Forum Romanum


Subject:	Re: Stranger Than Faction
From:	"Don and Crys Meaker" famromo@--------
Date:	Sun, 2 Jan 2000 08:23:15 -0600

On 20 Dec 99, at 5:58, Nicolaus Moravius wrote:

> Factions don't. They tend to keep their deliberations
> and membership quiet. Another difference is that anyone can claim to be,
> or accuse another of being, a mamber of a faction, and either is hard to
> prove or disprove - unlike party membership.

I don't know about all these "factions" but the one *I* was a
member of was a figment of some paranoid person or other. First I
heard of it was a phone call from Sulla telling me that he and I were
members of this "faction" because 1. I had complete and total
control of the Back Alley, which the Senate of the time didn't seem
to like or appreciate. and 2. because I put Sulla in charge of said
Alley when my computer went kerfluey. If the paranoid person
mentioned above had taken his medication, this "faction" stuff
never would have been created. He wanted there to be a faction
and so we played into his paranoid delusion.

Pax Vobiscum,
Crys
Great OneLists <G>
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Subject:	Re: Re: Stranger Than Faction
From:	"Don and Crys Meaker" famromo@--------
Date:	Sun, 2 Jan 2000 10:57:25 -0600

On 20 Dec 99, at 11:38, RMerullo wrote:

> Salvete Crystallina et alii
>
> I figured it out!
>
> The factions must be the geographic cliques, you know, the East Coast
> Clique/Faction, the West Coast Clique/Faction, the Britannia
> Clique/Faction. So the Populares must be the West Coast Clique/Faction,
> right?
>

I thought that too, but I would up in the West Coast bunch while I
lived in the flippin Midwest!!! Maybe I'm special (ya'll know I *think*
I am <VBG>).

> (sniff sniff, boo hoo) I guess that I can't be a popularis. I live and
> work on the East Coast :(. So, I must commit myself to eternal struggle
> against the evildoers of the West Coast Faction, the Britannia Faction,
> and any other factions that may rear their hideous heads over Nova Roma's
> future (except for the East Coast Faction, they are the good guys and
> gals, because they live within driving distance of me).
>

Maybe you could be part of the Faction of your choice someday.
Now THAT would be democracy in NR <G>.

> Marce Cassi, Deci Iuni, do we have a manifesto, platform....we must surely
> have at least some demands? How about we sponsor an East Coast Hunger
> Strike until the NR Senate agrees to strike the letter "y" from the
> English Language?
>
> Valete et ridete bene
>
> C Marius Merullus

Hmmmmmm ...... that could be taken as an attempt to rid NR of
people who use "y" in their name (of course *I* spring to mind <G>).

You guys don't think you'll get rid of me THAT easily, do you???

Pax Vobiscum,
Crystallina Materna (off to take her medication <G>)
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Subject:	Oath of Office-Governor of Sarmatia
From:	"A. Artorius Arius Sarmaticus" sarmaticus@--------
Date:	Sun, 02 Jan 2000 15:08:46 YEKT

I, Artyom E. Kouzminykh/Aulus Artorius Arius Sarmaticus do hereby solemnly
swear to uphold the honor of Nova Roma and to act always in the best
interests of the people and the Senate of Nova Roma.

As a magistrate of Nova Roma, I, Aulus Artorius Arius Sarmaticus swear to
honor the Gods and Goddesses of Rome in my public dealings and to pursue the
Roman Virtues in my public and private life.

I, Aulus Artorius Arius Sarmaticus swear to uphold and defend the Religio
Romana as the State Religion of Nova Roma and swear never to act in a way
that would threaten its status as the State Religion.

I, Aulus Artorius Arius Sarmaticus swear to protect and defend the
Constitution of Nova Roma.

I, Aulus Artorius Arius Sarmaticus further swear to fulfill the obligations
and responsibilities of the office of Governor of Sarmatia to the best of my
abilities.

On my honor as a Citizen of Nova Roma and in the presence of the
Gods and Goddesses of the Roman people and by their will and
favor, do I accept the position of Governor of Sarmatia and
all the rights, privileges, obligations and responsibilities attendant
thereto.

AVLVS ARTORIVS ARIVS SARMATICVS, CIVIS ET BARBARVS NOVAE ROMAE

LIBERTAS INAESTIMABILIS RES EST

VALE IN PACE


Subject:	Re: Digest Number 683
From:	william wheeler wuffa@--------
Date:	Sun, 02 Jan 2000 02:20:24 -0800

>

Salve Jordi A Reus
Marcius Cornelius Felix pontitff greets you.
have you been to the web site of NR yet? Nova Roma: Rome Reborn
welcome to our list.
Vale

> ________________________________
> _______________________________________________________________________________
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sat, 1 Jan 2000 19:02:32 -0500
> From: Jordi A Reus <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=045233091150082209184168000248155208071048" >--------ireus@--------</a>
> Subject: Hello
>
> Thank you Senator,
>
> I am not sure yet what it means to join Nova Romans, but I will learn to
> the best of my ability and hope to contribute postively, otherwise I will
> simply remain silent and continue learning.
>
> This is my third post here. I am a subsriber to other onelists, but they
> are all Catalan and Italian lists. Perhaps you have seen my name in
> those?
>
> I did not choose a Roman name because I have not decided on one yet.
> Also, I wished to introduce myself with my family name to show that
> though I appreciate the government and protection Roma offers, and I wish
> to learn from the great Roman thinkers, I am still only a Laietan, a
> citizen of the Llobregat valley where L'Ebre River flows. My heart, my
> language, even my future is Roman, but my blood is Celtic, Laietan and
> Iberic. Jordi does mean "of the earth/farmer", the Italians would say
> "Giorgio" and the Greeks would say "George" and it means the same thing.
> I confess I am not familiar enough with the language of my Senator to
> know how to properly write my name in Latin.
>
> Deu vos guard.
>
> ________________________________________________________________
> YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!
> Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!
> Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit:
> <a href="http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj" target="_top" >http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj</a>.
>
> _______________________________________________________________________________


Subject:	Gratias - annus novum faustum vobis!
From:	"A. Artorius Arius Sarmaticus" sarmaticus@--------
Date:	Sun, 02 Jan 2000 17:58:24 YEKT

Salvete quirites et annus novum faustum vobis!

Sending this just to express my thanks to the Senatus Populesque Romani, to
all the senators who voted for establishing the new Provincia Sarmatia (and
even one who voted against too) - hope I'll be able to justify your trust.
Gratiam vodis ago!

Let this be the year without "Civil Wars" and "disagreements", the year to
made Nova Roma greater than She ever was!

AVLVS ARTORIVS ARIVS SARMATICVS, CIVIS ET BARBARVS NOVAE ROMAE ETIAM
PROPRAETOR SARMATIAM PROVINCIAM

LIBERTAS INAESTIMABILIS RES EST

VALE IN PACE


Subject:	New Year greating in English&Latino Moderne
From:	"A. Artorius Arius Sarmaticus" sarmaticus@--------
Date:	Sun, 02 Jan 2000 18:23:06 YEKT

Salvete,

Just a little bit of your attention for some more New, 2753 a.u.c., year
wishes:

Let there be respect for the New Rome,
Peace for Her people,
Love in our lives,
Delight in the good,
Forgiveness of past wrongs,
And from now on
A new start

Sia le respecto pro Nova Roma,
Pace pro gentes sua,
Amore in vitas nostras,
Delecto in le bon,
Pardono de males ancian,
Et ab nunc - con
Un initio nove!

AVLVS ARTORIVS ARIVS SARMATICVS, CIVIS ET BARBARVS NOVAE ROMAE ETIAM
PROPRAETOR SARMATIAM PROVINCIAM

LIBERTAS INAESTIMABILIS RES EST

VALE IN PACE


Subject:	Adsum!
From:	"Martins-Esteves" esteves@--------
Date:	Sun, 2 Jan 2000 11:29:49 -0200

Avete Quirites!
Avete amici!

I am back. Actually I allways followed the debates on the List, but was not
able to participate. A huge amount of work has waited for me all the year at
University and at work, and I couldn't be more active. But the first
semester of 2000 shall be better (at least I hope so).

Thanks to Marco Minucio Audenti for the warm wellcome! I wish you and
everybody a wonderful year.

Valete

Titus Horatius Atticus


Subject:	Pagan festival in Copacabana
From:	"Martins-Esteves" esteves@--------
Date:	Sun, 2 Jan 2000 12:13:20 -0200

Avete Quirites!

As some of you may know, I live in a small city near the babilonic Rio de
Janeiro. At the end of every year thousands of people gather on Copacabana
beach to await the Neu Year. This time there were much more than three
million there!

It is part of the tradition to send offerings to a sea goddes, named
Iemanj�. The funny is that Brazil is the biggest catholic country in the
world, but the amount of polytheistic souls here is huge. That's an obvious
influence of the afro culture inherited from the slaves, but it is not like
Voodoo or the Cuban Santer�a. There is such a deep inculturation between the
slaves' religion and the Iberic catholicism, that is hard to recognise an
African deity by its idol, as almost all of then are white.

Anyway, it is quite touching for a pagan like me to watch thousand of men
and women offering flowers, wine or little wooden ships full of gifts to a
Goddes, whose idol is to be mistaken for a Nereid...

May Neputnus bless us all

Valete

T. Horatius Atticus


Subject:	Trying to figure propitious days.
From:	"Caius Fabius" spqr_hq@--------
Date:	Sun, 02 Jan 2000 21:48:46 GMT

Congratulations to the Consuls, Senators and Augars, And to the people of
Roma, may we have a wonderful new year. This is year 2753 since the
founding of the city? Is that right?

Does anyone have a URL for a calendar for figuring out which days are good
for business, weddings, sacrifices, etc.?

I am a bit slow, out here in the provinces and need all the help I can get.

Caius Fabius


Subject:	Mus incolumnis (The Unharmed Rat)
From:	"Bradius V. Maurus III" bvm3@--------
Date:	Sun, 02 Jan 2000 23:12:32 +0100

Salvete omnes Novi Romani!

It was with a sense of the greatest relief and satisfaction that I read of the sparing of the life of the rat. I have yet to
be granted citizenship, and perhaps I do not yet have the right to an opinion, but I have faith in the new Censorate and hope to
be officially a citizen soon, so forgive my presumption, if you will.

As a former teacher of (comparative) Religious Studies at the University of Hawai'i and current Treasurer of the
international organisation for comparative religion l'Association Internationale d'�tude des Enseignements Spirituels et
Th�ologiques, I take a keen interest in the Religio Romana. I was very impressed by the suggestion of Pierbarus Ullerius Venator
that an effigy of a bull might be used. 'Effigies' is indeed a good old Latin word, and the Romans (as the Greeks) used them for
various religious purposes. This would still leave the necessity of finding some appropriate divinatory method. Perhaps one
could buy chickens to watch them peck, or observe the flight of birds. 'Auspices' indeed is a term from 'avis-spicere', "to
watch birds". That is such an eco-friendly idea - and one which requires neither blood nor special equipment - that it might
especially appeal to Novi Romani. As to that the religious authrities of Nova Roma would have to rule, of course.

Animal sacrifice was very important in Old Rome (and Greece), but no more so than to the Jews, who successfully outgrew it.
Circumstances (i.e. Romans!) destroyed their Temple, and they came to find the associated sacrifices spiritually unnecessary.
The Religio Romana was deprived of its temples (by the Christians basically), and might learn in a similar way. Indeed the
Pythagoreans in antiquity were downright vegetarians, and Ovid in Book I of the Metamorphoses gives a picture of the diet in the
Golden Age, which is perfectly vegetarian. In Book XV, furthermore, Pythagoras is made to say:

"Thankless indeed was he, and undeserving of the gift of corn, who first had the heart to lift the weight of the curved plow
from his beast's neck, and slay the ox who had tilled his fields, bringing down his ax on the work-worn necks of the cattle with
whose help he had so often broken up the hard earth and planted so many crops.
"Not content with committing such crimes, men have enrolled the very gods as their partners in wickedness, and suppose that
the divinities in heaven take pleasure in the slaying of patient bullocks!"
(Translation of Mary M. Innes)

One therefore has a lot of classical support for an anti-animal-sacrifice position in the Religio Romana. Indeed, ancient
Rome very obviously developed over its centuries of existence in a humane and humanitarian direction, despite its later problems
with authoritarian government, the economy and the barbarians. Slavery, for example, accepted from the first, by the time of the
last legal codifiers was officially regarded as an unnatural institution (although still practised...). That we today have an
extension to animals of that feeling of widening humanitarian sympathy is very much in the tradition of the best in Roman
humanistic civilisation. (Not especially due to Christianity, for although the Christians abolished animal sacrifice due to
their having their own special Sacrifice, otherwise Christians were until the 19th century not noticably more kind to animals
than ancient pagans.) Dixi. (I.e., I have said what I wanted to say.)

Congratulations to the new sponsus and sponsa! Saturnalia is surely the perfect time for Novi Romani to get engaged. How
romantic!

Atque omnibus Novis Romanis annum faustum felicemque exopto! (And to all New Romans I wish an auspicious and happy year!)

Ab manu M. Aurelii Formosani
Kandersinone-Coseliae (in Silesi� Superiori)


Subject:	Re: Trying to figure propitious days.
From:	"Labienus" labienus@--------
Date:	Sun, 2 Jan 2000 20:10:35 -0600

Salve Caie Fabi.

> This is year 2753 since the founding of the city? Is that right?

Yes. 2753 AUC.

> Does anyone have a URL for a calendar for figuring out which days are good
> for business, weddings, sacrifices, etc.?

The best calendar I know of on-line is at
<a href="http://www.clubs.psu.edu/aegsa/rome/romec.html" target="_top" >http://www.clubs.psu.edu/aegsa/rome/romec.html</a>.

Vale,
T Labienus Fortunatus


Subject:	1999 Provincia Reports
From:	jmath669642reng@--------)
Date:	Sun, 2 Jan 2000 21:25:54 -0500 (EST)

Salvete, Provincial Propraetors and Proconsuls;

Q. Fabius Maximus and I wish to thank the Out-going Propraetor of the
California Provincia and the Proconsul of the Nova Britania Provincia
for their timely and interesting annual provincial reports. The Consuls
wish to encourage all Propraetors and Proconsuls to report the status of
their provinces.

Magistrates; communication is the life blood of this micro-nation. With
our face-to-face opportunities limited by time, distance and finance,
the extended effort of communication between the government of Nova Roma
and her Provinces is doubly important. I ask that you take a moment to
review the ideas and efforts of your sister provincias and use those
ideas that you may in order to increase communication within your
boundaries.

--Who within your boundaries are awaiting confirmation for citizenship?

--Who within your boundaries have some ideas that can be put to work in
making the world more aware of Nova Roma and your Provincial presence?

--Who within your boundaries have questions regarding their Provincia
and Nova Roma.

--The Consuls have welcomed all the new Propraetors appointed of late
and although it may be too early to make a report of your provincia, a
message outlinng your ideas and future goals for your provincia would be
most welcome!!

--Remember also as you face the obvious problems of distance, and sheer
volumes of things to do as a Propraetor, others all over the world face
the same types of problems, and many are making headway against them.
Open a communication and share ideas and problems. Take a moment and
make a list of the propraetors and their E-Mail addresses. Drop them a
line, ask a question, share a problem, just say hi. I am sure that you
will be glad that you did!!!!

Valete, Respectfully
Marcus Minucius Audens
Consul

Fair Winds and Following Seas!!!


Subject:	Re: 1999 Provincia Reports
From:	Razenna razenna@--------
Date:	Sun, 02 Jan 2000 19:10:30 -0800

I wish to give the credit for the idea of the Provincial Reports to
the man
who gave me the idea. G. Triumphius Cicero.
He promised a report, (after he finishes unpacking I gather) and I
thought
It was a great idea. Particularly since I have left stepped down from
that job.

Valete.
C. Aelius Ericius.


Subject:	Re: on the meaning of sacrifice
From:	"Gaius Marius Merullus" rmerullo@--------
Date:	Sun, 2 Jan 2000 22:07:05 -0500

Salvete Cassia et alii

Have no fear! Nova Roma does not condone, sponsor or conduct animal
sacrifice.

But, I would like to stand up for that rat for a second here. You say that
a pile of 20's is more valuable, and maybe it is. Given the choice between
the two, I'd probably take the 20's.

However, just because one person doesn't value the rat's life enough to
consider it a worthy sacrifice, does not mean that someone else couldn't
value the rat sufficiently to offer it.

You speak of slaughtering animals as though it were as part of the
irrevocable past as the Colossus of Rhodes, yet most people in my circle
have been feasting on meat quite a bit for the last week or so. There is
still value in raising animals, we need animals as much now as we ever did.

Australicus spoke of "the agrarian society". Most of the people here may
not live in agrarian societies, in that our economies and spheres of
activity contain much more than ancient ones did, yet we all eat food. Even
those of us who are vegetarians must eat cereals, grains, beans whatever.
Societies can be agrarian, or agrarian+, but, as far as I know, they cannot
"get past" the agrarian part. That we ignore the land, the crops and the
animals and leave it all to someone else's toil does not equate with our
elevating ourselves above it. It is part of my mission in life, in fact, to
re-establish a strong bond with the land.

I think that there is nothing wrong with sacrificing meat, as long as the
one doing the sacrificing does so with the right intention, that is to offer
something of real value, from his/her perspective, to a deity.

And, as poor a sacrifice as a lab rat might be, it couldn't be any worse
than the slice of multigrain bread I tried last Kalends.

Valete

C Marius Merullus

:From: <--------ef="/post/nov----------------otectID=173075066165082116036098035140229088239144044009209130152" >Justini--------si--------..</--------;
:
:On a personal basis, I find it somewhat disturbing to realize I've joined
an
:organization that would condone animal sacrifice. I had assumed that would
:be up there with slavery & the subordination of women as institutions best
:discarded.
:
:Justinia Cassia
:


Subject:	In Senatum veniens
From:	"Gaius Marius Merullus" rmerullo@--------
Date:	Sun, 2 Jan 2000 22:45:00 -0500

Salvete Novoromani

Magnopere sentio religionem erga Novam Romam in Senatu Perficere omnia ut
nostra res publica in omne tempus crescat conabor Di immortales nos
adiuvent

I appreciate the sacred responsibility toward Nova Roma given to me as a new
senator. I shall strive to do my best to see that our Republic thrives
forever. May the immortal gods favor us.

Valete

C Marius Merullus