| Subject: |
[novaroma] Remembrance Rites |
| From: |
"M. Apollonius Formosanus" <bvm3@--------> |
| Date: |
Sat, 11 Nov 2000 02:56:34 +0100 |
|
M. Apollonius Formosanus omnibus Novoromanis S.P.D.
I applaud Vado's call for a remembrance on the eleventh hour of the
eleventh day of the eleventh month of all who have in the history of
the human race fallen in war.
At 11:00 a.m. G.M.T. I shall on behalf of myself and the Gens
Apollonia make offerings and prayers to the Di Manes, Mars, Bellona,
Minerva, Concordia, and Pax.
For your meditations on this day of remembrance I here include a
reading for everyone from Cicero in De Officiis (On Duties) on war to
give a true Roman perspective from a thoughtful man of his time:
Book I
XI. Again, there are certain duties that we owe even to those who
have wronged us. For there is a limit to retribution and to
punishment; or rather, I am inclined to think, it is sufficient that
the aggressor should be brought to repent of his wrongdoing, in
order that he may not repeat the offence and that others may be
deterred from doing wrong. Then, too, in the case of a state in its
external relations, the rights of war must be strictly observed. For
since there are two ways of settling a dispute: first, by discussion;
second; by physical force; and since the former is characteristic of
man, the latter of the brute, we must resort to force only in case we
may not avail ourselves of discussion. The only excuse, therefore,
for going to war is that we may live in peace unharmed; and when the
victory is won, we should spare those who have not been blood-thirsty
and barbarous in their warfare. For instance, our forefathers
actually admitted to full rights of citizenship the Tusculans,
Acquians, Volscians, Sabines, and Hernicians, but they razed Carthage
and Numantia to the ground. I wish they had not destroyed Corinth;
but I believe they had some special reason for what they did - its
convenient situation, probably - and feared that its very location
might some day furnish a temptation to renew the war. In my opinion,
at least, we should always strive to secure a peace that shall not
admit of guile. And if my advice had been heeded on this point, we
should still have at least some sort of constitutional government, if
not the best in the world, whereas, as it is, we have none at all.
Not only must we show consideration for those whom we have conquered
by force of arms but we must also ensure protection to those who lay
down their arms and throw themselves upon the mercy of our generals,
even though the battering-ram has hammered at their walls. And among
our countrymen justice has been observed so conscientiously in this
direction, that those who have given promise of protection to states
or nations subdued in war become, after the custom of our
forefathers, the patrons of those states.
As for war, humane laws touching it are drawn up in the fetial code
of the Roman People under all the guarantees of religion; and from
this it may be gathered that no war is just, unless it is entered
upon after an official demand for satisfaction has been submitted or
warning has been given and a formal declaration made. Popilius was
general in command of a province. In his army Cato's son was serving
on his first campaign. When Popilius decided to disband one of his
legions, he discharged also young Cato, who was serving in that same
legion. But when the young man out of love for the service stayed on
in the field, his father wrote to Popilius to say that if he let him
stay in the army, he should swear him into service with a new oath of
allegiance, for in view of the voidance of his former oath he could
not legally fight the foe. So extremely scrupulous was the observance
of the laws in regard to the conduct of war. There is extant, too, a
letter of the elder Marcus Cato to his son Marcus, in which he writes
that he has heard that the youth has been discharged by the consul,
when he was serving in Macedonia in the war with Perseus. He warns
him, therefore, to be careful not to go into battle; for, he says,
the man who is not legally a soldier has no right to be fighting the
foe.
XII. This also I observe - that he who would properly have been
called "a fighting enemy" (perduellis) was called "a guest" (hostis),
thus relieving the ugliness of the fact by a softened expression; for
"enemy" (hostis) meant to our ancestors what we now call "stranger
"(peregrinus). This is proved by the usage in the Twelve Tables: "Or
a day fixed for trial with a stranger" (hostis). And again: "Right of
ownership is inalienable for ever in dealings with a stranger"
(hostis). What can exceed such charity, when he with whom one is at
war is called by so gentle a name? And yet long lapse of time has
given that word a harsher meaning: for it has lost its signification
of "stranger" and has taken on the technical connotation of "an enemy
under arms."
But when a war is fought out for supremacy and when glory is the
object of war, it must still not fail to start from the same motives
which I said a moment ago were the only righteous grounds for going
to war. But those wars which have glory for their end must be carried
on with less bitterness. For we contend, for example, with a
fellow-citizen in one way, if he is a personal enemy, in another, if
he is a rival: with the rival it is a struggle for office and
position, with the enemy for life and honour. So with the
Celtiberians and the Cimbrians we fought as with deadly enemies, not
to determine which should be supreme, but which should survive; but
with the Latins, Sabines, Samnites, Carthaginians, and Pyrrhus we
fought for supremacy. The Carthaginians violated treaties; Hannibal
was cruel; the others were more merciful. From Pyrrhus we have this
famous speech on the exchange of prisoners:
"Gold will I none, nor price shall ye give; for I ask none;
Come, let us not be chaff'rers of war, but warriors embattled.
Nay; let us venture our lives, and the sword, not gold, weigh the
outcome.
Make we the trial by valour in arms and see if Dame Fortune
Wills it that ye shall prevail or I, or what be her judgment.
Hear thou, too, this word, good Fabricius: whose valour soever
Spared hath been by the fortune of war - their freedom I grant them.
Such my resolve. I give and present them to you, my brave Romans;
Take them back to their homes; the great gods' blessings attend you."
A right kingly sentiment this and worthy a scion of the Aeacidae.
..
With this I will close my discussion of the duties connected with
war. But let us remember that we must have regard for justice even
towards the humblest.
_________________________
I shall also follow Vado's worthy suggestion that we remember our
noble equine servants who served us in war and so died.
In addition I shall specially pray the Gods for the true Iustitia
and Libertas that will engender Concordia in our Respublica and in
the world.
Valete!
_______________________
Vado scripsit:
Subject: Remembrance
Omnibus plurimam salutem
At the eleventh hour of the eleventh day of the eleventh month in
Britannia, according to long and honourable custom, a two minutes'
silence is called for so that all may pause in whatever they are
doing and remember the suffering of countless souls in wars wiithout
number.
To my mind, it is also good at that time to reflect on the purposes
of that suffering, whether one perceives it as murder, or sacrifice,
or both.
At that time, I shall offer to the Di Manes (especially those known
to me who suffered in war). I shall offer to Mars and Minerva in
respect of the honourable aspects of military endeavour, and to Pax
and Concordia, that all those pledged to protect and defend their
communities may agree together in a common honour and respect.
I ask that, wherever you are at that time, you join with the Cassii,
Aletheia Moravia, myself and all others of like mind who will be
making an act of remembrance - no matter how small, and no matter
what their loyalties and beliefs - around the world.
Be it only for two minutes, let us honour the dead and the living,
and unite the power of our intention.
Bene valete,
Vado.
(P.S. You may also wish to remember before Epona the two million or
so horses killed in two world wars in reward for their loyalty and
service to humankind).
Marcus Apollonius Formosanus
Paterfamilias Gentis Apolloniae (http://www.crosswinds.net/~bvm3/)
Moderator et Praeceptor Sodalitatis Latinitatis; Scriba Censorius
ICQ# 61698049 AIM: MAFormosanus MSN: Formosanus
Civis Novae Romae in Silesia, Polonia
The Gens Apollonia is open to new members.
Ave nostra Respublica Libera - Nova Roma!
________________________________________
Si vis omnia tibi subicere, te subice Rationi. (Seneca)
(Se vi deziras subigi al vi chion, subigu vin al Racio)
________________________________________
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| Subject: |
[novaroma] Fwd: [SenatusRomanus] Voting Results |
| From: |
Ira Adams <iadams@--------> |
| Date: |
Fri, 10 Nov 2000 22:31:18 -0600 |
|
---------------- Begin Forwarded Message ----------------
Date: 11/9/00 6:22 AM
Received: 11/10/00 5:29 PM
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Senatores present
C. Aelius Ericius
M. Cassius Julianus
P. Cassia
L. Cornelius Sulla
L. Equitius Cincinnatus
Q. Fabius Maximus
A. Gryllus Graecus
M. Iunius Iulianus
T. Labienus Fortunatus
G. Marius Merullus
M. Mucius Scaevola Magister
Proxy
M. Minucius Audens
Regrets
M. Iuncundia Flavia
F. Vedius Germanicus
G. Tullius Triumphius Cicero
D. Iunius Palladius Invictus
Item the First.
Should Alexander Iulius Caesars name be added to the Senate Rolls?
Vti rogas 8 Negat 3 Abstaino 1
Item Passes
Item the Second
That the Rogator be chosen from this list of candidates.
Lucius Aetius Dalmaticus 11
Caeso Fabius Quintilianus 0
Marcus Scribonius Curio Britannicus 1
L. Aetius Dalmaticus is chosen.
Item the Third.
To form the province of Gallia, and appoint a Praetor to administer it.
Shall we form the Gallia province?
Vti rogas 12 Negat 0 Abstanio 0
Item Passes
As its Provincial Praetor
Marcus Maximius Gaius 3
Ianus Querius Armoricus Lutecio 9
I. Querius Armoricus Lutecio is chosen
Item the Forth.
Combining the governorships of Provincae America
Austroccidentalis and Medioccidentalis Superior
into one province with L. Cornelia Aurelia as Praetor.
Shall we combine the two provinces into one?
Vti rogas 1 Negat. 9 Abstanio 2
Item Fails
If not, shall we move modern Colorado to America Austroccidentalis
Vti rogas 9 Negat. 1 Abstanio 2
Item Passes
And make Livia Cornelia Aurelia America Austroccidentalis' Praetor?
Vti rogas 7 Negat. 3 Abstanio 2
L. Cornelia Aurelia is chosen.
Item the Sixth
Shall we give authority to Aedile Marcus Octavius Germanicus to handle
election computer problems as he sees fit, then report the solution to
the
Senate?
Vti rogas 12 Negat. 0 Abstanio 0
Item Passes
Item the Seventh
Q. Fabius' Tax proposal for the citizens of Nova Roma.
Shall this proposal be accepted to be voted upon by the Comitia?
Vti rogas 9 Negat. 3 Abstanio 0
Item Passes
Item the Eighth
The proposed Edicta Commentary Period of Marcus Iunius Iulianus.
Is the edicta approved by the Senate?
Vti rogas 12 Negat. 0 Abstanio 0
Item Passes
Item the Ninth
The Senate is asked to order the removal of Porto Claro from Rome's list
of
recognized micronations.
Shall this be carried out?
Vti rogas 12 Negat. 0 Abstanio 0
Item Passes
Item the Tenth.
That the current provincial map be changed by the Senate to the one at
http://www.angelfire.com/scifi/nrbras/nr4.htm.
Shall this be done?
Vti rogas 12 Negat. 0 Abstanio 0
Item Passes.
Thank you Conscript Fathers.
We declare this meeting of the Senate to be over.
The Consules
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Subject: [SenatusRomanus] Voting Results
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| Subject: |
[novaroma] Propraetor for Canada Occidentalis |
| From: |
"Quintus Sertorius" <quintus-sertorius@--------> |
| Date: |
Fri, 10 Nov 2000 23:09:32 -0600 |
|
11 Nov 2000
Salve Nova Roman Senators and Citizens
I have a question that I would humbly like to ask? I have in the past
expressed a great interest in becoming the Propraetor for Canada
Occidentalis as there is no one filling this position at present. I have
been told to wait for various reasons from different people, and I have been
patient, trusting in the system to hear my request and do something with it.
The Senate heard my request, but there was no follow up. There has been
different requests from other areas to have Propraetors appointed and to be
recognized as Provincias, and these have been granted. Yet still I wait for
a further response to my request. Canada Occidentalis has a substantial
population, and is already recognized as a Provioncia but without a Praetor
to look out for it. At present it seems that all the citizens in Canada
Ociddentalis are under the administration of Canada Orrientalis, this is I
hope a temporary situation. I would like to, with all humility, know if the
Senate is going to look at my request to be to Propraetor for Canada
Occidentalis.
Vale
Quintus Sertorius
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| Subject: |
[novaroma] Fabula |
| From: |
"Nick Ford" <gens_moravia@--------> |
| Date: |
Sat, 11 Nov 2000 08:42:16 -0000 |
|
Popularibus salutem
Sic Pontius, on taxation:
>Hi, hope im not too late with this but I have been thinking this topic
over.
>I think it would be much cooler to simply provide some sort of reward for
>donating money.. make it well know how much someone donates, if they
>donate..
I think, if I read this post aright, and from what one or two others have
said about what a good idea it is to sell rank and status in NR, that we are
encountering an aberration called money-worship (Chremolatry). I want to
tell a little story...
Once upon a time, there was a city with a magnificent temple. It cost a lot
to keep up. People came from all over to worship the god there. The temple
was half the reason why the city existed at all.
The temple officials were always desperately keen to collect funds. They hit
on a plan similar to the one above. Major offerings were to be proclaimed in
the temple, in the hearing of all, as they were made.
It worked. Lots of money came in. Citizens vied with each other for the
public adulation of their generosity. One day, a wealthy merchant, with a
retinue of slaves and clients, strode into the temple, as his lackeys
shouted: "Make way for ( )!" (Whoever he was, for his name is lost to
posterity now, and that's an unaccountable thing, because he was very famous
for being rich). We'll have to call him Quisquam.
Well, Quisquam the merchant ceremoniously gave order that bags his slaves
were sweating under the weight of were opened, and a million gold pieces
tumbled and rattled into the temple coffer. Bells were rung. The Chief
Priest bowed and thanked Quisquam effusively. All the temple assistants
fawned on him, and when the temple choir sang: "Quisquam has donated a
million gold pieces to the temple and to the god!", everyone applauded.
Quisquam beamed, nodded to the multitude and waddled off to have tea with
the Chief Priest. Many followed after. Quisquam was worth many more millions
in gold.
Unnoticed in the surge of the excited crowd, an old widow shuffled up to
the treasure-chest and dropped in a single, small copper coin. It made no
noise at all. No-one applauded. No-one saw. But the god saw. He loved that
old woman more than he loved any other mortal, because she was poor but had
given half the money she had in the world.
End of story.
N. Moravius Vado.
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| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] Propraetor for Canada Occidentalis |
| From: |
"Quintus Sertorius" <quintus-sertorius@--------> |
| Date: |
Sat, 11 Nov 2000 05:13:39 -0600 |
|
11 Nov 2000
Salve Consul
Actually I am 38 years old, so I hope that is not too young! In old Roma I
would not be consul legally for four more years, but I believe Provincia
Praetors do not need to be 42.
Vale
Quintus Sertorius
----- Original Message -----
From: <SFP55@-------->
To: <quintus-sertorius@-------->
Sent: Saturday, November 11, 2000 2:22 AM
Subject: Praetor for Canada Occidentalis
> In a message dated 11/10/2000 9:20:08 PM Pacific Standard Time,
> quintus-sertorius@-------- writes:
>
> << I have a question that I would humbly like to ask? I have in the past
> expressed a great interest in becoming the Propraetor for Canada
> Occidentalis as there is no one filling this position at present. >>
> Q. Fabius Maximus Quinto Sertorio Salve
> Actually when the Senate inquired into your qualifications as Provincial
> Praetor, you were said to be too young. Has that changed? You aren't
> thinking of running away to Spain if you don't get your way here? Sorry,
a
> bad joke. I agree with you that the province needs a Praetor especially
with
> the tax survey coming up. If you could tell me what you have planned for
the
> province, what you have done so far, and I see that you are committed to
the
> job, I'll attempt to over ride the age qualification with the Senate. That
is
> all I can do however, after that it will be in the hands of the Senate to
> accept it.
> Our next call is the 18th. Respond as quick as possible.
> Vale
>
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| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] Fwd: [SenatusRomanus] Voting Results |
| From: |
Marcus Octavius Germanicus <haase@--------> |
| Date: |
Sat, 11 Nov 2000 07:19:45 -0600 (CST) |
|
Ex Domo Aedilis Curulis
M. Octavius Germanicus Propraetoribus Novibus SPD
Congratulations to the newly appointed Propraetores,
Livia Cornelia Aurelia of America Austroccidentalis and
Ianus Querius Armoricus Lutecio of Gallia.
I will update the provinicial pages on the web site today (and
begin work on importing M. Arminius' maps).
Congratulations also to senator-elect Alexander Iulius Caesar Macedonius
and rogator Lucius Aetius Dalmaticus.
Vale, Octavius.
--
M. Octavius Germanicus
Curule Aedile, Nova Roma
Microsoft delenda est!
http://www.graveyards.com/
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| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] Fwd: [SenatusRomanus] Voting Results |
| From: |
"Ianus Querius Armoricus Lutecio" <yquere@--------> |
| Date: |
Sat, 11 Nov 2000 15:21:32 +0100 |
|
I.Querius Armoricus Lutecio M. Octavio Germanico SPD
Thank you very much for your congratulations.
I would like to congratulate Livia Cornelia Aurelia for her appointement
too, as well as newly elected senators.
Valete Omnes
Maxima Gratia Deorum Senatoribusque
Lutecio
----- Original Message -----
From: Marcus Octavius Germanicus <haase@-------->
To: Nova Roma <novaroma@-------->
Sent: Saturday, November 11, 2000 2:19 PM
Subject: Re: [novaroma] Fwd: [SenatusRomanus] Voting Results
> Ex Domo Aedilis Curulis
> M. Octavius Germanicus Propraetoribus Novibus SPD
>
> Congratulations to the newly appointed Propraetores,
> Livia Cornelia Aurelia of America Austroccidentalis and
> Ianus Querius Armoricus Lutecio of Gallia.
>
> I will update the provinicial pages on the web site today (and
> begin work on importing M. Arminius' maps).
>
> Congratulations also to senator-elect Alexander Iulius Caesar Macedonius
> and rogator Lucius Aetius Dalmaticus.
>
> Vale, Octavius.
>
> --
> M. Octavius Germanicus
> Curule Aedile, Nova Roma
> Microsoft delenda est!
> http://www.graveyards.com/
>
>
>
>
>
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| Subject: |
[Fwd: Re: [novaroma] Fwd: [SenatusRomanus] Voting Results] |
| From: |
<gmvick32@--------> |
| Date: |
Sat, 11 Nov 2000 13:20:20 -0700 |
|
-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Re: [novaroma] Fwd: [SenatusRomanus] Voting
Results
Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2000 13:19:20 -0700
From: gmvick32@--------
Reply-To: gmvick32@--------
To: Marcus Octavius Germanicus <haase@-------->
References:
<Pine.BSF.4.21.0011110706050.58209-100000@-------->
Thank you for the kind words, Octavii, and also
congratulations to you on your Senatorial burn-in, along
with Vado and....oh heavens, I've forgotten the third
Senator-elect waiting for confirmation, but congrats to you
all.
Other congratulations:
Congratulations to Alexander Iulius Caesar as the newest
Senator-elect.
Congratulations to the new Propaetor of Gallia, Ianus
Querius Armoricus Lutecio, and a special congratulations to
you and your fellow Gallic quirities on the official
formation of your provincia!!! It is a good day indeed.
Also, a HEARTY congrats and welcome to Lucius Aetius
Dalmaticus, who will be joining me in the Rogatorship.
Dalmaticus, I will be conversing with you forthwith so we
can get underway with preparing for the elections.
Facio Servitium Novae Romae,
Livia Cornelia Aurelia
Propaetor of America Austroccidentalis
Rogator
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| Subject: |
[novaroma] Office of the Propaetor: America Austroccidentalis |
| From: |
<gmvick32@--------> |
| Date: |
Sat, 11 Nov 2000 14:10:48 -0700 |
|
Salvete Quirities:
This is to introduce myself in an official capacity as
Propaetor of America Austroccidentalis to the people at
large and to the cives who reside in that province.
America Austroccidentalis is in the United States and
consists of the following states:
Arizona - 3 cives present
Colorado - 8 cives present
New Mexico - 4 cives present
Oklahoma - 3 cives present
Texas - 20 cives present
Utah - 9 cives present
I look forward to getting to know the people in each of
these states better and to do my part to enrich the presence
and activity of Nova Roma in the American Southwest and the
Colorado Rockies. I am proud to be a part of this, the land
and people of the United States and Nova Roma, that I love
best.
At this time I invite citizens of America Austroccidentalis
to join the list: NR_Rockies. You can find the list at:
http://www.egroups.com/group/NR_Rockies
At this time I would also like to extend an offer to the
cives of Medioccidentalis Superior who remain without a
propaetor, particularly the cives of Kansas, to know you
have a special welcome from your western neighbor. If any
cive of Medioccidentalis Superior (three cives in Kansas and
one in Minnesota) ever feels the need to bring an issue to
somebody of office about your regio, this office will be
open to help or advise you to the extent we can.
Facio Servitium populesque America Austroccidentalis,
Livia Cornelia Aurelia
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