| Subject: |
[novaroma] New poll for novaroma |
| From: |
novaroma@-------- |
| Date: |
10 Jun 2000 00:11:10 -0000 |
|
Enter your vote today! Check out the new poll for the novaroma
group:
Should Senate topics be displayed daily
by the Tribunes to the citizens of Nova
Roma?
o Definitly
o Perhaps, if better explained
o Not likely
o Absolutly Not
To vote, please visit the following web page:
http://www.egroups.com/polls/novaroma
Note: Please do not reply to this message. Poll votes are
not collected via email. To vote, you must go to the eGroups
web site listed above.
Thanks!
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| Subject: |
[novaroma] New poll for novaroma |
| From: |
novaroma@-------- |
| Date: |
10 Jun 2000 00:14:01 -0000 |
|
Enter your vote today! Check out the new poll for the novaroma
group:
Should Senate topics be displayed daily
to the citizens of Nova Roma by the
Tribunes?
o Definitly
o Perhaps, if more detailed
o Maybe
o Not likely
o Absolutly Not
To vote, please visit the following web page:
http://www.egroups.com/polls/novaroma
Note: Please do not reply to this message. Poll votes are
not collected via email. To vote, you must go to the eGroups
web site listed above.
Thanks!
------------------------------------------------------------------------
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| Subject: |
[novaroma] Gladiator |
| From: |
"Michael" <maf@--------> |
| Date: |
Sat, 10 Jun 2000 17:59:49 +1000 |
|
Salve
I may be the last on the list to do so - but I've finally seen Gladiator. The verdict: Good, but could have been better. The best parts for me were the images of Rome (though I desperately wanted to see more than just the Colosseum), and the opening battle sequence. Despite the inaccuracies, I thought it was probably a very good depiction of what battle must have been like before gunpowder - a disorganised melee of desperate men hacking at each other. As for the rest of the movie, I wont quibble about inaccuracies - although they were apparent, even to a novice historian like myself - but they didnt really detract from the movie. In some cases they may even have enhanced it (I'm sure the all black armour and gear of the Praetorians wasnt accurate, but I thought it looked suitably sinister). Commodus was wonderfully slimy, it was a real treat to see Derek Jacobi back in toga and sandals (although I almost expected him to start stammering!), and Richard Harris was superb as Marcus Aurelius. I havent forgotten the star either - the best thing I can say for him is - Braveheart would have been an incomparably better movie with Russell Crowe instead of Mel Gibson in the lead role.
Vale
Marcus Afranius Regulus
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] Citizen from Italy |
| From: |
Guido Costantini <flyke@--------> |
| Date: |
Sat, 10 Jun 2000 12:50:26 +0200 |
|
At 10.38 08/06/00 -0000, you wrote:
>Salve Domitius Costantinus,
>
>benvenuto fra noi ; beato te che non dimostri problemi con la lingua
>inlese! Come potrai leggere sul Foro Romano board , ho dato un
>meeting di massima per i cittadini di lingua italiana sulla chat line
>verso le ore 14.00 dei giorni feriali. Spero di trovarti.
>
>Marcus Attilius salutem dicit.
>
>
Vale
errr.. come ci arrivo alla chat?
Domitius Constantinus Fuscus
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| Subject: |
[novaroma] Fw: FW: Roman Military |
| From: |
Jennifer E Hunt <riturtle@--------> |
| Date: |
Sat, 10 Jun 2000 14:04:42 -0400 |
|
Could someone respond to this request for information, please?
Gratias vobis ago!
-----Original Message-----
From: Ar nDraiocht Fein Warriors list [mailto:ADF-WARRIORS@--------]On
Behalf Of Rene H. Morache
Sent: Friday, June 09, 2000 8:38 PM
To: ADF-WARRIORS@--------
Subject: Roman Military
I am currently researching a topic for a project of mine and would like
to know if anyone has any informantion regarding the Roman Navy. What
kind of vessels they had and how large they were. What kind of
capabilities they had and their seakeeping qualities. Also if anyone
might know if their chain of command would have used written orders or
verbal commands when giving assignments to ships. Basicly I was
wondering if Caesar would have given a verbal command to one of his
captains or if he would send a written order via a courier. One has to
wonder if we have the Romans to thank for military paperwork as well?
I eagerly await a reply. I can be reached privately at
rmorache@--------
Blessed Be,
Brian Morache
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| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] Fw: FW: Roman Military |
| From: |
Razenna <razenna@--------> |
| Date: |
Sat, 10 Jun 2000 12:17:52 -0700 |
|
Salve.
I received this forward through the Nova Roma main list. I am not the
most knowledgible on this subject -- not by far -- but I am a naval
enthusiast and I thought I would give you what I could. A very
knowledgeable man on the subject is Marcus Minucius Audens the founder
of the Military and Naval Sodalicum. Q. Fabius Maximus is also very
knowledgeable from his historical interests and as a wargamer. I'm
"cc'ing" this to Audens in hopes that he will be able to add some more
illuminating information. I've also cc'ed the Nova Roma list in hopes
that interested Nova Romans will enjoy something different.
I'll try to intersperse my comments below in the appropriate places.
First: An excellent book is _ The Age of the Galley _ in the
Conway's History of the Ship series, published by Naval Institute
Press in the U.S.. You might be able to find it in a good library --
it costs $50.
Jennifer E Hunt wrote:
> Could someone respond to this request for information, please?
>
> Gratias vobis ago!
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Ar nDraiocht Fein Warriors list
> [mailto:ADF-WARRIORS@--------]On
> Behalf Of Rene H. Morache
> Sent: Friday, June 09, 2000 8:38 PM
> To: ADF-WARRIORS@--------
> Subject: Roman Military
>
>
> I am currently researching a topic for a project of mine and would
> like
> to know if anyone has any informantion regarding the Roman Navy.
***The Naval Institute Press also offers the early 20th Century book,
Greek and Roman Naval Warfare by W. L. Rodgers. Much in it has been
revised by later research and discoveries, not to mention the
reconstruction of some of the ships.
> What
> kind of vessels they had and how large they were. What kind of
> capabilities they had and their seakeeping qualities.
The period in question is important, but I will just skim things and
not go past Actium.There were many types and sizes of vessels. The
prime small warship in the Roman Navy was probably the Liburnian. It
had two banks of oars. It was fast. It was adopted and adapted from
a favorite vesel of pirates in the Adriatic, the coast of Liburnia.
The largest ships that the Romans got for themselves were Quadriremes
and Quinquiremes. Triremes were used a lot, but in the course of the
Punic Wars the "Fours" and "Fives" were the main combat ships. It was
a case of each side using large ships and as good as a "Three" was as
an excellent balance of size and speed, they were at a disadvantage
against the "battleships".
Seakeeping: That has been argued a lot. Mostly on the side of the
galleys not being all that good at seakeeping. The replica trireme
Olympias showed that the Threes, and possibly the larger vessels by
extension of thought, were better seakeepers than had been thought.
Olympias could sail closer to the wind than had been thought, and she
did not heel as much as had been theorized. As you know, one of the
big points in seakeeping is staying afloat, the freeboard to the
lowest oar ports is a critical factor with the galleys. The Olympias
had leather gaskets that were fastened around the lower oars by means
of lashings. The vessel stayed drier than they had expected, this
allowed them to cautiously push the envelope a bit more.
Of course we know about the numerous Roman fleets that were
lost to storms. Many on the south coast of Sicily. Poor seamanship
was the telling factor in these cases, in my opinion. There are times
when you should just stay in port. The demands of war added to the
bad decisions (we gotta get There Son!), but the human factor was
there.
Capabilities: The types of ships varied as did the
capabilities. And, of course, there are the various categories of
capabilities. Speed, under oar and under sail. Seakeeping. Combat
abilities -- number of troups carried and types. Number of crew and
their quality. Endurance. I'm going to pass on this one. I'm just
not up to a dissertation =({[;-)
> Also if anyone
> might know if their chain of command would have used written orders
> or
> verbal commands when giving assignments to ships. Basicly I was
> wondering if Caesar would have given a verbal command to one of his
> captains or if he would send a written order via a courier. One has
> to
> wonder if we have the Romans to thank for military paperwork as
> well?
The Romans were not only literate, they were big on putting things in
writing, and there is the fact that the expanse covered by a fleet,
and many of the fleets were monstrous in size, would necessitate
written orders. Okay, I'm using a lot of supposition here. Here it
is for what it's worth. Signal flags are only so much use, even
before the smoke of burning ships obscures things. Signals would be
used while they could. It seems individual ships' commanders'
initiative had some play. Some of the formations in the Greek battles
were innovative, which indicates planning, drill and communication, at
least before the action was joined. A lot of the communication would
have been before the action. The High Commander's orders in the
course of battle would have weight, but there is the factor of anybody
being able to know what he wanted. At Actium the plans of both sides
were determined before the battle. Once it was joined it was
basically a grand melee. This is not far from what the land battles
were like. But if Caesar said do such and such, those who heard him
would do it. A courier might be able to reach farther, but the
dispatch boat would not be able to effectively communicate with more
than a few ships. The Romans might well have been the originators of
military paperwork, but battle orders would be limited by the physical
restrictions of the limitations of the battlefield communications of
that technology level. On the sea and on land. It always is.
> I eagerly await a reply. I can be reached privately at
> rmorache@--------
> Blessed Be,
> Brian Morache
I hope this helps some. At the least, I hope the cc'ing I did will
shake loose some better information for you.
Di Deaque te ament.
Bene Vale.
Caius Aelius Ericius.
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|
| Subject: |
[novaroma] V. ID. IUN. |
| From: |
Razenna <razenna@--------> |
| Date: |
Sat, 10 Jun 2000 12:50:08 -0700 |
|
Today is the VESTALIA.
Today is a Dies Nefasti.
As such it is a day on which no legal action of public voting may take
place.
The VESTALIA. Offerings were made to the Goddess in the home and on
the state level. Women were allowed to visit the Temple of Vesta and
bring offerings. Ovid writes of a barefooted matron bringing simple
offerings to Vesta -- "a clean platter contains the food offered to
Vesta."
The day became a holiday for millers and bakers who decorated the
millstones and donkeys that did the work with garlands and small
loaves.
The VESTALIA is the focal point for the June activities of the
Vestals. The temple of Vesta was open from June 7 for eight days for
worshipping women.
Salve Vesta Mater. Quod bonum faustum, felictatem, prosperitatem,
fortunatem salutareque sit Novae Romae.
Ita est.
Valete.
C. Aelius Ericius.
Pontifex. Augur.
-----------
post scriptum:
apologies to Latinistas.
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|
| Subject: |
[novaroma] Galley links |
| From: |
Razenna <razenna@--------> |
| Date: |
Sat, 10 Jun 2000 13:42:56 -0700 |
|
Here are a few I dragged up after I sent the earlier post.
an Introduction to the trireme Olympias
http://www.atm.ox.ac.uk/rowing/ttintro.html
an encyclopedia entry
http://www.historyofship.com/s012.htm
some links from "Google.com" search of Roman Navy
http://www.classis-romana.de/
http://www.archeologia.com/roman_navy/rn.html
http://www.freeweb.org/letteratura/romaeterna/index.htm
Vale.
C. Aelius Ericius.
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| Subject: |
[novaroma] Additional notes from the Senate floor |
| From: |
LSergAust@-------- |
| Date: |
Sat, 10 Jun 2000 16:51:05 EDT |
|
Salvete Omnes,
Two additional items that have been before the Senate:
1) questions about what in the way of public business should and what
should not be permitted on religious days, i.e., dies nefasti. I think
the Senate has decided to hold off conducting further formal business
until after the Ides, when there will be legal days for public business
again.
2) a demand for sanctions against your (not so) humble Tribunus Plebis (I
think the "not so humble" thing is part of the problem). It seems that a
certain senior magistrate who had been freely calling other people
"dishonest" and similar terms, is incensed that when he called me a liar
I replied that he was the liar. I'm afraid that in my anger, I said some
things that made some other magistrates feel insulted, and I have
apologized to anyone else who might have taken offense. I have even
stated that I will apologize to the magistrate who called me and others
liars IF he apologizes for having done so. However he is apparently not
inclined to apologize. So be it.
I was hesitant to announce this feud to the public, since I don't
normally report other political squabbles that are a part of the Senate's
deliberations. However, since the other magistrate seems to want to make
it a matter of official business, I think the citizens should be informed.
I have requested that the Comitia Centuriata be convened to consider both
the edict that was the topic of the debate in question, and now
additionally the issue of whether there has been magisterial misconduct
on the part of either of us. It remains undetermined whether the senior
magistrates of Nova Roma are willing to allow the citizens to exercise
their supreme authority as the Constitution calls for.
End of Senate news report.
**********************************************************************
WARNING -- Editorial Comment follows:
What part do the "People" play in "SPQR" (Senate and People of Rome)?
Lucius Sergius Australicus
Tribunus Plebis
sentio aliquos togatos contra me conspirare.
(I think some people in togas are plotting against me.)
------------------------------------------------------------------------
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| Subject: |
[novaroma] The poll. |
| From: |
DrususCornelius@-------- |
| Date: |
Sat, 10 Jun 2000 18:02:05 EDT |
|
Salvete!
I would like to call to the attention of the citizenry of Nova Roma the
current results of the poll regarding gender naming policy (as if Nova Roma's
attention isn't fixed there already). After 53 replies it seems simply
obvious to me that the people of Nova Roma are not in favor of the edict
issued by my paterfamilias, and our honored Censor, Lucius Cornelius Sulla.
I believe it is time that the Comitia Centuriata be called in order for the
people to make it officially known that they are truly against this edict.
In these early stages of the Republic can't we stand up and declare that Nova
Roma is truly a Public Affair and not an oppressive oligarchy who's leaders
care nothing for the will of its populous? To whichever magistrates this
concerns: Please, call the committee and let the people include their voice
to the governance of this young nation.
For the Senate and the Roman People, Valete!
Drusus Cornelius Claudius
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| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] Additional notes from the Senate floor |
| From: |
RexMarcius@-------- |
| Date: |
Sat, 10 Jun 2000 18:06:28 EDT |
|
Salvete omnes!
I want to state publicly, that any sanctions against a Tribune for whatever
he has done in connection with his office, are in my not so humble opinion
too grave a matter to be kept from the citizens. All I say now has to be
understood in the sense that I do not exactly know what is going on and that
I therefore have to suppose the worst is happening.
I live in Austria which has been in the news lately because of a right wing
politician who led his extremist party into government. One of the things he
now proposed, was to have criminal proceedings opened against opposition
politicians who voiced criticism (very outspoken) against the
government....this has provoked an outcry - not only in Austria - because it
is so obviously undemocratic: To call for sanctions in the political arena
(where a lot of ugly things are happening daily) by those in power is also a
call for silencing the opposition. And the Tribune is not merely the
"opposition", it is a sacrosanct office. For this reason IMnsHO even the
Senate has not enough authority to impose sanctions on it, probably (and even
there I am not absolutely sure, as Tribunes can also veto laws) only the
People could. Such a senatus consultum would therefore be against the spirit
of the Constitution and the Tribunes could and should collegially veto it.
A VERY concerned citizen
Marcus Marcius Rex
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| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] The poll. |
| From: |
Guido Costantini <flyke@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 11 Jun 2000 01:28:45 +0200 |
|
> After 53 replies it seems simply
>obvious to me that the people of Nova Roma are not in favor of the edict
>issued by my paterfamilias, and our honored Censor, Lucius Cornelius Sulla.
Vale
I'm sorry.. WHAT are you talking about?.. if we read teh same page, 58,5%
of the people said that
"Yes, one's Roman name should always reflect his/her actual gender", even
if the 34% thinks that "exceptions should be made for those living their
real (not virtual) lives as the opposite gender." (how this should be
checked, is something that escapes me).. so, seems to me that most of the
people think that generally the edict of Sulla had some good in it if that
true intention of the Censor was to avoid mere online "players" around.
Incidentally, it still escapes me how things are going to be checked... I
could have submitted as a woman when I asked for citizenship and I really
doubt the censor or an official envoy of Nova Roma would have taken an
intercontinental flight to Italy to come here in Rome and check it...
just my two pater (childless so far) cent
Vale
Domitius Constantinus Fuscus
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