Forum Romanum


Subject:	Re: Gender Naming (a note, not a rant) >({\|:-)
From:	"S--------dan/ Hibernicus" <a --------="/post/novaroma?protectID=034056178009193132062218046036129208" >legioix@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 00:08:16 -0000

--- In <a href="mailto:novaroma@--------" >novaroma@--------</a>, Marius Fimbria legion6@s... wrote:

>
> 'Sulla' and 'Fimbria' are just two examples of names that end with
-a
> but are not feminine gender.

Same with many of the names of Legions... legiO IX hispanA

Hibernicus


Subject:	"Belief"?
From:
Date:	Thu, 27 Apr 2000 17:22:03 -0700

Graecus has given us on several occasions his beliefs on the Roman
view towards their Gods. He tells us that what he says is a result of
his
studies in Classical religions, philosophies. A basic thing that
keeps
being put forward is that the Romans had no sense of, perhaps even
no concept of faith in their religion, their deities, their
practices. That
all
the Romans did was go through the routine of ritual, or whatever one
might
call it in this situation, and that was the extent of Roman religion.
Only
the
Asians had a sense of belief and faith, and through them the Greeks.
I have a problem with this. I have read woks from the early European
contacts
with the natives of this hemisphere (the Western one) where the
Europeans
said that the natives had no belief in their superstitious practices,
only a
fear
of grotesque spirits. Later writers, say around the 19th Century talk
of
the
natives "beliefs" and "faith" and even their "religion" (rather than
their
"superstitions").
You know it might all be a matter of linguistics and semantics. Lack
of
understanding
of the word symbols employed have caused much trouble through time.
Right up to today on the list. (No examples. It is a blanket
statement that
is safe
to say.) To some "belief" means that you are talking about something

that you can not "know". Perhaps something like believing a cretin
horse
will win
in the sixth race.

Joseph Campbell had a story of when he was at a Jesuit
school and one of the Jesuits (a specific type of Catholic priest -
elite)
started
a conversation. After a while the Jesuit asked Campbell to let the
Jesuit
prove
to Campbell, through whatever types of "proof" those two
"philosophers" were
using
in their bull session, the existence and reality of Jesus Christ. To
this
Dr. Campbell
replied, "But then what role would Belief have?"

I am a 20th Century (yes, I'm behind the times) American. I have
several
sets of
meanings for each of the words "faith" and "belief". I can use them
in what
would
be odd ways to people of other times in history. I can use either of
those
words
in ways that would be quite odd to people of our own times (much less
my own
culture).

Did the Romans "believe" in their Gods? Did they "believe" in rocks?
How would you react if someone at work asked you if you "believed in
rocks"?
You would most likely be caught aback, then engage your "word
processing
mental centers", and give some sort of reply. Probably in the
affirmative.
And you would wonder about the very, very strange person who posed
such
a question. The ancients, even the most learned, did not have the
depth
of accumulated knowledge, frames of reference that a grammar school
drop out on the poorest Indian Reservation has today.
Teach them the "language", the groups of meaning and connotations and
the rest, and they would say, "Yes." And then they would go on about
how they were better than the Easterners and how things weren't as
good
as they were in the old days.

[with a smile]
Valete.
C. Aelius Ericius.
Senator.
Augur.
Pontiff.
Paterfamilias.
Postpropraetor.
Senex.


Subject:	A Proposal for Legislation
From:	"M. Apollonius Formosanus" <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=014130014161146028033082190" >bvm3@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 02:54:35 +0200

Salvete Quirites!

I wish to praise the wisdom and common sense of Marcus
Audens with respect to the latest controversy. A little good
sense and more respect for others would go a long way to
solving these problems. *Comitas.* But I also think that
clear and definite legislation to protect people from
defamation by a speedy and expeditious process is to be
desired. Hopefully pre-censorhip of any kind can be avoided,
but if someone is personally insulted, he or she should have
immediate recourse to some designated magistrate for
redress.

If, as our Censor says, people are choosing names of the
opposite sex too lightly through not realising that we wish
to be a bit more serious and realistic than that, it might
be well and good to have an edictum to deal with the
problem. (Hey, 1 edictum, 2 edicta!) But would it not be
less problematic to simply say in such an edictum that the
gender of the name must be in accord with the applicant's
civil identity in state/country of origin? Other countries
normally give faith and credence to one another's decisions
on civil identity. As a micronation, cannot Nova Roma do the
same? Then no one would have fewer rights in such matters
here than in their native societies. ***I would like to
think that Lucius Cornelius and his colleague will give
serious thought to such a solution, *** even though some of
those most affected have most unfortunately already left us.
Such a policy would be more in keeping with acting as a
serious nation, and would only require a slight polishing of
the original edictum.

I do feel the loss of these citizens, if one who has
only been on this list from December may be permitted to say
that. In the rough and tumble of her politics Nova Roma is
sometimes a bit too like Antiqua Roma! But human
relationships are rarely perfect, and sticking with them and
working things out is a quality I admire very much. Indeed
it is the union of the two Roman Virtues of Firmitas and
Fides to produce Concordia. But those who fled into exile
felt that they had not met with enough Comitas and Aequitas.
Perhaps they didn't.

As far as *my* ideals for Nova Roma go, they have not
changed. I do feel that I should emphasise the religio a
little more myself to compensate for the loss of some pious
Nova Romans. And maybe we all should go back and take
another serious look at the Virtues...

By the way, I *do* expect to see temples to Venus and
Isis springing up. Neopaganism is, as a matter of objective
fact, growing by leaps and bounds. (Here in "Catholic"
Poland too.) And I know from a personal visit that the old
Roman temple to Isis in Savaria (now western Hungary) is
being used for rites by local neopagan groups. We in Nova
Roma have to play our rôle, but we are not alone.

I wish all my fellow citizens a joyous Floralia!

--
ICQ# 61698049
Si vis omnia tibi subicere, te subice Rationi. (Seneca)
[Se vi deziras subigi chion al vi, subigu vin al Racio.]


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Latina vivit was Re-think goals?
From:
Date:	Thu, 27 Apr 2000 21:45:37 -0400

I will be there with bells on!
Oh, there is someone on a bilingual families list that I am on
that intends to raise her very-soonly-due child in the best Latin
that she can manage to decline on the fly. I thought that that
was pretty neat. [I am attempting to raise my youngest children
bilingually, in that new fangled Latin that passed through Spain
and landed in Central America.]

My husband wants to learn Latin, so that's going to be my
immediate, personal Latin related project.

Latin is looking more and more alive every day.

Ursula Numeria Fortunata

RMerullo wrote:
>
> Salvete Ursula Numeria et alii
>
> Wonderful to see you in the forum again after so long. Didn't you and I
> fight about turnips once? Maybe not.
>
> The nerds are assembling, even as we speak. I don't know whether they'll
> ever be able to standardize Latin, but the conversation is ongoing over on
> <a href="mailto:Latinitas@--------" >Latinitas@--------</a> on what to translate first, how et cetera. Offering
> Latin courses is also on the agenda. Perhaps you would consider getting
> involved?
>
> Valete
>
> C Marius Merullus
>
> bibliophilus honorarius ("honorary nerd")

--

Mia Soderquist
Firetalk #605102
ICQ #19818811 or 5926593
MSN Messenger/--------ail: <a --------="/post/novaroma?protectID=224212066182018031172168072077172089134098204046209130" >ursulanumeria@--------</a>


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] A Proposal for Legislation
From:	<a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=226028211237082190172248203043129208071" >Lykaion1@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 00:02:48 EDT

In a message dated 4/27/00 8:55:12 PM Eastern Da--------ht Time, <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=014130014161146028033082190" >bvm3@--------</a>
writes:

<< Neopaganism is, as a matter of objective fact, growing by leaps and
bounds. >>

I would be interested in a source for this.

Here in the US, adherents of "new religions" which would include neo-pagans
grew from 0.1% to 0.2% of the population, in a 30 year period,from mid-1970
to projected mid-2000. {Brittanica 1998 Book of the Year}

Gaius Lupinius Festus


Subject:	TEST
From:
Date:	Thu, 27 Apr 2000 21:14:04 -0700

Just testing to see if my posts are coming through....

Sulla Felix
Censor

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] TEST
From:	<a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=226028211237082190172248203043129208071" >Lykaion1@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 00:15:26 EDT

No, they are not. I couldn't see your test post at all!

Festus


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] TEST
From:
Date:	Thu, 27 Apr 2000 21:19:25 -0700

Oh thank you....hehe...I sent like three posts...on here and on the Senate
list and none of them appeared....I am hoping for lag.....but after 4
hours... Oh well.

Sulla Felix
----- Original Message -----
From: <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=226028211237082190172248203043129208071" >Lykaion1@--------</a>
To: <a href="mailto:novaroma@--------" >novaroma@--------</a>
Sent: Thursday, April 27, 2000 9:15 PM
Subject: Re: [novaroma] TEST

> No, they are not. I couldn't see your test post at all!
>
> Festus
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Was the salesman clueless? Productopia has the answers.
> <a href="http://click.egroups.com/1/3019/4/_/61050/_/956895351/" target="_top" >http://click.egroups.com/1/3019/4/_/61050/_/956895351/</a>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>


Subject:	Joining us in Pompeii
From:	"S--------dan/ Hibernicus" <a --------="/post/novaroma?protectID=034056178009193132062218046036129208" >legioix@--------</a>
Date:	Thu, 27 Apr 2000 19:36:48 -0000

Salvete!

We've started something fun and want everyone to join in!

Go here to find out how:

<a href="http://www.geocities.com/~hibernicus/pompeii.html" target="_top" >http://www.geocities.com/~hibernicus/pompeii.html</a>

Hibernicus
Legio IX Hispana


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Joining us in Pompeii
From:
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 01:42:05 EDT

Euge Hibernice,

Cool! I like the guy in the front row -- or, more appropriately, omnibus
animo agitatis, I like his team. :o)

(Noli timere, Rufa amica; iocus est! Nina me leones diligere scit.)

Valete, Legio Fortissime,

Acadianus Draco


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Why we resigned our Citizenship - REBUTAL
From:	"S--------dan/ Hibernicus" <a --------="/post/novaroma?protectID=034056178009193132062218046036129208" >legioix@--------</a>
Date:	Thu, 27 Apr 2000 23:58:14 -0000

snipage here and there...

> As for my hopes for Roma, (a separate thread) I want us to be a Via
back to the original. I want to fund research, I want recreate the
political system so others can experience it. I want to sponsor digs
to further knowledge. I want to give our old gods their due.
> Valete
> Q. Fabius Maximus

Let's not forget experiencial archaeology.. using the technologies
and
crafts of the time.. doing in order to learn... knowing how it was
done
by using... a very wonderful aspect to all of this!


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] "Belief"? Question?
From:
Date:	Thu, 27 Apr 2000 17:24:23 -0700

> [with a smile]
> Valete.
> C. Aelius Ericius.
> Senator.
> Augur.
> Pontiff.
> Paterfamilias.
> Postpropraetor.
> Senex.

What does 'Senex' mean? Sorry I dont know Latin...hehehe

Sulla Felix


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Law n' order
From:
Date:	Thu, 27 Apr 2000 18:57:08 EDT

Indeed that is true -- the reposted message to which I referred was from
Tacitus/Marconi and not from Festus. My deepest apologies for mistakenly
ascribing the rather vicious post in question to you, Festus.

L. Sergius Aust.

On 4/27/00 11:38 AM <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=226028211237082190172248203043129208071" >Lykaion1@--------</a> (<a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=226028211237082190172248203043129208071" >Lykaion1@--------</a>) wrote:

>In a message dated 4/27/00 12:32:43 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
><a hr--------/post/novaroma?prot--------D=210166080237038233015038190036129" >iadams@--------</a> writ--------/font>
>
><< Yes. That was intended as a reminder to Dex, who had re-posted a private
> email from me and then one from Festus. >>
>
>Dex didn't post any email from me. We did not exchange any email at all.
>
>Festus

certe, Toto, sentio nos in Kansate non iam adesse.

(You know, Toto, I have a feeling we're not in Kansas anymore.)


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] "Belief"?
From:	"Antonio Grilo" <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=243232178003185091033082" >amg@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 10:38:26 +0100

Salvete Razenna et al

>Graecus has given us on several occasions his beliefs on the Roman
>view towards their Gods. He tells us that what he says is a result of
>his
>studies in Classical religions, philosophies. A basic thing that
>keeps
>being put forward is that the Romans had no sense of, perhaps even
>no concept of faith in their religion, their deities, their
>practices. That
>all
>the Romans did was go through the routine of ritual, or whatever one
>might
>call it in this situation, and that was the extent of Roman religion.
It's not as simple. The Romans gave the Gods what was in Their right. In
exchange, the Gods protected and helped the Romans.

>Only
>the
>Asians had a sense of belief and faith, and through them the Greeks.
>I have a problem with this.
I didn't talk about "belief". The Romans (the majority, though many surely
did not, including priests and magistrates) believed their Gods, of course.
But "faith" is different from belief. "Faith" in our modern sense is
connected to "Creed". The Romans had no Creed and the myths were not rigid.
Many versions existed and the authors were glad to present several versions
and interpretations about the role of the Gods.

>I am a 20th Century (yes, I'm behind the times) American. I have
>several
>sets of
>meanings for each of the words "faith" and "belief". I can use them
>in what
>would
>be odd ways to people of other times in history. I can use either of
>those
>words
>in ways that would be quite odd to people of our own times (much less
>my own
>culture).
I understand what you mean.

>Did the Romans "believe" in their Gods? Did they "believe" in rocks?
>How would you react if someone at work asked you if you "believed in
>rocks"?
>You would most likely be caught aback, then engage your "word
>processing
>mental centers", and give some sort of reply. Probably in the
>affirmative.
>And you would wonder about the very, very strange person who posed
>such
>a question. The ancients, even the most learned, did not have the
>depth
>of accumulated knowledge, frames of reference that a grammar school
>drop out on the poorest Indian Reservation has today.
>Teach them the "language", the groups of meaning and connotations and
>the rest, and they would say, "Yes." And then they would go on about
>how they were better than the Easterners and how things weren't as
>good
>as they were in the old days.
Good metaphor =).

Valete
Antonius Gryllus Graecus
Pontifex


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Why we resigned our Citizenship
From:	"Kyrene" <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=200028091056078198015242190036129" &--------yrene@--------</a&--------/td>
Date:	Thu, 27 Apr 2000 19:24:06 -0400

Salvete all...

----- Original Message -----
From: Antonio Grilo <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=243232178003185091033082" >amg@--------</a>
To: <a href="mailto:novaroma@--------" >novaroma@--------</a>
Sent: Thursday, April 27, 2000 2:11 PM
Subject: Re: [novaroma] Why we resigned our Citizenship

> >We began SERIOUSLY thinking of leaving Nova Roma many months ago. The
> >loss of KEY citizens to the Coup and Dictatorship came very close to
> >taking me and my husband with it. Then came the chance to bring the
> >Religio Romana into the public eye. I discussed it with the Pontifex
> >Maximus Cassius. He strongly suggested we pretend we were nothing more
> >than "history buffs". That we were not Pagan, let alone Roman Pagan. I
> >could not believe it! This is the PONTIFEX MAXIMUS!!!!!!! And he didn't
> >have enough faith in his own religion to hope it finally come across as
> >something good. He wanted us to hide.
> As TRUE ROMANS you should have obeyed the Pontifex Maximus, suppreme
> authority on matters of the RELIGIO ROMANA. You should have followed the
> guidelines of the COLLEGIUM PONTIFICUM and you should not have insulted
> ROMA, and the DII ROMANI.

I respectfully disagree. A true Roman would take pride in who he or she
was, and would not hide it from the public. I think that the truer insult
to Roma is to deny who you are, and lie about it.

I've always had a deep respect for the Pontifex Maximus and his policies,
but on this matter I disagree with him, and I disagree with you. I'm not
trying to pick a fight here, merely stating my opinion.

Valete et xairete,

Andrea Gladia Kyrinia
Sacerdos Apollinis

-=* Kyrene Ariadne/Andrea Gladia Kyrinia *=-
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
-=* <a href="http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Troy/1527" target="_top" >http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Troy/1527</a> *=-
-=* ~The Tholos~ *=-
-=* ICQ:6663573 Yahoo:KyreneAriadne AIM:KyreneAriadne *=-


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Why we resigned our Citizenship
From:	"Antonio Grilo" <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=243232178003185091033082" >amg@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 10:59:31 +0100

Salvete Kyrene et al

I agree that I have exagerated in my statements. But the reason for this is
that I know the efforts that the Pontifex Maximus and other people have done
for the Meakers. Their constant rebel reactions and unpolite statements made
me angry, even more because they were cowards posting their statement. Why?
They are attacking the Pontifex Maximus while he is absent. Marcus Cassius
Iulianus cannot answer their statement. In some way I'm happy with it
because such as statement, taking into account the history of the Meakers in
Nova Roma, does not deserve any answer. That was another of my mistakes.

Valete
Antonius Gryllus Graecus


Subject:	ATTN (Religio Romana): ante diem IV Kalendas Mai (April 28th)
From:	"Antonio Grilo" <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=243232178003185091033082" >amg@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 12:38:40 +0100

Salvete omnes

This is a dies comitiales (C), when committees of citizens can vote on
political or criminal matters.

Today the Ludi Florales in honour of Flora begin! Flora is the "mother of
flowers". She is also the patron of prostitutes
The Floralia was originally a moveable festival whose date was determined by
the Pontifex Maximus for each year according to the growth of the products
of the earth. This is the reason why it is not marked on the Calendars.
In 240 BC, the Ludi Florales (Floral Games) were instituted after a
consultation of the Sibylline Oracles, and span from April 28 to May 3. They
celebrated the 'dedicatio' of a temple of Flora, which is built near the
Circus Maximus. Later (173 BC?) the Floralia was assimilated to the Ludi
Florales and took place on April 28.
In this day, the Flamen Floralis sacrifices an ewe in Flora's old temple on
the Quirinal Hill near the Sanqualis gate. During this feast, people throw
grains, beans, peas. The feast ends only at night, with dansing and drinking
iluminated by torches. Clothes of wild colours are worn. Strip-tease shows
make also part of the feast.
The Ludi Florales consist of theatrical performances and, on the last day
hoats and hares are hunted in the Circus Maximus prior to the Games.

Pax Deorum vobiscum

Antonius Gryllus Graecus
Pontifex


Subject:	Senex
From:	<a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=045232113165042200148200112241225012177026038196249130152150" >jmath669642reng@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 08:27:47 -0400 (EDT)

Senex--Old man or aged--My handy little Oxford Latin dictonary from
Madiera.

Marcus Audens

Fair Winds and Following Seas!!!


Subject:	The history of the Meakers in Nova Roma
From:	"Donald and Crystal Meaker" <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=029056113163056209105098072248155208071048" >meakerfam@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 13:57:33 -0000

--- In <a href="mailto:novaroma@--------" >novaroma@--------</a>, "Antonio Grilo" amg@c... wrote:
> Salvete Kyrene et al
>
> I agree that I have exagerated in my statements. But the reason for
this is
> that I know the efforts that the Pontifex Maximus and other people
have done
> for the Meakers.

The only thing the Pontifex has done for me is send Lapis a reindeer
the Saturnalia before he was born, as well as gifts for Terry and a
few things for me. The application for the Priestess of Juno was
lost not less than 4 times. It was then "given" to me by
Germanicus. Are Cassius and Germanicus the same person?

>Their constant rebel reactions and unpolite statements made
> me angry, even more because they were cowards posting their
statement. Why?
> They are attacking the Pontifex Maximus while he is absent. Marcus
Cassius
> Iulianus cannot answer their statement. In some way I'm happy with
it
> because such as statement, taking into account the history of the
Meakers in
> Nova Roma, does not deserve any answer. That was another of my
mistakes.
>
> Valete
> Antonius Gryllus Graecus

Would you like me to forward all the digests to the Pontifex? Give
me his phone number. I will be HAPPY to call him and let him know
EXACTLY what I think. Cassius has mentioned in the past that I am
extremely honest, with myself and others. That everyone has such a
problem with that strakes me as hilarious!!!

Crystal Meaker


Subject:	Public apology to the Collegium Pontificum and the Meakers (limited apology)
From:	"Antonio Grilo" <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=243232178003185091033082" >amg@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 15:08:59 +0100

Salvete omnes

Yesterday my anger directed my speech towards the Meakers. I have not even
read their posting as I should. In fact I was already expecting another
complaining post to be sent to the Nova Roma list.

My intention was not to speak for the Collegium Pontificum, which so many
times I have spared from identifying with my personal views on Roman
religion. My failure to write a not stating my complete responsibility
deserves an apology, and I now state that my answer to the Meakers was
solely mine.

To the Meakers I want to apologize for having misinterpreted some of their
statements (in fact I didn't understand that it had been their 3 year-old
child to say "Lady Iuno"). I also want to apologize for calling them
un-Roman and for stating that their view on Roman religion is wrong.

Nevertheless, I cannot but keep my last statements:
"You started a unfair war with Nova Roma. The Pontifex Maximus tried to help
you with advice. If you do not agree with
advice, simply do not follow it. Instead you think that every word is
proferred against your family. I don't understand you... We were willing to
accept you as Reges Sacrorum... You are very ungrateful."

And I still think that the Meakers were coward for Marcus Cassius Iulianus
cannot at the moment answer your statements on this list.

Valete omnes
Antonius Gryllus Graecus


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] A Proposal for Legislation
From:	<a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=045232113165042200148200112241225012177026038196249130152150" >jmath669642reng@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 10:22:49 -0400 (EDT)

Salve, M. Appollonius Formosanus;

I thank you for your kind words. They are most gratifying . In your
comments regarding protection of people from defamation by a speedy and
expeditious process, I wish to point out that in the last round of such
here in NR, there were several items to consider:

1. Those NR Citizens on the list demonstrated a wide range of emotions
from downright outrage through mild disapproval, all the way to "what's
the problem?"

2. Those people who were outraged and angry appealed to the Senior
Magistrates and those Magistrates responded with statements which, while
not terribly effective in my view, reflected the maximum immediate
effort allotted to them by the NR law;

3. The individual responsible did make a limited apology, based on his
feelings about his statements and his consideration of the seriousness
of the comments. This was apprently satisfactory to him and to most of
the other NR citizens based upon responses recieved by those magistrates
involved;

4. Other NR Citizens did not see the problem and wondered what all the
fuss was about. Most citizens did not comment at all. Therein lies the
problem.

It is fairly simple to state that,

"clear and definate legislation to protect people from defamation by a
speedy and expedtious process is to be desired"

It would, however, seem that the above points would render that
desireability virtually impossible with the wide range of feelings
evident in NR.

First of all define "defamation" as opposed to "difference of ideas."
If I remember correctly, in several previous cases of this problem the
difference agreed upon was only one or two small words. Considering our
penchant in NR for discussion and debate, I think that those differences
can be very easily mixed up. Some citizens will agree with this and
others will violently disagree, but most will not comment, and it will
be interesting to see the numbers.

Second a determination of "degrees" of defamation is necessary. There
were two or three messages indicating rage and outrage at the comments
aired here, there were a couple of messages that reflected the fact that
the authors were uncomfortable with the comments. I was myself
concerned as I wondered briefly what my Oath of Office really meant in
the case at hand. I made my decision and took action as I saw fit, as
did other Magistrates, but for some citizens it was too little-too late,
and for others it was too much-too soon. I later consulted with some in
NR who are much cleverer that I regarding those very feelings, and I now
have a better idea of the meanings. However, I still wonder how I could
have done a better job.

Thirdly, some accomodaion needs to be made for some kind of concrete
punishment for those who defame our citizens, but my friend what shall
that be? This NR is supposedly a gathering of people who are admiring
of the Roman Culture, who in some cases are of the Roman Religio, and in
other cases respect that belief, but do not indulge in it. All
supposedly hew in some degree to the Roman Virtues. Then with all this
said, are we to engage in politcal development of concrete punishments
of our fellow members? I am not convinced that such a reason is why I
hold a Magistate's Office. Many of our ciizens already complain of an
over-active Political Machine which is crushing their real reason for
being here. Shall we add more weight to that burden?

Can these problems be solved. I would say yes, but with a large degree
of effort and a generous measure of time. Back to your
suggestion---yes, some accomodation should probably be made---yes, the
items listed above must be addressed and answered before effective
accomodation can be made---yes, some dedicated people must be found to
work out these detailed problems to the satisfaction of the majority of
NR Citizens and approval by our Senate.

Who is to do this task? Who is to gather the information? Who is to
sift the data? Who is to hammer out the answers to the above questions?
Why the collective you, the citizens of NR will--who else??? And how
will the collective you do this--by voting in elections--by filling the
positions in your government left open by lack of volunteers, by
organizing into groups and dealing with those problems, and developing
solutions that are acceptable to the Majority and to the Senate.

Until that time is nigh, I fear that you will have to be satisfied with
the Magistrates that you have, and the time that they can devote, and
the determinations that they are able to make from thier limited sources
of authority.

Please do not think that I criticize you for your suggestion, my friend.
I have already asked my Assesai to record your suggestion in my consular
archives, for further review. I only use your suggestion as a basis to
demonstrate that your "good ideas" while desirable, are not totally
sufficient to fill your stated needs and desires. A certain amount of
labor and time is also necessary on the part of all citizens to effect
the results that you seem to desire.

I thank you again for your kind words and for your interest in posting
your ideas to the Onelist. I look forward to working with you in the
future.

Vale, Respectfully;
Marcus Audens

Fair Winds and Following Seas!!!


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Why we resigned our Citizenship
From:	R--------vandewater <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=194028113185042057074218164036129208" >r--------20@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 07:30:49 -0700 (PDT)

Salvete,
Stay true to the Gods and all will be well.
Unfortunately there are still people in Nova roma who
think that this is a computer game and not a way of
life.
Pax Vobiscum,
G. Africanus Secundus

--- Donald and Crystal Meaker <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=029056113163056209105098072248155208071048" >meakerfam@--------</a>
wrote:
> Salvete,
>
>
> There are many things that went into our decision to
> leave Nova Roma. To
> much Political Correct Bull Sh*t being one reason
> that covers dozens of
> little situations and flame wars. I am going to
> share ONE of the MAJOR
> reasons we left Nova Roma -- lack of Faith in the
> gods by the very people
> , including Priests within Nova Roma.
>
>
> We began SERIOUSLY thinking of leaving Nova Roma
> many months ago. The
> loss of KEY citizens to the Coup and Dictatorship
> came very close to
> taking me and my husband with it. Then came the
> chance to bring the
> Religio Romana into the public eye. I discussed it
> with the Pontifex
> Maximus Cassius. He strongly suggested we pretend
> we were nothing more
> than "history buffs". That we were not Pagan, let
> alone Roman Pagan. I
> could not believe it! This is the PONTIFEX
> MAXIMUS!!!!!!! And he didn't
> have enough faith in his own religion to hope it
> finally come across as
> something good. He wanted us to hide.
>
>
> Fortunately we refused! *I* knew there was no harm
> in the Religio. I
> had so much faith in the Religio that I chanced
> losing my CHILDREN to
> bring it to the fore. We gave books to the Social
> Worker in charge of
> the adoption. We asked members of Nova Roma to
> write letters about their
> PERSONAL experience as practioners of the Religio
> (this is where I may
> thank, again, Cin and QFM for their support) and
> gave that to the Social
> Worker. We brought the Social Worker into our HOME
> to see our Alter.
> Anyone may pass by our house and see the statue of
> Juno in our front yard
> (the artist I don't think was thinking of Juno, but
> when Terry saw it,
> she said "Lady Juno" and that is who she came to our
> front yard as). We
> hid NOTHING!
>
>
> The Social Worker has finished her report. The
> Religio has passed
> through the toughest court in the United States
> (IMO), Family Court.
> Terry's adoption may even be pushed up from the
> original August date. We
> have been told that to hide our religion from the
> Courts would have been
> DISASTROUS!!! Not only would Don have not been
> allowed to adopt Terry,
> it may well have come to pass that NO children would
> be considered "safe"
> in this house because WE HAD SOMETHING TO HIDE! And
> when you have
> something to hide, you open yourself up to the
> assumption that you are
> doing something BAD! There is nothing "bad" about
> the Religio.
>
>
> After another half dozen experiences with the lack
> of any true faith in
> the gods by others, to include some of Nova Romas
> own Pontifexes (not ALL
> of them, but enough to greatly disturb the gods), we
> decided to leave.
> Juno has finally shown me the way to go. It is NOT
> the Politically
> Correct Path Nova Roma has been on and will continue
> to be on. I need to
> go back to living the Roman life I was living before
> I got involved with
> this organization, where the gods will must be
> modernized so to be
> non-offensive. In so many ways ancient Roma was as
> politically INcorrect
> as to be open to all and the gods blessed it. The
> gods ARE open to
> modernization. They are NOT open to PCBS.
>
>
> I have finally succumbed to the will of Juno by
> speaking the words. I
> can only hope they do not fall on deaf ears. While
> I breathe, I hope.
>
>
> And so I joined Nova Roma for and because of the
> Religio Romana. I have
> now LEFT Nova Roma for and because of the Religio
> Romana.
>
>
> Pax Vobiscum,
> Crystal Meaker
>
>
------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Was the salesman clueless? Productopia has the
> answers.
>
<a href="http://click.egroups.com/1/3019/4/_/61050/_/956858517/" target="_top" >http://click.egroups.com/1/3019/4/_/61050/_/956858517/</a>
>
------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Talk to your friends online and get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger.
<a href="http://im.yahoo.com/" target="_top" >http://im.yahoo.com/</a>


Subject:	Re: Public apology to the Collegium Pontificum and the Meakers (limited apology)
From:	"Donald and Crystal Meaker" <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=029056113163056209105098072248155208071048" >meakerfam@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 14:38:27 -0000

--- In <a href="mailto:novaroma@--------" >novaroma@--------</a>, "Antonio Grilo" amg@c... wrote:

> To the Meakers I want to apologize for having misinterpreted some
of their
> statements (in fact I didn't understand that it had been their 3
year-old
> child to say "Lady Iuno"). I also want to apologize for calling them
> un-Roman and for stating that their view on Roman religion is wrong.
>

For the second, we (*I*) can acceept the apology. For the first, the
comments about Terry, I cannot. How many times has the suggestion to
read first and comment second been posted here? Is it alright to
attack a 3 year old child on matters he/she does not even comprehend,
no matter how "unintentional", even if you *are* a Pontiff? I have
read your posts, sir, at least twice before I responded. Attacking a
child is unforgiveable, IMO, be the child mine or another.

> And I still think that the Meakers were coward for Marcus Cassius
Iulianus
> cannot at the moment answer your statements on this list.
>
> Valete omnes
> Antonius Gryllus Graecus

Believe me, Cassius will know EXACTLY my opinion as soon as I am
aware he is back. I am honest and asking me "What do you REALLY
think?" is a question I rarely encounter.

Crystal Meaker


Subject:	RE: [novaroma] Re: Public apology to the Collegium Pontificum an d the Meakers (limited apology)
From:	Mary Beth Clemon--------t;a href="/po--------ovaroma?protectID=029158235056038190172232203219129208071" >mclemon--------..</a>
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 10:50:45 -0400

Didn't you resign your citizenship yesterday? Or was that a stunt to draw
attention to yourself?

I grow weary of your constant complaining and bickering. If you haven't
figured out why you think all of NR is against you, it's because you make it
that way. Everything has be a huge ordeal for you. And so, you attract
negative attention. And the sick thing is is that you like it. That's why
you are still sticking around to see what people say about you.

Make a move. If you resign, then unsubscribe from the list. I am sorry
things didn't work out and I wish you and your family well.

Vale,

Minervina Iucundia Flavia
Propraetor SE USA Provincia
Senator

-----Original Message-----
From: Donald and Crystal Meaker [mailto:<a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=029056113163056209105098072248155208071048" >meakerfam@--------</a>]
Sent: Friday, April 28, 2000 10:38 AM
To: <a href="mailto:novaroma@--------" >novaroma@--------</a>
Subject: [novaroma] Re: Public apology to the Collegium Pontificum and the
Meakers (limited apology)

--- In <a href="mailto:novaroma@--------" >novaroma@--------</a>, "Antonio Grilo" amg@c... wrote:

> To the Meakers I want to apologize for having misinterpreted some
of their
> statements (in fact I didn't understand that it had been their 3
year-old
> child to say "Lady Iuno"). I also want to apologize for calling them
> un-Roman and for stating that their view on Roman religion is wrong.
>

For the second, we (*I*) can acceept the apology. For the first, the
comments about Terry, I cannot. How many times has the suggestion to
read first and comment second been posted here? Is it alright to
attack a 3 year old child on matters he/she does not even comprehend,
no matter how "unintentional", even if you *are* a Pontiff? I have
read your posts, sir, at least twice before I responded. Attacking a
child is unforgiveable, IMO, be the child mine or another.

> And I still think that the Meakers were coward for Marcus Cassius
Iulianus
> cannot at the moment answer your statements on this list.
>
> Valete omnes
> Antonius Gryllus Graecus

Believe me, Cassius will know EXACTLY my opinion as soon as I am
aware he is back. I am honest and asking me "What do you REALLY
think?" is a question I rarely encounter.

Crystal Meaker

_____

<<a href="http://click.egroups.com/1/3589/4/_/61050/_/956932714/" target="_top" >http://click.egroups.com/1/3589/4/_/61050/_/956932714/</a>>
<<a href="http://adimg.egroups.com/img/3589/4/_/61050/_/956932714/clace08b.gif" target="_top" >http://adimg.egroups.com/img/3589/4/_/61050/_/956932714/clace08b.gif</a>>

_____

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Subject:	RE: [novaroma] Re: Public apology to the Collegium Pontificum an d the Meakers (limited apology)
From:	"Donald and Crystal Meaker" <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=029056113163056209105098072248155208071048" >meakerfam@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 15:21:14 -0000

--- In <a href="mailto:novaroma@--------" >novaroma@--------</a>, Mary Beth Clemons mclemons@s... wrote:
> Didn't you resign your citizenship yesterday? Or was that a stunt
to draw
> attention to yourself?
>

We resigned our citizenship Wednsday, not yesterday. You were
informed as a Senator. Did you not read the email?

> I grow weary of your constant complaining and bickering. If you
haven't
> figured out why you think all of NR is against you, it's because
you make it
> that way. Everything has be a huge ordeal for you. And so, you
attract
> negative attention. And the sick thing is is that you like it.
That's why
> you are still sticking around to see what people say about you.
>
> Make a move. If you resign, then unsubscribe from the list. I am
sorry
> things didn't work out and I wish you and your family well.
>
> Vale,
>
> Minervina Iucundia Flavia
> Propraetor SE USA Provincia
> Senator
>

I see Senator, that this email list is NOT open to all after all, is
it? The Senate didn't order me around before and it won't now.
Please have your fellow senators ask me, publically, to remove myself
from this list, as I still enjoy Roman History. This list is
OBVIOUSLY only intended for citizens and those who wish to BECOME
citizens but not for FORMER citizens who retain interest in history.

Nova Roma is not discrimination in spades again.

Crystal Meaker


Subject:	Things which will remain the same (repost)
From:	"Donald and Crystal Meaker" <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=029056113163056209105098072248155208071048" >meakerfam@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 15:25:33 -0000

Before I am thrown from this list for speaking my mind, defending
myself against attacks from Pontiffs and Senators, and not being a
member of Nova Roma any longer, I need to repost this ----

Below there are links to the sites/lists which I began, which the
government does not care for, but will not go away with my
citizenship in Nova Roma.

<a href="http://www.egroups.com/subscribe/ViaTrames" target="_top" >http://www.egroups.com/subscribe/ViaTrames</a> This is the Public list
for those who wish to speak their minds. Remember this is a public
list, so you may still want to kiss a little NR mucky muck butt.

<a href="http://www.egroups.com/subscribe/TemplumOraclum" target="_top" >http://www.egroups.com/subscribe/TemplumOraclum</a>

<a href="http://www.egroups.com/subscribe/RomanBackAlley" target="_top" >http://www.egroups.com/subscribe/RomanBackAlley</a> This is still a
private list. My leaving Nova Roma will NOT make this list
disappear. Be warned however, that you may or may not be punished
for your participation on this list by those who remain.

Sodalis Familiaris -- This Sodalis has won more awards than the
Nova Roma site. It is the only one of it's kind. A site dedicated
to the forgotten ones. Ancient Roman children and elderly. The only
place you will find information on the children of Nova Roma, besides
the Gens Iunia site (and that will likely be removed as I am no
linger a member) is here. Nova Roma has historically shown little
interest in it's children or the children within the society it
wishes to "recreate". <a href="http://famromo.wiccan.net" target="_top" >http://famromo.wiccan.net</a>

Templum Oraclum <a href="http://famromo.wiccan.net/templum/" target="_top" >http://famromo.wiccan.net/templum/</a>

The Online Temple of Juno <a href="http://famromo.wiccan.net/iuno/" target="_top" >http://famromo.wiccan.net/iuno/</a>

Crystal Meaker


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Public apology to the Collegium Pontificum and the Meakers (limited apology)
From:	"Augusti--------ulia Caesaria Noctur--------#34; <a href="/post/--------roma?protectID=091176219007018031015158190036129" >--------la@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 16:31:21 +0100

Salvete Omnes

> And I still think that the Meakers were coward for Marcus Cassius Iulianus
> cannot at the moment answer your statements on this list.


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] The history of the Meakers in Nova Roma
From:
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 11:42:21 EDT

Salve whatever-your-name-is-today,

You have left and returned so many times that it has really become a
rather empty gesture at this point, which is, I suppose, why you remain
here after having supposedly left again. Too bad Rome never identified a
"Goddess of the Revolving Door" -- you could serve her well.

For my part, I think it would be a courtesy, if you despise Nova Roma so,
for you to depart and leave us alone. We'll be fine. Hope you will too.

'Bye.

L. Sergius Aust.

On 4/28/00 8:57 AM Donald and Crystal Meaker (<a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=029056113163056209105098072248155208071048" >meakerfam@--------</a>) wrote:

>--- In <a href="mailto:novaroma@--------" >novaroma@--------</a>, "Antonio Grilo" amg@c... wrote:
>> Salvete Kyrene et al
>>
>> I agree that I have exagerated in my statements. But the reason for
>this is
>> that I know the efforts that the Pontifex Maximus and other people
>have done
>> for the Meakers.
>
>
>The only thing the Pontifex has done for me is send Lapis a reindeer
>the Saturnalia before he was born, as well as gifts for Terry and a
>few things for me. The application for the Priestess of Juno was
>lost not less than 4 times. It was then "given" to me by
>Germanicus. Are Cassius and Germanicus the same person?
>
>
>>Their constant rebel reactions and unpolite statements made
>> me angry, even more because they were cowards posting their
>statement. Why?
>> They are attacking the Pontifex Maximus while he is absent. Marcus
>Cassius
>> Iulianus cannot answer their statement. In some way I'm happy with
>it
>> because such as statement, taking into account the history of the
>Meakers in
>> Nova Roma, does not deserve any answer. That was another of my
>mistakes.
>>
>> Valete
>> Antonius Gryllus Graecus
>
>
>Would you like me to forward all the digests to the Pontifex? Give
>me his phone number. I will be HAPPY to call him and let him know
>EXACTLY what I think. Cassius has mentioned in the past that I am
>extremely honest, with myself and others. That everyone has such a
>problem with that strakes me as hilarious!!!
>
>
>Crystal Meaker

certe, Toto, sentio nos in Kansate non iam adesse.

(You know, Toto, I have a feeling we're not in Kansas anymore.)


Subject:	Things which will remain the same
From:	Donald and Crystal Meaker <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=029056113163056209105098072248155208071048" >meakerfam@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 09:12:08 -0700

Below there are links to the sites/lists which I began, which the
government does not care for, but will not go away with my citizenship in
Nova Roma.

<a href="http://www.egroups.com/subscribe/ViaTrames" target="_top" >http://www.egroups.com/subscribe/ViaTrames</a> This is the Public list for
those who wish to speak their minds. Remember this is a public list, so
you may still want to kiss a little NR mucky muck butt.

<a href="http://www.egroups.com/subscribe/TemplumOraclum" target="_top" >http://www.egroups.com/subscribe/TemplumOraclum</a>

<a href="http://www.egroups.com/subscribe/RomanBackAlley" target="_top" >http://www.egroups.com/subscribe/RomanBackAlley</a> This is still a private
list. My leaving Nova Roma will NOT make this list disappear. Be warned
however, that you may or may not be punished for your participation on
this list by those who remain.

Sodalis Familiaris -- This Sodalis has won more awards than the Nova
Roma site. It is the only one of it's kind. A site dedicated to the
forgotten ones. Ancient Roman children and elderly. The only place you
will find information on the children of Nova Roma, besides the Gens
Iunia site (and that will likely be removed as I am no linger a member)
is here. Nova Roma has historically shown little interest in it's
children or the children within the society it wishes to "recreate".
<a href="http://famromo.wiccan.net" target="_top" >http://famromo.wiccan.net</a>

Templum Oraclum <a href="http://famromo.wiccan.net/templum/" target="_top" >http://famromo.wiccan.net/templum/</a>

The Online Temple of Juno <a href="http://famromo.wiccan.net/iuno/" target="_top" >http://famromo.wiccan.net/iuno/</a>

Crystal Meaker


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Things which will remain the same (repost)
From:
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 12:07:30 EDT

In a message dated 4/28/2000 8:27:16 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
<a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=029056113163056209105098072248155208071048" >meakerfam@--------</a> writes:

<< Before I am thrown from this list for speaking my mind, defending
myself against attacks from Pontiffs and Senators, and not being a
member of Nova Roma any longer >>
Oh come on now, Crystal! Quit being so melodramatic! No one is throwing you
off the list. Disgruntled Ex Nova Romans of Yesterdays (DENRY) have every
right to be here to observe. However since you are no longer a citizen of
the micro nation you no longer can make comments except in a historical
nature. Actually you have done several good projects on Roman history. And
I acknowledge that. Good luck in future endeavors.
Farewell
Q. Fabius Maximus.


Subject:	Journal of Roman Archaeology
From:
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 12:18:14 EDT

Salvete! For your information
New supplements to the Journal of Roman Archaeology are now available; all
are proceedings of important conferences. See:

<a href="http://www.journalofromanarch.com" target="_top" >http://www.journalofromanarch.com</a>

S37.2 Roman baths and bathing Part 2 (First international conference on
Roman Baths) edited by Janet DeLaine and David Johnston.

S38. Romanization and the city: creation, transformations and failures.
Conference held at the American Academy. edited by Elizabeth Fentress. This
includes the first publication by Eugenio La Rocca of the painting of a
city from the Colle Oppio (Baths of Trajan) in Rome, with colour plates.
Also a report by the excavators on the context of the painting.

S39.1. From the parts to the whole. Part 1. Proceedings of the 13th
International Bronze Congress held at Harvard University, edited by Carol
Mattusch, Amy Brauer and Sandra Knudsen.
------------------------------------------------------------------
Dr. Pe--------W. Foss <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=197044253112099135227082190036" >pfoss@--------</a>
Department of Classical Studies Ph. 765-658-4597
L-40 East College Fax. 765-658-4764
DePauw University <a href="http://acad.depauw.edu/romarch/" target="_top" >http://acad.depauw.edu/romarch/</a>
Greencastle, IN 46135


Subject:	The Cista
From:	"Augusti--------ulia Caesaria Noctur--------#34; <a href="/post/--------roma?protectID=091176219007018031015158190036129" >--------la@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 17:58:24 +0100

Salvete Omnes!

I would like to explain to those who did not understand what was happening, just what happened with the Cista, and apologise for the trouble it caused.

Firstly; my cousin, Tarquinius Caesar's computer crashed, just after I had offered to help him with other bits of the site.
Graecus was heading off for a holiday (lucky person!) so I was to upload the Cista.

At this point I did not realise there were any problems with it, I assumed (Stupid thing to do!) that I would just upload the file and it would work as per usual.

Well, as you saw it did not.

Then my dad tied up the computer for a couple of days and I could only use it for short amounts of time, even then I could not fix the Cista as I do not have the correct software.

I would like to thank Marcus Octavius Germanicus for stepping in and saving the elections!

Thanks to him things have been sorted out and the voting has gone without any problems.

I woudl like to apologise for the trouble this caused to the elections.

Valete.

A I C Nocturnia

------------------------------------------------
Augustina Iulia Caesaria Nocturnia
Materfamilias of the British gens Iulia Caesaria
etc, etc, etc

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Subject:	Reminder to Vote
From:	"susan brett" <a --------="/post/novaroma?protectID=061158091009093031223225065148243223136058139046209" >scriba_forum@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 17:09:21 GMT

Salvete Civites:

This has been quite an eventful week in the forum. With all that has gone
on, it would be pretty easy to forget to vote, a most important duty as
citizens of our res publica. So,...here's a friendly reminder!

The voting cista is located at our website www.novaroma.org, for those who
may not know.

Voting was to terminate April 30 but was extended for 48 hours due to
technical difficulties at the onset of the election.

Valete,
Pompeia Cornelia Strabo
Scriba Consula
Marcus Minucius Audens
Nova Roma

________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at <a href="http://www.hotmail.com" target="_top" >http://www.hotmail.com</a>


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Joining us in Pompeii
From:	"Rick Brett" <a --------="/post/novaroma?protectID=189212253108160085015199190036129" >trog99@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 10:24:20 PDT

Salve, Hibernicus!

That is so cool!
Pompeia Cornelia

>From: "S--------dan/ Hibernicus" <a --------="/post/novaroma?protectID=034056178009193132062218046036129208" >legioix@--------</a>
>Reply-To: <a href="mailto:novaroma@--------" >novaroma@--------</a>
>To: <a href="mailto:novaroma@--------" >novaroma@--------</a>
>Subject: [novaroma] Joining us in Pompeii
>Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 19:36:48 -0000
>
>Salvete!
>
>We've started something fun and want everyone to join in!
>
>Go here to find out how:
>
><a href="http://www.geocities.com/~hibernicus/pompeii.html" target="_top" >http://www.geocities.com/~hibernicus/pompeii.html</a>
>
>Hibernicus
>Legio IX Hispana
>
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws.
><a href="http://click.egroups.com/1/3020/4/_/61050/_/956899268/" target="_top" >http://click.egroups.com/1/3020/4/_/61050/_/956899268/</a>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>

________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at <a href="http://www.hotmail.com" target="_top" >http://www.hotmail.com</a>


Subject:	Goals / Hopes
From:	<a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=045232113165042200148200112241225012177026038196249130152150" >jmath669642reng@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 11:06:02 -0400 (EDT)

Salve, Gaius Festus;

I will start this message by stating that I don't think I care much for
you and your manner. I am sure that this will not make much difference
to you, but I wanted to be honest and up-front. I must say that your
philosophy and your obvious literate accomplishments are very impressive
and your ability to argue your points are well done. Far better that
mine, in that regard. Having started on that note let me further say
that I am not afraid to admit a mistake if such an admission is
warranted. I am willing to make common cause with you, but I just
wished you to know that if that is to be, it may be a little harder in
this case. Again that may not interest you, but there it is.

When you first posted your message. I discarded it as something I did
not wish to consider, but when it came back to me a couple of times I
realized that I was being unfair. I don't like the feeling that I am
being unfair, and I suppose that I have an over-developed sense of
conscience. Whatever!!

In response to your question what do I expect from Nova Roma, I think
that my last two messages to the list define my ideal vision of what I
hope for Nova Roma in the short term. As for the long term:

--I hope to see a significant increase in the desire of ciizens to
participate in Nova Roma by taking advantage of their right to vote;

--I hope to see more citizens taking an active part in solving, in a
fair and equitable manner, the probems outlined in my previous messages;

--I hope at the end of my period in the Cursus Honorium to return to my
Sodalitas and continue my research work in Roman Engineering and
Cartography with an eye to possibly publishing a thesis of that work
through the Eagle;

--I hope that in the near future we can develop some kind of element
that will allow our overseas members to communicate with those of us who
use the English language exclusively, as I know from y experinces in
other countries, that we are missing much from the other great cultures
of the world hidden from us by the mask of a language barrier;

--I hope that our Provinces will begin to share the good ideas of those
who govern, and learn better ways of reaching those within their borders
who desire to know more about Rome and her culture;

--I hope that I will be able to deveop the proposed Outreach Sodalitas
into an effective organization for the contact of like-minded people
throughout the world, and make it an effective instrument of Nova Roma.

As for the rest, I am confident that our membership if properly
supported and sufficently refreshed with new ideas and challenges, will
move this Micro-Nation to a place of continued prominance limited only
by the internal ideas of the organization.

I bid you a good day, and I thank you for the opportunity to expound my
hopes for the future in regard to NR.

Vale, Respectfully;
Marcus Audens

Fair Winds and Following Seas!!!


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] TEST
From:
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 10:12:34 -0500

My last post here was delayed by a full day. (And I note we're both on
via Earthlink.)

L. Sergius Aust.

On 4/27/00 11:19 PM L. Corn--------s Sulla (<a hr--------/post/novaroma?prot--------D=243128192154082190130232203077129208071" >al--------us@--------</a>) wrot--------r>
>Oh thank you....hehe...I sent like three posts...on here and on the Senate
>list and none of them appeared....I am hoping for lag.....but after 4
>hours... Oh well.
>
>Sulla Felix


Subject:	Adios, Aufweidersehen, Ha det, Au Revior, Ciao, and Vale
From:	Mary Beth Clemon--------t;a href="/po--------ovaroma?protectID=029158235056038190172232203219129208071" >mclemon--------..</a>
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 11:47:29 -0400


Subject:
From:	Mary Beth Clemon--------t;a href="/po--------ovaroma?protectID=029158235056038190172232203219129208071" >mclemon--------..</a>
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 11:37:40 -0400

Oh, I got the date wrong. I apologize. Although, everything else in the
letter is accurate!

So, say what you want, I will not allow everything little thing someone says
about me get my feathers in a ruffle, unlike you. I am confident in what I
say and do and someone's "humble opinion" will never change that.

This is my final response to this issue. Anything else would give you a
reason on to keep posting. And I encourage anyone who read and agreed with
my last post to do the same.

Vale,

Minervina Iucundia Flavia
Propraetor SE USA Provincia
and Senator

-----Original Message-----
From: Donald and Crystal Meaker [mailto:<a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=029056113163056209105098072248155208071048" >meakerfam@--------</a>]
Sent: Friday, April 28, 2000 11:21 AM
To: <a href="mailto:novaroma@--------" >novaroma@--------</a>
Subject: RE: [novaroma] Re: Public apology to the Collegium Pontificum an d
the Meakers (limited apology)

--- In <a href="mailto:novaroma@--------" >novaroma@--------</a>, Mary Beth Clemons mclemons@s... wrote:
> Didn't you resign your citizenship yesterday? Or was that a stunt
to draw
> attention to yourself?
>

We resigned our citizenship Wednsday, not yesterday. You were
informed as a Senator. Did you not read the email?

> I grow weary of your constant complaining and bickering. If you
haven't
> figured out why you think all of NR is against you, it's because
you make it
> that way. Everything has be a huge ordeal for you. And so, you
attract
> negative attention. And the sick thing is is that you like it.
That's why
> you are still sticking around to see what people say about you.
>
> Make a move. If you resign, then unsubscribe from the list. I am
sorry
> things didn't work out and I wish you and your family well.
>
> Vale,
>
> Minervina Iucundia Flavia
> Propraetor SE USA Provincia
> Senator
>

I see Senator, that this email list is NOT open to all after all, is
it? The Senate didn't order me around before and it won't now.
Please have your fellow senators ask me, publically, to remove myself
from this list, as I still enjoy Roman History. This list is
OBVIOUSLY only intended for citizens and those who wish to BECOME
citizens but not for FORMER citizens who retain interest in history.

Nova Roma is not discrimination in spades again.

Crystal Meaker

_____

<<a href="http://click.egroups.com/1/3727/4/_/61050/_/956935279/" target="_top" >http://click.egroups.com/1/3727/4/_/61050/_/956935279/</a>>
Auction listings at govWorks.com. Click here.
<<a href="http://adimg.egroups.com/img/3727/4/_/61050/_/956935279/" target="_top" >http://adimg.egroups.com/img/3727/4/_/61050/_/956935279/</a>>

_____

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Subject:	Earthlink
From:	<a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=045232113165042200148200112241225012177026038196249130152150" >jmath669642reng@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 13:00:29 -0400 (EDT)

Just a note for Serg. Aust, and Sulla, I canceled my account about two
weeks ago with earthlink since they canceled their contact phone number
here in my area without notification. I had computer repair people and
telephone people trying to figue out the problem, and my son advised my
breaking off. Just yesterday they billed me again and when my wife
objected, the response was "oh yes, we have the cancellaton here in our
record, we just didn't look for it."

As far as I am concerned they still owe me for the two months charges
after they cut me off, but of course,----- "I am sorreeee sir, there is
no record of such action in our logs!!!!"

Back to square one!!!!

Marcus Audens

Fair Winds and Following Seas!!!


Subject:	Re: Reminder to Vote
From:	"RMerullo" <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=194232192180194153138149203043129208071" >rmerullo@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 15:01:36 -0400

Salvete Cives

Actually, I believe that the new, working cista is located at
<a href="http://www.konoko.net/novaroma/cista.html" target="_top" >http://www.konoko.net/novaroma/cista.html</a>

Valete

C Marius Merullus

>The voting cista is located at our website www.novaroma.org, for those who
>may not know.
>
>Voting was to terminate April 30 but was extended for 48 hours due to
>technical difficulties at the onset of the election.
>


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Re: Reminder to Vote
From:	"JusticeCMO" <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=045075066165082194184102072024114015071048139" &--------usticecmo@--------</a&--------/td>
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 16:08:30 -0400

Salve,

I may have missed the original announcement in my absence, but perhaps
someone here can assist me. I seem to have misplaced my voter code. Whom
should I approach for this information so that I may vote?

Thanking helpful citizens in advance.

Vale,
Priscilla Vedia Serena

----- Original Message -----
From: RMerullo <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=194232192180194153138149203043129208071" >rmerullo@--------</a>
To: <a href="mailto:novaroma@--------" >novaroma@--------</a>
Sent: Friday, April 28, 2000 3:01 PM
Subject: [novaroma] Re: Reminder to Vote

Salvete Cives

Actually, I believe that the new, working cista is located at
<a href="http://www.konoko.net/novaroma/cista.html" target="_top" >http://www.konoko.net/novaroma/cista.html</a>

Valete

C Marius Merullus

>The voting cista is located at our website www.novaroma.org, for those who
>may not know.
>
>Voting was to terminate April 30 but was extended for 48 hours due to
>technical difficulties at the onset of the election.
>

------------------------------------------------------------------------
Get paid for the stuff you know!
Get answers for the stuff you don't. And get $10 to spend on the site!
<a href="http://click.egroups.com/1/2200/4/_/61050/_/956949227/" target="_top" >http://click.egroups.com/1/2200/4/_/61050/_/956949227/</a>
------------------------------------------------------------------------


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Re: Reminder to Vote
From:	<a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=045232113165042200148200112241225012177026038196249130152150" >jmath669642reng@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 16:19:13 -0400 (EDT)

Salve, Pricilla Vedia Serena;

You may approach the ever-helpful and dashing Censor Sulla!

(ha, I got to tell this lovely lady before you did Censor--It doesn't
happen often, but it is most satsfying when it does (Grin !!!!!!!!!!!!!)

Vale, Respectfully,
Marcus Audens

Fair Winds and Following Seas!!!


Subject:	Re: Reminder to Vote
From:	"RMerullo" <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=194232192180194153138149203043129208071" >rmerullo@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 16:26:02 -0400

Salvete Vedia et alii

Censor Sulla should be able to supply you with the code. His e-mail is
<a hr--------/post/novaroma?prot--------D=243128192154082190130232203077129208071" >al--------us@--------</a>.

Valete

C Marius Merullus

>I may have missed the original announcement in my absence, but perhaps
>someone here can assist me. I seem to have misplaced my voter code. Whom
>should I approach for this information so that I may vote?
>
>Thanking helpful citizens in advance.
>
-------
>
>
>


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] TEST
From:
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 13:23:58 -0700

Same here...but I think it was onelist...I could send e-mail privately and it
went through right away. :)

SF

Ira Adams wrote:

> My last post here was delayed by a full day. (And I note we're both on
> via Earthlink.)
>
> L. Sergius Aust.
>
> On 4/27/00 11:19 PM L. Corn--------s Sulla (<a hr--------/post/novaroma?prot--------D=243128192154082190130232203077129208071" >al--------us@--------</a>) wrot--------font>
>
> >Oh thank you....hehe...I sent like three posts...on here and on the Senate
> >list and none of them appeared....I am hoping for lag.....but after 4
> >hours... Oh well.
> >
> >Sulla Felix
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Get paid for the stuff you know!
> Get answers for the stuff you don’t. And get $10 to spend on the site!
> <a href="http://click.egroups.com/1/2200/4/_/61050/_/956943833/" target="_top" >http://click.egroups.com/1/2200/4/_/61050/_/956943833/</a>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Re: Reminder to Vote
From:
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 13:35:26 -0700

Salve

that would be me...could you please send me a private e-mail and I will
respond. :)

Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix
Censor

JusticeCMO wrote:

> Salve,
>
> I may have missed the original announcement in my absence, but perhaps
> someone here can assist me. I seem to have misplaced my voter code. Whom
> should I approach for this information so that I may vote?
>
> Thanking helpful citizens in advance.
>
> Vale,
> Priscilla Vedia Serena
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: RMerullo <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=194232192180194153138149203043129208071" >rmerullo@--------</a>
> To: <a href="mailto:novaroma@--------" >novaroma@--------</a>
> Sent: Friday, April 28, 2000 3:01 PM
> Subject: [novaroma] Re: Reminder to Vote
>
> Salvete Cives
>
> Actually, I believe that the new, working cista is located at
> <a href="http://www.konoko.net/novaroma/cista.html" target="_top" >http://www.konoko.net/novaroma/cista.html</a>
>
> Valete
>
> C Marius Merullus
>
> >The voting cista is located at our website www.novaroma.org, for those who
> >may not know.
> >
> >Voting was to terminate April 30 but was extended for 48 hours due to
> >technical difficulties at the onset of the election.
> >
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Get paid for the stuff you know!
> Get answers for the stuff you don't. And get $10 to spend on the site!
> <a href="http://click.egroups.com/1/2200/4/_/61050/_/956949227/" target="_top" >http://click.egroups.com/1/2200/4/_/61050/_/956949227/</a>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Get paid for the stuff you know!
> Get answers for the stuff you don’t. And get $10 to spend on the site!
> <a href="http://click.egroups.com/1/2200/4/_/61050/_/956952654/" target="_top" >http://click.egroups.com/1/2200/4/_/61050/_/956952654/</a>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Re: Reminder to Vote
From:
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 13:37:48 -0700

ROFL....Thats funny....I needed that.... heheh ;)

Sulla Felix

<a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=045232113165042200148200112241225012177026038196249130152150" >jmath669642reng@--------</a> --------e:

> Salve, Pricilla Vedia Serena;
>
> You may approach the ever-helpful and dashing Censor Sulla!
>
> (ha, I got to tell this lovely lady before you did Censor--It doesn't
> happen often, but it is most satsfying when it does (Grin !!!!!!!!!!!!!)
>
> Vale, Respectfully,
> Marcus Audens
>
> Fair Winds and Following Seas!!!
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Get paid for the stuff you know!
> Get answers for the stuff you don’t. And get $10 to spend on the site!
> <a href="http://click.egroups.com/1/2200/4/_/61050/_/956953180/" target="_top" >http://click.egroups.com/1/2200/4/_/61050/_/956953180/</a>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Re: Reminder to Vote Whoops!
From:	"susan brett" <a --------="/post/novaroma?protectID=061158091009093031223225065148243223136058139046209" >scriba_forum@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 21:28:53 GMT

Salvete Cives:

Oops...I apologize for issuing the wrong cista addie ...At any rate...please
do not forget to vote! Assensus Merullus has kindly issued the correct Cista
Address below...again, my apologies!
Pompeia Cornelia

>From: "RMerullo" <a href="/post/novaroma?prote--------=194232192180194153138149203043129208071" >rmerullo@--------</a>
>Reply-To: <a href="mailto:novaroma@--------" >novaroma@--------</a>
>To: <a href="mailto:novaroma@--------" >novaroma@--------</a>
>Subject: [novaroma] Re: Reminder to Vote
>Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 15:01:36 -0400
>
>Salvete Cives
>
>Actually, I believe that the new, working cista is located at
><a href="http://www.konoko.net/novaroma/cista.html" target="_top" >http://www.konoko.net/novaroma/cista.html</a>
>
>Valete
>
>C Marius Merullus
>
>
> >The voting cista is located at our website www.novaroma.org, for those
>who
> >may not know.
> >
> >Voting was to terminate April 30 but was extended for 48 hours due to
> >technical difficulties at the onset of the election.
> >
>
>

________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at <a href="http://www.hotmail.com" target="_top" >http://www.hotmail.com</a>


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Goals / Hopes
From:	"Doug Barr" <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=114015211254158209218218186036129208" >dhkbarr@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 13:11:51 -0700

Salve Marce Audens

----- Original Message -----

[snip of prologue and some interesting goals]

> --I hope that in the near future we can develop some kind of element
> that will allow our overseas members to communicate with those of us who
> use the English language exclusively, as I know from y experinces in
> other countries, that we are missing much from the other great cultures
> of the world hidden from us by the mask of a language barrier;

One thing that might be of limited help is to find out which citizens speak
which languages, so that we can turn to those citizens for help or a quick
translation. Just a thought. Acadianus Draco and I already have nearly half
the globe covered, as languages go.

Valete
Gaius Albius


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Goals / Hopes
From:
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 15:21:09 -0700

Well...we can add something to the Citizenapplication to account for other
languages. And make a portion of the website over for that....with e-mail
links (With consent) Given the Lex Cornelia de Privats Rebus. I know
already that my Gens member, Cornelius Scriptor is preparing a copy of the
Nova Roma site in French. And Lucius Pompeius speaks Spanish... :) Maybe
once I get some progress on the Instant Messaging programs (my pet project)
going, my Censorial Colleague will work on the language issue. :)

Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix
Censor
----- Original Message -----
From: "Doug Barr" <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=114015211254158209218218186036129208" >dhkbarr@--------</a>
To: <a href="mailto:novaroma@--------" >novaroma@--------</a>
Sent: Friday, April 28, 2000 1:11 PM
Subject: Re: [novaroma] Goals / Hopes

> Salve Marce Audens
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>
> [snip of prologue and some interesting goals]
>
> > --I hope that in the near future we can develop some kind of element
> > that will allow our overseas members to communicate with those of us who
> > use the English language exclusively, as I know from y experinces in
> > other countries, that we are missing much from the other great cultures
> > of the world hidden from us by the mask of a language barrier;
>
> One thing that might be of limited help is to find out which citizens
speak
> which languages, so that we can turn to those citizens for help or a quick
> translation. Just a thought. Acadianus Draco and I already have nearly
half
> the globe covered, as languages go.
>
> Valete
> Gaius Albius
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Get paid for the stuff you know!
> Get answers for the stuff you don't. And get $10 to spend on the site!
> <a href="http://click.egroups.com/1/2200/4/_/61050/_/956959961/" target="_top" >http://click.egroups.com/1/2200/4/_/61050/_/956959961/</a>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>


Subject:	Reminder
From:
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 16:24:37 -0700

Everyone who needs a voter code. Please e-mail me and I will get them to you. We need everyone to come out and vote.

Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix
Censor
*I have voted, have you?*

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Subject:	Languages
From:	<a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=045232113165042200148200112241225012177026038196249130152150" >jmath669642reng@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 19:28:57 -0400 (EDT)

Salve, all interested;

I have thought from the very beginning of my involvement on Nova Roma
that such subject efforts were worthy to make and be sensitive to, but I
am probably the world's worst linguist. If it had not been for three
bottles of expensive scotch whiskey and an understanding Spanish
professor, I should have had a much worse time in college than I did.

My first hope was that the internet would develop a kind of translation
website or websites, but those who are more involved than I, tell me
that this kind of effort is still very much in it's infancy.

A second possibilty has occurred to me with the idea of the Proposed
Outreach Sodalitas, where it might be possible to combine our present NR
linguists with others who might be attacted to our organization to build
on our skills. At the present time all I possess are the desire to do
something along those lines, and a few disconnected ideas. Perhaps as
we go along we will be able to pick up some linguistic scholars who may
have a few good ideas. At any rate it is one of my personal goals for
NR.

I thank you for your kind comments and recogniton.

Vale, Respectfully;
Marcus Audens

Fair Winds and Following Seas!!!


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Reminder
From:	"Doug Barr" <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=114015211254158209218218186036129208" >dhkbarr@--------</a>
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 16:26:47 -0700

Salve Censor:

I voted, but don't think I received a confirming vote number. Will my vote
have counted?

Vale
C. Albius Gadelicus


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Reminder
From:
Date:	Fri, 28 Apr 2000 16:56:37 -0700

Salve, if you voted in the OLD Cista.....those votes are invalidated you
need to vote in the New Cista....Everyone then gets a voter Number.

Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix
Censor
----- Original Message -----
From: "Doug Barr" <a href="/post/novaroma?protectID=114015211254158209218218186036129208" >dhkbarr@--------</a>
To: "Nova Roma List" <a href="mailto:novaroma@--------" >novaroma@--------</a>
Sent: Friday, April 28, 2000 4:26 PM
Subject: Re: [novaroma] Reminder

> Salve Censor:
>
> I voted, but don't think I received a confirming vote number. Will my vote
> have counted?
>
> Vale
> C. Albius Gadelicus
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws.
> <a href="http://click.egroups.com/1/3020/4/_/61050/_/956965548/" target="_top" >http://click.egroups.com/1/3020/4/_/61050/_/956965548/</a>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>