Subject:	[novaroma] Interesting site
From:	"L. Cornelius Sulla" <alexious@-------->
Date:	Thu, 28 Sep 2000 18:24:39 -0700

Ave

I have found a website that will allow anyone to register Domains for a year for 1.00!

I have just registered www.genscornelia.org for a year.

Here is the URL: staples.register.com

Vale!

Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


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Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Interesting site
From:	StarVVreck@--------
Date:	Thu, 28 Sep 2000 22:06:50 EDT

Ave Sulla,

I have seen services to register Domains for free. Their service just
fowards anyone who goes to the URL to whatever URL you want (an IP address or
a free web-space server like Tripod.com)
www.domainzero.com is completely free, catch - you have to sign up for half
dozen email programs using the email address you used to sign up.
and www.namezero.com is also completely free, their catch - a big frame on
the bottom with a bunch of advertisements.

<< Ave

I have found a website that will allow anyone to register Domains for a year
for 1.00!

I have just registered www.genscornelia.org for a year.

Here is the URL: staples.register.com

Vale!

Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix >>

Vale!
Iulius Titinius

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Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Interesting site
From:	"L. Cornelius Sulla" <alexious@-------->
Date:	Thu, 28 Sep 2000 19:09:54 -0700

yea but this is from Staples....so there isnt those catches. :) At least
not that I have found...and this site is going through Earthlink....so, if
there was that kind of a catch.... I dont think people here would be going
after it so fast..... :) So I thought I would pass it on. :)

Sulla Felix

----- Original Message -----
From: <StarVVreck@-------->
To: <novaRoma@-------->
Sent: Thursday, September 28, 2000 7:06 PM
Subject: Re: [novaroma] Interesting site


> Ave Sulla,
>
> I have seen services to register Domains for free. Their service just
> fowards anyone who goes to the URL to whatever URL you want (an IP address
or
> a free web-space server like Tripod.com)
> www.domainzero.com is completely free, catch - you have to sign up for
half
> dozen email programs using the email address you used to sign up.
> and www.namezero.com is also completely free, their catch - a big frame on
> the bottom with a bunch of advertisements.
>
> << Ave
>
> I have found a website that will allow anyone to register Domains for a
year
> for 1.00!
>
> I have just registered www.genscornelia.org for a year.
>
> Here is the URL: staples.register.com
>
> Vale!
>
> Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix >>
>
> Vale!
> Iulius Titinius
>
>
>
>
>


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Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Interesting site
From:	Marcus Octavius Germanicus <haase@-------->
Date:	Thu, 28 Sep 2000 22:42:51 -0500 (CDT)

On Thu, 28 Sep 2000, L. Cornelius Sulla wrote:

> yea but this is from Staples....so there isnt those catches. :) At least
> not that I have found...and this site is going through Earthlink....so, if
> there was that kind of a catch.... I dont think people here would be going
> after it so fast..... :) So I thought I would pass it on. :)

The "catch" is that you'll have to pay $35 to keep the name after the first
year (which they freely admit). This is significantly higher than the
price at several other domain registrars, such as joker.com ($12).


---
M. Octavius Germanicus
Curule Aedile, Nova Roma
Microsoft delenda est!
http://www.graveyards.com/


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Subject:	[novaroma]
From:	"Wladyslaw Polakowski" <wlad@-------->
Date:	Thu, 28 Sep 2000 08:22:36 +0400

Dear friends!
Let me inform you about beginning of new E-group devoted to problem of
chronology, nonunderstable, mysterical and contradictionary places in the
world history.
It has the name chronam@-------- (CHRONology of Antiquity and Medievity)
Languages: english, french, german, russian.
Wlad Polakowski, group moderator


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Subject:	[novaroma] Germanic view of Time?
From:	Lucilla Cornelia Cinna <CorneliaLucilla@-------->
Date:	Fri, 29 Sep 2000 13:21:55 +0200

Vadoni omnibusque amicis Lucilla Cinna S.D.P.

Interesting thread ... particularly since I am German having studied
Gothic language, AHD/OHG, and MHD/MHG as well as classics and philosophy
at university - sorry for being a snob. ;o)

Nick Ford wrote:
>
> Language expresses thought, and thought is in turn conditioned by language.
>
>From my point of view, I have to object. In my humble opinion (based
on Plato, Aristotle, Thomas et al.) Language is conditioned by and based
on thought. It is posterior to thought (and even more imperfect), since
it is a medium of communication exchanging thought between particular
individuals. Being imperfect himself an individual may fail in the use
of language to express thought, and consequently communication may fail
in this particular case which is called misunderstanding.
The possibility of misunderstanding due to a lack of perfection reveals
the gap between individuals which can never be wholly bridged. We cannot
read each others' thoughts, we can only anticipate or draw conclusions
from what (s)he is saying (among other thing from which we draw our
conclusions etc.).

Well, at least it is my opinion.
There is not only one ultimate dogma of the priority of language on one
side or thought on the other. Those are just 2 ways to approach the same
problem.
>
> In these latter (and in Greek, as well), verbs have future tenses. This indicates that a future action is assumed to be definite - id est, it is going to happen. In the Germanic languages, however, you can't do this with future time.
>
I am sorry, but I have to object again.
Greek and Latin both have many different ways to express future. In
fact, they use different forms like a potentialis or optative to express
the speakers attitude towards that future event, either if it may happen
or should happen or will happen, etc.
By the way, Plato and Aristotle do explicitely deny the predetermination
of reality (which is seen as only a small part of the universe as a
whole). The prime quality of reality and existence is changeability -
real, existing things are mutabilia.
Predetermination is the basis of Stoic thought due to their idea of the
logos as the driving impulse within the universe which is assumed to be
completely material, so that reality turns out to be but the incarnated
God. So if God is the perfect being he cannot deviate from himself; and
that is why someone who could see the universe as a whole, would be able
to predict the future without even the chance to go wrong.

The fact that Germanic languages don't have a specific inflection to
express future events but use different kinds of composite forms using
modals, doesn't say much about their attitude towards future. The idea
of the thought "because Germanic languages had/have no grammatic future,
they don't think future as something fixed" looks very strange to me.
Languages do change permanently. Only a few are preserved as a medium of
international communication (like Latin was) or a cultural treasure
(like Greek, Latin, Classic Arab etc.).
With those preserved versions as Attic or Homeric Greek and Ciceronian
or Vergilean Latin we have languages of a very high standard of
cultivation - compare Goethe's use of German language with the language
rural people used, and you would be astonished about the difference.
Probably it is not a problam of mentality but of literacy? Literacy
fixes a certain state and makes it a model for later writers.
>
> Other Germanic languages, being far less influenced by Latin-based language than English, don't even have this option.
>
In case he's talking about German, I, being a German native speaker and
having studied my language carefully, can assure you, he is completely
wrong.
When we say: Es wird geschehen.- It will happen. - it depends on our
point of view which we have to express by additional adverbs, particles,
or other syntactical components, if we think it will hapen for sure or
most likely or eventually or probably or hopefully ... As for itself "Es
wird geschehen." definitely means "eveniebit" in Latin.

By the way, mind that Latin was the lingua franca from ancient times to
the 16th century all over Europe - and even in South America!

> Or, it seems that the Latins have a cultural mindset which regards the future as knowable, while the Northerners don't.
>
Well, I really advise you to study Plato or Aristotle ... It is
definitely not true that the Romans or Greeks assumed future events as
being knowable or fixed.
The business of prophecy and fortune-telling is well-known all over the
world. It is a part of human nature. We don't know about the future, and
we know we don't.
And we wonder. Which is the beginning of philosophy.

Bene vale
>
> Vado (student of many things, a Master in none).
>
Lucilla Cinna (student in many things - master in one) ;o)
http://www.geocities.com/CorneliaLucilla/ (Bibliotheca Germaniae)
http://www.ancientsites.com/users/CORNELIUS_LUCILLA/


--
http://www.geocities.com/CorneliaLucilla/ (Bibliotheca Germaniae)
http://www.ancientsites.com/users/CORNELIUS_LUCILLA/
___________________________________________________
qualis in Eurotae ripis aut per iuga Cynthi
exercet Diana choros, quam mille secutae
hinc atque hinc glomerantur Oreades, illa pharetram
fert umero gradiensque deas supereminet omnis,
Latonaae tacitum pertemptant gaudia pectus,
talis erat Dido, talem se laeta ferebat
per medios instans operi regnisque futuris.
(Verg.Aen.1.498-504)


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Subject:	[novaroma] An Invitation
From:	"For the Muses" <scriba_forum@-------->
Date:	Fri, 29 Sep 2000 12:59:39 GMT

>********************************************
>
>Salvete Omnes!
>
>
>The Organizing Committee Members (the Delcti) are pleased to invite you to
>take part in an interest group known as Musarum.
>
>We are a group whose work is dedicated to the Nine Muses and Apollo in our
>celebration of the arts and sciences ...prose, poetry, music, dance,
>natural and social sciences, etc. It is our aim to celebrate those aspects
>of the arts and sciences which contributed to the glory of Rome, and those
>which materialized from Roman influence.
>
>
>Indeed, this leaves alot of things to celebrate!
>
>For how can we comprehensively celebrate the goodness of Rome without
>addressing artistic achievement and scientific discoveries?
>
>In time, we hope to become a Sodalitas of Nova Roma. For now, we are a
>group of individuals with a common interest.
>
>Our group is divided into 10 Collegiae, or Interest Areas, named after the
>Muses and Apollo, as follows:
>
> I. Calliope (Epic Poetry)
>
> II. Clio (History and Social Sciences)
>
>III. Euterpe (Music)
>
> IV. Melpomene (Tragedy)
>
> V. Terpscichore (Dance)
>
> VI. Erato (Lyric Poetry)
>
>VII. Polyhymnia (Sacred Song and Verse)
>
>VIII. Urania (Astronomy and Natural Science)
>
> IX. Thalia (comedy)
>
> X. Apollo (Graphic and Plastic Arts and Architecture)
>
>
>
>
>To join us, please do the following:
>
>Subscribe to the For the Muses Egroups list by linking to the following
>URL, and just follow the instructions.
>
>http://www.egroups.com/group/FortheMuses
>
>Post a note on the list stating your intent to join the group....this is
>important as merely subscribing to the list will not relay to us your
>intent to actually be a part of the organization. Please look over the
>Collegia as listed above and indicate in your post the name of the
>Collegium to which you would like to be associated.
>
>As of October 8 2400 EST, membership acceptance shall be closed for a short
>time, and those who have joined us will be asked to approve the charter, or
>Regula, which shall be posted on the Egroups list. Elections for this are
>temporarily slated for October 15-19...we will keep you posted.
>
>Not a citizen yet???? Not to worry! You are most welcome to join us, and
>you will be able to vote on the charter. Further, when your citizenship is
>approved, you will be able to run for office.
>
>Citizenship in Nova Roma is not essential to membership, although it is if
>you wish to hold an office.
>
>We do hope that you will consider joining us for some delightful sharing of
>materials and experiences, and the planning of enriching projects in the
>celebration of the arts and sciences.
>
>For Apollo and The Muses,
>Buona Fortuna!
>
>Musarum Delecti: Aeternia Draconia (Foundress et Rogator)
> G. Piscinus Moravius (Rogator)
> P. Cornelia Strabo (Obstetrix)
> Senator et Proconsul L. Cornelius Sulla Felix
> Sextus Apollonius Draco
> Propraetor Alexander I.C. Probus
>
>

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Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Interesting Sight
From:	"Nick Ford" <gens_moravia@-------->
Date:	Fri, 29 Sep 2000 20:27:35 +0100

Salutem

Gens Cornelia is now an *organisation* ?!

Vado.

>I have found a website that will allow anyone to register Domains for a
year for 1.00!

>I have just registered www.genscornelia.org for a year.

>Here is the URL: staples.register.com

>Vale!

>Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix






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Subject:	[novaroma] Words and Things
From:	"Nick Ford" <gens_moravia@-------->
Date:	Fri, 29 Sep 2000 22:01:32 +0100

Quiritibus salutem iterum

Sic scripsit Primus Fabius:

>The fact that Latin tongues have a future tense that express the absolute
>convintion that something is going to happen doesn't imply that they
believe
>in an immutable or knowable future. As a matter of fact, Latin and its
>derivative languages have a large number of future tenses to express the
>possibility of something to happen or the fact that something may happen
>subject to a prerequisite.

I'll admit I oversimplified my point - but the fact remains that Latins and
Greeks invented a single-word future tense verb declension form, to express
something that was going to happen, unconditionally - even though they also
produced conditional future tense constructions, like other people. What
interests me is that the Germanic languages didn't have these single,
unconditional forms, so that future tense is untranslatable into those
languages by a single word. Surely, if language conveys what you think
about, this is significant?

>Personally I consider Latin to be a sort of scientific language, I mean a
>language that provides you with specific "tools" to express in a proper way
>any idea that you might have (and, to some extent, German is similar to
>Latin in this).

I think that any language, considered as a social construct, enables its
users to do this to the extent that the "tools" are relevant to the work
which a given society considers important.

>As a matter of fact, Italian, Spanish or French grammar is much more
complex
>than English grammar; on the other hand, English is much more direct and
>practical (and this is, to me, one of the reasons why it is so widely
used).
>I think that this kind of language (Latin, I mean), played a major role in
>consenting to the Romans to establish a so complete corpus juris: as a
>lawyer, I consider the law as a strict logic system expressed, by accident,
>in words and not in symbols (as maths):

I'm confused, here, mi Prime Fabi: do you mean to say that the formation of
language is accidental?

>this cause the precision of the
>system itself to be uncertain as far as the words used are subject to
>interpretation. What is exciting with Latin is that you relly do not need
to
>use interpretation in many circumstances for the language is clear and self
>explaining as it provides any necessary "tool". It is not by accident that
>we still use Latin in modern law: as a matter of fact you can explain a
>juridic concept in two pages in English or Italian, while you only need a
>single sentence in Latin (for example, think to the principle by which the
>fact that one doesn't know the existence of a given law provision is not an
>excuse for a certain criminal offence; everyone just says "ignorantia legis
>non excusat").

Hmm. In English, we could also say: "legal ignorance excuses none." I know
that three out of these four words are loan-words derived from Latin, either
directly or through French, but I suspect that this is because lawyers in
the West have tended to favour Latin ever since the Roman empire gave
western Europe a unified legal code: it's a rather circular argument - one
would not have expected them to switch to Greek (an equally good language
for precision). The medical profession,on the other hand, uses so much Greek
in the West because the majority of practising physicians in the Roman
Empire were Greek, and consequently worked from Greek texts and were taught
by Greek teachers. But if we were to uninvent the Roman and Norman conquests
of England, we could still express "ignorantia legis non excusat" as
"Law-unwitting forgiveth none".

>It is not a matter, therefore, of being more or less fatalistic about the
>future (which it might be, but is not reflected by the language the way you
>suggest)

In so, then why did the Germanic languages not produce an unconditional
future tense? My argument is that, if a society believes something, they
create a word for it. If it doesn't exist for them, they don't.

> it is much more the "inheritage" of a language that was "created"
>for the sake of clarity and for serving a community of architects, lawyers,
>businessmen, etc. needing precision and safety in their interactions.

It is common practice in every specialist profession or trade, in any
language, to use code-expressions which condense an agreed meaning: medical
people can use a single Greek word to convey a specific medical condition,
or a clinical procedure; in just the same way, for example, shoemakers (in
English) speak of "welting" rather than lengthily describing the process of
turning the edges of the upper part of the shoe into a seam overlapping the
inner sole, which is then glued and stitched in place to prevent the shoe
from leaking and to make as strong a bond between the upper and the sole as
possible. (I have just used 46 words to do this, in place of that single
word). Such translations often turn out to be descriptive commentaries -
which is why such verbal "tools" of the trade were, I think, invented (to
save breath) .

Our modern societies have a high regard for "intellectual" professions such
as law and medicine - but sadly, not for shoemakers, or any who work with
their hands (what an expression - as if artisans worked without brains!),
and whose vocabulary in Britain is consequently still from an historically
non-elite language, like Anglo-Saxon).

Every language has its own pragmatic excellences: I am told that anyone
going in for camel-breeding or camel-racing will find Arabic a
terminological gold-mine. Or if it's 57 varieties of snow you want to
discuss, the Innuit dialects are said to be unparalleled. But if a thing
does not exist for a given society, they will not create a word for that
thing.

Bene valete,

Vado.


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