Subject:	[novaroma] RE: Century Points
From:	antoniuscorvusseptimius@--------
Date:	Sun, 19 Aug 2001 02:11:19 -0000

Salvete ubique terrarum,

A recent post has been made. In which a question of
century points was (is) the topic of issue. Later, being fully and very
well explained by Marcus Octavius Germanicus. And that (of course)
should have been enough.

M. Apollonius Formosanus: I have had my little
disagreements with the censors in the past.
M. Octavius Germanicus: "little"? You dominated
conversation for months on this list with your vendetta, forcing the
censores to defend themselves and their edicts constantly. (edit)

ACS: You, Formosanus (e or i? for I am sure that I
will be corrected) took offense to this passage? Fortunately, I was
present while this was happening. And the only one throwing wood on the
fire, was you. If you wish to do good by the people, then come up with
some hard facts about your (so called) corruption. Then it will no
longer seem to the rest of Nova Roma, that you DO have a vendetta.


If you do sir, feel that there is something
distructive to our culture lurking within the Senate. Then I challenge
you to find what it is.And, subsequently divulge this information in a
manner that is clear. Without drudging up past arguments.For I am sure
that you have more issues to discuss.

MAF: Since he (Octavius) insists on making a direct
personal attack.

ACS: So then you must have a counter to this? I
interpret this as skirting the issue. Which in this case was quite loud
and clearly settled. We are adults here. And the retaliation of name
calling, seems unproductive to your cause (if any). By the way, I do
NOT see any legislation against transgendering, gay, or lesbianism in
the Tabularium. If so, dirext me to it. So that I can judge for my own.
And, making my own judgement as to what it means.

The current issue; I am a plebian. My century
points may, or may not be what they should be.Let this be known.If my
voice does not equal that of others, then I am at fault for not lifting
MYSELF up and making myself known to our esteemed Censors &
Consuls.Equal? no, no. I will not work twice as hard to recieve what
someone else might get for sleeping the day off.My point is, that if my
voice is not heard by my votes. I will certainly make my presence
known. And, by no means are you authorized to speak on my behalf.
As your generalization implies in this passage: (MAF) So, keep the
basic institutions of centurues (ies?) Comitia Centuriata out of the
respect for the tradition, but remove the venom (venom?) of inequality
in public decision-making and voting from it.It is not wanted today.
ACS: This is not accurate when discribing Roman Law. It only discribes
those with personal agendas.For the law does not make the people.. By
this I mean.. A law (whatever it may be) can be interpreted to suit
anyone's means. Without re-writting it.
"The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace
alarmed(and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an
endless series of hobgobblins, all of them imaginary" - H.L. Mencken



Valete,
A. Corvus Septimius
SEMPER FIDELIS








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Subject:	RE: [novaroma] Century Allocation (was RE: Century Points)
From:	"Flavius Vedius Germanicus" <germanicus@-------->
Date:	Sat, 18 Aug 2001 23:24:11 -0400

Salve

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Maia Apollonia Pica [mailto:mjarc@--------]
> Sent: Friday, August 17, 2001 3:26 AM
>
> To be very blunt: why do we need centuries at all? They are historic
> of course, but then so are many other things which Nova Roma chooses
> not to revive, such as slavery. (I'm not saying the system of
> centuries and slavery are similar, only that historicity is not
> enough in itself to encourage us to revive things. And it's an honest
> question, not some lame atempt at provocation.)

To be equally blunt, because there are certain questions that should rightly
be voted on under a system that gives more weight to those people who have a
vested interest in the outcome than those who do not. For example, take
changes to our Constitution. I believe it is not unreasonable to assert that
someone who has been active in Nova Roma's development for several years
should have more of a say in changing her fundamental documents than someone
who has joined last week and has no idea of the history that led up to the
current situation. Similarly, I think it is not unreasonable to give people
with a history of fuller involvement in Nova Roma's development a larger
voice in the choice of her chief magistrates.

> Century points give unequal rights to various citizens, right? The
> Constitution says that the criterion is "commitment to Nova Roma",
> but I don't think commitment can be measured, and, as Propraetor L.
> Sicinius Drusus noted, only some forms of commitment are rewarded
> anyway.

I disagree with your assertion that commitment cannot be measured. Perhaps
imperfectly so, but quantification is certainly possible. Of course, we do
not live in a perfect world, and thus we strive for ever-more-accurate
quantification. It won't ever be perfect, but what ever is?

> Even if commitment could be measured precisely, I suppose I
> would still see a system based on it as undemocratic, unfair. As this
> is the 28th century AUC, shouldn't we see all basically undemocratic
> forms of government as obsolete? (Unless in a game, but NR is not a
> game. BTW, I have nothing against role-playing, being a gamer
> myself.)

Here I disagree with you on philosophical grounds, rather than merely on
practical considerations. As I mentioned above, there are indeed cases where
it is proper for certain individuals' opinions to have more weight than
others. In Nova Roma's case, it is those individuals who have demonstrated a
commitment to the Republic through deeds who get to have a more influential
voice in certain-- limited-- matters. It is not Nova Roma's mission to
eliminate "undemocratic forms of government as obsolete". It is to recreate
Roman society as it was historically known, as accurately as practical. If
you were looking for a utopia where everyone is 100% equal, you're in the
wrong micronation.

Vale,

Flavius Vedius Germanicus,
Consul




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Subject:	[novaroma] gathering
From:	PompeiaAntoniaCaesar <europamoon7@-------->
Date:	Sat, 18 Aug 2001 22:02:19 -0700 (PDT)

Avete Omnes,

I will be hosting a gathering at my home in Orange
County, California on Saturday, October 13 at 1:00
p.m.. The afternoon will include performance of a
ritual to the God Mars, a Roman banquet, several brief
presentations by cives of Nova Roma, discussion and
games. All food and beverage will be provided. Please
RSVP by September 30. Please feel free to contact me
for questions or comments.

Bene Valete,

Pompeia Antonia Caesar

__________________________________________________
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Subject:	RE: [novaroma] Century Allocation (was RE: Century Points)
From:	Gnaeus Salix Astur <salixastur@-------->
Date:	Sun, 19 Aug 2001 02:31:26 -0700 (PDT)

Salvete omnes.

Please forgive once more my intrusion into this thread of conversation,
but I just wanted to point out some ideas.

--- Flavius Vedius Germanicus <germanicus@--------> wrote:
> Salve
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Maia Apollonia Pica [mailto:mjarc@--------]
> > Sent: Friday, August 17, 2001 3:26 AM
> >
> > To be very blunt: why do we need centuries at all? They are
> historic
> > of course, but then so are many other things which Nova Roma
> chooses
> > not to revive, such as slavery. (I'm not saying the system of
> > centuries and slavery are similar, only that historicity is not
> > enough in itself to encourage us to revive things. And it's an
> honest
> > question, not some lame atempt at provocation.)
>
> To be equally blunt, because there are certain questions that should
> rightly
> be voted on under a system that gives more weight to those people who
> have a
> vested interest in the outcome than those who do not. For example,
> take
> changes to our Constitution. I believe it is not unreasonable to
> assert that
> someone who has been active in Nova Roma's development for several
> years
> should have more of a say in changing her fundamental documents than
> someone
> who has joined last week and has no idea of the history that led up
> to the
> current situation.

But then, we are awarding new citizens who simply choose to join a
patrician gens a heavier vote than those who join the plebeian order
WITHOUT any additional proof of a higher level of commitment or
compromise. Don't you think that this situation should somehow be fixed
to grant coherence to our system?

<<snipped>>

> > Even if commitment could be measured precisely, I suppose I
> > would still see a system based on it as undemocratic, unfair. As
> this
> > is the 28th century AUC, shouldn't we see all basically
> undemocratic
> > forms of government as obsolete? (Unless in a game, but NR is not a
> > game. BTW, I have nothing against role-playing, being a gamer
> > myself.)
>
> Here I disagree with you on philosophical grounds, rather than merely
> on
> practical considerations. As I mentioned above, there are indeed
> cases where
> it is proper for certain individuals' opinions to have more weight
> than
> others. In Nova Roma's case, it is those individuals who have
> demonstrated a
> commitment to the Republic through deeds who get to have a more
> influential
> voice in certain-- limited-- matters. It is not Nova Roma's mission
> to
> eliminate "undemocratic forms of government as obsolete". It is to
> recreate
> Roman society as it was historically known, as accurately as
> practical.

The problem I often see is that some of the solutions we have come up
with are neither historically accurate nor too practical. We should try
to stick more closely to historical tradition in those points were
tradition does not enter in conflict with modern life, and then we
should try to distantiate ourselves from those practices that can not
be adopted without turning our collective back to modern assumptions.

> If
> you were looking for a utopia where everyone is 100% equal, you're in
> the
> wrong micronation.

I guess that there should be no limits on the ideas we can discuss or
vote on. I am not in favour of obliterating the Comitia Centuriata, but
I would not consider that the idea of discarding it is out of the
discussion in our Republic. Esteemed consul, you must understand that
your vision of how Nova Roma should be is not the only one which
deserves respect. Other ideas might not be majoritary, and might be
wrong from your (or mine) point of view, but they do deserve some
degree of respect.


=====
Bene Valete in Pace Deorum!
Gnaeus Salix Astur.
Scriba ad Res Externas Academiae Thules.

__________________________________________________
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Subject:	[novaroma] AMERICA AUSTRORIENTALIS EDICTUM NUMBER EIGHT (Addendum)
From:	"L. Sicinius Drusus" <lsicinius@-------->
Date:	Sun, 19 Aug 2001 06:04:55 -0700 (PDT)

AMERICA AUSTRORIENTALIS EDICTUM NUMBER EIGHT is hereby
amended to include the following

5. Whereas, The proprietiary rites for our Patron
Deities have been performed, and the omens were
auspicious, I declare that the aforementioned Gods and
Goddesses have agreed to take us under thier
protection.

L. Sicinius Drusus,
Propraetor America Austrorientalis



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Subject:	RE: [novaroma] Century Allocation (was RE: Century Points)
From:	Marcus Octavius Germanicus <haase@-------->
Date:	Sun, 19 Aug 2001 08:59:26 -0500 (CDT)

Salve Gnae Salix,

> But then, we are awarding new citizens who simply choose to join a
> patrician gens a heavier vote than those who join the plebeian order
> WITHOUT any additional proof of a higher level of commitment or
> compromise. Don't you think that this situation should somehow be fixed
> to grant coherence to our system?

Those same new citizens are completely unable to vote in the Comitia
Plebis Tributa, unable to run for Tribune (one of the most powerful
offices in our government), or to vote for Tribune. A slightly higher
ranking in the centuries is a small compensation for being entirely
locked out of the process of selecting Tribunes.

Vale, Octavius.

M. Octavius Germanicus
Propraetor, Lacus Magni
Curator Araneum et Senator

"... one of the main causes of the fall of the Roman Empire was that,
lacking zero, they had no way to indicate successful termination of
their C programs." -- Robert Firth




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Subject:	RE: [novaroma] Century Allocation (was RE: Century Points)
From:	Gnaeus Salix Astur <salixastur@-------->
Date:	Sun, 19 Aug 2001 08:14:45 -0700 (PDT)

Salvete omnes; et salve, M. Octavi.

--- Marcus Octavius Germanicus <haase@--------> wrote:
> Salve Gnae Salix,
>
> > But then, we are awarding new citizens who simply choose to join a
> > patrician gens a heavier vote than those who join the plebeian
> order
> > WITHOUT any additional proof of a higher level of commitment or
> > compromise. Don't you think that this situation should somehow be
> fixed
> > to grant coherence to our system?
>
> Those same new citizens are completely unable to vote in the Comitia
> Plebis Tributa, unable to run for Tribune (one of the most powerful
> offices in our government), or to vote for Tribune. A slightly
> higher
> ranking in the centuries is a small compensation for being entirely
> locked out of the process of selecting Tribunes.

That would be in theory. But given that, up to today, no legislation
has ever been successfully proposed to the Comitia Plebis Tributa, and
that on the sole occasion in which one was proposed many patrician
cives complained about being left out of the votation; and given that,
up to today, no tribunician veto has successfully been issued, I think
your affirmation is pretty biased.

Patricians do not loose much by giving up the possibility to join the
Comitia Plebis Tributa.



=====
Bene Valete in Pace Deorum!
Gnaeus Salix Astur.
Scriba ad Res Externas Academiae Thules.

__________________________________________________
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Subject:	[novaroma] Digest No 1577
From:	"Lucius Equitius" <vze23hw7@-------->
Date:	Sun, 19 Aug 2001 14:51:06 -0400

Salvete,

I would like to inquire on the nature of the 'ritual to the God Mars'. Is
this a private/family rite?
As Flamen Martialis, I am responsible for the 'official' cult of Mars and
Nova Roma hasn't the means, yet, to perform a proper Equus October. However,
I do perform rituals on behalf of the state on those days devoted to Mars.
The 13th of October is actually known to be the 'Fontinalia' in honor of
FONS, god of fountains, springs, and wells. On this day garlands of flowers
were spread in decoration, especially around wells and springs.

Valete, Flamen Martialis Lucius Equitius

BTW Today is the fall 'VINALIA", festival of wine.


> Message: 11
> Date: Sat, 18 Aug 2001 22:02:19 -0700 (PDT)
> From: PompeiaAntoniaCaesar <europamoon7@-------->
> Subject: gathering
>
> Avete Omnes,
>
> I will be hosting a gathering at my home in Orange
> County, California on Saturday, October 13 at 1:00
> p.m.. The afternoon will include performance of a
> ritual to the God Mars, a Roman banquet, several brief
> presentations by cives of Nova Roma, discussion and
> games. All food and beverage will be provided. Please
> RSVP by September 30. Please feel free to contact me
> for questions or comments.
>
> Bene Valete,
>
> Pompeia Antonia Caesar





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Subject:	[novaroma] Re: Re: Century Points
From:	"M. Apollonius Formosanus" <bvm3@-------->
Date:	Sun, 19 Aug 2001 20:46:40 +0200

Salvete M. Octavi Germanice et omnes Quirites!

Octavi, you wrote the following:

Salve Marce Apolloni,

> Because he is so personally involved in these
> matters and knows them so well, he may not understand
that
> when he wrote that certain categories of points owed
> various cives were "never" entered into the data base, I
> naturally assumed that he meant since the inception of
the
> original version of the database and the beginning of the
> whole century-point system.

You immediately assumed the worst because of your dislike
for the Censores and myself. Rather than investigating,
rather than asking any questions privately, you made a
libelous public accusation of lawbreaking. All of this
could have been avoided if you had exercised some restraint
and tried to learn the facts before assuming conspiracy.

RESPONDEO: First of all, mi Octavi, I have assumed that
*you* have been acting constitutionally and legally with
respect to acting only under the direction of the censores
in regard to the maintenance of the database. My worries
were about what the censores might have left undone, and
were not directed at you. If I failed to make that clear
enough (since I took it as too obvious to stress), I
apologise for any unintended besmirching of your honour.

I specifically stated that I had not previously suspected
even the censors of the sort of misdeads as your words
seemed to point to.

I asked my question about your public words equally
publically, and you have had a chance to reply equally
publically. This was never a private matter that I should
deal with behind the scenes, but one that is of immense
importance to everyone here in NR. I see no reason why I
should have done differently.

Furthermore, I immediately assumed that you were telling
the truth in your reply, and I expressed my belief in your
words and thanked you for them. What I got in reply was the
rabidity that follows.
______________________

> Perhaps Octavius did not perceive that I was trying to
> express my concern about the present situation without
> naming names or expressing myself in any way extremely.
The
> comment in question was deliberately understated, and was
> even so much so as to be (I had hoped) dryly humorous.

Humorous? I've reread it five times now and still fail to
see anything even slightly humorous about it.

RESPONDEO: Octavi, Octavi, the humour was in the
*understatement* with which I characterised the past
conflicts between a certain censor and myself. If you
didn't get it, you didn't get it, but I thought that it
might have raised a little smile. My whole intent thereby
was to milden my words and decrease tensions, and maybe
draw us together a little bit in thinking of the silly
aspect of our conflicts.
___________________

<snip>

> Since he insists on making a direct personal attack,

YOU made the first personal attack. You accused us of
breaking laws, without any proof, without attempting to
first learn the truth of the matter. My "personal attack"
was in response to your own.

RESPONDEO: I took your own word at its face value. If you
said that certain kinds of points had *never* been entered
into the database, how was I to know that it meant only
since the most recent changes? I took your words in their
literal sense and according to their most probable
interpretation as it seemed to me. If you had used the word
"new" there somewhere before "database", then I and perhaps
other more passive readers would not have misperceived the
situation.
____________________________

No one here is fooled by your attempts to play the victim,
Formosanus. You made an unprovoked attack on the Censores
and myself, and that has been preserved in the mailing list
archives for all to see.

RESPONDEO: My provocation was the fact that you seemed to
be reporting things that would be seriously criminal, and I
believed you.

_______________________

My response was to accuse you of being motivated by your
personal dislike for the Censores and myself. I firmly
believe this to be true, and I stand by my statement that
you are pursuing a vendetta.

RESPONDEO: If I did not believe that there really might be
a problem, why would I attack it just to make myself look
silly? I immediately admitted everyone was innocent as
soon as you explained. I did not carry on further
discussion of that point or contest the issue, but have
only reacted to your vendetta against me. I am sure that it
is obvious that you reacted very disproprotionately and
with more emotion than I ever put into my public inquiry.
___________________

> I shall reply that if a certain censor had let well
> enough alone,

[dead horseflesh removed]

>That piece of prejudiced and unfair legislation, which is
> festering in our Tabularium and undermining any claim we
> may have to be a nation of justice, is unfinished
> business.

It certainly is finished. The people have spoken, and they
have rejected your position.

Some people thought the cause of the Confederate States of
America was "unfinished business" after April of 1865. They
were mistaken.

RESPONDEO: And for some time up until a few years before
that date no doubt whites in the Southern States thought
that the "Negro" was forever going to be kept "in his
place". And yet we now have a black Secretary of State.

Idealism is not about vendettas, but it is about increasing
social justice. And it has a special strength all its own.
Don't underestimate it. It can suffer its share of defeats
or more, and still go on to win out.
________________

<snip>


YOU STRUCK FIRST. YOU posted because of personal
animosity, and all I did was to respond. YOU were the
aggressor here.

RESPONDEO: I posted because I had good reason to think
there was a serious problem in our Respublica. If you think
that you are going to make either yourself or the censors
immune to pointed inquiry and public scrutiny in the
carrying out of your jobs by such outbursts of gross and
unpleasant overreaction as soon as we let out a peep, then
you have got another think coming.
______________________


> But I consider my most valuable
> contribution to Nova Roma to be my campaign for justice
in
> the case of Marius, my co-founding of the Amici
Dignitatis,
> my campaign against linguistic chauvinism, and my
warnings
> over the dangers of oligarchy. Criticism of evils is a
very
> precious thing for any human society that is not perfect
> (i.e all human societies). And yet it is made so
unwelcome
> here (as Octavius' unnecessary comments above show) that
I
> cannot see it in the near future being rewarded as it
> deserves, nor do I know how to quantify it.

You think you "deserve" rewards for having strong opinions,
and for harping on the same issues endlessly? In that
case, I should get the same rewards, as I've spent nearly
as much time as you have debating the same issues.

RESPONDEO: Perhaps you should. On the other hand, mere
defence of the status quo doesn't push things forward to
improvements in quite the same way as criticism, does it?
_________________

Or do you think rewards should go only to those who agree
with you? (I wouldn't be at all surprised).

RESPONDEO: And that was in the end my real point - these
things cannot be objectively quantified to everyone's
satisfaction.
_____________________


> Those who want to "build" and consider warnings that the
building
> is on moral sand and bound to collapse to be just a
> malicious waste of time will not appreciate the degree of
> effort

When persons are engaged in building on a foundation of
reinforced concrete, and some madman repeatedly barges in
to the construction site raving about sand and imminent
collapse, naturally they will not be appreciative.

RESPONDEO: You do not paint a very favourable picture of
me, do you? It seems to me to be motivated by a very great
and persistent personal dislike that has lasted over many
months indeed since it had any pretext to express itself.
Sounds like a vendetta against me, in fact.

> Nova Roma if it is to be a decent and respectable
> institution in the 21st C.E. century must not be a haven
> for right-wing or authoritarian political malcontents who
> just cannot stand the growth of democracy and equality in
> society at large,

More unfounded name-calling. It seems that everyone who
disagrees with you on any issue whatseover is "right-wing"
or "authoritarian" or "ultra right-wing".

RESPONDEO: I think that people who are against democracy
are both in everday speech and in political science are
indeed named in that manner.
_________________________

Where are these imaginary right-wing authoritarians you
keep babbling about?

REPONDEO:

Vedius:
"It is not Nova Roma's mission to
eliminate "undemocratic forms of government as obsolete".
It is to recreate Roman society as it was historically
known, as accurately as practical. If you were looking for
a utopia where everyone is 100% equal, you're in the wrong
micronation."
_________________

I'm certainly not one of them. I am a paid member of the
ACLU (American Civil Liberties Union) and the
anti-censorship Electronic Frontier Foundation, the group
that recently negotiated the release of the unjustly
imprisoned Dimitry Sklyarov. You already
knew that, of course, but it's easier for you to inveigh
against some mythical right-wingers than to attack the real
positions of your opponent.

RESPONDEO: If you described the state of political affairs
in Nova Roma as a nation to some of your friends in the
ACLU, disguising the names and the fact that it was a
micronation, how many of said friends would approve? I
think that you have by some mental mechanisms failed to
judge things in NR by the same criteria you would use off
net or in some other associations you might belong to. I
really wish that you would sit down with yourself and try
to reconcile the diametrically opposed political
philosophies you are espousing in different places.

And I congratulate you on the Sklyarov affair, by the way.
In your off-net persona our values are in many ways very
congruent. But I apply mine here too.
_____________________

You hope that if you mention these mythical right-wingers
often enough that the people may actually start to believe
that they exist. This tactic is known as "the Big Lie",
and I for one find it contemptible. In the interests of
balance, should I start referring to you as a "communist
infiltrator" or somesuch nonsense?

REPONDEO: I should say the denialism that refuses to admit
the gross injustices done to former civis Marius
Peregrinus, the sexual prejudice in the Name-change Lex,
and the unwholesome effects on openness and democracy of
the oligarchic tendencies here is a far more serious form
of Big Lie. And obviously you have concocted your own Big
Lie about me, by consistently trying to portray me as some
kind of fanatic demagogue simply because I have a moral and
social concern about several issues that I refuse to keep
conveniently silent about.


>So, keep the basic institutions of centurues and the
>Comitia Centuriata out of respect for the tradition, but
>remove the venom of inequality in public decision-making
>and voting from it. It is not wanted today.

Do you also favor removing the Comitial Plebis Tributa, in
which only two-thirds of the citizens can vote? If not,
then all your purported dislike for "inequality" is a lie.

REPONDEO: A fair question. I think that if that turns out
to be the only effective means for reform in favour or
equality, then it must be used, but I do not regard it as
ideal in itself and as it is. The real problem is in the
disproportionate number of patricians in the population
relative to historical times. That is a point that
certainly deserves a bit of reform. If that is also your
opinion, then we in that agree. As things stand now,
though, it is needed as a defence - in some form - against
the oligarchy. The fact that the patricians per se in Nova
Roma are not exactly the same group as the oligarchy does
not mean that the Plebs does not need its power and its
defence. Probably some of the non-powerful patricians need
some part in that defence too.

I am a person who believes that human beings should be
politically equal and free. I believe that that should
apply to all nations and all voluntary associations. I tend
to dislike those who refuse to allow that equality and
freedom, especially those motivated by a desire to keep
disproprotionate power for themselves. And I believe that
it is right and necessary to try to bring about such a free
and equal world actively and that not to work for this
wherever necessary is irresponsible. I intend to do that in
Nova Roma as anywhere. I think that hundreds of millions of
people in the countries where Nova Roma cives live in their
macronations in North and South America, and Europe
recognise these values and do not consider them one bit
fanatical or extreme.

Octavi, we have in the past corresponded to try to come to
a more amicable relationship. I would be glad to resume
that private dialogue with you, because, as noted above,
you seem to have a viewpoint in the non-net world that is
highly congruent with mine. These heated exchanges between
us seem to me useless, whereas discussion might be more
fruitful.

Valete!


_________________________________________________
Marcus Apollonius Formosanus
Psterfamilias Gentis Apolloniae
Aedilis Plebeius, Amicus Dignitatis
Magister Scholae Latinae
ICQ# 61698049 AIM: MAFormosanus
Minervium Virtuale: http://www.crosswinds.net/~bvm3/Minervium.htm
Gens Apollonia: http://www.crosswinds.net/~bvm3/
The Gens Apollonia is accepting new members.
____________________________________________________
All that is needed for the forces of evil to triumph in the world is for
enough good men to do nothing. - Edmund Burke
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Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Digest No 1577
From:	PompeiaAntoniaCaesar <europamoon7@-------->
Date:	Sun, 19 Aug 2001 12:16:51 -0700 (PDT)

Salve,

When I decided upon the date for the event I looked up
the calendar of holidays and festivals on the Pantheon
site and it stated that October was sacred to the God
Mars. That is how my decision was made. The rite
performed at the last event was brief and performed by
Quintus Fabius Maximus in honor of the Goddess Minerva
and Fabius will probably perform the ritual at the
next event as well. I welcome any comments or
suggestions as to the proper procedure in performing a
ritual for the upcoming event.

Vale,

Pompeia Antonia Caesar


--- Lucius Equitius <vze23hw7@--------> wrote:
> Salvete,
>
> I would like to inquire on the nature of the 'ritual
> to the God Mars'. Is
> this a private/family rite?
> As Flamen Martialis, I am responsible for the
> 'official' cult of Mars and
> Nova Roma hasn't the means, yet, to perform a proper
> Equus October. However,
> I do perform rituals on behalf of the state on those
> days devoted to Mars.
> The 13th of October is actually known to be the
> 'Fontinalia' in honor of
> FONS, god of fountains, springs, and wells. On this
> day garlands of flowers
> were spread in decoration, especially around wells
> and springs.
>
> Valete, Flamen Martialis Lucius Equitius
>
> BTW Today is the fall 'VINALIA", festival of wine.
>
>
> > Message: 11
> > Date: Sat, 18 Aug 2001 22:02:19 -0700 (PDT)
> > From: PompeiaAntoniaCaesar
> <europamoon7@-------->
> > Subject: gathering
> >
> > Avete Omnes,
> >
> > I will be hosting a gathering at my home in Orange
> > County, California on Saturday, October 13 at 1:00
> > p.m.. The afternoon will include performance of a
> > ritual to the God Mars, a Roman banquet, several
> brief
> > presentations by cives of Nova Roma, discussion
> and
> > games. All food and beverage will be provided.
> Please
> > RSVP by September 30. Please feel free to contact
> me
> > for questions or comments.
> >
> > Bene Valete,
> >
> > Pompeia Antonia Caesar
>
>
>


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Subject:	[novaroma] Re: Thank you Pompeia Antonia and Pompeia Cornelia and Censors
From:	Maximina Octavia <myownq@-------->
Date:	Sun, 19 Aug 2001 11:28:50 -0700 (PDT)

Avete Pompeia et Pompeia,
I am ever so grateful for the kind comments regarding my artwork. I apologize for the late debt of thanks as I have been feverishly working on larariums for Nova Roma and my continuing research to ensure the accuracy of the shrines.
I will make Mithraeums, Egyptian (Roman Isis), Nabataen and many other shrines available as I am able. Other special handmade (by me) creations such as lamps, altars, incense burners, and ushabtis are forthcoming.
Again, thank you for your kind words and support. If there is anything you especially would like to request, please fell free to do so anytime. I will do my best to fulfill your wishes
Vale, Maximina Octavia

PompeiaAntoniaCaesar <europamoon7@--------> wrote:
--- trog99@-------- wrote:
> --- Salvete Omnes: I checked out Domina Maximina's
> website, and in my
> opinion, her work is absolutely breathtaking.
>
> I applaud your talents, Maximina, and I thank you
> for your willingness
> to share them in the name of Nova Roma.
>
> Bene valete,
> Pompeia Cornelia
>
>
> In novaroma@--------, "Lucius Equitius" <vze23hw7@v...>
> wrote:
> > Ex Domo Censor Lucius Equitius Cincinnatus
> Quiritibus SPD
> >
> > Quiris Maximina Octavia has been added to the Ordo
> Equester.
> >
> > Her website http://www.caesar-a.cityslide.com
> should be added to the
> Macellum http://www.novaroma.org/macellum/index.html
> very soon.
> >
> >
> > Bene omnibus nobis



Avete Omnes.

A special thanks to Maximina for so generously
contributing her exceptional talents to our heritage.
I know she will make us proud. I have personally seen
her work and it is truly beautiful and inspiring.

Valete,

Pompeia Antonia Caesar
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been
> removed]
>
>


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