| Subject: |
[novaroma] Re: Back to Basics |
| From: |
"pjane@-------- " <pjane@--------> |
| Date: |
Wed, 22 Nov 2000 00:43:07 -0000 |
|
> Who has access to the Checking account? Who has the oversight to
> see if money is being duly and timely processed? Who prepares the income
> statments and balance sheets and who has the authority to see those
> documents? Who gets the banking statements? Who has access to view the
> banking statements?
I have access to the checking account and have kept Nova Roma's
accounting record in a database since April 1999. I receive the bank
statements, and have been making quarterly reports to the Senate. (The
third-quarter report is overdue, but will be completed within the
week.)
At the beginning of this year, I asked the Senate, of which I was not
then a member, to appoint one of my fellow Quaestors to oversee my
work. This never happened, and the only conclusion open to me was that
the Senators, including Lucius Cornelius, did not care.
I hope that in this next election, one Quaestor will be appointed
custodian of the checkbook and deposit tickets, with another (who
cannot deposit or withdraw) assigned to keep daily accounts and do
monthly bank reconciliations. I plan to submit a proposal to the Senate
to enshrine this practice in law.
I have also obtained information from my insurance agent on bonding for
Nova Roma's financial officials, which can be done for a very
reasonable fee. I hope the Senate will authorize the payment of this
fee for those entrusted with handling funds, at least in the United
States. This would reimburse Nova Roma in the event that any of these
officials improperly diverted funds, and would also require that such
officials submit their personal information to the bonding agency.
If Nova Roma's citizens or leaders require more frequent reports,
deadlines for reporting or other administrative procedures, they have
only to enact them.
Patricia Cassia
Quaestor (Treasurer), Nova Roma
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| Subject: |
[novaroma] Re: Mehercule, taxes! |
| From: |
"pjane@-------- " <pjane@--------> |
| Date: |
Wed, 22 Nov 2000 00:48:06 -0000 |
|
>What I find disturbing here is that for two
> years now Nova Roma has been collecting (small) amounts of monies
> while posing itself on its website as a nonprofit corporation, but
> has only recently filed for incorporation? So exactly where has this
> money been going, into whose accounts, under whose liability? Have
> any official documents for NR ever been filed, and then under what
> tax ID number if we were not incorporated?
Nova Roma has been incorporated under the laws of the state of New
Hampshire for the better part of two years. The amounts collected by
the Treasury do not rise to the level which requires filing with the
Internal Revenue Service. Nova Roma's tax ID number was not required
for state incorporation, and is attached to the Treasury account.
Nova Roma did not therefore need to file for incorporation - only for
tax-exempt status in the United States. This filing has been made, and
I received a note from the IRS today saying they had received the
application. They advise that we will hear from them within 120 days.
I hope this answers your questions! I welcome suggestions for how we
can better organize this important part of our government.
Patricia Cassia
Quaestor, Nova Roma
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| Subject: |
[novaroma] Most notable Roman woman! |
| From: |
"pjane@-------- " <pjane@--------> |
| Date: |
Wed, 22 Nov 2000 03:21:57 -0000 |
|
I've enjoyed some of the recent discussions of history, and see no
reason why we can't keep a thread on "greatest Romans" going at the
same time that we discuss immediate and important Nova Roman concerns.
So to follow up: Who do you consider to be the most notable Roman
woman? Obviously, there are many women of fine qualities whose lives
are simply unknown to us, because they were not high-ranking enough to
be written up in imperial histories, and for whatever reason were not
commemorated with a long-lasting tomb. So this is obviously going to
refer only to the selective sample of Roman women known to us through
history.
What woman did the most to change or alter the course of Roman history?
What Roman woman (including women of the entire Empire, of course) best
demonstrated the qualities most valued in women of her time? What Roman
woman's qualities carry the most validity for women today?
Patricia Cassia
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| Subject: |
[novaroma] Re: Most notable Roman woman! |
| From: |
"Catja " <ponton.3@--------> |
| Date: |
Wed, 22 Nov 2000 05:08:16 -0000 |
|
--- In novaroma@--------, "pjane@j... " <pjane@j...> wrote:
> So to follow up: Who do you consider to be the most notable Roman
> woman? Obviously, there are many women of fine qualities whose
lives
> are simply unknown to us, because they were not high-ranking enough
to
> be written up in imperial histories, and for whatever reason were
not
> commemorated with a long-lasting tomb. So this is obviously going
to
> refer only to the selective sample of Roman women known to us
through
> history.
>
> What woman did the most to change or alter the course of Roman
history?
> What Roman woman (including women of the entire Empire, of course)
best
> demonstrated the qualities most valued in women of her time? What
Roman
> woman's qualities carry the most validity for women today?
>
> Patricia Cassia
Who demonstrated qualities most valued in her time? Well, by
definition, we probably won't have heard of her...I get the
impression that virtuous Roman women were rather like true Southern
ladies; being in the newspaper for any reason other than your own
birth, marriage, or death was a breach of ladylike modesty.
Validity for women today? Women who wouldn't show their faces
outside, uncomplainingly accepted their husbands' absolute rights
over their bodies and minds (and those of their children), and who
killed themselves after being raped to make their male relatives feel
better about their manly honor are not exactly strong role models for
our daughters -- though their centuries-long endurance in the face of
that s--t is remarkable (admittedly, Roman women were better off than
Greek ones)! Therefore, I'd like to nominate two barbarian queens:
Zenobia of Palmyra and Boadicea of Britain <g>.
Don't get me wrong, I'm a proud Roman -- but by my own choice. Both
of these women refused to let anyone else make that choice for them,
and fought as best they could against the Roman war machine. Their
courage, valor, and chutzpah are definitely something to be admired.
Forget Lucretia -- after her land was overrun, her people
slaughtered, and her daughters raped, Boadicea went to WAR (none of
that "female honor is based on male definitions of your sexuality"
crap -- no disrespect intended to Lucretia herself, but to the system
that made her feel it was the only way out). Zenobia defied
Aurelian, and suffered mightily for it -- paraded through the streets
as a war prize (a fate Boadicea died rather than suffer) -- but she
had her brief shining moment, when the legions of the east cowered
before her. These women were proud and strong, and struck fear into
the heart of a mighty empire, if only for a moment. For that, they
deserve our honor and admiration.
Camilla Iulia Circe
(who's a sucker for the underdog)
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| Subject: |
[novaroma] Re: Most notable Roman woman! |
| From: |
"Michael" <maf@--------> |
| Date: |
Wed, 22 Nov 2000 16:34:56 +1000 |
|
Ave,
Livia.
Her methods might have been reprehensible, but the influence she had on the shaping of the Early Imperial period was enormous. If we can believe Suetonius and Tacitus, she more than anyone else was responsible for the idea of the Emperorship being inherited.
A few other possibles
Clodia
Julia (daughter of Caesar, wife of Pompey)
Messalina
Agrippina
Flavia Domitilla (mother of Titus & Domitian)
Faustina (wife of Antoninus Pius)
Vale
Marcus Afranius Regulus
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|
| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] Re: Back to Basics |
| From: |
Jeff Smith <JSmithCSA@--------> |
| Date: |
Tue, 21 Nov 2000 22:05:23 -0800 (PST) |
|
--- "pjane@-------- " <pjane@-------->
wrote:
> I plan to submit a
> proposal to the Senate
> to enshrine this practice in law.
Having a little experience in this field, I also
recommend an alternate "check signer" be identified,
whose name and signature will be on record with our
bank.
L A Dalmaticus
=====
LTC JEFFREY C. SMITH
HQ USAREUR/7A
CMR 420, BOX 2839
APO AE 09063-2839
"Statistics show that married men live longer than single men, but they are more willing to die." -- Anonymous
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| Subject: |
[novaroma] Re: Back to Basics |
| From: |
"Rita " <ritasax@--------> |
| Date: |
Wed, 22 Nov 2000 11:56:35 -0000 |
|
Moravius Piscinus Dalmatico et alii SPD:
Patricia Cassia scripsit:
> > I plan to submit a proposal to the Senate
> > to enshrine this practice in law.
Dalmaticus scripsit:
> Having a little experience in this field, I also
> recommend an alternate "check signer" be identified,
> whose name and signature will be on record with our
> bank.
Since ultimate accountability of any corporation lays with its chief
executive my suggestion would be that the Consuls should have
oversight responsibilities with regard to all banking accounts.
Normally it is the corporate president who has the lone authority to
open corporate accounts, or another corporate officer acting on the
president's written instruction. The Consuls could forward such
information to quaestors assigned to them. A corporate president
would have accountants do the books, but the president would still be
responsible and have to sign legal documents such as tax reports.
Our consuls should be given the same responsibility. As for check
writers, two quaestors, one assigned to each Consul, and other than
any quaestor assigned by a respective consul to keep the books.
Patricia Cassia's efforts have been more than sufficient for the
present needs of NR. Quarterly reports to the Senate and tribunes as
a board of directors, with other documents on request, and an annual
report to the membership. Once again Patricia should be commended
for the work she does.
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| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] Re: Most notable Roman woman! |
| From: |
<gmvick32@--------> |
| Date: |
Wed, 22 Nov 2000 01:31:11 -0700 |
|
Catja wrote:
> Validity for women today? Women who wouldn't show their
> faces outside, uncomplainingly accepted their husbands'
> absolute rights over their bodies and minds (and those of
> their children),
Where do you get the idea that it was like this for Roman
women?
> and who killed themselves after being raped to make their
> male relatives feel better about their manly honor are not
> exactly strong role models for our daughters -- though
> their centuries-long endurance in the face of that s--t is
> remarkable (admittedly, Roman women were better off than
> Greek ones)! Therefore, I'd like to nominate two
> barbarian queens: Zenobia of Palmyra and Boadicea of
> Britain <g>.
>
> Don't get me wrong, I'm a proud Roman -- but by my own
> choice. Both of these women refused to let anyone else
> make that choice for them, and fought as best they could
> against the Roman war machine. Their courage, valor, and
> chutzpah are definitely something to be admired.
As part Boudicca's revolut, if I recall, Boudicca gave her
war parties the boon to rape both Roman women prisoners of
war and British women, at will. Boudicca was a bit insane,
driven mad by circumstances that befell her, and is not a
role model I would choose to emulate.
> Forget Lucretia -- after her land was overrun, her people
> slaughtered, and her daughters raped, Boadicea went to WAR
> (none of that "female honor is based on male definitions
> of your sexuality" crap -- no disrespect intended to
> Lucretia herself, but to the system that made her feel it
> was the only way out).
I have to protest this modern interpretation of the messages
that Lucretia may or may not have been receiving from her
culture. It's directly disrespectful to Lucretia and it
does nothing to try to understand Lucretia in the context of
her own age. You take a revered figure to the people of
Republican Rome (she had statues raised to her memory,
according to Livy), and try to turn her into yet another
pathetic victim of the ubiquitous patriarchial hegemony in
need of our pity for both her weakmindedness and the
incident which befell her. I'll have none of that.
Remember, according to the histories, the death of Lucretia
sparked the revolution that founded the Republic. The men
of Rome did not take her dishonor and death lightly.
If Lucretia was without honor and strength, why did she wait
until after naming her accuser to kill herself? That in
itself was an act of vengence.
Livia Cornelia Aurelia
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| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] Most notable Roman woman! |
| From: |
<gmvick32@--------> |
| Date: |
Wed, 22 Nov 2000 01:01:48 -0700 |
|
"pjane@--------" wrote:
> What woman did the most to change or alter the course of
> Roman history?
I'd have to say this is a toss-up between Livia and
Agrippina the Younger.
Livia, for her role and influence, such as it really was
(and not necessarily portrayed to be) in the life and reign
of Augustus -- the reign which really WAS the Pax Romana; as
well as for her role in getting Tiberius to the throne and
being influential (we must suppose) in the rearing of
successor Emperors and other players in the Iulio-Claudian
dynasty.
Agrippina the Younger for marrying Claudius, without which
Nero would most likely have never been Emperor. Who knows
what history would have been if Brittanicus had been able to
succeed Claudius instead of Nero?
> What Roman woman (including women of the entire Empire, of
> course) best demonstrated the qualities most valued in
> women of her time? What Roman woman's qualities carry the
> most validity for women today?
My answer to both of these: Cornelia the Mother of the
Gracchi. A fascinating woman about whom too little is
known. What is known is that she raised her children
single-handedly both while her husband went on military
campaign and after his death, refusing the offer of a
foreign (Egyptian, if I recall) king in marriage. By
remaining a widow she had an amazing amount of freedom to
manage her own affairs that she never would have married or
never married. She raised her children with notable
adherence to the Roman virtues, and her surviving sons went
on to be champions of agrarian reforms (and ultimately died
for their forward-thinking political views). According to
authors of the day, she remained sought after all her life
by leading men in Rome for her advice and conversation, and
lived a life of true Roman virtue and free from impugnity to
her reputation.
It was my admiration for Cornelia that led me to join the
Cornelii.
Livia Cornelia Aurelia
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| Subject: |
[novaroma] an honor to be a cive.. |
| From: |
"Aurelius Tiberius" <kminer_rsg@--------> |
| Date: |
Wed, 22 Nov 2000 02:41:43 -0500 |
|
I just wanted to write a brief note on what I feel is a privlage to be a Cive in NR. (Especially considering the American President issue)
I want to thank our August fathers for being wise enough to bring our Micro Nation into being. And I want to thank all of the commited cives who have seen NR through the troubled times it has had.
I also want to thank the Cives that have given NR new ideas and new blood. I am a relative new cive, and know I have many Ideas that will benefit NR. as do you all.... I hope and wish the new senate/consuls have a smooth time in transitioning and bringing the new ideas to light.
I feel that NR has given me an outlet for my ideas and concepts with truly objective perspectives about their realization. I wnat to thank Consul Audens personally for his suppport and mentorship the past few months. Sir,,, I look foward to serving you loyal and true for the years to come in the Sodalitas....
to the rest of the Nation, Take part and be an active member in any way possible...
Vale
Aurelius Tiberius Ronanus
Praefectus Legionis & Tribuni Militum Legio VI
General of the Northern Army of the SCA Household of Rome
& Cornicularius,Sodalitas Militarium et Nova Roma
"Nos Sumus Romae milites, parati stamus ad potestatem et gloriam eius. Roma est Lux."
"we are soldiers of Rome, for her might and glory we stand ready... She is the Light"
All Hail Dominus Caesar!!!
www.geocities.com/legio_vi<br clear=all><hr>Get more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : <a href="http://explorer.msn.com">http://explorer.msn.com</a><br></p>
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| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] Re: Back to Basics |
| From: |
Jeff Smith <JSmithCSA@--------> |
| Date: |
Wed, 22 Nov 2000 05:24:45 -0800 (PST) |
|
--- Rita <ritasax@--------> wrote:
> Since ultimate accountability of any corporation
> lays with its chief
> executive my suggestion would be that the Consuls
> should have
> oversight responsibilities with regard to all
> banking accounts.
> Normally it is the corporate president who has the
> lone authority to
> open corporate accounts, or another corporate
> officer acting on the
> president's written instruction. The Consuls could
> forward such
> information to quaestors assigned to them. A
> corporate president
> would have accountants do the books, but the
> president would still be
> responsible and have to sign legal documents such as
> tax reports.
> Our consuls should be given the same responsibility.
> As for check
> writers, two quaestors, one assigned to each Consul,
> and other than
> any quaestor assigned by a respective consul to keep
> the books.
Excellent idea.
> Patricia Cassia's efforts have been more than
> sufficient for the
> present needs of NR. Quarterly reports to the
> Senate and tribunes as
> a board of directors, with other documents on
> request, and an annual
> report to the membership. Once again Patricia
> should be commended
> for the work she does.
In this as in so many other areas, she is an example
to all of us.
L A Dalmaticus
=====
LTC JEFFREY C. SMITH
HQ USAREUR/7A
CMR 420, BOX 2839
APO AE 09063-2839
"Statistics show that married men live longer than single men, but they are more willing to die." -- Anonymous
__________________________________________________
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| Subject: |
[novaroma] Most Notable Roman Women |
| From: |
"Pompeia Cornelia" <scriba_forum@--------> |
| Date: |
Wed, 22 Nov 2000 15:30:06 -0000 |
|
......I vote for......
Patricia Cassia!
Quaestor, Curatrix Sermone, Senator, Journalist, et alia.........
I, too, wish to commend P. Cassia for her virtuous example and all of her
hard work on behalf of Nova Roma.
Vale,
Po
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| Subject: |
[novaroma] Ten Tribune Martyrs |
| From: |
"Rita Reali" <ritasax@--------> |
| Date: |
Wed, 22 Nov 2000 10:54:33 -0800 |
|
Cn. Moravius Piscinus Quiritibus et popularibus suis plurimam
salutamdat:
Yesterday in the Taverna, Sentius Sura (Australia),
Ammianus Maior (Brazil), Deximus Maximus (Turkey), meus amicus M. Atilius
Regulus (Italy) and I (US; did I forget any one?) held a global discussion
on the topic of the tribunes. Part of that conversation involved a
question on how many tribunes had been murdered during the long fight to uphold
the rights of all citizens. Most everyone knows about the Gracchi
brothers, here is a list of others I know about. If anyone could add some
information (or corrections) to the list, or would simply like to mention other
Tribunes who they regard as significant in the history of Rome and its people,
please, mi scriviti.
I begin in 494 bce / 259 auc, with the first
Tribunes, C. Licinus and L. Albinus, later joined by Sicinius and three others,
up to the assumption of the tribunician powers by Augustus in 27 bce /
726 auc.
450 bce / 303 auc: Dentatus murdered while
defending Verginius; his death brought down the Decemviri.
449 bce / 304 auc: Genucius murdered for
attempting to employ the power of coercito to arrest consuls Manlius and
Furius. His death lead to the second secessio of the plebes.
132 bce / 621 auc: T. Sempronius Gracchus. T.
Gracchus actually died the year after his tribunate, leading a peaceful protest
over the repeal of his legislation. He and 3,000 retired to the Aventine
in the tradition of the first secessio and were there slaughtered.
122 bce / 631 auc: C. Sempronius Gracchus murdered
by a senator Nasica.
100 bce / 653 auc: L. Appuleius Saturninus along
with the plebeian praetor C. Servilius Glaucia were hung by a senatorial lynch
mob over land distributions to veterans of the Marius campaigns in Gallia.
91 bce / 662 auc: M. Livius Drusus murdered in
Asculum for attempting to extend citizenship to all Italians. His murder
touched off the Social War. Citizenship was then granted the Italians the
following year by Consul L. Iulius Caesar.
88 bce / 665 auc: P. Sulpicius Rufus murdered
for proposing a redistribution of enfranchised Italians among the 35
tribes. After the Italians were enfranchised they were relegated to only 8
(or 10) tribes, effectively limiting their voting power. Sulpicius
Rufus in the same proposal offered to extend voting privileges to
freedmen.
70-68 bce / 683-685 auc Lucius Sicinius murdered
for agitating for the restoration of the Republican constitution and tribunician
powers removed by the Dictator Sulla. Consuls Gn. Pompeius Magnus and M.
Lucinius Crassus restore the powers of the tribunes in 68 bce / 685 auc.
A. Gabinius becomes tribune the following year.
52 bce / 701 auc: P. Clodius Pulcher murdered on 18
Jan during a street fight in Bovillae with followers of Milo, a tribune of the
optimates. Earlier, Clodius Pulcher as Tribune in 58 bce/ 695 auc had
exiled Cicero for executing Roman citizens without trial while consul the
previous year. Milo as Tribune in 57 bce / 696 auc had recalled Cicero
from exile. Then Sallust, as Tribune, prosecuted Milo for the murder of Clodius
Pulcher, with Cicero as Milo's defense council. Cicero failed to deliver
his speech and Milo was exiled.
44 bce / 709 auc: G. Julius Caesar. In 48 bce
/ 705 auc Caesar was given the tribunicia potestas, but not until
the year of his death was he given the sancroctitas as well. The
tribunician powers assumed by Octavian in 30 bce, and later in January 27
bce / 726 auc and every year thereafter, became the legal basis of the other
imperial offices.
--- ritasax@--------
--- EarthLink: It's your Internet.
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| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] Re: Most notable Roman woman! |
| From: |
"S. Apollonius Draco" <hendrik.meuleman@--------> |
| Date: |
Wed, 22 Nov 2000 19:46:50 +0100 |
|
Salvete,
While the person I'm going to recommend isn't truly a Roman, it kind of
amazes me she hasn't been mentioned here yet: Cleopatra! She was ambitious,
and nearly brought the proud Roman respublica to its knees. She managed to
wind great men like Caesar and Antonius around her finger (even at a
considerably young age), and she was respected or admired throughout the
whole classical world. Even the ones that hated her had to recognize some
skills and talents she had. She was admired for her "Roman" sense of dignity
and pride, and her choice of suicide over public humiliation.
Valete,
Sextus Apollonius Draco, civis Novae Romae
Legatus Galliae Borealis,
Procurator Galliae,
Wind Dragon, ICQ# 32924725
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|
| Subject: |
[novaroma] The Statement of the Amici Dignitatis |
| From: |
"S. Apollonius Draco" <hendrik.meuleman@--------> |
| Date: |
Wed, 22 Nov 2000 21:27:00 +0100 |
|
Salvete, o Novaromani,
I'd like to have your attention for the following statement, drafted by the Amici Dignitatis.
ENGLISH VERSION
-------------------------
Salvete, Quirites Novae Romae
We, the Amici Dignitatis, gather in the Dignitas Forum, joining in free
association, to promote the principles of democratic process in Nova Roma.
We recognize:
1) that the sovereignty of our Res publica rests solely with the People
who form it;
2) that the government of Nova Roma and all of its associated
sodalitates, lists, and fora are to be free and open to all citizens;
3) that the actions of all government agencies, officials, and
magistrates of Nova Roma are to be made on behalf of all its citizens and
therefore are accountable to the people of Nova Roma assembled in Comitia;
4) that each and every citizen, and every applicant for citizenship,
enjoy certain individual rights without any exception, and that these rights
are to be guaranteed and protected under the laws of Nova Roma, and that
among these is the right of redress before the people assembled in Comitia;
and
5) that beyond the laws of our Res publica the dignitas of each
individual is entitled to the same degree of respect and civility commonly
afforded all citizens within our civitas.
In order to further promote the principles of democratic process in Nova
Roma, we propose to sponsor and support open communication among all
citizens of the Res publica through varied means:
1) Sponsor open fora in which all citizens of Nova Roma may
participate.
2) Sponsor moderated civil debate before all citizens.
3) Provide a multilingual list, known as the Dignitas list, for
political discussions separate from the Nova Roma main list.
4) Sponsor, support, and/or assist in the establishment of lists for
each provincia and territory in its native language as well as the Nova Roma
lingua franca.
5) Arrange, coordinate and schedule chats between cives of our varied
provinciae to promote international communication within Nova Roma.
6) Assist all cives in participating in Nova Roma's political life by
providing information on Nova Roma political institutions in the varied
languages of the Res publica.
7) Encourage and provide nonpartisan assistance to all citizens in
preparing position papers on their ideas for posting to the Dignitas list.
8) Provide nonpartisan information concerning issues to be presented to
the varied comitia, and on candidates for major and minor magistracies.
We, sponsors of the Dignitas Forum, commit ourselves to the ideals of the
democratic process and to the promotion of the goals of the Dignitas Forum
by offering our assistance to all citizens in participating in the political
life of Nova Roma.
Gn. Moravius Piscinus (piscinus@--------)
N. Moravius Vado (gens_moravia@--------)
L. Marius Peregrinus (peregrinus@--------)
M. Apollonius Formosanus (bvm3@--------)
S. Apollonius Draco (hendrik.meuleman@--------)
T. Labienus Fortunatus (labienus@--------)
M. Marcius Rex (marcheinz@--------)
C. Flavius Diocletianus (3s@--------)
M. Scribonius Curio Britannicus (marcusaemiliusscaurus@--------)
The URL of our eGroup can be found at www.egroups.com/group/NR_DignitasForum
; those who also wish to sign this statement can e-mail S. Apollonius Draco
privately. A list of signees shall be posted under the files folder of the
Dignitas Forum, along with this general ethical document itself.
Valete,
the Amici Dignitatis
NEDERLANDS (as translated by S. Apollonius Draco)
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Salvete, Quirites Novae Romae
Wij, de Amici Dignitatis, komen samen in het Dignitas Forum in vrije
associatie, om de principes van vrije democratische processi te promoten
binnen Nova Roma. Wij erkennen:
1) dat de soevereiniteit van onze res publica volledig berust bij de
mensen die er deel van uitmaken
2) dat de regering van Nova Roma en all haar geassociëerde sodalitates,
lijsten en fora vrij en open zijn voor alle burgers
3) dat de acties van de gouvernementele organen, de officials en de
magistraten van Nova Roma in het voordeel van de burgers moeten gedaan
worden en aldoende ter verantwoording kunnen geroepen worden door het volk
van Nova Roma, vergaderd in de Comitia
4) dat elke burger en elke kandidaat voor het burgerschap dezelfde
rechten heeft zonder uitzondering, en dat deze rechten moeten gegarandeerd
en beschermd worden onder Nieuwromeinse wetten, en dat onder die weten het
recht is om de mensen, vergaderd in de Comitia, toe te spreken; en
5) dat krachtens de wet of onze res publica de waardigheid van elk
individu behandeld wordt met hetzelfde respect en fatsoen voor en door alle
burgers in onze gemeenschap
Met het oog op de principes van democratische processi te promoten binnen
Nova Roma stellen wij voor open communicatie onder alle burgers van de res
publica te steunen door middel van verscheidene middelen:
1) Het steunen van open fora in dewelke alle burgers van Nova Roma
mogen participeren
2) Het steunen van gematigde, beleefde debatten voor alle burgers
3) Een meertalige lijst opzetten, bekend als het Dignitas Forum, voor
politieke discussies, gescheiden van de Nova Roma hoofdlijst
4) Het steunen en helpen in het opzetten van lijsten voor elke
provincie en elk territorium in haar moederta(a)le(n), zowel als in de
algemene taal van Nova Roma
5) Het regelen, coördineren en het organiseren van chats tussen cives
uit onze verschillende provincies, om internationale communicatie binnen
Nova Roma te promoten
6) Het bijstaan van alle burgers in te participeren in het politieke
leven van Nova Roma door informatie te voorzien over Nieuwromeinse politieke
instellingen in de verscheidene talen van de staat
7) Het aanmoedigen en voorzien van partijloze assistentie voor alle
burgers in het voorbereiden van verhandelingen van hun ideëen voor de
Dignitas lijst.
8) Het voorzien van partijloze informatie betreffende zaken die zullen
gepresenteerd worden aan de verschillende Comitia, en betreffende kandidaten
voor grote of kleine ambten
Wij, de sponsors van het Dignitas Forum, wijden onszelf aan de idealen van
het democratische proces en aan de promotie van de doelstellingen van het
Dignitas Forum door onze hulp aan te bieden aan alle burgers die deelnemen
aan het politieke leven in Nova Roma.
Gn. Moravius Piscinus (piscinus@--------)
N. Moravius Vado (gens_moravia@--------)
L. Marius Peregrinus (peregrinus@--------)
M. Apollonius Formosanus (bvm3@--------)
S. Apollonius Draco (hendrik.meuleman@--------)
T. Labienus Fortunatus (labienus@--------)
M. Marcius Rex (marcheinz@--------)
C. Flavius Diocletianus (3s@--------)
M. Scribonius Curio Britannicus (marcusaemiliusscaurus@--------)
De URL van onze eGroup kan gevonden worden op
www.egroups.com/group/NR_DignitasForum ; zij die ook dit document wensen te
tekenen kunnen S. Apollonius Draco privé e-mailen. Een lijst van
ondertekenaars zal gepost worden onder de files map van het Dignitas Forum,
tesamen met dit algemeen ethisch document zelf.
Valete,
the Amici Dignitatis
FRANCAIS (as translated by S. Apollonius Draco)
--------------------------------------------------------------
Salvete, Quirites Novae Romae
Nous, les Amici Dignitatis, convenons dans le Dignitas Forum, joignants en
association libre, pour faire de la promotion pour les principes de procès
démocratique en Nova Roma. Nous reconnaissons:
1) que la souverainité de notre res publica reste avec les gens qui en
font part
2) que le gouvernement de Nova Roma et tout les sodalitates, mailing
lists et fora associés doivent être libres et ouverts pour tous les
citoyens.
3) que les actions du gouvernement et ses officials et magistrates de
Nova Roma doivent être décider au bénéfice de peuple novaromain, assemblé
dans la Comitia
4) que chaque citoyen, et chaque applicant pour la novaromanité a des
droits individuel sans exception, et que ces droits doivent être garantis et
protégés sous les lois de Nova Roma, et que parmi ceux et le droit
d'adresser le peuple assemblé dans la Comitia; et
5) que chaque individu doit être traiter avec le même degré de respect
et politesse, en concernant sa dignité
Pour faire de la promotion de nos principes de procès démocratique dans Nova
Roma, nous proposons de soutenir de la communication libre pour tous les
citoyens de la res publica en utilisant des moyens variés:
1) Soutenir des fora ouverts où tous les citoyens de Nova Roma peuvent
participer
2) Soutenir des débats civlisés pour tous les citoyens
3) Former une liste multilinguale, le Dignitas Forum, pour les
discussions politques, séparé de la liste principale de Nova Roma
4) Soutenir et assister la création des listes pour chaque province ou
territoire en sa langue maternelle, ainsi que la lingua franca de Nova Roma
5) Arranger, coördiner et organiser des chats entre les citoyens des
provinciae variées pour améliorer la communication international dans Nova
Roma
6) Assister tous les citoyens en participer dans la vie politique de
Nova Roma en fournissant d'information des institutions politiques de Nova
Roma, en plusieures langues
7) Encourager et fournir d'assistance non-partisane à des gens
préparant une proposition ou une idée pour le Dignitas Forum
8) Fournir d'information non-partisane concernant des choses qui
devraient être présenter aux Comitia, et concernant les candidats pour des
peits postes ou des grands postes
Nous, soutenants du Dignitas Forum, commettons nous-mêmes aux idéals de
procès démocratique et à la promotion pour le buts du Dignitas Forum, en
offrant notre assistance à tous les citoyens participants dans la vie
politique de Nova Roma.
Gn. Moravius Piscinus (piscinus@--------)
N. Moravius Vado (gens_moravia@--------)
L. Marius Peregrinus (peregrinus@--------)
M. Apollonius Formosanus (bvm3@--------)
S. Apollonius Draco (hendrik.meuleman@--------)
T. Labienus Fortunatus (labienus@--------)
M. Marcius Rex (marcheinz@--------)
C. Flavius Diocletianus (3s@--------)
M. Scribonius Curio Britannicus (marcusaemiliusscaurus@--------)
L'URL de notre eGroup est www.egroups.com/group/NR_DignitasForum ; ceux qui
aussi veulent signer cet document doivent envoyer un e-mail à S. Apollonius
Draco privatement. Une liste de signeurs sera être placée à la site du
Dignitas Forum, avec cet document générale même.
Valete,
the Amici Dignitatis
DEUTSCH (as translated by C. Flavius Diocletianus)
----------------------------------------------------------------
Salvete, Quirites Novae Romae,
Wir, die Amici Dignitas, versammelt in einem offenen Forum der
Dignitas,
schließen uns in einer freien Vereinigung zusammen,
um die Prinzipien eines demokratischen Prozesses in Nova Roma
voranzutreiben.
Wir anerkennen
I) dass die Souveränität unserer Res Publica allein auf dem Volk
beruht, das
sie bildet;
II) dass die Regierung von Nova Roma und alle ihr verbundenen
Gesellschaften, Listen und Foren frei und allen Bürgern offen sein
sollen;
III) dass die Aktivitäten aller Regierungsstellen, Beamten und
Magistraten
von Nova Roma im Namen aller Bürger stattfinden und daher gegenüber dem
Volk von Nova Roma, das in Comitien zusammengefasst ist, verantwortet
werden müssen;
IV) dass jeder Bürger und jeder Bewerber um das Bürgerrecht ohne
Ausnahme
bestimmte individuelle Rechte genießt, und dass diese Rechte durch die
Gesetze von
Nova Roma, garantiert und geschützt werden sollen; eines dieser Rechte
ist
das
Recht sich mit einem Rechtsmittel an das in Comitien zusammengefasste
Volk
zu wenden, und
V) dass über die Gesetze unserer Res Publica hinaus der Dignitas eines
jeden
Individuums das gleiche Maß an Respekt und Höflichkeit gebührt,
das normalerweise allen Bürgern in unserer Gemeinschaft geboten wird.
Um die Prinzipien eines demokratischen Prozesses in Nova Roma weiter zu
verbessern, beabsichtigen wir die offene Kommunikation unter allen
Bürgern
der Res Publica durch verschiedene Maßnahmen zu fördern und
unterstützen:
I) Durch das Sponsoring offener Foren, in denen alle Bürger von Nova
Roma
teilnehmen können.
II) Durch das Sponsoring von moderierten, den Staat betreffenden
Debatten
unter allen Bürgern.
III) Durch die Schaffung einer mehrsprachigen Liste für politische
Diskussionen, unter dem Namen Dignitas Liste, die getrennt von der Nova
Roma
Hauptliste ist.
IV) Durch das sponsern, unterstützen und/oder assistieren bei der
Einrichtung von Listen für jede Provinz und für jedes Territorium
sowohl in
der Landessprache als auch in der Nova Roma Lingua Franca.
V) Durch das Arrangieren, Koordinieren und das zeitliche Planen von
Chats
unter den Bürgern unserer verschiedenen Provinzen, um die
internationale
Kommunikation in Nova Roma zu fördern.
VI) Durch Hilfestellung für alle Bürger bei der Teilnahme am
politischen
Leben von Nova Roma durch das Bereitstellen von Informationen über die
politischen Institutionen von Nova Roma in den verschiedenen Sprachen
der
Res Publica.
VII) Durch Ermutigung und Bereitstellung von unparteiischer Hilfe für
alle Bürger bei der Vorbereitung von Positionspapieren für ihre Ideen,
die
in der Dignitas Forum-Liste veröffentlicht werden sollen.
VIII) Durch die Bereitstellung von unparteiischen Informationen
betreffend
Vorhaben, die den verschiedenen Comitien vorgelegt werden sollen und
über die
Kandidaten für die verschiedenen höheren und niedrigeren
Magistratspositionen.
Wir, die Sponsoren des Dignitas Forums binden uns an die Ideale des
demokratischen Prozesses und verpflichten uns zur Förderung der Ziele
des
Dignitas Forums durch das
Angebot unserer Unterstützung für alle Bürger bei der Teilnahme am
politischen Leben von Nova Roma.
Gn. Moravius Piscinus (piscinus@--------)
N. Moravius Vado (gens_moravia@--------)
L. Marius Peregrinus (peregrinus@--------)
M. Apollonius Formosanus (bvm3@--------)
S. Apollonius Draco (hendrik.meuleman@--------)
T. Labienus Fortunatus (labienus@--------)
M. Marcius Rex (marcheinz@--------)
C. Flavius Diocletianus (3s@--------)
M. Scribonius Curio Britannicus (marcusaemiliusscaurus@--------)
Valete,
Amici Dignitatis
*****************************************
more versions to be added soon at our egroups site
******************************************
Valete!
Sextus Apollonius Draco, civis Novae Romae
Legatus Galliae Borealis,
Procurator Galliae,
Wind Dragon, ICQ# 32924725
--**--
There are no bad guys. Just disturbed guys.
--**--
Novaromain? Parlez-vous français? Cliquez ici!:
http://www.egroups.com/group/NRGallia_GalliaBelgicaF
Nieuwromein? Spreekt u Nederlands? Klik hier!:
http://www.egroups.com/group/NRGallia_BelgicaBataviaD
Novaroman? Interested in philosophy? Click here!:
http://www.egroups.com/group/NR_Philosophy
--**--
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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|
| Subject: |
RE: [novaroma] The Statement of the Amici Dignitatis |
| From: |
"Antonio Grilo" <amg@--------> |
| Date: |
Wed, 22 Nov 2000 20:41:12 -0800 |
|
Salvete omnes
> 2) that the government of Nova Roma and all of its associated
>sodalitates, lists, and fora are to be free and open to all citizens;
I protest against this item if it includes the Senate, Religious Collegia
and Sodalitates. For example, I'm a member of the Sodalitas Cultorum
Mithrae, which is a secret society as appropriate to the Mysteries of
Mithras. I'm sure that other similar organisations have the same feeling.
Valete
Antonius Gryllus Graecus
Pontifex, Senator, Magisratus, cultor Mithrae, Civis Romanus
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|
| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] The Statement of the Amici Dignitatis |
| From: |
"S. Apollonius Draco" <hendrik.meuleman@--------> |
| Date: |
Wed, 22 Nov 2000 22:07:51 +0100 |
|
Salve,
>
> > 2) that the government of Nova Roma and all of its associated
> >sodalitates, lists, and fora are to be free and open to all citizens;
> I protest against this item if it includes the Senate, Religious Collegia
> and Sodalitates. For example, I'm a member of the Sodalitas Cultorum
> Mithrae, which is a secret society as appropriate to the Mysteries of
> Mithras. I'm sure that other similar organisations have the same feeling.
This is something different, yes. I think what's meant is the common
sodalitates, the common lists and the common fora, not the special religious
groups such as the Mithraic Mysteries.
Vale,
Sextus Apollonius Draco, civis Novae Romae
Legatus Galliae Borealis,
Procurator Galliae,
Wind Dragon, ICQ# 32924725
--**--
There are no bad guys. Just disturbed guys.
--**--
Novaromain? Parlez-vous français? Cliquez ici!:
http://www.egroups.com/group/NRGallia_GalliaBelgicaF
Nieuwromein? Spreekt u Nederlands? Klik hier!:
http://www.egroups.com/group/NRGallia_BelgicaBataviaD
Novaroman? Interested in philosophy? Click here!:
http://www.egroups.com/group/NR_Philosophy
--**--
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|
| Subject: |
[novaroma] Advice to Tom News About Books |
| From: |
"Nick Ford" <gens_moravia@--------> |
| Date: |
Wed, 22 Nov 2000 20:08:01 -0000 |
|
Salve Tomase Quiritibusque salutem
> My name is Tom and I'm new to the study of Roman History. I was
wondering if any >of you could recommend a good one- or multi-volume history
of Rome. The History >Book Club has lots of offerings, but nothing which
serves as an overview. I've read >enough history to know that is the way to
get started. Any help would be greatly >appreciated. Many thanks in advance.
Be welcome, Tom. For me there is no substitute for primary sources. Looking
at them, you can make up your own mind about the way things were, without
some subsequent writer (ancient or modern, pursuing his own private agenda)
telling you what to think. By all means read commentators, but examine the
evidence for yourself first. To begin with this, I recommend:
LEWIS, N., and REINHOLD, M.(Editors): 'Roman Civilization: A Sourcebook'
Volume I (The Republic and the Augustan Age), Volume II (The Empire)
(Columbia University Press, New York, 1990)(Paperback). Borrow copies from a
library first and see what you think (that's just my frugalitas talking).
This compendium of original material, on everything from letters and
gravestone inscriptions to astrology and the price of wine, will also point
you in the direction of ancient historians (also quoted in exerpts) whom you
may wish to read in more depth. Nearly all are available in English
translations, too.
After that, my advice is to read modern historians last of all. As for
modern fiction, avoid it completely (except as entertainment). Cursed be he
whose Romanitas is derived from the works of Colleen McCullough! ):-(
Alteris verbis, avoid in your mental nourishment, wherever possible, food
which has been pre-digested for you by somebody else, except for fertilizing
your own produce.:-)
Bene lege et disce,
Vado.
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|
| Subject: |
[novaroma] Re: Most Notable Roman Woman! |
| From: |
"Nick Ford" <gens_moravia@--------> |
| Date: |
Wed, 22 Nov 2000 20:59:39 -0000 |
|
Salutem
Good post, mea Circe (your cognomen doesn't reflect your opinion of all men,
I hope?)
Me, I'm voting for the British Queen Cartimandua of the Brigantes, who did
all she could to maintain the treaty obligations to Rome of the Brigantian
Tribal Federation. Maybe the trouble with the Brigantes wouldn't have
started if she hadn't divorced King Venutius and taken up with his
armour-bearer instead, but one has to admire her independence as a woman as
well as her consistent loyalty to Rome (see Tacitus, Annales XII.40 for
details).
Bene valete,
Vado.
> Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 05:08:16 -0000
> From: "Catja " <ponton.3@-------->
> Subject: Re: Most notable Roman woman!
>
> --- In novaroma@--------, "pjane@j... " <pjane@j...> wrote:
> > So to follow up: Who do you consider to be the most notable Roman
> > woman? Obviously, there are many women of fine qualities whose
> lives
> > are simply unknown to us, because they were not high-ranking enough
> to
> > be written up in imperial histories, and for whatever reason were
> not
> > commemorated with a long-lasting tomb. So this is obviously going
> to
> > refer only to the selective sample of Roman women known to us
> through
> > history.
> >
> > What woman did the most to change or alter the course of Roman
> history?
> > What Roman woman (including women of the entire Empire, of course)
> best
> > demonstrated the qualities most valued in women of her time? What
> Roman
> > woman's qualities carry the most validity for women today?
> >
> > Patricia Cassia
>
> Who demonstrated qualities most valued in her time? Well, by
> definition, we probably won't have heard of her...I get the
> impression that virtuous Roman women were rather like true Southern
> ladies; being in the newspaper for any reason other than your own
> birth, marriage, or death was a breach of ladylike modesty.
>
> Validity for women today? Women who wouldn't show their faces
> outside, uncomplainingly accepted their husbands' absolute rights
> over their bodies and minds (and those of their children), and who
> killed themselves after being raped to make their male relatives feel
> better about their manly honor are not exactly strong role models for
> our daughters -- though their centuries-long endurance in the face of
> that s--t is remarkable (admittedly, Roman women were better off than
> Greek ones)! Therefore, I'd like to nominate two barbarian queens:
> Zenobia of Palmyra and Boadicea of Britain <g>.
>
> Don't get me wrong, I'm a proud Roman -- but by my own choice. Both
> of these women refused to let anyone else make that choice for them,
> and fought as best they could against the Roman war machine. Their
> courage, valor, and chutzpah are definitely something to be admired.
> Forget Lucretia -- after her land was overrun, her people
> slaughtered, and her daughters raped, Boadicea went to WAR (none of
> that "female honor is based on male definitions of your sexuality"
> crap -- no disrespect intended to Lucretia herself, but to the system
> that made her feel it was the only way out). Zenobia defied
> Aurelian, and suffered mightily for it -- paraded through the streets
> as a war prize (a fate Boadicea died rather than suffer) -- but she
> had her brief shining moment, when the legions of the east cowered
> before her. These women were proud and strong, and struck fear into
> the heart of a mighty empire, if only for a moment. For that, they
> deserve our honor and admiration.
>
> Camilla Iulia Circe
> (who's a sucker for the underdog)
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| Subject: |
[novaroma] First Things First (was Back to Basics) |
| From: |
"Nick Ford" <gens_moravia@--------> |
| Date: |
Wed, 22 Nov 2000 22:35:57 -0000 |
|
Quiritibus salutem
I am attempting to follow the example of Consul Q. Fabius Maximus and Quaestor Patricia Cassia in addressing this to the people rather than to the Senate (who are also currently discussing fiscal procedures), as it relates closely to the issue of taxation. I hope the Conscript Fathers won't be offended with me for so doing.
You know, friends and fellow-Romans, it worries me when Censor Sulla and I agree on something, and still more when my son Piscinus agrees with him too. Thus most of my days pass untrammelled by anxiety. :-)
But seriously...
Agreed, money is required for our Respublica. To date, money has been found, but in the unstructured and haphazard way that speaks well of the dedication and generosity of many of our citizens - magistrates and senators, mostly, take note - but which also puts our organisational professionalism (or lack of it) in an unflattering light. Money freely given in good faith must be looked after wisely, or the good faith of our public benefactors (who in this respect resemble the leading citizens of ancient Rome) will evaporate, and when that good will disappears, so does the money.
Patricia Cassia has my personal gratitude, and should have the gratitude of you all, for everything she has done thus far as Quaestor, but she really does need more backup, both in terms of manpower and sound legislation ensuring good practice.
If you think this is a boring issue, citizens, I promise you you won't when you find we can't meet our operating costs. You already know what I think about taxation: that everyone should be asked - asked, mind - to pay a fair share towards a budgeted sum instead, and that the Provinciae should keep at least half (otherwise, what's the incentive for making NR more of a reality at local level for everyone?). Besides, the machinery of taxation is in itself expensive.
But Sulla is absolutely right (Gods, I nearly choked on that) when he says you can't reasonably expect people to invest in an organisation when the capital expenditure isn't forecast and justified, and the normal probity and accountability safeguards you would expect aren't already all in place. Before we raise money (or even spend the money we've got - but there Sulla and I part company) you need something like this:
1. (January): the Consuls and Quaestors prepare an annual budget for approval by the Senate.
This will be based on individual budgets submitted by ALL magistrates, itemising their projected expenditure and income (if applicable) to the Senate from October to December of the previous year. Nil returns are also required. The completion of such a budgetary return shall be an integral part of a magistrate's duties. Each magistrate shall be responsible for compiling similar information from all those whom (s)he has appointed to office, and such information shall form part of that magistrate's budgetary return.
2. (February): if this budget requires extra revenue, not only must the citizens be consulted on how it is to be raised, they should vote in comitia tributa if any taxation proposals are involved.
3. (March): The provincial governors are asked to collect that revenue from the provinciae, and Quastors from the Macellum. Governors should be bonded for the estimated provincial quota, and be required to send documentary proof of this to the Quaestors, who should similarly be bonded for the total revenue expected. Personal bank accounts shall NOT be used by any public official for the handling of public monies. All public bank accounts, whether central or provincial, shall have at least 2 signatories, one of whom in the case of provincial bank accounts, shall be the governor.
4. (April): The provincial governors send the agreed proportion of revenue as a single credit transfer to a specially designated central NR account, managed by both Quaestors (we can't rely on just one to stay alive, well and functioning). Both Quaestors must be approved signatories to that account.
5. (April): One designated Quaestor receives the monies and deposits them in the account. A statement of account is maintained, updated regularly, on the Aerarium Saturnii page of the NR website, for all citizens to examine. Provincial statements of account shall be similarly displayed in the Aerarium Saturnii.
6. (May): A Senate committee (of 3 senators, say) are selected by lot, with power to inspect the accounts and other financial records at any time, without prior warning. They report to the Consuls.
7. Throughout the year, all payments to, and claims from, provincial and central accounts, shall be documented by transmitted faxed or scanned copies of relevant receipts, cheques, invoices, money orders and credit and debit statements.
8. (March): at the end of the financial year, the old and new Quaestors shall submit a full statement of account to a certified accountant, who is NOT a citizen of NR, for independent audit. The completed audit report shall be submitted directly to the Senate for ratification, and afterwards placed in the Aerarium Saturnii for public inspection.
I hope this very rough draft goes some way towards satisfying the basic requirements for ensuring fiscal integrity, and that these ideas stimulate enough constructive discussion to enable a second set of proposals to be constructed for a Senatus Consultum and Consular lex.
To my mind, the last thing we want is demands for money when we don't know what it's for and have no surety it will be used as we would wish. Nor do we want the office of a magistrate to become bankrupt for lack of proper procedures you would expect in a small club, never mind a fledgeling nation.
Your thoughts, please. citizens?
N. Moravius Vado
Propraetor and Senator.
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| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] Advice to Tom News About Books |
| From: |
"Tom News" <tnews4@--------> |
| Date: |
Wed, 22 Nov 2000 18:28:47 -0500 |
|
Nick,
Thanks for the advice. The Colleen McCullough books are giberish, aren't they.
Tom
----- Original Message -----
From: Nick Ford
To: novaroma@--------
Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2000 3:08 PM
Subject: [novaroma] Advice to Tom News About Books
Salve Tomase Quiritibusque salutem
> My name is Tom and I'm new to the study of Roman History. I was
wondering if any >of you could recommend a good one- or multi-volume history
of Rome. The History >Book Club has lots of offerings, but nothing which
serves as an overview. I've read >enough history to know that is the way to
get started. Any help would be greatly >appreciated. Many thanks in advance.
Be welcome, Tom. For me there is no substitute for primary sources. Looking
at them, you can make up your own mind about the way things were, without
some subsequent writer (ancient or modern, pursuing his own private agenda)
telling you what to think. By all means read commentators, but examine the
evidence for yourself first. To begin with this, I recommend:
LEWIS, N., and REINHOLD, M.(Editors): 'Roman Civilization: A Sourcebook'
Volume I (The Republic and the Augustan Age), Volume II (The Empire)
(Columbia University Press, New York, 1990)(Paperback). Borrow copies from a
library first and see what you think (that's just my frugalitas talking).
This compendium of original material, on everything from letters and
gravestone inscriptions to astrology and the price of wine, will also point
you in the direction of ancient historians (also quoted in exerpts) whom you
may wish to read in more depth. Nearly all are available in English
translations, too.
After that, my advice is to read modern historians last of all. As for
modern fiction, avoid it completely (except as entertainment). Cursed be he
whose Romanitas is derived from the works of Colleen McCullough! ):-(
Alteris verbis, avoid in your mental nourishment, wherever possible, food
which has been pre-digested for you by somebody else, except for fertilizing
your own produce.:-)
Bene lege et disce,
Vado.
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