Forum Romanum


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Question on the new Lex Vedia change
From:	Fortunatus <labienus@-------->
Date:	Thu, 01 Nov 2001 19:23:06 -0600

Salvete

> The system would work if we had fewer Centuries. We
> have enough active Citizens to make it work with
> around 25 Centuries. We DON'T have enough active
> citizens to reasonably expect a majority of votes from
> two canidates with 193 Centuries.

I agree entirely. As close as we are to the December elections,
however, we would have to rush in order to enact a constitutional
amendment due to the need for a vote in both the centuries and the
Senate. Such an amendment would be needed because the number of
centuries is enshrined in the constitution.

Therefore, I tend to lean toward using Consul Vedius' current proposal
as a quick fix, then deal with changing the constitution next year. It
may be that this would be unnecessary, though.

Valete
T Labienus Fortunatus
--
Quicquid latine dictum sit, altum videtur.


Subject:	[novaroma] Re: Offline
From:	radams36@--------
Date:	Fri, 02 Nov 2001 01:30:25 -0000

--- In novaroma@--------, "Teleri ferch N--------n" <rckovak@e...> wrote:
> Salve,
> My best wishes and compassion to you and to your mother in the next
few days - may the gods be with you whatever the outcome.
> Vale bene,
> Helena Galeria
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix
> To: Gens_Cornelia@-------- ; novaroma@-------- ; censors@n...
> Sent: Thursday, November 01, 2001 1:41 PM
> Subject: [novaroma] Offline
>
>
> Ave,
>
> I will be offline for the next 4 days at least because I will be
in
> Riverside. My mother, as some of you know, has been in the
hospital for
> the past 4 weeks and the Doctors are not optimistic about her
status.
> They are moving her to ICU, today. So I will be staying in
Riverside
> with my family. I hope this wont cause too much of an
inconvenience.
>
> Respectfully,
>
> Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix
> Censor
>
My thoughts and best wishes are with you and your family as well,
friend Sulla.

Warmest regards,

Rufus Iulius Palaeologus

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Subject:	[novaroma] Provincial magistracies
From:	"Magus" <consul63@-------->
Date:	Fri, 02 Nov 2001 00:45:58 -0000

How is it that the majority of procinciae have propraetor as the
highest office? Sources indicate that if no former consul was
available for provincial governorship, and a praetor took the office,
then that praetor was still known as a proconsul. Propraetors could
only exist if a proconsul was already in place.

Confused Republican


Subject:	[novaroma] Re: Provincial magistracies
From:	amg@--------
Date:	Fri, 02 Nov 2001 09:16:29 -0000

Salve

Can you identify and quote those sources? In fact I am more familiar
with the provincial administration of the time of the empire, and
there are some similarities with what you say. In Hispania there were
3 provinciae: Tarraconnensis, Boetica and Lusitania. Tarraconnensis
had a Proconsul. The other two, each had a Lagatus Augusti PRO
PRAETORE, which indeed matches your statement.
But before Augustus there were only two provinciae in Hispania and
each was governed by a Praetor, and I'm not sure that they were
already called "Proconsules" by that time, for I have read somewhere
that only when there was no possibility of sending a real Consul or
Praetor (e.g. when provinciae started to be too many), they sent a
Proconsul (someone who had been a Consul in the past) or Propraetor
(someone who had been a Praetor in the past). That's why I am so
interested on your quotations.

Vale bene
Graecus

--- In novaroma@--------, "Magus" <consul63@h...> wrote:
> How is it that the majority of procinciae have propraetor as the
> highest office? Sources indicate that if no former consul was
> available for provincial governorship, and a praetor took the
office,
> then that praetor was still known as a proconsul. Propraetors could
> only exist if a proconsul was already in place.
>
> Confused Republican

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Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Question on the new Lex Vedia change
From:	Kristoffer From <from@-------->
Date:	Fri, 02 Nov 2001 12:21:42 +0100

Flavius Vedius Germanicus wrote:
> You will not have.
>
> YOU will not have?
>
> Just who the Hell do you think YOU are? It's unacceptable? Fine! Don't
> accept it! Feel free to leave if you don't like it.
>
> But don't tell me you "will not have" this or that.

Salve, Flavi Vedi Germanice.

I'm sorry for my unlucky choice of words, please forgive me. What I
meant was that I would not stand by silently while watching something I
felt was unfair take place, this is why I felt the need to speak out.
I'd rather try to let you, and the rest of Nova Roma, know that I feel
something is wrong, than quietly slip away from our nation.

I realize I must have hit a sore spot, and caused you some undue
agitation, so for this I humbly ask your forgiveness. But at the same
time, I must ask you to consider the points I was trying to make,
however incompetently I did this.

I am not a native english speaker, so I may from time to time utilize
phrasings and words which may sound overly aggressive for you, or mean a
completely different thing for you than for me. Please don't hold this
against me, as there is precious little I can do, other than keep on
trying.

Vale,

Titus Octavius Pius,
Senior Legatus Thules,
Praeco Anarei Thules,
Scriba to the Curator Araneum

AKA Kristoffer From

---

Si hoc signum legere potes,
operis boni in rebus latinis alacribus
et fructuosis potiri potes.

- Not-so-famous quotation

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
Version: 3.1
GCS d- s:++> a-- C++>$ ULS++ P+ L++ E- W++(--) N
o-- K- w--- !O M-- V-- PS->$ PE- Y+ PGP- t+@ 5- X-
R+++>$ !tv- b+++>$ DI++++ D+ G e h! !r-->r+++ !y-
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] roman halloween
From:	"Teleri ferch Nyfain" <rckovak@-------->
Date:	Fri, 2 Nov 2001 08:06:50 -0500

Blessed Samhain
BB
Teleri/Helena Galeria
----- Original Message -----
From: Franciscus Apulus Caesar
To: novaroma@--------
Sent: Wednesday, October 31, 2001 7:40 PM
Subject: [novaroma] roman halloween

Salvete,
I wish you a marry Halloween, beacuse this festivity is roman too.
When in the first century the Romans took the Britain, they knew the celtic
Samhain festivity. At 1° November the Romans honoured Pomoma, fruits and
gardens' Goddess: in this period they offered fruits (apples) for the
fertility. Now this ancient rite is in the pumpkins.

Marry Halloween and peace in the world.

Valete
Franciscus Apulus Caesar
-------------------------------------------
Provincia Italia
Paterfamilias Gens Apula
www.provinciaitalia.f2s.com/apula
----------------------------------------
Alme Sol ... Possis Nihil Urbe Roma Visere Maius


Subject:	[novaroma] a little help to a fellow citizen?
From:	"Magus" <consul63@-------->
Date:	Fri, 02 Nov 2001 02:19:41 -0000

Hi,

Not sure if this is allowed, but I hope so, and I hope someone can
help.
I'm new here, and was wondering if anyone could help me out. I've got
a quote from Cicero, and a rough date, but I can't seem to trace the
original source. I only have it in English, so I'm not sure how good
the translation will be. I'd be really, incredibly grateful if
someone could provide me with a reference :)

The date I have is November (50?),

"A madhouse of men thirsting for war."

Any ideas?

Thanks in advance

Iulia Statilia Tiro

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Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Re: Provincial magistracies
From:	Michel Loos <loos@-------->
Date:	02 Nov 2001 09:05:55 -0200


Subject:	[novaroma] Re: Provincial magistracies
From:	"Magus" <consul63@-------->
Date:	Fri, 02 Nov 2001 12:51:17 -0000

I can't seem to find the references, but I do recall that one of the
was Sertorius. Apparantly his correct title whilst in Spain was
proconsul, despite the fact that he had only achieved praetorian
power in Rome. I'll keep looking for the exact references though.

--- In novaroma@--------, amg@c... wrote:
> Salve
>
> Can you identify and quote those sources? In fact I am more
familiar
> with the provincial administration of the time of the empire, and
> there are some similarities with what you say. In Hispania there
were
> 3 provinciae: Tarraconnensis, Boetica and Lusitania. Tarraconnensis
> had a Proconsul. The other two, each had a Lagatus Augusti PRO
> PRAETORE, which indeed matches your statement.
> But before Augustus there were only two provinciae in Hispania and
> each was governed by a Praetor, and I'm not sure that they were
> already called "Proconsules" by that time, for I have read
somewhere
> that only when there was no possibility of sending a real Consul or
> Praetor (e.g. when provinciae started to be too many), they sent a
> Proconsul (someone who had been a Consul in the past) or Propraetor
> (someone who had been a Praetor in the past). That's why I am so
> interested on your quotations.

I know that what you relate occurred from 458 (ALC), under Pompey's
legislation for that year. Cicero and Bibulus were both forced to
take provinciae having not done so at the end of their respective
Consulships. But how does this relate to the lex Sempronia, or was
this already defunct under the lex Vatinia (I know it should only
have affected certain of the Gallic provinciae, but was something
similar passed with reference to the rest?).

How many provinciae were there under the Empire? (I'm afraid my
knowledge of that period is minimal). Even in the Republic there must
have been more than six (if we allow that proconsulares held that
office for between one and three years, surely there can still only
be a maximum of six at a time...), yet the majority seem to have been
titled proconsuls, rather than propraetors.

Laura

> Vale bene
> Graecus
>
> --- In novaroma@--------, "Magus" <consul63@h...> wrote:
> > How is it that the majority of procinciae have propraetor as the
> > highest office? Sources indicate that if no former consul was
> > available for provincial governorship, and a praetor took the
> office,
> > then that praetor was still known as a proconsul. Propraetors
could
> > only exist if a proconsul was already in place.
> >
> > Confused Republican


Subject:	[novaroma] Help - virtual tour of reconstructed Forum Romanum
From:	"Martins-Esteves" <esteves@-------->
Date:	Tue, 30 Oct 2001 15:52:08 -0200

avete, quirites

I am titus horatius, citizen of nova roma living in provincia brasilis. i
don't know if some of you will remember me, for it is almost two years since
i last showed up at the list.

some time ago, i remember having visited an excellent site, where one could
make a tour trough the reconstructed forum romanum. i have searched the web
for this site now, but i could not find it. does somebody any information on
the subject?

valete

t. hor. atticus


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Help - virtual tour of reconstructed Forum Romanum
From:	"Teleri ferch Nyfain" <rckovak@-------->
Date:	Fri, 2 Nov 2001 09:24:42 -0500

Salve,

http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Forum/6946/rome.html
It's listed on the Links on the Nova Roma site.

Vale bene
Helena Galeria
I am titus horatius, citizen of nova roma living in provincia brasilis. i
don't know if some of you will remember me, for it is almost two years since
i last showed up at the list.

some time ago, i remember having visited an excellent site, where one could
make a tour trough the reconstructed forum romanum. i have searched the web
for this site now, but i could not find it. does somebody any information on
the subject?

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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Subject:	[novaroma] Re: Hey, It's OK: Was Question on the new Lex Vedia change
From:	trog99@--------
Date:	Fri, 02 Nov 2001 14:32:32 -0000

--- In novaroma@--------, Fortunatus <labienus@t...> wrote:
> Salvete
>
> > The system would work if we had fewer Centuries. We
> > have enough active Citizens to make it work with
> > around 25 Centuries. We DON'T have enough active
> > citizens to reasonably expect a majority of votes from
> > two canidates with 193 Centuries.
>
>
> I agree entirely. As close as we are to the December elections,
> however, we would have to rush in order to enact a constitutional
> amendment due to the need for a vote in both the centuries and the
> Senate. Such an amendment would be needed because the number of
> centuries is enshrined in the constitution.
>
> Therefore, I tend to lean toward using Consul Vedius' current
proposal
> as a quick fix, then deal with changing the constitution next year.
It
> may be that this would be unnecessary, though.
>
> Valete
> T Labienus Fortunatus

Salvete Honoured Consul et Omnes:

I am also satisfied that Consul Vedius' suggestion is a workable
proposal for the forthcoming magisterial elections; I was pleased when
he presented it.

As Senator Fortunatus points out, we are weeks away from this election
and therefore do not have time to properly implement a reduction of
Centuries (L.Sicinius Drusus), or a Census (L. Cornelius Sulla).
These are wonderful ideas, IMHO, but to be effective they must be
accurately implemented, and I don't think that is going to happen
before December.

I am content to go with the Consul's solution too, and we'll iron out
the wrinkles of these corrective proposals next year.

We can complain/lament all we wish, but those who voted for the
initial lex must assume responsibility for not seeing the possible
negative outcomes. Hey, none of us is perfect.

This is fine, as a short term solution, IMHO.

And, for what it's worth, Consul Germanicus, I hope I have never
personally made you feel that I didn't appreciate your efforts. I
don't have to agree with you always to see that you have been an
industrious, level-headed, cool tempered (???, well, "most" of the
time, ......big, toothy grin), and dedicated Consul.

And if my post the other night came across as "crusty", it was not the
intent; I was just worried that we were all misfocusing our energies
on worrying about the Census, in the absence of deciding on a definite
plan for the forthcoming elections. No offense was intended toward
your efforts as Consul.

I assume when magistrates post stuff in the forum, ie lexes,
proposals, law packages, they are looking for opinions, and that I am
not out of line in giving them, as long as I focus on the ideas and
not the personalities. I am not abashed to this approach on my
opinions by others, if the intent is bona fide and for the benefit of
the res publica.

I know also, that we cannot always be a "mutual admiration society",
but let's do a 360 on the name calling and stuff, ok? It serves no
positive purpose. Perhaps any "necessary" knock-down, draggem-outs are
best left to private communication.??

Bene vale,
Pompeia Cornelia
Propraetrix Canada Orientalis

> --
> Quicquid latine dictum sit, altum videtur.


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Re: Provincial magistracies
From:	Caeso Fabius Quintilianus <tjalens.h@-------->
Date:	Fri, 2 Nov 2001 17:44:04 +0100

On Fri, 2001-11-02 at 07:16, amg@-------- wrote:
> Salve
>
> Can you identify and quote those sources? In fact I am more familiar
> with the provincial administration of the time of the empire, and
> there are some similarities with what you say. In Hispania there were
> 3 provinciae: Tarraconnensis, Boetica and Lusitania. Tarraconnensis
> had a Proconsul. The other two, each had a Lagatus Augusti PRO
> PRAETORE, which indeed matches your statement.
> But before Augustus there were only two provinciae in Hispania and
> each was governed by a Praetor, and I'm not sure that they were
> already called "Proconsules" by that time, for I have read somewhere
> that only when there was no possibility of sending a real Consul or
> Praetor (e.g. when provinciae started to be too many), they sent a
> Proconsul (someone who had been a Consul in the past) or Propraetor
> (someone who had been a Praetor in the past). That's why I am so
> interested on your quotations.
>

Salve,

before the Punic Wars, the consuls were affected provinces/regions as
their war zones. They could stay there as proconsuls until the newly
elected consul arrived.
With the creation of provinces (Sardinia and Sicily the first), 2 extra
praetores were elected each of them in charge of a Province, again if
their term had to be prolongated they became pro praetores.
In case of need, during wars the command of extra armies was given to
old consuls or praetores to whom was also given the title of pro consul
or pro praetor, meaning they had consular or praetorian imperium over
their army (and conquered land).

The number of praetores kept growing with creation of new provinces,
for example in 197BC we have alread 6 praetors (the classical Urbanus
and Peregrinus + Sardinia,Sicily and the 2 Spains).

With the multiplication of provinces and war zones adn the extension of
the distances between Rome and the provinces the proconsuls and
propraetores were multiplied in the various provinces.

Manius Villius Limitanus

Salvete Quirites!

And after the founding of the "criminal case courts of law" (quaestiones)
in 149 BC, I don't know the correct word in English, the administration of
the provinces was taken care of in another way. It was done by sending
former consuls and praetors to a province each, with the title of proconsul
or propraetor, or by prolonging the term of a proconsul or propraetor. The
Consuls and Praetors stayed in Rome to deal with the leadership of Rome and
the "civilian" tasks of their offices. I think that we could say that there
is were Nova Roma is. To name the governor Consul as long he still is
active as Consul, also could be considered authetic.

The other titles discussed are mostly from Imperial times. Although ther
were a few exeptions, with pro magistral titles such as the imperium
extrordinarium given to Scipio Africanus 211 BC and proconsular power
given to Pompeius Magnus in the wars against the pirates 67 BC. These were
really not quite constitutional and laid the foundations for the
extraordniarie power that formed the powerbase of the Emperors.

Vale

Caeso Fabius Quintilianus
Quaestor of Nova Roma
Propraetor of Thule

The Opinions expressed are my own,
and not an offical opinion of Nova Roma
************************************************
Join the Main List for Nova Roma
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/novaroma
Join the List for the Thule Provincia in Nova Roma
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ThuleNovaRoma/join
************************************************
The homepage of the Nova Roma Provincia Thule:
http://thule.novaroma.org/
************************************************
Aut inveniam viam aut faciam
"I'll either find a way or make one"
************************************************
"Do not give in to hate. That leads to the dark side."
************************************************
Caeso, he who also is known as Christer Edling.
************************************************
Using a keyboard that don't want to make L! :-(
************************************************
PRIVATE PHONE: +90 - 10 09 10
DOG BOARDING HOUSE PHONE: +90 - 503 56
MOBILE: +70 - 643 88 80


Subject:	[novaroma] Sulla's Mother
From:	jmath669642reng@--------
Date:	Fri, 2 Nov 2001 13:44:47 -0500 (EST)

Censor Sulla;

My best felicitations to your mother and my best wishes to her, as well.
I most humbly offer that she is in my prayers, and in my own humble way
I hope for her improvement. If there is anything that I ay further do
for either her or yourself, I beg that you will not hesitate to ask.

Very Respctfully;
Marcus Audens

Fair Winds and Following Seas!!!

http://community.webtv.net/jmath669642reng/NovaRomaMilitary

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Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Offline
From:	Caeso Fabius Quintilianus <tjalens.h@-------->
Date:	Fri, 2 Nov 2001 21:16:26 +0100

>Ave,
>
>I will be offline for the next 4 days at least because I will be in
>Riverside. My mother, as some of you know, has been in the hospital for
>the past 4 weeks and the Doctors are not optimistic about her status.
>They are moving her to ICU, today. So I will be staying in Riverside
>with my family. I hope this wont cause too much of an inconvenience.
>
>Respectfully,
>
>Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix
>Censor

Salve Illustrus Censor!

I will include You and your mother in my thoughts and prayers.

Vale

Caeso Fabius Quintilianus
Quaestor of Nova Roma
Propraetor of Thule

The Opinions expressed are my own,
and not an offical opinion of Nova Roma
************************************************
Join the Main List for Nova Roma
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/novaroma
Join the List for the Thule Provincia in Nova Roma
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ThuleNovaRoma/join
************************************************
The homepage of the Nova Roma Provincia Thule:
http://thule.novaroma.org/
************************************************
Aut inveniam viam aut faciam
"I'll either find a way or make one"
************************************************
"Do not give in to hate. That leads to the dark side."
************************************************
Caeso, he who also is known as Christer Edling.
************************************************
Using a keyboard that don't want to make L! :-(
************************************************
PRIVATE PHONE: +90 - 10 09 10
DOG BOARDING HOUSE PHONE: +90 - 503 56
MOBILE: +70 - 643 88 80


Subject:	[novaroma] Re: Provincial magistracies
From:	"Magus" <consul63@-------->
Date:	Fri, 02 Nov 2001 18:35:18 -0000

After consultation:
Sources include Cicero's Verrines, with a discussion on provincial
governorship; Livy; and apparantly inscriptions refer to proconsuls
rather than propraetors, even where the individual had not achived
consular office.

Exceptions, however: Sicily, Sardinia, and some of the older
provinciae, where a praetor was elected specifically for the purpose
of governing the province.

Tiro

--- In novaroma@--------, "Magus" <consul63@h...> wrote:
> I can't seem to find the references, but I do recall that one of
the
> was Sertorius. Apparantly his correct title whilst in Spain was
> proconsul, despite the fact that he had only achieved praetorian
> power in Rome. I'll keep looking for the exact references though.
>
>
> --- In novaroma@--------, amg@c... wrote:
> > Salve
> >
> > Can you identify and quote those sources? In fact I am more
> familiar
> > with the provincial administration of the time of the empire, and
> > there are some similarities with what you say. In Hispania there
> were
> > 3 provinciae: Tarraconnensis, Boetica and Lusitania.
Tarraconnensis
> > had a Proconsul. The other two, each had a Lagatus Augusti PRO
> > PRAETORE, which indeed matches your statement.
> > But before Augustus there were only two provinciae in Hispania
and
> > each was governed by a Praetor, and I'm not sure that they were
> > already called "Proconsules" by that time, for I have read
> somewhere
> > that only when there was no possibility of sending a real Consul
or
> > Praetor (e.g. when provinciae started to be too many), they sent
a
> > Proconsul (someone who had been a Consul in the past) or
Propraetor
> > (someone who had been a Praetor in the past). That's why I am so
> > interested on your quotations.
>
> I know that what you relate occurred from 458 (ALC), under Pompey's
> legislation for that year. Cicero and Bibulus were both forced to
> take provinciae having not done so at the end of their respective
> Consulships. But how does this relate to the lex Sempronia, or was
> this already defunct under the lex Vatinia (I know it should only
> have affected certain of the Gallic provinciae, but was something
> similar passed with reference to the rest?).
>
> How many provinciae were there under the Empire? (I'm afraid my
> knowledge of that period is minimal). Even in the Republic there
must
> have been more than six (if we allow that proconsulares held that
> office for between one and three years, surely there can still only
> be a maximum of six at a time...), yet the majority seem to have
been
> titled proconsuls, rather than propraetors.
>
> Laura
>
>
> > Vale bene
> > Graecus
> >
> > --- In novaroma@--------, "Magus" <consul63@h...> wrote:
> > > How is it that the majority of procinciae have propraetor as
the
> > > highest office? Sources indicate that if no former consul was
> > > available for provincial governorship, and a praetor took the
> > office,
> > > then that praetor was still known as a proconsul. Propraetors
> could
> > > only exist if a proconsul was already in place.
> > >
> > > Confused Republican


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Sulla's Mother
From:	"Caius Puteus Germanicus" <puteus@-------->
Date:	Fri, 2 Nov 2001 19:58:19 +0100

Ave Sulla,

I want to join Marcus in his prayers for you and your mother. I hope you and your mother find the strength to come through these hard times. May the gods walk with you! I implore Asclepius, god of healing, to hear our prayers and to grant your mother a full recovery.

As Marcus already stated, do not hesitate to ask if help is needed!

In pace deorum,
C. Puteus G
----- Original Message -----
From: jmath669642reng@--------
To: novaroma@--------
Sent: Friday, November 02, 2001 7:44 PM
Subject: [novaroma] Sulla's Mother

Censor Sulla;

My best felicitations to your mother and my best wishes to her, as well.
I most humbly offer that she is in my prayers, and in my own humble way
I hope for her improvement. If there is anything that I ay further do
for either her or yourself, I beg that you will not hesitate to ask.

Very Respctfully;
Marcus Audens

Fair Winds and Following Seas!!!

http://community.webtv.net/jmath669642reng/NovaRomaMilitary


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Help - virtual tour of reconstructed Forum Romanum
From:	"Martins-Esteves" <esteves@-------->
Date:	Wed, 31 Oct 2001 10:05:50 -0200

t. horat. atticus s.d. helenae valeriae

it is not the site i am talkking about. i knew this one before, as it was
listed on the Links on the Nova Roma site.
the site i mean provided a recreation of the ancient forum, trough which you
could walk.

but thanks anyway.

vale

>Salve,
>
>http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Forum/6946/rome.html
>It's .
>
>Vale bene
>Helena Galeria
> I am titus horatius, citizen of nova roma living in provincia brasilis. i
> don't know if some of you will remember me, for it is almost two years
since
> i last showed up at the list.
>
> some time ago, i remember having visited an excellent site, where one
could
> make a tour trough the reconstructed forum romanum. i have searched the
web
> for this site now, but i could not find it. does somebody any information
on
> the subject?
>
>
>
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>


Subject:	Re: [novaroma] R: The Comitia Centuriata will be called soon
From:	Michael Loughlin <qccaesar@-------->
Date:	Thu, 1 Nov 2001 19:33:25 -0800 (PST)

Ave,
Well part of the problem with Nova Roma possibly
being inaffective in keeping the attention of its
citizens is maybe the unwillingness of some to accept
the point of views and opinions of others. Yes we are
all going to have varying views on issues and opinions
and we may agrre at points and disagree. But is it a
crime to have a different view on a matter? I have
noticed that there is a tendency to accuse people of
being antagonists and out to cause trouble. Also
there is a tendency to tell people that they're just
wrong because we don't agree. I am even guilty of
that but I have only engaged in such a response when I
can factually prove my point with actual material that
exists and not just speak off the top of my head.
Plus the name calling (i.e. "Troll") does not help to
keep people interested. As well there seems to be a
tendency of people saying that this or that topic
should not even be discussed on the Nova Roma main
list and basically imply that everyone should just
drop it cause they said so (my interpretation).
Unless you created this ML and have full knowledge of
its purpose, goals, and intent then people quite
possibly should not speak as if they are in a position
of authority higher than that which they hold.
Now this is a focus on the negative aspects of NR
that I see. There are plenty of possible positive
aspects or potential positive things that could be
looked into to make NR more appealing to citizens.
vale,
Quintus Cornelius Caesar

__________________________________________________
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Find a job, post your resume.
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Subject:	[novaroma] Re: The Comitia Centuriata will be called soon
From:	cassius622@--------
Date:	Fri, 2 Nov 2001 17:56:57 EST

Quintus Cornelius Caesar wrote:

Well part of the problem with Nova Roma possiblybeing inaffective in keeping
the attention of itscitizens is maybe the unwillingness of some to accept the
point of views and opinions of others.

Cassius respondit:
If you're talking about the proposed changes to the "Lex Vedia De Ratione
Comitiorum Centuriatum," it seems to me that timing has been the greatest
issue. We're coming to the end of the year; and the election season is almost
upon us. This was hoped to be a quick sideline issue, and instead it turned
into quite a stumbling-block.

>Yes we areall going to have varying views on issues and opinionsand we may
agrre at points and disagree. But is it a crime to have a different view on
a matter?

Cassius respondit:
Not at all, except that time is growing short and we need to be focusing on
larger issues very soon. If we can't reach consensus on a minor (possibly
temporary) voting rules change, how on earth will we get through the voting
season itself?

> I have noticed that there is a tendency to accuse people of being
antagonists and out to cause trouble. Also there is a tendency to tell
people that they're just wrong because we don't agree.

Cassius respondit:
I think there was frustration in this issue partuclarly for Consul
Germanicus. Germanicus has an excellent track-record of involving others in
legislation and being willing to draft laws in consensus with others. In
fact, he's been accused of making laws with *too much* Citizen involvement!
In this case, a law was not questioned or commented on until the last moment,
and then it was questioned very strongly. My guess is that he felt a little
blindsided.

> I am even guilty of that but I have only engaged in such a response when I
can factually prove my point with actual material that exists and not just
speak off the top of my head. Plus the name calling (i.e. "Troll") does not
help to keep people interested.

Cassius respondit:
Compared to some lists I've been on, name calling is really at a minimum
here. There *have* been a few posts which even I would consider "troll"
posts, and people will mention that sort of thing if they feel it's
happening. As far as keeping people's interests, the best way to maintain
that is for the list to have a good variety of interesting topics. If *one*
issue is debated over long, even if people have really, really good things to
say, it can get tiresome anyone hoping for a variety of Roman experience.

> As well there seems to be a tendency of people saying that this or that
topic should not even be discussed on the Nova Roma mainlist and basically
imply that everyone should just drop it cause they said so (my
interpretation).

Cassius respondit:
This happens frequently on almost *all* internet lists. Sometimes things
really are off topic, or continue to the point where they can damage the very
forum itself, (for example the Afgan War topics that continued for three
weeks on end, to the total exclusion of anything Roman on this list.) In
general this forum has been an excellent one, and everyone does get their
say.

>Unless you created this ML and have full knowledge of its purpose, goals,
and intent then people quite possibly should not speak as if they are in a
position of authority higher than that which they hold.

Cassius respondit:
I believe the rules of this forum have been (and continue to be) communicated
well by our Curatrix Sermonem. Hopefully most of us here have a basic
understanding of the list purposes, goals, and intent. If anyone does have
questions about this, the Curatrix Sermonem or her assistants will no doubt
be happy to assist.

> Now this is a focus on the negative aspects of NRthat I see. There are
plenty of possible positive aspects or potential positive things that could
be looked into to make NR more appealing to citizens.

Cassius respondit:
Many thanks for your input. I'd be equally as happy to hear about any ideas
you may have for positive potential things. If you have strong feelings about
getting some of those ideas out I can also recommend the "Sodalitas
Egressus", which works to focus on gettnig positive materials together to
promote interest in Nova Roma.

Valete,

Marcus Cassius Julianus
Consul

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/


Subject:	[novaroma] Re: Help - virtual tour of reconstructed Forum Romanum
From:	danielovi@--------
Date:	Fri, 02 Nov 2001 23:03:56 -0000

Salve tite horati
By chance, are you referring to Ancientsites and its game SPQR ?. If
so, then that website already disappeared.
Vale bene
Lucius Pompeius Octavianus
Propraetor provincialis Argentinae

--- In novaroma@--------, "Martins-Esteves" <esteves@c...> wrote:
>
>
> avete, quirites
>
>
> I am titus horatius, citizen of nova roma living in provincia
brasilis. i
> don't know if some of you will remember me, for it is almost two
years since
> i last showed up at the list.
>
> some time ago, i remember having visited an excellent site, where
one could
> make a tour trough the reconstructed forum romanum. i have searched
the web
> for this site now, but i could not find it. does somebody any
information on
> the subject?
>
> valete
>
>
> t. hor. atticus


Subject:	[novaroma] Re: Help - virtual tour of reconstructed Forum Romanum * SPQR
From:	"Julilla Sempronia Magna" <julilla@-------->
Date:	Fri, 02 Nov 2001 23:32:27 -0000

> By chance, are you referring to Ancientsites and its game SPQR? If
so, then that website already disappeared.
> Vale bene
> Lucius Pompeius Octavianus
> Propraetor provincialis Argentinae
>

It has, more's the pity. I worked at AncientSites and have taken the
liberty of recreating the forum walkthrough at villa mea --
http://julilla.tripod.com/concordia/ -- This is the only
reconstruction of the Forum that I know to be in existance.

Enjoy!

---
cura et valeas,

@____@ Julilla Sempronia Magna
|||| http://julilla.tripod.com/
Daily Life in Ancient Rome
@____@ julilla@--------
||||