Subject:	Re: Re: Roman citizenship (Historical)
From:	"A. Artorius Arius Sarmaticus" <a --------="/post/novaroma?protectID=061166091213158134036102228219114187071048139" >sarmaticus@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 21 Jan 2000 08:54:47 YEKT

Salve,

I'm sorry again I am mistaken in this, and happy I am mistaken, too.

SARMATICUS


>From: "RMerullo" <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=194232192180194153138149203043129208071" >rmerullo@--------</a>
>Reply-To: <a href="mailto:novaroma@--------" >novaroma@--------</a>
>To: <a href="mailto:novaroma@--------" >novaroma@--------</a>
>Subject: [novaroma] Re: Roman citizenship (Historical)
>Date: Thu, 20 Jan 2000 13:58:53 -0500
>
>From: "RMerullo" <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=194232192180194153138149203043129208071" >rmerullo@--------</a>
>
>Salvete Aule Artori et alii
>
>I wouldn't worry about exclusion. Everyone seems to share the common
>interest of bringing more, not less, people into Nova Roma. I haven't read
>a single line anywhere here that would suggest that limiting citizenship on
>any racial, ethnic or other grounds had even been brought up for
>discussion.
>
>The subject of some of this thread, however, has been historical criteria
>for Roman citizenship. And those criteria were, relative to say, modern US
>criteria, pretty narrow and exclusionary. One could argue whether the
>criteria remained relatively narrow and exclusionary after Caracalla's
>edict, but, even if they did not, the segment of Roma's timeline remaining
>thereafter is much smaller than that preceding. So it is accurate enough
>to
>say that, for most of the Roman period, citizenship criteria were narrow
>and
>exclusionary.
>
>Valete
>
>C Marius Merullus
>
>
> >From: "A. Artorius Arius Sarmaticus" <a --------="/post/novaroma?protectID=061166091213158134036102228219114187071048139" >sarmaticus@--------</a>
> >
> >errr...It looks like I missed something importanant... Am I mistaken, or
>is
> >there anybody in NR planning to accept in NR only people of certain
> >ethnicity? And exclude people of "not proper" ethnicity, race, colour,
>etc.?
> >Or may be they want to make a SLAVES out of us???
> >
> >I hoped this racist, fascist stuff would never arise in NR again... and
> >therefore I joined her. Did I hope in vain?
> >
>
>
>
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Subject:	Re: Welcome was Roman citizenship (Historical)
From:	"A. Artorius Arius Sarmaticus" <a --------="/post/novaroma?protectID=061166091213158134036102228219114187071048139" >sarmaticus@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 21 Jan 2000 08:58:36 YEKT

"Salvete Gnaee Pompei" IMHO.

SARMATICUS

>From: "RMerullo" <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=194232192180194153138149203043129208071" >rmerullo@--------</a>
>Reply-To: <a href="mailto:novaroma@--------" >novaroma@--------</a>
>To: <a href="mailto:novaroma@--------" >novaroma@--------</a>
>Subject: [novaroma] Welcome was Roman citizenship (Historical)
>Date: Thu, 20 Jan 2000 14:09:18 -0500
>
>From: "RMerullo" <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=194232192180194153138149203043129208071" >rmerullo@--------</a>
>
>Salvete Gnaee Pompeie et alii
>
>Welcome to Nova Roma. I hope that you find your experience here
>productive.
>
>I am afraid that I might have butchered the declension of your name. Can
>you help me out with the vocatives of Gnaeus and Pompeius? The i has a
>consonantal quality to it that would seem to warrant exception from the
>standard rule of dropping the us.
>
>On the subject of names, why bother signing off "humbly" with a name like
>Pompeius Magnus :)?
>
>Valete
>
>C Marius Merullus
>kind of into trivial points of Latin grammar, as may be sort of evident
>from
>this message
>
>
>
> >From: RCL <a href="/--------/novaroma?--------ectID=034166018056078209025218055036129208" >lavenrc@--------</a>
> >
>
> >
> >Vale, humbly,
> >Gn. Pompeius Magnus
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
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Subject:	A Problem with Paterfamilias of Gens Valeria
From:	"A. Artorius Arius Sarmaticus" <a --------="/post/novaroma?protectID=061166091213158134036102228219114187071048139" >sarmaticus@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 21 Jan 2000 16:27:38 YEKT

Salve Corneli Sulla!

Well, it is exactly you who can help, I believe. The problem is Marcus
Valerius Corvinus, a cive from Sarmatia (the only one except for me so
far...;-)) was (as we suppose, illegally;-)) deprived of his rights of being
a Paterfamilias of Gens Valeria. He was a citezen for rather a long period
of time, much longer than me anyway. He still is indicated in Album Civium,
but no longer is in Album Gentium. Instead it is honorable citizen Marcus
Valerius Quadrasus from Gaul who is indicated as the Paterfamilias of Gens
Valeria.

But it is Alexander Probus, the Propraetor of Pannonia, who can confirm that
Marcus Valerius Corvinus *was* a Paterfamilias of the only one Gens Valeria
as for 7/10/1998, and also as for 7/01/1999 he still was a Paterfamilias of
Gens Valeria (Sarmatia) and there also was a Gens Valeria from Britannia,
but no any other Gens Valeria, particulary from Gaul. This all can be easily
checked, I believe.

We also both are sure that Marcus Valerius Corvinus had never ever refused
from being the Paterfamilias of Gens Valeria.

The question is: that has heppend with Gens Valeria (Sarmatia)? And if Gens
Valeria (Sarmatia) and Gens Valeria (Gaul) are the one whole, why the
Paterfamilias of it is Marcus Valerius Quadrasus from Gaul, and not Marcus
Valerius Corvinus from Sarmatia, who, I stress, *was* the Paterfamilias of
Gens Valeria earlier?

Could you help as with this? Whom am I or Marcus Valerius Corvinus to
contact additionaly? Could this be a technical mistake of the webmaster?

I feel that I, being a Propraetor of Sarmatia, must clarify this question
myself and try to defend the rights of my only one - so far! -co-provincial
citizen, because Valerius Corvinus appears very rarely in NR lists and may
not know of all this.

Hoping to receive some information upon this item from you or anyone who
knows something about it.

Respectfully,

AVLVS ARTORIVS ARIVS SARMATICVS, CIVIS ET BARBARVS NOVAE ROMAE ETIAM
PROPRAETOR SARMATIAE PROVINCIAE

LIBERTAS INAESTIMABILIS RES EST

VALE IN PACE


>From: Lucius Corn--------s Sulla <a hr--------/post/novaroma?prot--------D=243128192154082190130232203077129208071" >al--------us@--------</a>
>Reply-To: <a href="mailto:NovaromaVizantia@--------" >NovaromaVizantia@--------</a>
>To: <a href="mailto:NovaromaVizantia@--------" >NovaromaVizantia@--------</a>
>Subject: Re: [NovaromaVizantia] Snowy storm over Danuvius (off topic)
>Date: Fri, 21 Jan 2000 01:37:42 -0800
>
>From: Lucius Corn--------s Sulla <a hr--------/post/novaroma?prot--------D=243128192154082190130232203077129208071" >al--------us@--------</a>
>
> > Valete bene and I wish you all a wonderful weekend
> >
> > Alexander I.C. Probus
> >
> > P.S. Amice Aulo Artori, please do not forget about the Valerius' Gens
> > question. Moreover you have got here on the list both our Censor Sulla
> > Felix and Marcus Valerius Corvinus.
>
>Whats this about Probus? Is there anything I can do?
>
>L. Cornelius Sulla Felix
>Censor
>
>
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Subject:	response to the Proud Solitary Roman Eclectic Wiccan
From:	Diana Aventina <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=114176113185158237169037163101249089000144044067209130152" >diana_aventina@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 21 Jan 2000 03:54:51 -0800 (PST)

Hi Dexippus,

> Who hurt you baby?

>But can we get off the US vs. WICCA soapbox?

Who said anything about any US versus Wicca thing? Maybe
you should know who you are responding to before you
comment :-) The reason that I used that particular line of
Germanicus's post was because it was towards the end. The
people who receive the digest form of this email list do
not need to reread his entire email in order to read my
comment on the bottom "Hear hear Excellent email" Since I
did say "excellent email" I meant the entire thing.

> Who hurt you baby?
AND I may be female, but I am not your "Baby."

Bright Blessings,
Diana Aventina


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Subject:	attaching files
From:	Pat Washburn <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=197063113185056135042082190036" >p--------@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 21 Jan 2000 07:52:25 -0500

Quoth Ericius:

>I am in favor of attachments being allowed, enabled

May I respectfully disagree? My machine can handle most attachments, but
since I'm on a Mac and most Nova Romans use PCs (I expect), there are
some files that I will not be able to read. Attaching a file greatly
increases the download time for that message, regardless of whether or
not the recipient's equipment can make sense of it.

In addition, there are many of us using older machines, WebTV or simply
lacking the software to process some attachments. I would prefer to keep
this list text-only to allow access to as many people as possible.

The Internet is about choices. I would very much prefer having the choice
of whether or not to look at a picture or file, instead of having it
crammed down my throat. A well-worded description, plus a link, will help
me decide whether or not this is worth my time. For instance, I might not
be interested in (say) a technical diagram of a ballista, but would very
much like to see pictures of Roman costumes.

I support Fimbria's decision in this matter.



Patricia Cassia . Quaestor, Nova Roma
<a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=197063113185056135042082190036" >p--------@--------</a>

Subject:	Re: response to the Proud Solitary Roman Eclectic Wiccan
From:
Date:	Fri, 21 Jan 2000 09:47:42 EST

In a message dated 1/21/00 6:55:50 AM Eastern Standard Time,
<a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=114176113185158237169037163101249089000144044067209130152" >diana_aventina@--------</a> writes:

<< Who said anything about any US versus Wicca thing? Maybe
you should know who you are responding to before you
comment :-) The reason that I used that particular line of
Germanicus's post was because it was towards the end. The
people who receive the digest form of this email list do
not need to reread his entire email in order to read my
comment on the bottom "Hear hear Excellent email" Since I
did say "excellent email" I meant the entire thing. >>

Ok...First, it may be better to clip and paste that part of the post you are
responding to and not just a part "near the end" (and that portion was not
near the end of the post, but towards the beginning...but oh well...).

When I read your reply, it sounded like you were commenting particular on the
"wiccan" mention. Commenting is fine...but there seems to be a lot of
anti-Wiccan sentiment running around certain Pagan/Reconstruction circles and
I don't wish to see that start here in NR. Whatever anybody's thoughts about
Wicca...let's not forget that it was "Wicca" that brought an interest in
Paganism as a restored faith back into mass.

<<AND I may be female, but I am not your "Baby." >>

Sorry...gay lingo. Can't help it. It's in the jeans...oops, I mean the
genes! : )

--Dexippus

Subject:	response to the Proud Solitary Roman Eclectic Wiccan
From:	Diana Aventina <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=114176113185158237169037163101249089000144044067209130152" >diana_aventina@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 21 Jan 2000 11:17:10 -0800 (PST)

Hi Dexippus,

>(and that portion was not near the end of the post, but
>towards the beginning...but oh well...).

Really? Um. Whoops.

> When I read your reply, it sounded like you were
> commenting particular on the "wiccan" mention.
I am not anti-Wiccan at all. Her in Belgium, I put aspiring
Wiccans/solitary Wiccans in contact with coven leaders in
their areas.

> <<AND I may be female, but I am not your "Baby." >>

> Sorry...gay lingo. Can't help it. It's in the
> jeans...oops, I mean the genes! : )

No problem, honey :-) But what a laugh! I thought that you
meant it in a macho condescending sort of way. I was
wrong--that's the problem with email--we can't hear the
tone of someone's voice or see the twinkle in their eye....
Ah well, we have to talk to Bill Gates about that!
Bright Blessings,
Diana
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Subject:	Re: response to the Proud Solitary Roman Eclectic Wiccan
From:
Date:	Fri, 21 Jan 2000 14:38:16 EST

In a message dated 1/21/00 2:20:53 PM Eastern Standard Time,
<a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=114176113185158237169037163101249089000144044067209130152" >diana_aventina@--------</a> writes:

<< No problem, honey :-) But what a laugh! I thought that you
meant it in a macho condescending sort of way. I was
wrong--that's the problem with email--we can't hear the
tone of someone's voice or see the twinkle in their eye....
Ah well, we have to talk to Bill Gates about that! >>

LOL...yeah, there's a kick in the ass! Me...macho? Ha Ha Ha! Well...only
on Friday evenings at the leather-bar! LOL

Bright Blessings to you too! : )

--Dexippus
Divus Maximus Extremus
The Flaming Queen of the Capitoline Hill

Subject:	Symposium Announcement
From:	JSA <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=081166091180193192130061163101147165026048139046" >varromurena@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 21 Jan 2000 13:57:36 -0800 (PST)

For those in the area and who are interested, take
note. Also, though the announcement itself has a
medieval focus, the symposium itself is concerned with
the ancient world.

L. Licinius Varro Murena

> King's College London, 11-13 Sep 2000
> 3-day conference on Personifications in the Greek
> World
> Contact Prof Judith Herrin (KCL), Dr Emma Stafford
> (Leeds)
> This conference will have a session on Byzantine
> Time and Place
> with papers by
> Liz James
> Byzantine cities
> Elizabeth Jeffreys
> Byzantine months
>
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Subject:	Re: A Problem with Paterfamilias of Gens Valeria
From:
Date:	Fri, 21 Jan 2000 21:39:18 EST

Salvete SPQNR,

<< The problem is Marcus
Valerius Corvinus, a cive from Sarmatia (the only one except for me so
far...;-)) was (as we suppose, illegally;-)) deprived of his rights of being
a Paterfamilias of Gens Valeria. He was a citezen for rather a long period
of time, much longer than me anyway. He still is indicated in Album Civium,
but no longer is in Album Gentium. Instead it is honorable citizen Marcus
Valerius Quadrasus from Gaul who is indicated as the Paterfamilias of Gens
Valeria. >>

This would indeed pose a controversy within the walls of Nova Roma, I myself
am concerned about it. Is it possible that Valerius Corvinus merely stepped
down in order to let other members of his gentes pursue opporurtunities that
he was not interested in (or some other reason)? I havn't come into view of
any other responses, and a response from Valerius Corvinus himself would be
appropriate.

Vale in Pace

Iulius Thompsonus

Faber est suae quisque fortunae.

Subject:	Re: A Problem with Paterfamilias of Gens Valeria
From:
Date:	Fri, 21 Jan 2000 18:57:40 -0800

> Salvete SPQNR,
>
> << The problem is Marcus
> Valerius Corvinus, a cive from Sarmatia (the only one except for me so
> far...;-)) was (as we suppose, illegally;-)) deprived of his rights of
being
> a Paterfamilias of Gens Valeria. He was a citezen for rather a long
period
> of time, much longer than me anyway. He still is indicated in Album
Civium,
> but no longer is in Album Gentium. Instead it is honorable citizen Marcus
> Valerius Quadrasus from Gaul who is indicated as the Paterfamilias of
Gens
> Valeria. >>
>
> This would indeed pose a controversy within the walls of Nova Roma, I
myself
> am concerned about it. Is it possible that Valerius Corvinus merely
stepped
> down in order to let other members of his gentes pursue opporurtunities
that
> he was not interested in (or some other reason)? I havn't come into view
of
> any other responses, and a response from Valerius Corvinus himself would
be
> appropriate.

When I get home tonite from work (Mac Training) I will check my database to
see who is listed as the paterfamilias. On our database, there are two
columns one requiring a check mark if a civie is the paterfamilias and the
second column asking if they recieve new members. If you are a new civie
creating a new gens, then you are then paterfamilias. We also have the date
when each civie as approved as a full citizen of Nova Roma. I will check
that information to see about this issue.

L. Cornelius Sulla Felix
Censor

Subject:	Re: attaching files
From:
Date:	Fri, 21 Jan 2000 18:47:40 -0800

Pat Washburn wrote:

> The Internet is about choices. I would very much prefer having the
> choice
> of whether or not to look at a picture or file, instead of having it
>
> crammed down my throat.

Ref. "cramming down throat' -- use the Delete button. :-)


> I support Fimbria's decision in this matter.

As do we all. But... there will always be the voicing of opinions.

C. Aelius Ericius
Senator
Augur
Pontifex


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]