Subject:	RE: [novaroma] unsubscribe
From:	"Flavius Vedius Germanicus" <germanicus@-------->
Date:	Sat, 8 Sep 2001 20:31:00 -0400

Salvete

> -----Original Message-----
> From: scott dolleck [mailto:billgatesson@--------]
> Sent: Saturday, September 08, 2001 1:47 PM
>
> I could not agree more with you,
> but I will not unsubscribe just yet.
> I have been on the list for a year now.
> It amazes me the things that our citizens
> talk about...(Most things about the state that NR is in.)
> But Also ALOT of junk.
> I can always hope people will change.

I've said it before (indeed; most lately just a few days ago) and I'll say
it again.

Don't like what people talk about on this list? Start your own thread. But
don't just sit there and kvetch because people aren't talking about what
_you_ want to talk about. If you don't try to change the conversation
yourself, you abbrogate your right to complain about the conversation.

Valete,

Flavius Vedius Germanicus,
Consul

Subject:	[novaroma] A question reagrding century points
From:	"C. Minucius Hadrianus" <shinjikun@-------->
Date:	Sat, 8 Sep 2001 23:20:04 -0400

Salvete,

I was just purusing the Lex Vedia Centuriata, and I have a question
reagrding century points. Are century points awarded for such appointed
positions as Legatus or Scribe? Just wondering! ^_^

Valete,

C. Minucius Hadrianus
Legatus of Massachusetts
Nova Britannia Provincia

ICQ# 28924742

"Qui desiderat pacem, praeparet bellum." - Vegetius




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Subject:	[novaroma] Was John Lennon Roman? {Was 'I'm a Bad American'}
From:	gcassiusnerva@--------
Date:	Sun, 09 Sep 2001 03:21:18 -0000

Helena,

Could you possibly be confusing 'Give Peace a Chance' with 'The
Ballad of John and Yoko'? The latter was released as a Beatles
single, though only John and Paul played on it. However, the
original jacket for 'Give Peace a Chance' does credit it to the
Plastic Ono Band and not the Beatles.

I suppose we should at least make a stab at linking this to
something Roman. So, how Roman was John Lennon? I think Ronald
Reagan was much more Roman than Lennon. He built up the US military
which was very Roman. He was also an excellent speaker, and rhetoric
was an art the Romans prized most highly. And Reagon's belief in
what professors of comparitve religion and US history call 'American
Civil Religion' could correspond somewhat to Roman leaders and the
Religio Romana.

But how Roman was Lennon? Should the man even be admired?

I remember the morning when I was a ninth grader when I woke up to
get ready for school and mom told me Lennon was murdered. As a
Beatle fan, I and my friends gave vent to grief in typical adolescent
fashion. We made our own buttons saying, "John Lennon: We'll Miss
You", hung up similar signs in the classrooms and played his music
endlessly, esecially 'Give Peace a Chance'. Ah....how naive we are
when we are so young.

The Beatles were very talented pop stars. But that was all they
were---POP stars. I value Beatle music and hope it never goes out of
style, or most of it anyway. But wheras Paul McCartney kept his feet
on the ground and realized that they were pop stars, Lennon lost his
mind and with Yoko, began presenting himsefl as some kind of great
revolutionary leader and 'conceptual artist', producing crap with
Yoko screaming her damn head off and doing very silly and stupid
things in public to show his "activism". The reasons for his
behavior? Oh, his father had left his mother, and his mother had
been killed by a car. Both tragic events, but was he the only one to
have lost someone? Paul lost his mother at a young agw as well, yet
was not a self-destructive spoiled brat.

I want to be fair to Lennon. In his last days, he did admit his
behavior could at least at times be atrocious, and he had laid off
trying to be the British version of Abbie Hoffman. His music,
especially in his Beatle days, still stands up favorably to today's
stuff.

On the end however, I see nothing about John Lennon worthy of
emulation save for his musical ability. His politics were hopelessly
naive, his methods puerile and stupid, and his narcissim nauseating.

Unfortunatly, as with another bunch of worthless people, the
Kennedys, Lennon has been idolized by those lacking discernment and
who need to seriously elevate their views to better things and better
people.

Nerva

Subject:	Re: [novaroma] A question reagrding century points
From:	Kristoffer From <from@-------->
Date:	Sun, 09 Sep 2001 10:48:25 +0200

"C. Minucius Hadrianus" wrote:
> I was just purusing the Lex Vedia Centuriata, and I have a question
> reagrding century points. Are century points awarded for such appointed
> positions as Legatus or Scribe? Just wondering! ^_^

Salve, C. Minuci Hadriane.

Having compared with my own century points, at my citizen page on the
Nova Roma website, I'd guess that appointed scribas of elected members
of the central government are awarded century points, but not those
officials (legatii et scribae) appointed by officials who themselves
have been appointed for their positions.

That sounded like so much nonsense...how about this way, then. Scribae
and legatii appointed by governors aren't awarded century points, scriba
appointed by elected magistrates are. I've got two scriba positions and
one legate position, of which only one of the scriba position has been
entrusted to me by an elected magistrate. The other two are provincial
titles, so they don't award me any additional century points, which my
position as Scriba to the Curator Araneum does. Five extra, to be exact.

Now, this guess is only based on my own allotment of century points, and
isn't based on our leges. I might be completely off, and if so, anyone
feel free to correct me.

Vale,

Titus Octavius Pius,
Senior Legatus Thules,
Praeco Anarei Thules,
Scriba to the Curator Araneum

AKA Kristoffer From

---

Si hoc signum legere potes,
operis boni in rebus latinis alacribus
et fructuosis potiri potes.

- Not-so-famous quotation

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R+++>$ !tv- b+++>$ DI++++ D+ G e h! !r-->r+++ !y-
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Subject:	[novaroma] Sodalitas Athletica
From:	Gnaeus Salix Astur <salixastur@-------->
Date:	Sun, 9 Sep 2001 03:05:14 -0700 (PDT)

Salvete omnes.

I have been thinking for some time about the possibility of creating a
new sodalitas centered on Classical "sports": Roman games like trigon
or harpastum, as well as the traditional Olympic disciplines. It would
be an addition to our study (and practice) of the Roman "way of life".

Is anyone also interested in this aspect of Roman culture?



=====
Bene Valete in Pace Deorum!
Gnaeus Salix Astur.
Triumvir Academiae Novae Romae in Thule
Scriba ad Res Externas Academiae Novae Romae in Thule.

__________________________________________________
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Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Was John Lennon Roman? {Was 'I'm a Bad American'}
From:	"J. Meuleman" <hendrik.meuleman@-------->
Date:	Sun, 9 Sep 2001 11:05:25 +0200

Salvete,

>
> Could you possibly be confusing 'Give Peace a Chance' with 'The
> Ballad of John and Yoko'? The latter was released as a Beatles
> single, though only John and Paul played on it. However, the
> original jacket for 'Give Peace a Chance' does credit it to the
> Plastic Ono Band and not the Beatles.
>
> I suppose we should at least make a stab at linking this to
> something Roman. So, how Roman was John Lennon? I think Ronald
> Reagan was much more Roman than Lennon. He built up the US military
> which was very Roman. He was also an excellent speaker, and rhetoric
> was an art the Romans prized most highly. And Reagon's belief in
> what professors of comparitve religion and US history call 'American
> Civil Religion' could correspond somewhat to Roman leaders and the
> Religio Romana.
>

Well, but Reagan was also one of the dumbest presidents in the history of
the US. Unless you think stupidity is a Roman trait, I don't see his
Romanity at all. The ancient Romans would have a good laugh knowing an actor
was elected president over such a great nation. Well, perhaps not in the
principate, but certainly in the republic.

(snipped the Beatles)

Vale bene!
Draco

Subject:	Re: [novaroma] A question reagrding century points
From:	"M Arminius Maior" <m_arminius@-------->
Date:	Sun, 09 Sep 2001 11:35:21 -0300

Salvete,

C. Minucius Hadrianus wrote:
>Salvete,
>
>I was just purusing the Lex Vedia Centuriata, and I have a question
>reagrding century points. Are century points awarded for such appointed
>positions as Legatus or Scribe? Just wondering! ^_^
>
>Valete,
>C. Minucius Hadrianus
>Legatus of Massachusetts
>Nova Britannia Provincia

MAIOR: According to the leges Vedia Centuriata, Iunia Centuriata and Vedia Apparitoria, every scriba, even if appointed by a magistrate, vigintisexviri or gubernator, is awarded with 5 century points. A Gubernator can appoint six provincial Lictores, who will receive 5 CPs too. The important Legate position isnt mentioned in this leges, and so doesnt receive CPs. This need to be reviewed in a future ammendment to this leges, that was discussed few weeks ago.

However, to award the points to the provincial positions, we need to do a complete review in the jungle of provincial edicts, a work that can be finished this month.

Valete
Marcus Arminius Maior
Scriba Censorum (or censorialis?)
--



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Subject:	Re: [novaroma] A question reagrding century points
From:	"M Arminius Maior" <m_arminius@-------->
Date:	Sun, 09 Sep 2001 12:49:37 -0300

Salve, T Octavius
--
On Sun, 09 Sep 2001 10:48:25
Kristoffer From wrote:
>Having compared with my own century points, at my citizen page on the
>Nova Roma website, I'd guess that appointed scribas of elected members
>of the central government are awarded century points, but not those
>officials (legatii et scribae) appointed by officials who themselves
>have been appointed for their positions.


MAIOR: The provincial scribes will receive 5 Century Points. The legatii arent mentioned in the leges, but im sure that they deserve some points!


>That sounded like so much nonsense...how about this way, then. Scribae
>and legatii appointed by governors aren't awarded century points, scriba
>appointed by elected magistrates are. I've got two scriba positions and
>one legate position, of which only one of the scriba position has been
>entrusted to me by an elected magistrate. The other two are provincial
>titles, so they don't award me any additional century points, which my
>position as Scriba to the Curator Araneum does. Five extra, to be exact.


MAIOR: In 18/ago, S Apollonius Draco, L Cornelius Dalmaticus and me were named scribae of the censores with the specific task to review the century points, in order to update this feature until the Reassigning of the Centurias in the kalends of november. We will update the provincial positions, and the resignation of Dalmaticus doesnt will delay our work.


>Now, this guess is only based on my own allotment of century points, and
>isn't based on our leges. I might be completely off, and if so, anyone
>feel free to correct me.
>
>Vale,
>Titus Octavius Pius,
>Senior Legatus Thules,
>Praeco Anarei Thules,
>Scriba to the Curator Araneum

Vale
Marcus Arminius Maior


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Subject:	Re: [novaroma] A question reagrding century points
From:	"L. Sicinius Drusus" <lsicinius@-------->
Date:	Sun, 9 Sep 2001 10:38:09 -0700 (PDT)

--- M Arminius Maior <m_arminius@--------> wrote:
> Salvete,
>
> C. Minucius Hadrianus wrote:
> >Salvete,
> >
> >I was just purusing the Lex Vedia Centuriata, and I
> have a question
> >reagrding century points. Are century points
> awarded for such appointed
> >positions as Legatus or Scribe? Just wondering! ^_^
> >
> >Valete,
> >C. Minucius Hadrianus
> >Legatus of Massachusetts
> >Nova Britannia Provincia
>
> MAIOR: According to the leges Vedia Centuriata,
> Iunia Centuriata and Vedia Apparitoria, every
> scriba, even if appointed by a magistrate,
> vigintisexviri or gubernator, is awarded with 5
> century points. A Gubernator can appoint six
> provincial Lictores, who will receive 5 CPs too. The
> important Legate position isnt mentioned in this
> leges, and so doesnt receive CPs. This need to be
> reviewed in a future ammendment to this leges, that
> was discussed few weeks ago.
>
> However, to award the points to the provincial
> positions, we need to do a complete review in the
> jungle of provincial edicts, a work that can be
> finished this month.
>
> Valete
> Marcus Arminius Maior
> Scriba Censorum (or censorialis?)
> --

Salvete,

I Don't care for the idea of awarding points to
provincial scribes, while giving nothing to the
legates.

There are several ways we could solve this problem.

The first would be a new lex on Century Points, but
once we start doing that too many people will want
other areas addressed. I doubt we will be able to make
this change before the Centuries are redrawn.

The Second would be for each Governor to issue edicts
reappointing their legates as scribes. The problem
with this is some Governors may neglect to do this so
some legates might receive points, while others
wouldn't. It would also create even more edicts that
would have to be checked before the Centuries could be
drawn.

The third would be for the Censors to issue an edict
stating that Legates would be considered scribes for
the purpose of assigning Century points. The legality
of this is open to Question.

Section II E 2 of the Constitution states
"There shall exist one hundred and ninety-three
centuries, into which the censors shall divide all of
the citizens. The exact composition of these centuries
shall be determined by law passed by the comitia
centuriata, but shall be weighted in favor of those
citizens who have shown the greatest commitment to
Nova Roma."

There is little doubt that the Legates are showing a
commitment to Nova Roma, and failing to award them
points violates this section.

Section III B states
"The comitia centuriata (Assembly of Centuries) shall
be made up of all of the citizens, grouped into their
respective centuries. While it shall be called to
order by either a consul or a praetor, only the
comitia centuriata shall pass laws governing the rules
by which it shall operate internally. It shall have
the following powers:"

There is little doubt that an edict that goes beyond
the letter of the law violates this section.

Section IV A 1 gives the Censors the power to
"To issue those edicta (edicts) necessary to carry out
those tasks in which they are mandated by this
Constitution and the law to engage (such edicts being
binding upon themselves as well as others);"

So we have the Censors charge with following the
mandates of the "Constitution and the law", but we
have a conflict between the mandate of II E 2 to weigh
the Centuries, and the lex issued under the authority
of Section III B.

A Censorial Edict would be the easiest solution to the
problem of points for legates, and it follows the
spirit of the constitution.

So I ask the Praetors and the Tribunes for their views
on this, Would a Censorial Edict that counted legates
as scibes for the purpose of assigning Century Points
be Constutional?

I Will defer issusing an edict reappointing my Legates
as scribes until I find if a Censoral edict is an
option.

Valete,
L. Sicinius Drusus
Propraetor America Austrorientalis






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Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Was John Lennon Roman? {Was 'I'm a Bad American'}
From:	"Teleri ferch Nyfain" <rckovak@-------->
Date:	Sun, 9 Sep 2001 14:33:15 -0400

Salve,
I must say I doubt one could call Lennon really Roman. I'm a BIG McCartney fan - I say with shame that I first heard that a former Beatle had been murdered without the name, so when I finally learned it was John I let out a sigh of relief.
I may indeed be mixing the two songs up - been a long time LOL. And I'll spare you my opinion of Yoko - not a pretty thing.
Still, Lennon had a great deal of poetic talent, and the ability to create haunting music to accentuate it. His influence on McCartney's exuberance made that song-writing team the greatest in the 20th century. I also DO admire his politics and his wit.
By the way, it was his heroin habit, along with MS Ono, that caused his bizarre behavior.
It does tick me off that so many people 1) idolize Lennon & 2) knock Paul. McCartney is the one who would make an admirable Roman, in my mind. He's always been true to his ideals, eager to learn different things and most important, family came first with him.
Vale bene,
Helena
----- Original Message -----
From: gcassiusnerva@--------
To: novaroma@--------
Sent: Saturday, September 08, 2001 11:21 PM
Subject: [novaroma] Was John Lennon Roman? {Was 'I'm a Bad American'}


Helena,

Could you possibly be confusing 'Give Peace a Chance' with 'The
Ballad of John and Yoko'? The latter was released as a Beatles
single, though only John and Paul played on it. However, the
original jacket for 'Give Peace a Chance' does credit it to the
Plastic Ono Band and not the Beatles.

I suppose we should at least make a stab at linking this to
something Roman. So, how Roman was John Lennon? I think Ronald
Reagan was much more Roman than Lennon. He built up the US military
which was very Roman. He was also an excellent speaker, and rhetoric
was an art the Romans prized most highly. And Reagon's belief in
what professors of comparitve religion and US history call 'American
Civil Religion' could correspond somewhat to Roman leaders and the
Religio Romana.

But how Roman was Lennon? Should the man even be admired?

I remember the morning when I was a ninth grader when I woke up to
get ready for school and mom told me Lennon was murdered. As a
Beatle fan, I and my friends gave vent to grief in typical adolescent
fashion. We made our own buttons saying, "John Lennon: We'll Miss
You", hung up similar signs in the classrooms and played his music
endlessly, esecially 'Give Peace a Chance'. Ah....how naive we are
when we are so young.

The Beatles were very talented pop stars. But that was all they
were---POP stars. I value Beatle music and hope it never goes out of
style, or most of it anyway. But wheras Paul McCartney kept his feet
on the ground and realized that they were pop stars, Lennon lost his
mind and with Yoko, began presenting himsefl as some kind of great
revolutionary leader and 'conceptual artist', producing crap with
Yoko screaming her damn head off and doing very silly and stupid
things in public to show his "activism". The reasons for his
behavior? Oh, his father had left his mother, and his mother had
been killed by a car. Both tragic events, but was he the only one to
have lost someone? Paul lost his mother at a young agw as well, yet
was not a self-destructive spoiled brat.

I want to be fair to Lennon. In his last days, he did admit his
behavior could at least at times be atrocious, and he had laid off
trying to be the British version of Abbie Hoffman. His music,
especially in his Beatle days, still stands up favorably to today's
stuff.

On the end however, I see nothing about John Lennon worthy of
emulation save for his musical ability. His politics were hopelessly
naive, his methods puerile and stupid, and his narcissim nauseating.

Unfortunatly, as with another bunch of worthless people, the
Kennedys, Lennon has been idolized by those lacking discernment and
who need to seriously elevate their views to better things and better
people.

Nerva

Subject:	Re: [novaroma] A question reagrding century points
From:	Fortunatus <labienus@-------->
Date:	Sun, 09 Sep 2001 14:25:09 -0500

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Tribunus Plebis Propraetori Lucio Sicinio Druso omnibusque salutem
plurimam dicit

> So I ask the Praetors and the Tribunes for their views
> on this, Would a Censorial Edict that counted legates
> as scibes for the purpose of assigning Century Points
> be Constutional?

Section IV.A.9 of the constitution defines the Apparitores, which do not
include legati:
1. Apparitores (Attendants). Collectively, the apparitores shall not
be considered magistrates, but rather shall be appointed into various
decuriae (corporations) to fulfill those necessary functions as shall
be assigned to them by law enacted by one of the comitia. They shall
include the lictores, lictores curiati, scribae, and accensi.

Section V.C.1.d and e of the constitution clearly delineate a
difference between legati and scribae:
d. To appoint legati (legates) to administer sub-divisions of their
province with all of the authority of the governor and to remove the
same as they see fit;
e. To appoint scribae (clerks) to assist with administrative and
other tasks, as the governor shall see fit.

Section III of Lex Vedia Apparitoria describes the Decuria Scribae,
and clearly does not mention legati among their number:
III. Decuria Scribae. The decuria scribae shall consist of scribae
(clerks), who shall undertake those administrative and other
functions as shall be assigned to them by the magistrate or
provincial governor they are assisting. Members of the decuria
scribae shall be appointed by those magistrates with the
Constitutional authority to appoint scribae.

The Leges Centuriatae mention apparitores, but not legati.

And, L Sicinius has already clearly demonstrated that it is beyond
the scope of the censores' powers to define how to divde cives among
the centuriae.
Constitution, section II.E.2:
2. There shall exist one hundred and ninety-three centuries, into
which the censors shall divide all of the citizens. The exact
composition of these centuries shall be determined by law passed by
the comitia centuriata, but shall be weighted in favor of those
citizens who have shown the greatest commitment to Nova Roma.

Therefore, I would be forced to impose my veto against a censorial
edictum that equated legati with scribae for the purpose of giving
them century points.

Valete


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Subject:	Re: [novaroma] A question reagrding century points
From:	"J. Meuleman" <hendrik.meuleman@-------->
Date:	Sun, 9 Sep 2001 21:45:18 +0200

Salvete omnes,

Allow me to jump in on this...

>
> Tribunus Plebis Propraetori Lucio Sicinio Druso omnibusque salutem
> plurimam dicit
>
> > So I ask the Praetors and the Tribunes for their views
> > on this, Would a Censorial Edict that counted legates
> > as scibes for the purpose of assigning Century Points
> > be Constutional?
>
> Section IV.A.9 of the constitution defines the Apparitores, which do not
> include legati:
> 1. Apparitores (Attendants). Collectively, the apparitores shall not
> be considered magistrates, but rather shall be appointed into various
> decuriae (corporations) to fulfill those necessary functions as shall
> be assigned to them by law enacted by one of the comitia. They shall
> include the lictores, lictores curiati, scribae, and accensi.
>
> Section V.C.1.d and e of the constitution clearly delineate a
> difference between legati and scribae:
> d. To appoint legati (legates) to administer sub-divisions of their
> province with all of the authority of the governor and to remove the
> same as they see fit;
> e. To appoint scribae (clerks) to assist with administrative and
> other tasks, as the governor shall see fit.
>

(snipped the rest)

I very much agree with Fortunatus here. Personally speaking, I have been
appointed as both scriba and legatus by my govenor, not because of the fancy
titles, but because I am actually doing these jobs. As his scriba, I do
translation work for him, and as a legatus I try my best to maintain contact
in my local region, and assist in meetings where I can.

I am, however, in favour of giving legati due credit for their work. While
some legati in NR get appointed and gather dust for the rest of the year, I
believe most of them try to do their job as good as possible, and have
usually more work to do than a scriba has. So, as Lucius Sicinius suggested,
we may look at a new amendment of the CP Lex. I hope we can find a quick
solution for this, and focus on the more important gens reform.

Valete bene!
S. Apollonius Draco

Subject:	[novaroma] A Question Regarding Century Points
From:	trog99@--------
Date:	Sun, 09 Sep 2001 20:35:21 -0000

Salvete Omnes:

Just a point regarding Scribes. There are some scribal positions
which, I am sure atleast equate, workload and responsibility-wise, a
Legatus' responsibilities.

Last year, I had the privilege of serving Consul Marcus Minucius
Audens as Scriba Consula. It was excellent, but I'll tell ya, around
Senate call time, I was a busy little bee. And even when there were
no major deadlines, I was compiling files, drafting letters and
proposal for the Consul and his Accensii.

Even this year as Scriba to the Curatrix, there is probably more of a
workload than the provincial Legate or Scriba in atleast "some" cases.

I can see a Scriba Censorum being a very busy person, also.

This is not a "poor me" post :) I enjoy/enjoyed these positions! My
intent is to demonstrate that certain Scribal positions entail a good
deal of work and commitment, and I think this should be considered
with respect to Century point awards.

Could we consider Provincial Scribae as being ineligible for Century
Points and Scribae serving the senate or major magisterial offices ie
Consul, Censor, Praeter Urbanis, Collegium (if this is appropriate)
as being eligible for Century Points?

If I have a good provincial "scriba", I am probably going to elevate
this individual to Legatus for work well done, and expand the
responsibilities a bit........This way they would accrue Century
Points as a legatus.

Just some thoughts.

Bene vale,
Pompeia Cornelia Strabo
Propraetrix, Canada Orientalis
NOVA ROMA

Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Sodalitas Athletica
From:	"Gaius Vipsanius Agrippa" <vipsaniusagrippa@-------->
Date:	Sun, 09 Sep 2001 15:14:49 -0600

Salve

Definitely!!!

I would love to help out in any way I could.

Gaius Vipsanius Agrippa


>From: Gnaeus Salix Astur <salixastur@-------->
>Reply-To: novaroma@--------
>To: novaroma@--------
>Subject: [novaroma] Sodalitas Athletica
>Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2001 03:05:14 -0700 (PDT)
>
>Salvete omnes.
>
>I have been thinking for some time about the possibility of creating a
>new sodalitas centered on Classical "sports": Roman games like trigon
>or harpastum, as well as the traditional Olympic disciplines. It would
>be an addition to our study (and practice) of the Roman "way of life".
>
>Is anyone also interested in this aspect of Roman culture?
>
>
>
>=====
>Bene Valete in Pace Deorum!
>Gnaeus Salix Astur.
>Triumvir Academiae Novae Romae in Thule
>Scriba ad Res Externas Academiae Novae Romae in Thule.
>
>__________________________________________________
>Do You Yahoo!?
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Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Was John Lennon Roman? {Was 'I'm a Bad American'}
From:	"Raina Faolan" <GuruPoet@-------->
Date:	Sun, 09 Sep 2001 17:56:21 -0400

Nerva,

Remind me never to ask you, your feelings on Jerry Garcia and Ozzy Osbourne
on just how 'Roman' they are. I'd like to argue and say what John and Yoko
were doing was expressions of art at high artistic value, I just won't say
much. And why is Yellow Submarine stuck in my head now?

Aeternia


>From: gcassiusnerva@--------
>Reply-To: novaroma@--------
>To: novaroma@--------
>Subject: [novaroma] Was John Lennon Roman? {Was 'I'm a Bad American'}
>Date: Sun, 09 Sep 2001 03:21:18 -0000
>
>Helena,
>
> Could you possibly be confusing 'Give Peace a Chance' with 'The
>Ballad of John and Yoko'? The latter was released as a Beatles
>single, though only John and Paul played on it. However, the
>original jacket for 'Give Peace a Chance' does credit it to the
>Plastic Ono Band and not the Beatles.
>
> I suppose we should at least make a stab at linking this to
>something Roman. So, how Roman was John Lennon? I think Ronald
>Reagan was much more Roman than Lennon. He built up the US military
>which was very Roman. He was also an excellent speaker, and rhetoric
>was an art the Romans prized most highly. And Reagon's belief in
>what professors of comparitve religion and US history call 'American
>Civil Religion' could correspond somewhat to Roman leaders and the
>Religio Romana.
>
>But how Roman was Lennon? Should the man even be admired?
>
> I remember the morning when I was a ninth grader when I woke up to
>get ready for school and mom told me Lennon was murdered. As a
>Beatle fan, I and my friends gave vent to grief in typical adolescent
>fashion. We made our own buttons saying, "John Lennon: We'll Miss
>You", hung up similar signs in the classrooms and played his music
>endlessly, esecially 'Give Peace a Chance'. Ah....how naive we are
>when we are so young.
>
> The Beatles were very talented pop stars. But that was all they
>were---POP stars. I value Beatle music and hope it never goes out of
>style, or most of it anyway. But wheras Paul McCartney kept his feet
>on the ground and realized that they were pop stars, Lennon lost his
>mind and with Yoko, began presenting himsefl as some kind of great
>revolutionary leader and 'conceptual artist', producing crap with
>Yoko screaming her damn head off and doing very silly and stupid
>things in public to show his "activism". The reasons for his
>behavior? Oh, his father had left his mother, and his mother had
>been killed by a car. Both tragic events, but was he the only one to
>have lost someone? Paul lost his mother at a young agw as well, yet
>was not a self-destructive spoiled brat.
>
> I want to be fair to Lennon. In his last days, he did admit his
>behavior could at least at times be atrocious, and he had laid off
>trying to be the British version of Abbie Hoffman. His music,
>especially in his Beatle days, still stands up favorably to today's
>stuff.
>
> On the end however, I see nothing about John Lennon worthy of
>emulation save for his musical ability. His politics were hopelessly
>naive, his methods puerile and stupid, and his narcissim nauseating.
>
> Unfortunatly, as with another bunch of worthless people, the
>Kennedys, Lennon has been idolized by those lacking discernment and
>who need to seriously elevate their views to better things and better
>people.
>
>Nerva
>
>
>
>
>
>


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Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Sodalitas Athletica
From:	Gnaeus Salix Astur <salixastur@-------->
Date:	Sun, 9 Sep 2001 15:00:11 -0700 (PDT)

Salvete omnes; et salve, Agrippa.

--- Gaius Vipsanius Agrippa <vipsaniusagrippa@--------> wrote:
> Salve
>
> Definitely!!!
>
> I would love to help out in any way I could.
>
> Gaius Vipsanius Agrippa

Fine! I guess that if more people is interested, we could start by
creating just another mailing list on Yahoo (the Novoroman invasion
marches on -- sound of drums --). Let's wait for a couple of days to
see how many sport lovers are there :-).


=====
Bene Valete in Pace Deorum!
Gnaeus Salix Astur.
Triumvir Academiae Novae Romae in Thule
Scriba ad Res Externas Academiae Novae Romae in Thule.

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Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Sodalitas Athletica
From:	Krysialtemus@--------
Date:	Sun, 9 Sep 2001 18:36:38 EDT

Very interested in Classical sports. This is my area of study for my Ph.D. in
Sport History. Caecilia Drusa Dalmatica

Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Sodalitas Athletica
From:	Gnaeus Salix Astur <salixastur@-------->
Date:	Sun, 9 Sep 2001 15:45:12 -0700 (PDT)

Salvete omnes; et salve, Drusa Dalmatica.

--- Krysialtemus@-------- wrote:
> Very interested in Classical sports. This is my area of study for my
> Ph.D. in
> Sport History. Caecilia Drusa Dalmatica

Perfect! A professional is what we need :-).


=====
Bene Valete in Pace Deorum!
Gnaeus Salix Astur.
Triumvir Academiae Novae Romae in Thule
Scriba ad Res Externas Academiae Novae Romae in Thule.

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Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Sodalitas Athletica
From:	"scott dolleck" <billgatesson@-------->
Date:	Sun, 09 Sep 2001 23:16:14 +0000

Salve

Oh Yes!!!
I am very interested in this!!
Count me in!

Lucius Avisius Seneca

>From: "Gaius Vipsanius Agrippa" <vipsaniusagrippa@-------->
>Reply-To: novaroma@--------
>To: novaroma@--------
>Subject: Re: [novaroma] Sodalitas Athletica
>Date: Sun, 09 Sep 2001 15:14:49 -0600
>
>Salve
>
>Definitely!!!
>
>I would love to help out in any way I could.
>
>Gaius Vipsanius Agrippa
>
>
> >From: Gnaeus Salix Astur <salixastur@-------->
> >Reply-To: novaroma@--------
> >To: novaroma@--------
> >Subject: [novaroma] Sodalitas Athletica
> >Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2001 03:05:14 -0700 (PDT)
> >
> >Salvete omnes.
> >
> >I have been thinking for some time about the possibility of creating a
> >new sodalitas centered on Classical "sports": Roman games like trigon
> >or harpastum, as well as the traditional Olympic disciplines. It would
> >be an addition to our study (and practice) of the Roman "way of life".
> >
> >Is anyone also interested in this aspect of Roman culture?
> >
> >
> >
> >=====
> >Bene Valete in Pace Deorum!
> >Gnaeus Salix Astur.
> >Triumvir Academiae Novae Romae in Thule
> >Scriba ad Res Externas Academiae Novae Romae in Thule.
> >
> >__________________________________________________
> >Do You Yahoo!?
> >Get email alerts & NEW webcam video instant messaging with Yahoo!
>Messenger
> >http://im.yahoo.com
>
>
>_________________________________________________________________
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>


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Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Sodalitas Athletica
From:	Gnaeus Salix Astur <salixastur@-------->
Date:	Sun, 9 Sep 2001 16:56:16 -0700 (PDT)

Salvete omnes; et salve, L. Avini Seneca.

--- scott dolleck <billgatesson@--------> wrote:
>
> Salve
>
> Oh Yes!!!
> I am very interested in this!!
> Count me in!
>
> Lucius Avisius Seneca

I surely will. As soon as I get some time (next week at maximum), I
will create a new mailing list and invite you all to join it.




=====
Bene Valete in Pace Deorum!
Gnaeus Salix Astur.
Triumvir Academiae Novae Romae in Thule
Scriba ad Res Externas Academiae Novae Romae in Thule.

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