece
> w4u.eexi.gr/~nbfg "Books from Greece", a new site
> for Greek books
>
> Other helpful sites
>
> www.aaup.princeton.com Association of American
> Univeristy Presses
> www.camlab.ox.ac.uk/archive/publishers.html List of
> academic publishers
> www.cup.org Cambridge University Press
> www.home1.gte.net/mcorphan/books.html Excellent
> listing of on-line
> bookstores and bookshops who are on-line
> www.oup.co.uk Oxford University Press
>
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Bid and sell for free at <a href="http://auctions.yahoo.com" target="_top" >http://auctions.yahoo.com</a>
|
| Subject: |
Re: Fwd: Book Web Sites |
| From: |
"RCW" alexious@-------- |
| Date: |
Fri, 3 Sep 1999 21:20:58 -0700 |
|
Salve L. Licinius Varro Murena et al.
Thank you for posting this list of online book store resources, these sites
have been very helpful.... and a great resource tool for those of us who are
building our own personal libraries. :)
L. Cornelius Sulla
Consul Elect et Senator
----- Original Message -----
From: Dr. J. S. Arkenberg <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=081166091180193192130061163101147165026048139046" >varromurena@--------</a>
To: Nova Roma <a href="mailto:novaroma@--------" >novaroma@--------</a>; Hellenion <a href="mailto:hellenion@--------" >hellenion@--------</a>
Sent: Friday, September 03, 1999 8:57 PM
Subject: [novaroma] Fwd: Book Web Sites
> From: "Dr. J. S. Arkenberg" <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=081166091180193192130061163101147165026048139046" >varromurena@--------</a>
>
> I thought most of you might appreciate having a list
> of book sites.
>
> L. Licinius Varro Murena
>
> > Here is the latest list of book web sites.
> >
> > US, UK, Canada, Australia
> > www.abebooks.com Individual sellers/stores post
> > here
> > www.academicbooks.com Theology and philosophy books
> > www.academy-bookstore.com Christian/theological
> > books
> > www.allchristianbooks.com Christian/theological
> > books
> > www.acses.com Excellent comparative site
> > www.alibris.com Formerly interloc.com;
> > out-of-prints
> > www.barnesandnoble.com
> > www.berkelouw.com.au Large Australian site
> > www.bibliocity.com
> > www.bibliofind.com Large new an used site--I
> > usually start here
> > www.bookcloseouts.com Discontinued titles--some
> > real bargains here
> > www.books.com Medium sized new and used site
> > www.booksforscholars.com Excellent site for Irish
> > and Welsh academic
> > works
> > bookshop.blackwells.co.uk Large UK book service
> > www.bookshop.co.uk The Internet Bookshop
> > www.borders.com
> > www2.buy.com/book/buybooks.html Large site for newer
> > books
> > www.catholicbooks.org Non-profit religious site
> > with many links
> > www.coop-bookshop.com.au Australian academic site
> > www.dillons.co.uk Large UK site
> > www.gutenbergholdings.com Used, out-of-prints and
> > rare books
> > www.heffers.co.uk UK shop--offers free searches
> > www.indigo.ca Large Canadian site
> > www.kingbooks.com Mid-sized Seattle-based site
> > www.powells.com Large used book chain
> > www.ramsaybooks.com Canadian antiquarian
> > www.spree.com Large (annoying) new book site
> > www.thebookplace.com Mid-sized UK site
> > www.thebookweb.com
> > www.waterstones.co.uk UK shop--offers free searches
> > www.whallenbooks.com
> > www.wordsworth.com Very large site, mostly new
> > www.zubal.com Antiquarian, used and rare
> >
> > Germany and the Netherlands
> > www.antiqbook.com Dutch out-of-print site
> > www.antiqnet.de German antiquarian
> > www.books.de Excellent German site
> > www.libri.de Smaller German site
> > www.zvab.com German anitquarian
> > www1.uni-bremen.de/~phil/www4.htm
> > One of the best sites! Contains search forms for
> > German, Italian, US,
> > UK, and French sites.
> >
> > Italy and France
> > www.aab.it American bookshop in Rome
> > www.alapage.com Large French site
> > www.bol.com UK, German and French offerings
> > www.casalini.it Large Italian site, mostly new
> > www.galaxidion.com French antiquarian
> > www.internetbookshop.it Excellent site for Italian
> > used and
> > out-of-prints
> > www.loescher.it Hard to use combination of several
> > Italian shops
> > www.edisons.it
> >
> > Greece
> > w4u.eexi.gr/~nbfg "Books from Greece", a new site
> > for Greek books
> >
> > Other helpful sites
> >
> > www.aaup.princeton.com Association of American
> > Univeristy Presses
> > www.camlab.ox.ac.uk/archive/publishers.html List of
> > academic publishers
> > www.cup.org Cambridge University Press
> > www.home1.gte.net/mcorphan/books.html Excellent
> > listing of on-line
> > bookstores and bookshops who are on-line
> > www.oup.co.uk Oxford University Press
> >
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