| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] Withdrawal Of Citizenship |
| From: |
Caeso Fabius Quintilianus <tjalens.h@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 2 Dec 2001 01:01:47 +0100 |
|
Salvete! Lucia Ambrosia Valeria sends Greetings To All!!
>Due to a busy schedule, I have no time to dedicate to Nova Roma and do not
>wish to sit back and just read through e-mails all day. I have enjoyed my
>time as a citizen and have tried to do what I can as Legatus to the DC area.
>I wish to thank Gens Ambrosia and the rest of Nova Roma for welcoming me. My
>thanks also to Consul Flavius Vedius Germanicus for the opportunity as
>Legatus. I hope to be able to join again when more time is available. May
>the Gods protect and guide each one of you.
>
>Many Blessings,
>Lucia Ambrosia Valeria
>Valerian75@--------
Salve Honorable Lucia Ambrosia Valeria!
You are not the first to leave Nova Roma when time becomes too short.
I am sorry, but I think this is the wrong decision, To me You are Lucia
Ambrosia Valeria, if You come back under another name, that would feel
absolutely wrong to me. I absolutely don't want to be rude, but this is my
personal feeling. I think it would be better if You just got out of the
main list until You have time for Nova Roma, but stayed as a citizen. To me
Nova Roma isn't just a couple of clothes that I can get out of and into
again or change when I need or feel like it. No Nova Roma is my skin and I
can't change skin, so I stay!
I am not saying this to be unpolite or unfriendly, on the contrary, I would
be very happy if You stayed in Nova Roma. I also understand that people
(could be me) sometimes has to take a break from being active. But still
there is the alternative to keep your citizenship and accept that You will
have to be passive for a period.
If You stil decide to leave I would still be most happy to greet You a warm
welcome back when You decide to return! :-)
Vale
Caeso Fabius Quintilianus
Quaestor of Nova Roma
Propraetor of Thule
CANDIDATE FOR CURULE AEDILE 2755
The Opinions expressed are my own,
and not an offical opinion of Nova Roma
************************************************
Join the Main List for Nova Roma
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/novaroma
Join the List for the Thule Provincia in Nova Roma
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ThuleNovaRoma/join
************************************************
The homepage of the Nova Roma Provincia Thule:
http://thule.novaroma.org/
************************************************
Aut inveniam viam aut faciam
"I'll either find a way or make one"
************************************************
"Do not give in to hate. That leads to the dark side."
************************************************
Caeso, he who also is known as Christer Edling.
************************************************
Using a keyboard that doesn't want to make L! :-(
************************************************
PRIVATE PHONE: +90 - 10 09 10
DOG BOARDING HOUSE PHONE: +90 - 503 56
MOBILE: +70 - 643 88 80
|
| Subject: |
[novaroma] Re: [novaroma_europe] Endorsement |
| From: |
Gnaeus Salix Astur <salixastur@--------> |
| Date: |
Sat, 1 Dec 2001 16:07:54 -0800 (PST) |
|
Salvete Quirites; et salve, Quirine Caesar.
--- Gaius Quirinus Caesar <gaius_quirinus_caesar@--------> wrote:
> Salvete omnes,
> we're in the campaign period than this is my
> endorsements for these offices:
>
> Tribunus Plebis:
> Gn Salix Astur
> he's one of the best cives i know: i think he can be
> one of the best Tribuni we have evere seen before!
Thank you very, very much for your kind words. I am really impressed by
the support I am receiving from my loved Italia.
I will try to behave according to your high expectations.
=====
Bene Valete in Pace Deorum!
Gnaeus Salix Astur.
Legatus Externis Rebus Provinciae Hispaniae
Triumvir Academiae Novae Romae in Thule
Scriba ad Res Externas Academiae Novae Romae in Thule.
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Buy the perfect holiday gifts at Yahoo! Shopping.
http://shopping.yahoo.com
|
| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] Languages |
| From: |
Michel Loos <loos@--------> |
| Date: |
01 Dec 2001 21:45:38 -0200 |
|
On Sat, 2001-12-01 at 21:18, Amulius Claudius Petrus wrote:
>
> Salvete cives et amici,
>
> I am all for freedom of speech, equality, and so on. Although I question the
> ability of this list to be fully moderated if other languages are spoken
> here. I don't look at it as a freedom of speech issue either. It comes down
> to the language the majority of our citizens are able to communicate in,
> English.
Freedom of speech and previous censorship ("moderation") are
incompatible.
>
> If our moderator cannot understand all the languages of the world how is
> he/she supposed to do her job? Even if we could get a group of translators
> to rewrite messages into English it would open up a huge flood of languages.
> I believe this would be a big pain.
>
Do we have a lot of languages with one unique citizen? If the mail's
destiantion is all of us somebody will translate it. If it is local
its destinataries will understand it.
> The only way I can see this working is if our moderators are language
> geniuses, or purchase a computer program to roughly translate messages into
> other languages they could understand. Again, is it worth the hassle?
>
In order for everybody to be able to freely speak, yes it is worth it.
The actual language policy forces the non fluent english speaker to
populate the provincial lists and to stay unaware of what is happening
on the ML, even if they have a little understanding of english.
Those same provincial lists are thought to be dividing to some because
they cannot participate therein. If we want to keep united AND universal
we must tolerate everybodies language on the main list.
Manius Villius Limitanus
|
| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] re: Curator Sermonem : a political choice |
| From: |
Michel Loos <loos@--------> |
| Date: |
01 Dec 2001 21:50:25 -0200 |
|
On Sat, 2001-12-01 at 21:41, Amulius Claudius Petrus wrote:
> Salve,
>
> >on 12/1/01 6:10 PM, Michel Loos at loos@-------- wrote:
> >
> > PS: Now the answer to the english version:
> > Well sort of my last sentence: there will probably always be somebody on
> > this list able to translate anybodys language, and this can be done
> > after your fast publication, it does not need to be done beforehand.
> > If few got what you meant in Swedish I am sure the swedes did and that
> > the first essential stpe in communication: somebody understood you and
> > will be able to translate.
>
> You actually think someone would take the time to translate messages into
> other languages? Sure, I can see small one paragraph messages, but how about
> the larger ones we see posted her on a daily bases. If I saw a message in
> French that was really long, I would not be translating it just because I
> can understand it. It would take forever for me to rewrite a long message
> into English. Just take a look at the last few posts, they are quite long.
> This time could be better spent doing other more productive work for Nova
> Roma.
>
We had the case in the beginning of the year with a long ode to Koln and
Romanitas written in German. In the matter of half a day 3 translations
appeared on this list. This is also a exercise of citizenship.
BTW our current Curatrix Sermonem registered citizens willing to do such
translations, which is really great. But she wants those translations to
be done before the message is posted. I simply want to reverse the order
of things: first post the message, then let the translators translate
it.
Manius Villius Limitanus
> Vale,
>
> "Quamquam cupido sit delictum ab suis crebro est mater virtutum"
> "Though ambition may be a fault in itself it is often the mother of virtues"
>
> --
> Amulius Claudius Petrus
> Candidate for Aediles Curules
> Provincia Legatus Canada Orientalis
> Retarius Officium Canada Orientalis
> Retarius Officium Gens Claudia
> Canada Orientalis Provincia
>
> Please visit my campaign website at:
> http://www.virtue.nu/amclaudius/index.htm
>
> Canada Orientalis Website:
> www25.brinkster.com/canorien/
>
> Gens Claudia Website:
> www.freehost.nu/members/gensclaudia/
> --
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
|
| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] Withdrawal Of Citizenship |
| From: |
Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix <alexious@--------> |
| Date: |
Sat, 01 Dec 2001 16:20:28 -0800 |
|
Ave,
IMHO you should just go on digest mode or even no mail. However, giving
up your citizenship is excessive. One does not give up your
macronational citizenship in a whim. Why should NR be different? Just
go to digest mode or go no mail then at your convenience you can keep
yourself informed. Your Pater/Materfamilias can inform you if there is
an upcoming vote or any events.
Respectfully,
Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix
Censor
Valerian75@-------- wrote:
>
> Salvete! Lucia Ambrosia Valeria sends Greetings To All!!
>
> Due to a busy schedule, I have no time to dedicate to Nova Roma and do
> not
> wish to sit back and just read through e-mails all day. I have
> enjoyed my
> time as a citizen and have tried to do what I can as Legatus to the DC
> area.
> I wish to thank Gens Ambrosia and the rest of Nova Roma for welcoming
> me. My
> thanks also to Consul Flavius Vedius Germanicus for the opportunity as
>
> Legatus. I hope to be able to join again when more time is
> available. May
> the Gods protect and guide each one of you.
>
> Many Blessings,
> Lucia Ambrosia Valeria
> Valerian75@--------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> ADVERTISEMENT
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
|
| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] re: Curator Sermonem : a political choice |
| From: |
Michel Loos <loos@--------> |
| Date: |
01 Dec 2001 22:52:28 -0200 |
|
On Sat, 2001-12-01 at 21:43, Caeso Fabius Quintilianus wrote:
> Salve Honorable Manius Villius Limitanus!
>
> Jag betvivlar att ditt system kommer att fungera i praktiken.
The system is nearly the same as the actual, the only difference is the
translation (if needed by the already formed team) will be done AFTER
the publication of the post. This will desinhibit the people who don t
like to first send theit post to a translater.If you believe Vedia s
system work, so does mine.
Vem tror Du
> ska ha tid att både vara aktiv själv och dessutom ägna sig åt att översätta
> andras texter?
>
First, the actual curatrix offered thsi translation service to
non-english fluent speakers: the team already exists.
Second, with the actual rules I dont know if somebody of the team was
used to translate, I definitively was not.
Third: I dont think there will be tons of posts in swedish or whatever
which would compromise the activity of the translaters, I just hope
there will be much more than with the actual rules (well more than none
should not be difficult).
Manius Villius Limitanus
>
> >
> >I have nothing against using english in order to be understood by all,
> >but I think if you want to speak fast, you should have the possibility
> >to speak your own language.
> >I am sure that somebody will understand you and will translate you loud
> >and clear.
> >
> >Vale
> >
> >Manius Villius Limitanus.
> >
> >PS: Now the answer to the english version:
> >Well sort of my last sentence: there will probably always be somebody on
> >this list able to translate anybodys language, and this can be done
> >after your fast publication, it does not need to be done beforehand.
> >If few got what you meant in Swedish I am sure the swedes did and that
> >the first essential stpe in communication: somebody understood you and
> >will be able to translate.
>
>
> Vale
>
> Caeso Fabius Quintilianus
> Quaestor of Nova Roma
> Propraetor of Thule
>
> CANDIDATE FOR CURULE AEDILE 2755
>
> The Opinions expressed are my own,
> and not an offical opinion of Nova Roma
> ************************************************
> Join the Main List for Nova Roma
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/novaroma
> Join the List for the Thule Provincia in Nova Roma
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ThuleNovaRoma/join
> ************************************************
> The homepage of the Nova Roma Provincia Thule:
> http://thule.novaroma.org/
> ************************************************
> Aut inveniam viam aut faciam
> "I'll either find a way or make one"
> ************************************************
> "Do not give in to hate. That leads to the dark side."
> ************************************************
> Caeso, he who also is known as Christer Edling.
> ************************************************
> Using a keyboard that doesn't want to make L! :-(
> ************************************************
> PRIVATE PHONE: +90 - 10 09 10
> DOG BOARDING HOUSE PHONE: +90 - 503 56
> MOBILE: +70 - 643 88 80
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
|
| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] Languages |
| From: |
Amulius Claudius Petrus <pkkt@--------> |
| Date: |
Sat, 01 Dec 2001 20:07:51 -0500 |
|
>Michel Loos at loos@-------- wrote:
>>
>> If our moderator cannot understand all the languages of the world how is
>> he/she supposed to do her job? Even if we could get a group of translators
>> to rewrite messages into English it would open up a huge flood of languages.
>> I believe this would be a big pain.
>>
>
> Do we have a lot of languages with one unique citizen? If the mail's
> destiantion is all of us somebody will translate it. If it is local
> its destinataries will understand it.
This is the main list. All messages posted here are for everyone to view.
Therefore should it not be in the language that the majority of us can read?
>
>> The only way I can see this working is if our moderators are language
>> geniuses, or purchase a computer program to roughly translate messages into
>> other languages they could understand. Again, is it worth the hassle?
>>
>
> In order for everybody to be able to freely speak, yes it is worth it.
>
> The actual language policy forces the non fluent english speaker to
> populate the provincial lists and to stay unaware of what is happening
> on the ML, even if they have a little understanding of english.
>
> Those same provincial lists are thought to be dividing to some because
> they cannot participate therein. If we want to keep united AND universal
> we must tolerate everybodies language on the main list.
This is understandable. Although the list also needs to be moderated. For
this to be done a translation is necessary.
Don't get me wrong, having *official* translators available to aide citizens
in having their messages translated into English is something I support.
Although I don't believe we should do away with the English requirement
altogether. This list needs to be moderated if we hope to keep the enjoyable
atmosphere we currently enjoy. I believe this will be difficult to do if we
rely on volunteer translations.
Vale,
"Quamquam cupido sit delictum ab suis crebro est mater virtutum"
"Though ambition may be a fault in itself it is often the mother of virtues"
--
Amulius Claudius Petrus
Candidate for Aediles Curules
Provincia Legatus Canada Orientalis
Retarius Officium Canada Orientalis
Retarius Officium Gens Claudia
Canada Orientalis Provincia
Please visit my campaign website at:
http://www.virtue.nu/amclaudius/index.htm
Canada Orientalis Website:
www25.brinkster.com/canorien/
Gens Claudia Website:
www.freehost.nu/members/gensclaudia/
--
|
| Subject: |
[novaroma] Re: 2003 ISAS Conference in Phoenix, AZ |
| From: |
"J. T. Sibley" <jrsibley@--------> |
| Date: |
Sat, 01 Dec 2001 20:36:11 -0500 |
|
Hi, all!
This just came in from another list; might be of
interest. Sounds like a *very* interesting conference!
Spread the news???
jane
> -----------------------ISAS in Arizona
> 4-9 August 2003
>
>
> Conference Theme: "Conversion and Colonization"
> The theme, conceived as the examination of cultural
> contact and exchange, is intended to be broadly
> inclusive: possible areas of interest might include
> relations between Romans and Britons, Britons and
> Saxons, pagans and Christians, Irish and English,
> English and Frankish, Danish, or Norman. For the
> purposes of this conference the terms 'conversion'
> and 'colonization' may be taken as interrelated, each
> figuring a kind of cultural annexation; in any
> instance of cultural appropriation the dominant and
> subaltern cultures affect each one -- cases to
> consider include the borrowings of vocabulary and
> literary themes between English and Latin, the
> germanicization of the idea of Christ in certain Old
> English poetic texts, Bede's efforts to be 'Roman' in
> the far north of England, Alfred's attempts to define
> the nation against the fragmentation of the Danish
> presence in England, the gradual textualization of
> traditional poetry, or the impulse towards uniformity
> of practice and belief in the Benedictine reform.
> Our location in the American Southwest may
> additionally inspire reflection on the role of the
> 'desert' in medieval thought, at the boundary between
> culture and nature itself. As always, however,
> papers on any topic and in any discipline germane to
> Anglo-Saxon studies are welcome.
>
> Location: Chaparral Suites Resort (Scottsdale,
> Arizona)
> The ISAS rates for a two-room suite will be $79/night
> for single and double occupancy, $89/night for triple
> occupancy and $99/night for quadruple occupancy. For
> a virtual tour and information about the resort, log
> onto www.chaparralsuites.com .
>
> Events & Excursions
> While the majority of the conference will be held at
> the Chaparral Suites, there will be several
> opportunities to see other sights in Arizona. On
> Tuesday evening join us for a reception at the
> Arizona State University Art Museum, and you will
> have the opportunity to explore the campus and
> downtown Tempe before or after you dine at one of
> many local restaurants. If you would like to do some
> advance research, visit the ASU website at
> www.asu.edu. The Art Museum website is
> www.asuartmuseum.asu.edu/home.
> On Wednesday, you will have the chance to take an
> excursion to see some of the beautiful scenery and
> interesting sights Arizona has to offer. You may
> want to go to the Grand Canyon, or you might choose
> to visit Sedona (nestled in the red rocks of Oak
> Creek Canyon), Montezuma Castle (an Indian ruin cliff
> dwelling), and Jerome (a onetime mining community,
> later a ghost town, and now somewhat of an artist
> colony). If you would prefer to stay closer to
> Scottsdale, you may tour the Heard Museum and Phoenix
> Art Museum. For more information about these tours,
> visit www.openroadtours.com.
>
> On Friday night, get ready to "go west" for a banquet
> at Rawhide Western Town. Enjoy the excellent food
> and the Old West atmosphere, including gunfights.
> You can shop, ride the train, and even take a
> stagecoach! For a preview, log onto www.rawhide.com.
>
> Post Conference Grand Canyon River Trip
> After the conference, there are a variety of options
> for a river rafting trip through the Grand Canyon or
> a boat trip on Lake Powell. If you are interested,
> please fill out the enclosed questionnaire and return
> it to Laura Slavin by 30 January 2002.
>
> For More Information
> Watch the Arizona Center for Medieval and Renaissance
> Studies website for updates: www.asu.edu/clas/acmrs
> . -------------------------------------------------- Grand
> Canyon River Trip Questionnaire If you are interested
> in participating in a post-conference river trip,
> pleasecomplete and return this questionnaire to the
> address below by 30 January 2001.Please note that
> this form is merely to determine interest and does
> not constitute a reservation. More specific
> information will follow as it becomes available.
>
> Submit one form for each person.
>
> Name:Phone:
>
> Address:
>
> City/State/Region:
>
> Country:
>
> Email Address:
>
> Yes, I am interested in the Grand Canyon river
> trip(s) described below. (Check all that apply.) .
>
> 3-4 day upper canyon motor trip (requires a 9.5 mile
> hike UP out of the canyon). Cost: from about
> $800/person*. www.rivers-oceans.com
>
>
> 5-6 day lower canyon motor trip (requires a 9.5 mile
> hike down into the canyon). Cost: from about
> $1600/person*. www.rivers-oceans.com
>
>
> 3-4 day western canyon motor "introductory section"
> (no hike required). Cost: from about $900/person*,
> leaves from and returns to Las Vegas, Nevada.
> www.rivers-oceans.com
>
>
> 3-4 day western canyon oar trip "introductory
> section" (no hike required). Cost: from about
> $1500/person*, leaves from and returns to Las Vegas,
> NV. www.rivers-oceans.com
>
>
> 1 day western canyon motor trip (no hike required,
> includes whitewater rapids)
> Cost: from about $285/person*.
> www.arizonaguide.com/grandcanyonwest/runners
>
>
> Full-day float trip from Glen Canyon Dam to Lee's
> Ferry (includes lunch) Cost: about $80/person*,
> leaves from and returns to Page, Arizona.
> www.riveradventures.com/smooth
>
>
> Half-day float trip from Glen Canyon Dam to Lee's
> Ferry. Cost: about $60/person*.
> www.riveradventures.com/smooth
>
>
> All-day boat trip on Lake Powell to Rainbow Bridge.
> Cost: about $80/person*.
> www.visitlakepowell.com/lodging/tours
> Return form by 30 January to: Laura Slavin, Program
> Coordinator / Arizona Center for Medieval &
> Renaissance Studies / Arizona State University / PO
> Box 872301 / Tempe, AZ 85287-2301. Fax: (480)
> 965-1681. Email: Laura.Slavin@-------- .
> *Price does not include transportation from Phoenix
> to departure point. Options and prices will be
> determined based on the number of participants.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
|
| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] Languages |
| From: |
"Claudius Salix Davianus" <davius_sanctex@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 2 Dec 2001 02:25:07 +0100 |
|
Latin needs an especial consideration! We are not speaking about the other 5000 languages in the world.
Provisonally we intend to recognize al least two languages: Latin and English.
Claudius Salix Davianus
If our moderator cannot understand all the languages of the world how is
he/she supposed to do her job?
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
|
| Subject: |
[novaroma] Latin terms questions |
| From: |
Decimus Antoninius Aquitanius <romalist2@--------> |
| Date: |
Sat, 1 Dec 2001 20:40:57 -0500 (EST) |
|
Ave all!
I have seen the terms Omnes and Quirites used a lot
within Nova Roma, but I don't know what they mean
though I have an idea. My Latin is very minimal so
could anyone fill me in please?
Valete!
_______________________________________________________
Build your own website in minutes and for free at http://ca.geocities.com
|
| Subject: |
RE: [novaroma] Curator Sermonem : a political choice |
| From: |
"JusticeCMO" <justicecmo@--------> |
| Date: |
Sat, 1 Dec 2001 20:52:12 -0500 |
|
Salve,
>>Language Policy. My ooponent is the responsible for the infamous language
policy that was
imposed to this list this year.>>
Indeed I am.
>>This language policy created de facto two classes of citizens: - The ones
that are free to express their thoughts on this list as they come to them
(all natural anglophones) - The ones that must twist their thoughts into a
foreign language, obviously this hinders the free expression of their
thoughts.>>
Untrue. Any "class" distinction you see is entirely of your own making.
Every single List member, citizen or not, is free to send their thoughts in
the native tongue to any of our translators, who will do the English
translation for them. To date, not *one* member has taken advantage of
this. That is, of course, a personal choice, but to try and say that the
Language Policy itself creates classes is simply untrue. Do not forget the
*reason* for this List: communication.
>>It is true that they have also the possibility of writing them twice,
first in their natural language and the translating them to a foreign one,
which only forces them to a huge overhead of work.>>
They certainly may provide their own English translation, indeed several
citizens make it a habit to post in multiple languages. If, however, they
wish to avoid a "huge overhead of work", they are free to avail themselves
of the services of our translators. To date, not a *single* person has
chosen the latter.
>>This still is discriminatory.>>
You have an odd definition of the word discriminatory. Let us see, shall
we? Every language is welcome here. Nope, no "discrimination" there.
Posts in multiple languages are more than welcome here. Nope, still no
"discrimination". If a cive cannot or will not translate into English
themselves, translation is provided. Hmmm, still no "discrimination".
>>Vedia's list is twisting NR to a (mostly) Northern American (less Mexico)
NovaRoma.>>
Really? Twisting is it? :) Remind me to scold all of those British
citizens for their use of English without being North American citizens.
While I am at it, I must be sure to take *all* those who have the temerity
to speak, read and write English without living in North America to task.
Seriously, Limitanus, I see the "secret hidden agenda" you are so
desperately trying to attribute to me, but you are being absurd.
>>I want a Universal NovaRoma where all citizen whatever their natural
language is, are treated equally.>>
All languages are not only respected here, they are welcomed with open arms.
It doesn't get much more "universal" than that.
>>Latin will be the official language of the list and ALL vernacular
languages will be equally tolerated.>>
As I pointed out the other day, I wish more members capable of doing so
would use their Latin skills here on the List. That, along with the English
translation so that they may be understood, would be a wonderful thing to
see, while still maintaining the primary purpose of this List:
communication.
>>Romans you have to choose between a Universal NR and a NorthAmerican NR.>>
Contrary to your sadly transparent attempt to make this an "us versus them"
debate, the cives have to choose between a candidate who has a proven track
record of hard work and dedication versus a candidate who has so alienated
himself from citizens in some corners that they refuse to even read, let
alone respond, to his words.
>>Censorship: Right at the the beginning of her term Vedia did, illegally,
stop discussions on this list (first on Republic/Democracy, then on the
Language Policy). She was vetoed by a tribune in the second case.>>
I am rather unsurprised that you are not even aware of the *duties* of the
position you seek. The "discussion" on Republic, etc had degenerated into a
fight. It is the duty of the Curatrix to prevent "uncivil" behavior here.
I did so. As for my stopping the Language debate, I must correct you. A
veto was attempted, but came too late to be enforced. See post # 18790 in
the archives.
>>Several citizen have been subjected to previous censorship (called
"moderated"), clearly an anti-democratic practise for expressing thei
ideas.>>
Amazing. You consider it "censorship" when a duly elected magistrate does
her sworn duty? That alone speaks volumes about your very ability to
perform this job should you be elected.
>>At least one (me) has been effectively censored for a political reason:
asking for the removal of charge of the Curatrix and the Senior Consul.>>
Your facts are very much in error. You are, indeed, on moderated status.
You have been ever since you openly declared that you had no intention of
abiding by List rules. That makes it my duty to view each post before it
hits the public List to be certain that you have not chosen to post
something that is a danger to our Nation. I hereby publicly challenge you
to produce ANY post of yours that was in compliance with List rules that was
rejected by me. You cannot. It never happened. You are free to think that
you are moderated for "political" reasons, but it is sadly even more basic.
Your inability to discuss things in a reasonable fashion and your refusal to
comply with the Policies of a magistrate caused your situation. I will not
apologize for doing my job.
>>From some reactions on the list it seems that other peoples (btw my
opponents) have been treated the same way.>>
Since all disciplinary actions are confidential, I am certain you are
speaking out of your hat on this one. Have members been moderated? Yes
indeed. Have those moderations been necessary? Indeed they have been. Not
*one* has been made due to what a person thinks politically. Your attempt
to falsify the facts does not surprise me, but it does offend me. Having
different approaches to a position is one thing. To make up lies about your
opponent in the hopes of tricking cives into voting for you is simply
abhorrent.
<SNIP>
>>As indicated in my declaration of candidature, my positions on those
points are quite the opposite: Freedom of Speech for all on all subjects. If
a citizen attacks the private life of another citizen, the case will be
deffered to the praetors for a juridical sanction. If this sanction implies
an action on the list, the action will be taken.>>
In other words, if elected, you have no intention of doing the job.
Interesting. The Praetors have a definite role in Nova Roma, however it is
*not* to run the Main List for a moderator who cannot be bothered.
>>I will not be the legislative/juridicional/executive power on this list,
quite the opposite of what Vedia did this year.>>
Are you even aware of what the *job* of Curatrix Sermonis *is*? You have
just now openly stated <twice, in fact> that, if elected, you will allow
this List to degenerate into a free for all and that you have NO intention
of taking any personal responsibility for the duties of the job of Curator.
*This*, my fellow citizens, is exactly why I felt it was necessary to run
for this position myself. Regardless of whether you like all of my Policies
or decisions, one thing is without question: I do my job each and every day
and I take full responsibility for the duties assigned to me via the
Constitution.
>>Romans you are facing a choice: Freedom or Censorship.>>
No, you are facing the choice between a Curatrix who will continue to have
the best interest of Nova Roma and this List at heart, or a candidate who
openly declares that he will do *nothing* if elected.
>>Technical: This year, this list experienced several technical problems due
to the fusion of yahoo with egroups.>>
Indeed, Yahoo experienced troubles at various times. I, however, fail to
see your point since I do not work for Yahoo, nor am I in any position to
dictate the technical proficiency of their company. You also, might I add,
never mention what *you* believe you could or would do in such an event. I
would be most interested in your suggestions.
>>Many citizens didn t receive the mails from the list.>>
Perhaps you feel that I should have copied and forwarded every post to every
citizen? Quite impractical since I had no way of knowing which of our 400+
citizens were having troubles on any given day.
>>What did Vedia to resolve the problem: nothing known.>>
Indeed? I see you don't know much about the behind the scenes workings at
all then. Various other List hosts were looked into, posts were forwarded
by me to several citizens who contacted me and let me know they had a
problem and I personally walked over 15 members through the process of
unsubscribing and resubscribing to the List in order to re-set their Yahoo
membership and thus solve their problem. Now, was I able to march down to
Yahoo headquarters, rip open their computers and fix *their* problem?
Sadly, no.
>>A group of citizens, when faced with this problem tried to encounter a
solution and build up the indenpendance of NovaRoma. Vedia dissalowed them
publicly.>>
Yet another lie. Several members approached me with suggestions for other
List hosts and all were thoroughly researched and evaluated for their
strengths and weaknesses. I never, at ANY time, "dissallowed" any
individual or group from looking into other groups unofficially for
themselves. I would suggest you research your facts before trying to use
them to attack me, you simply end up looking foolish. Check posts # 21897
and # 21903 in the archives, they should help inform you about what actually
was said.
>>If elect, I will encourage the independance of NR and revive this group of
citizens.>>
The only "group" of citizens a Curator should concern themselves with are
the members of this List. *That* is the job you are seeking. That you say
this is not your intended audience, in conjunction with your earlier
statement that, if elected, you have no intention of *doing* the job speaks
more against the wisdom of your achieving victory than anything I ever
could.
>>We NEED an independant vehicle. When something goes wrong with OUR
vehicle, you will know who is responsible: I.>>
With your proposal of doing *nothing* to guide, guard and moderate this List
it is clear that *everything* would go wrong should you be elected. In
plain words, you have made it clear that if you are elected this List will
be an untended Forum with no Curator doing their Constitutional duty.
>>Romans you have a choice: Independance or submission to the aleas of a
foreign vehicle of speech.>>
The citizens do indeed have a choice to make, but not the one you state
above. Each citizen must ask themselves whether they wish to see this List
continue to be a Forum for smooth communication or to allow it to languish
under the custody of an "absentee landlord" unwilling to do the work he has
been elected to do.
I have every confidence that the voters will choose wisely in the coming
election.
Vale,
Priscilla Vedia Serena
> Salvete,
>
> Manius Villius Limitanus
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
|
| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] Endorsement |
| From: |
"Marcus Minicius Rufus" <xperiko@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 2 Dec 2001 02:59:15 +0100 |
|
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Gaius Quirinus Caesar" <gaius_quirinus_caesar@-------->
>To: "Europa Mail List" <novaroma_europe@-------->; "Nova Roma Mail
List" ><novaroma@-------->
>Sent: Saturday, December 01, 2001 8:14 PM
>ZSubject: [novaroma] Endorsement
>Salvete omnes,
>we're in the campaign period than this is my
>endorsements for these offices:
>Tribunus Plebis:
>Gn Salix Astur
>he's one of the best cives i know: i think he can be
>one of the best Tribuni we have evere seen before!
I must admit I don't know much about the other candidates, but as far as I
know I deeply encourage you to vote Gn Salix Astur. He is one of the master
pieces of Hispania's strength and his availability makes him the right
choice. Let me explain all this feelng in just one sentence: He believes in
Rome and Romans and he will support this feeling by heart.
Valete!!!
Marcus Minicius Rufus
>Quaestor, Curator Araneum:
>Fr Apulus Caesar
>he is my compatriot than i had a lot of time to know
>him and to understand that he is a really good person:
>since we start to rebuilt our Provincia he had ever
>done an exellent work and i think he could give a good
>service to our Res Publica
>Valete,
>Gaius Quirinus Caesar
______________________________________________________________________
Iscriviti al Meglio della Settimana, la newsletter di Yahoo!
Per saperne di più vai alla pagina: http://buongiorno.yahoo.it
|
| Subject: |
Fw: [novaroma] Endorsement |
| From: |
"Marcus Minicius Rufus" <xperiko@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 2 Dec 2001 03:01:50 +0100 |
|
----- Original Message -----
From: "Marcus Minicius Rufus" <xperiko@-------->
To: <novaroma@-------->; "Europa Mail List"
<novaroma_europe@-------->
Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2001 2:59 AM
Subject: Re: [novaroma] Endorsement
>
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: "Gaius Quirinus Caesar" <gaius_quirinus_caesar@-------->
> >To: "Europa Mail List" <novaroma_europe@-------->; "Nova Roma Mail
> List" ><novaroma@-------->
> >Sent: Saturday, December 01, 2001 8:14 PM
> >ZSubject: [novaroma] Endorsement
>
>
> >Salvete omnes,
> >we're in the campaign period than this is my
> >endorsements for these offices:
>
> >Tribunus Plebis:
> >Gn Salix Astur
> >he's one of the best cives i know: i think he can be
> >one of the best Tribuni we have evere seen before!
>
I must admit I don't know much about the other candidates, but as far as I
know I deeply encourage you to vote Gn Salix Astur. He is one of the master
pieces of Hispania's strength and his availability makes him the right
choice. Let me explain all this feelng in just one sentence: He believes in
Rome and Romans and he will support this feeling by heart.
Valete!!!
Marcus Minicius Rufus
>
> >Quaestor, Curator Araneum:
> >Fr Apulus Caesar
> >he is my compatriot than i had a lot of time to know
> >him and to understand that he is a really good person:
> >since we start to rebuilt our Provincia he had ever
> >done an exellent work and i think he could give a good
> >service to our Res Publica
>
> >Valete,
> >Gaius Quirinus Caesar
>
> ______________________________________________________________________
>
> Iscriviti al Meglio della Settimana, la newsletter di Yahoo!
> Per saperne di più vai alla pagina: http://buongiorno.yahoo.it
>
> Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> ADVERTISEMENT
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
>
>
>
_________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
|
| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] Latin terms questions |
| From: |
"Uriel" <uriel@--------> |
| Date: |
Sat, 1 Dec 2001 20:03:47 -0600 |
|
Quirites means 'citizens' if I'm not mistaken, and Omnes means All (of you)
again, if I'm not mistaken.
Decia Cornelia Sepulchatia
Uriel Storm
http://www.geocities.com/sstorm1us/index.html
----- Original Message -----
From: "Decimus Antoninius Aquitanius" <romalist2@-------->
To: <novaroma@-------->
Sent: Saturday, December 01, 2001 7:40 PM
Subject: [novaroma] Latin terms questions
>
> Ave all!
> I have seen the terms Omnes and Quirites used a lot
> within Nova Roma, but I don't know what they mean
> though I have an idea. My Latin is very minimal so
> could anyone fill me in please?
>
> Valete!
>
> _______________________________________________________
> Build your own website in minutes and for free at http://ca.geocities.com
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
|
| Subject: |
RE: [novaroma] Latin terms questions |
| From: |
"Flavius Vedius Germanicus" <germanicus@--------> |
| Date: |
Sat, 1 Dec 2001 21:19:52 -0500 |
|
And for those who wonder why we don't allow Latin-only posts on this list...
Omnes is Latin for "everyone", and "Quirites" is another term for "Romans".
Sorry to use you as an example, Decimus Antoninius, but there has been some
talk lately of allowing folks to post in Latin without English translations.
Considering that you found a few random words confusing, imagine what would
have happened if you were confronted with whole posts in Latin!
Quirites, the purpose of this list is to foster communication between as
many of our Citizens as is possible and practical. Allowing posts in Latin,
while admirable and noble, does not further that goal.
FVG
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Decimus Antoninius Aquitanius [mailto:romalist2@--------]
> Sent: Saturday, December 01, 2001 8:41 PM
> To: novaroma@--------
> Subject: [novaroma] Latin terms questions
>
>
>
> Ave all!
> I have seen the terms Omnes and Quirites used a lot
> within Nova Roma, but I don't know what they mean
> though I have an idea. My Latin is very minimal so
> could anyone fill me in please?
>
> Valete!
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
|
| Subject: |
[novaroma] Re: Languages |
| From: |
kinneret_sp@-------- |
| Date: |
Sun, 02 Dec 2001 02:18:59 -0000 |
|
Salve Amulius Claudius Petrus
I see, you don't see like a important problem in Nova Roma that some
of the citizens cannot express their opinions in the mail list, and
that some of them cannot read the web, or to know the matters that
they have to vote, becouse perhaps for you is more important the
censorship in this main list.
Of course for you it is not worth yo can speak English, but for the
citizens of Novaroma that cannot do it, yes it is a problem and they
want a solution.
I know that the censors cannot be able to understand all the
languages in the world, but then why all the people in the world have
to be able that speak English???
And the majority may can be able to understand the problem of these
citizens and help them to that all the people can express theirs
opinions here and the freedom be equal for all the citizens in Nova
Roma although they dont be in majorities.
I hope that you can understand me becouse my English is not good
becouse is not my language, I can only speak a little it so
frequently I cannot undestand some messages here, and now is very
difficult to me to write these simple lines although with them I
cannot express all that I´d like to tell.
Vale
Durmia Cintia Domna
--- In novaroma@--------, Amulius Claudius Petrus <pkkt@b...> wrote:
>
> Salvete cives et amici,
>
> I am all for freedom of speech, equality, and so on. Although I
question the
> ability of this list to be fully moderated if other languages are
spoken
> here. I don't look at it as a freedom of speech issue either. It
comes down
> to the language the majority of our citizens are able to
communicate in,
> English.
>
> If our moderator cannot understand all the languages of the world
how is
> he/she supposed to do her job? Even if we could get a group of
translators
> to rewrite messages into English it would open up a huge flood of
languages.
> I believe this would be a big pain.
>
> The only way I can see this working is if our moderators are
language
> geniuses, or purchase a computer program to roughly translate
messages into
> other languages they could understand. Again, is it worth the
hassle?
>
> Valete,
>
> "Quamquam cupido sit delictum ab suis crebro est mater virtutum"
> "Though ambition may be a fault in itself it is often the mother of
virtues"
>
> --
> Amulius Claudius Petrus
> Candidate for Aediles Curules
> Provincia Legatus Canada Orientalis
> Retarius Officium Canada Orientalis
> Retarius Officium Gens Claudia
> Canada Orientalis Provincia
>
> Please visit my campaign website at:
> http://www.virtue.nu/amclaudius/index.htm
>
> Canada Orientalis Website:
> www25.brinkster.com/canorien/
>
> Gens Claudia Website:
> www.freehost.nu/members/gensclaudia/
> --
|
| Subject: |
RE: [novaroma] Re: Languages |
| From: |
"Flavius Vedius Germanicus" <germanicus@--------> |
| Date: |
Sat, 1 Dec 2001 21:42:14 -0500 |
|
Salve;
> -----Original Message-----
> From: kinneret_sp@-------- [mailto:kinneret_sp@--------]
> Sent: Saturday, December 01, 2001 9:19 PM
>
> Of course for you it is not worth yo can speak English, but for the
> citizens of Novaroma that cannot do it, yes it is a problem and they
> want a solution.
Actually, at the risk of speaking on behalf of our Curatrix Sermo, they
already have a solution. There stand ready, even as I type this, several
cives who have voluntered to translate posts into (and from) English. No
effort is required on the part of non-English-speakers other than forwarding
their posts to a third party. To date, I understand no one has availed
themselves of this service.
The solution exists. It seems that certain people are trying to make a
problem where none exists...
Vale,
Flavius Vedius Germanicus,
Consul
|
| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] Re: Languages |
| From: |
Amulius Claudius Petrus <pkkt@--------> |
| Date: |
Sat, 01 Dec 2001 22:00:13 -0500 |
|
Salve Honourable Durmia Cintia Domna,
> I see, you don't see like a important problem in Nova Roma that some
> of the citizens cannot express their opinions in the mail list, and
> that some of them cannot read the web, or to know the matters that
> they have to vote, becouse perhaps for you is more important the
> censorship in this main list.
I am saddened to see that you think that I don't believe in letting citizens
of this res publica voice their opinions. I do believe in letting all
citizens voice their opinions, although I also believe in retaining control
of the main list.
Manius Villius Limitanus believes in letting any language to be posted on
the main list without translation. I do not agree with this proposal.
Durmia, what good would this do you? The majority could not read these
posts, and moderation would be made impossible. I think that an official
team of translators should be established for any language can be spoken and
translated into English for the majority to read. Unfortunately, I am not
running for this position in our elections. Therefore my proposal will most
likely not become a reality.
>
> Of course for you it is not worth yo can speak English, but for the
> citizens of Novaroma that cannot do it, yes it is a problem and they
> want a solution.
> I know that the censors cannot be able to understand all the
> languages in the world, but then why all the people in the world have
> to be able that speak English???
>
> And the majority may can be able to understand the problem of these
> citizens and help them to that all the people can express theirs
> opinions here and the freedom be equal for all the citizens in Nova
> Roma although they dont be in majorities.
I hope from reading my response from above that you see this is untrue. I
support all of our citizens that don't speak English. I just believe both
candidates, Manius Villius Limitanus and Priscilla Vedia Serena are
incorrect in solving this problem. We need you to be able to post messages
in your own language, and also be able to read these messages.
> I hope that you can understand me becouse my English is not good
> becouse is not my language, I can only speak a little it so
> frequently I cannot undestand some messages here, and now is very
> difficult to me to write these simple lines although with them I
> cannot express all that I´d like to tell.
I understand you perfectly. I hope you can now see that I am on your side.
Vale,
"Quamquam cupido sit delictum ab suis crebro est mater virtutum"
"Though ambition may be a fault in itself it is often the mother of virtues"
--
Amulius Claudius Petrus
Candidate for Aediles Curules
Provincia Legatus Canada Orientalis
Retarius Officium Canada Orientalis
Retarius Officium Gens Claudia
Canada Orientalis Provincia
Please visit my campaign website at:
http://www.virtue.nu/amclaudius/index.htm
Canada Orientalis Website:
www25.brinkster.com/canorien/
Gens Claudia Website:
www.freehost.nu/members/gensclaudia/
--
|
| Subject: |
[novaroma] Re: The Comitia Centuriata is called to order |
| From: |
trog99@-------- |
| Date: |
Sun, 02 Dec 2001 03:20:43 -0000 |
|
--- In novaroma@--------, "Claudia Putea Pulchra" <puteus@h...> wrote:
> Ave omnes!
>
> I just wanted to say that I hope both laws will meet with the wishes
of the majority of the populus. I think - as already ventilated in
earlier posts - that bringing the tribunate back to its historical
roots will be a good thing for Nova Roma. Secondly, as long as these
impuberes do not have the right to vote under 18, I would certainly
not be the one to privy them of the rights of Roman citizenship.
Salvete Claudia et Omnes:
I am pleased with the above propositions, and I truly hope they pass.
The proposed five Tribunes promises a more generous and just
representation for the plebian class of Nova Roma. This will, I
believe, be of positive byproduct for all citizens of Nova Roma.
The citizenship proposal allows for expansion of Nova Roma without the
concomitant litigous risks of allowing minors into Nova Roma without
parental/guardian consent.
I am also happy with the gens lex for now.
I urge you to support these lexes, quirites.
Bene valete,
Pompeia Cornelia Strabo
Propraetrix Canada Orientalis
Candidate Praetor Urbanus
Nova Roma
>
> Vale optime in pace deorum!
>
> Caius Puteus Germanicus
> Civis Provinciae Novae Romae Galliae / Germaniae Inferioris
> Rogator MMDXXIV AUC
> Praefectus Sodalitatis Egressi Germaniae Inferioris Europaeque
Occidentalis
> http://www.geocities.com/germania_inferior/
> http://www.geocities.com/caius_puteus_germanicus/
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
|
| Subject: |
[novaroma] Re: withdrawal of candidature |
| From: |
trog99@-------- |
| Date: |
Sun, 02 Dec 2001 03:26:03 -0000 |
|
---Salve Claudia:
I am sorry this isn't going to work out for you this year, amica. One
day it will. Whatever you do............do not 'wish' to be older :)
This will happen quicker than you think (trust me!)
This citizen thanks you for your willingness to serve the respublica,
Claudia.
Bene vale,
Pompeia Cornelia
In novaroma@--------, "Claudia Putea Pulchra" <puteus@h...> wrote:
> Claudia Putea Pulchra omnibus salutem!
>
> Just a short message: I seem to generate a lot of support for my
candidacy for the office of quaestor. However, I got a message from M.
Octavius, in which he explains that I can't stand for this office,
since I'm not over 21...
>
> Via this mail I want to thank everybody for supporting me & I hope
that next year, when I will finally be over 21, this support will
still be there! I remain at the disposition of the people, senate and
magistracy of Nova Roma to help them where I can with the elaboration
of plans for our Republic!
>
> Valete!
>
> Claudia Putea Pulchra
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
|
| Subject: |
[novaroma] Re: New Provincial Website |
| From: |
trog99@-------- |
| Date: |
Sun, 02 Dec 2001 03:39:00 -0000 |
|
---Salvete Legatus Amulius Claudius et Omnes:
Thank you so much for taking the time (and I'm sure it was a
tooth-pulling, time-consuming pain) to move our provincial website to
a new home, at such a point in your life where you are also trying to
run an election campaign.
You are totally awesome! I wish I could buy you a nice villa in
Capri :) Claudius does a great job.
Our provincia, well "all" of NR is very lucky to have you, Claudius.
Buona Fortuna during the forthcoming elections.
Bene vale,
Pompeia Cornelia Strabo
Propraetrix Canada Orientalis
Nova Roma
In novaroma@--------, Amulius Claudius Petrus <pkkt@b...> wrote:
>
> Salvete cives et amici,
>
> The old host for the Canada Orientalis provincial website has gone
under.
> They have informed me that they will give us a chance to transfer
our files
> to a different server. Although no updates can be made to these
files until
> they are moved off of their server. Because of this I have moved our
> provincial website to a different company called Brinkster.
>
> I am really sorry for any inconvenience this may of caused. It was a
pain to
> have to transfer all the files over and so on. I hope we have better
luck
> with the new host I have selected.
>
> The new address for the provincial website is:
>
> http://www25.brinkster.com/canorien/
>
> If you bookmarked the old site please remember to update your
bookmarks to
> the new URL.
>
>
> "Quamquam cupido sit delictum ab suis crebro est mater virtutum"
> "Though ambition may be a fault in itself it is often the mother of
virtues"
>
> --
> Amulius Claudius Petrus
> Candidate for Aediles Curules
> Provincia Legatus Canada Orientalis
> Retarius Officium Canada Orientalis
> Retarius Officium Gens Claudia
> Canada Orientalis Provincia
>
> Please visit my campaign website at
> http://www.virtue.nu/amclaudius/index.htm
>
> Canada Orientalis Website:
> www25.brinkster.com/canorien/
>
> Gens Claudia Website:
> www.freehost.nu/members/gensclaudia/
> --
|
| Subject: |
[novaroma] The Comitia Populi Tributa is called to order |
| From: |
"Flavius Vedius Germanicus" <germanicus@--------> |
| Date: |
Sat, 1 Dec 2001 22:57:49 -0500 |
|
Flavius Vedius Germanicus novaromanis S.P.D.
Under the authority vested in me by the Constitution of Nova Roma, with the
auspices having been sought and found to be favorable, I hereby call the
Comitia Centuriata to order.
The timing of the vote shall be as follows (all times are official Nova Roma
time; subtract 1 hour for GMT, 6 hours for Eastern Time):
* Contio (discussion): 6 PM December 2nd through 6 PM December 8th
* Voting: 6 PM December 8th through 6 PM December 16th
The following individuals stand for the offices indicated:
Aediles Curules (2 vacancies):
Caeso Fabius Quintilianus
Amulius Claudius Petrus
Quaestor (8 vacancies):
Decius Cornelius Sepulchatius
Marcus Minucius Audens
Gaius Minucius Hadrianus
Titus Octavius Pius
Gaius Popillius Laenas
Gaius Quirinus Italicus Caesar
Franciscus Apulus Caesar
Quintus Fabius Maximus
Curator Araneum:
Marcus Octavius Germanicus
Franciscus Apulus Caesar
Curator Differium (1 vacancy):
Marcus Scipiadus Scipio Africanus
Curator Sermo (1 vacancy):
Manius Villius Limitanus
Priscilla Vedia Serena
Rogator (8 vacancies):
Marcus Scipiadus Scipio Africanus
Petrus Domitianus Artorinus Longinus
Julilla Sempronia Magna
Marcus Bianchius Antonius
Titus Horatius Atticus
In addition, the following leges are hereby presented for consideration by
the Comitia:
-----
I. Lex Vedia de Quaestores
This Lex Vedia de Quaestores is hereby enacted in order to require the
bonding of those magistrates empowered to handle the funds of Nova Roma.
I. All quaestores must be legally bonded to handle funds. Should an elected
quaestor be denied bonding for any reason, he or she shall be considered to
not hold the position, and an election for a suitable replacement shall
proceed according to those procedures established by law.
II. The Senate shall authorize the reasonable expenditure of funds from the
central treasury to cover the administrative and other costs of bonding
elected Quaestores.
III. The Consules or their legally delegated subordinates shall handle the
administrative and other details related to obtaining such bonding, in
conjunction with and with the cooperation of the various elected Quaestores.
-----
II. Lex Vedia de Oratio
This Lex Vedia de Oratio is hereby enacted in order to define the policy for
language use on those official fora for communications administered by the
Curator Sermo.
I. Whereas, the essential purpose of the email list(s) administered by the
Curator Sermo is to foster communication, dialog, and understanding among
the Cives of Nova Roma, and,
II. Whereas, English is at the present time that language which is best
understood by the majority of Nova Roman citizens, either as a first or
second language;
III. Is it hereby mandated that all posts to those electronic mail lists and
other communications fora adminstrated by the Curator Sermo may be made in
any language the poster may find convenient and/or appropriate, but must
also be accompanied and/or followed by a suitable and accurate translation
into English.
IV. The Curator Sermo shall arrange, as available and practical, to make
available voluntary translators to assist those cives who might not have the
knowledge and/or resources to make their own translations.
V. Failure of the Curator Sermo to enforce this measure shall be considered
grounds for removal from office.
-----
III. Lex Vedia de Magistratum Aetate
The Lex Iunia de Magistratum is hereby amended as follows, establishing the
following procedures for the purpose underaged candidates to petition an
exemption to run for office.
VI.A. Citizens who wish to run for office must present the Consuls with
their petition for exemption to the age restriction.
VI.A.1. In the case of the annual December magisterial elections, such
petitions must be presented to the Consuls no later than the 31st of
October.
VI.A.2. In the case of mid-year elections, such petitions must be presented
to the Consuls as soon as possible, but the presentation of such petitions
shall not be regarded as sufficient reason to postpone replacement elections
more than thirty days as required by the Constitution, and the right of
underage cives to run for office shall not override the Constitutional
requirement to fill vacant magistracies in a timely manner.
VI.B. The petition will include the following information:
A. Full Roman name
B. Length of Citizenship
C. Prior experience within Nova Roma
D. The office for which they intend to run
VI.C. The Consuls shall present the petition to the Senate for a vote in
such manner as to allow due consideration of the petition.
-----
Valete,
Flavius Vedius Germanicus,
Consul
|
| Subject: |
RE: [novaroma] Re: Languages |
| From: |
Michel Loos <loos@--------> |
| Date: |
02 Dec 2001 01:00:48 -0200 |
|
On Sun, 2001-12-02 at 00:42, Flavius Vedius Germanicus wrote:
> Salve;
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: kinneret_sp@-------- [mailto:kinneret_sp@--------]
> > Sent: Saturday, December 01, 2001 9:19 PM
> >
> > Of course for you it is not worth yo can speak English, but for the
> > citizens of Novaroma that cannot do it, yes it is a problem and they
> > want a solution.
>
> Actually, at the risk of speaking on behalf of our Curatrix Sermo, they
> already have a solution. There stand ready, even as I type this, several
> cives who have voluntered to translate posts into (and from) English. No
> effort is required on the part of non-English-speakers other than forwarding
> their posts to a third party. To date, I understand no one has availed
> themselves of this service.
>
> The solution exists. It seems that certain people are trying to make a
> problem where none exists...
The simple fact that no one used this service shows how inhibitory it is
to non english fluent people.
If you really think this not a concern, why are you afraid to give
the translation a posteriori instead of insisting on the need of a a
priori translation?
Manius Villius Limitanus
|
| Subject: |
RE: [novaroma] Candidates for the office of Censor |
| From: |
"JusticeCMO" <justicecmo@--------> |
| Date: |
Sat, 1 Dec 2001 23:15:34 -0500 |
|
Salve,
>>I see that the endorsement Diana was trying to make is based on a wrong
choice of words.>>
I sincerely hope so. I have quite a bit of respect for my opponent and the
work he does for Nova Roma as a Propaetor and a Senator. I do not, however,
want to see this election <for any office> lower itself to such things as
where one lives. We are, frankly, both good candidates and I think we each
offer unique benefits to the office of Censor. In truth, I feel that the
citizens are in a win-win situation with the position of Censor, as I know
we both have the Nation's best interest at heart and a strong work ethic to
bring to the office.
>>I quite recently became a civis and have been active from day one, on a
daily basis too. I have to admit I saw some interventions of Priscilla on
the main list and I am sure there are others that received individual mails
as procedure proscribes to the Curatrix. In that, I respect the work she has
accomplished.>>
My thanks for your kind words. It is always nice to hear that one has done
well. :)
>>Being a European myself, I have no problem working with people from the
'New World', I have established friendship relations with some of them, and
I chat with people from Australia to Argentinia. To us - Nova Romans - the
world is our home. This point of view is actually quite accurate for a
Roman: the stoics shared our universalism based on philosophical terms
too.>>
I agree with you 100%.
>>Just to mention Dio being European, is quite inadequate to support him.>>
That was my main objection to the other post. It appeared that his European
status was the basis for which she asked citizens to vote for him over me.
He has many fine qualities, but simply being European is not one of them.
>>However, there are other possibilities to endorse his candidacy.>>
Agreed. In fact, I would like to see he and I both post our thoughts and
ideas on the specifics of the job and what we would like to accomplish.
That will also give voters a way to make their choice based on our plans.
We both have excellent track records as workers and friends, what will
likely matter most to the voters is what we plan to do.
>>I have not yet had the pleasure to look at the daily work of either Dio or
Priscilla, nor could I witness their activities as senatores.>>
Just a quick correction here. I am flattered by the idea, but I am not a
Senator.
<SNIP>
> I hope that Priscilla will calm down a bit, before reacting to me as she
did to Diana. I think that, if attacked, please don't react immediately,
think about it and save the mail in your drafts before sending it is - in
one way or another - a very good advise she gave all of us at the main list
and the codebook she wrote for the use of it.>>
I am as calm now as I was when replying to Diana. That is to say, perfectly
in possession of my intellect and not working from any emotional core. She
made some fairly strong insinuations and I confronted them head-on. That
does not, de facto, mean I was upset when I replied to her. I believe in
meeting challenges in a straight forward way. Perhaps not the most
"lady-like" response, but it is the most honest one. I will also note, for
the record, that I did not fire off a "first draft" to Diana, I always
draft, revise, and then send.
Vale,
Priscilla Vedia Serena
> Caius Puteus Germanicus
>
|
| Subject: |
[novaroma] Re: Languages |
| From: |
kinneret_sp@-------- |
| Date: |
Sun, 02 Dec 2001 02:34:03 -0000 |
|
Salve Amulius Claudius Petrus
I see, you don't consider like an important problem in Nova Roma that
some of the citizens cannot express their opinions in the mail list,
and that some of them cannot read the web, or to be able to
understand the matters that they have to vote, becouse perhaps for
you is more important the censorship in this main list.
Of course for you it is not worth yo can speak English, but for the
citizens of Novaroma that cannot do it, yes is a problem and they
want a solution.
I know that the censors cannot be able to understand all the
languages in the world, but then why all the people in the world have
to be able that speak English??? And would not be more natural to
learn Latin in Nova Roma that have to learn English to express us?
And the majority may can be able to understand the problem of these
citizens and help them, to that all the people can express theirs
opinions here and the freedom be equal for all the citizens in Nova
Roma although they dont be in majorities.
I hope that you can understand me becouse my English is not good
becouse is not my language, I can only speak a little one so
frequently I cannot undestand some messages here, and now is very
difficult to me to write these simple lines although with them I
cannot express all that I´d like to tell.
Vale
Durmia Cintia Domna
--- In novaroma@--------, Amulius Claudius Petrus <pkkt@b...> wrote:
>
> Salvete cives et amici,
>
> I am all for freedom of speech, equality, and so on. Although I
question the
> ability of this list to be fully moderated if other languages are
spoken
> here. I don't look at it as a freedom of speech issue either. It
comes down
> to the language the majority of our citizens are able to
communicate in,
> English.
>
> If our moderator cannot understand all the languages of the world
how is
> he/she supposed to do her job? Even if we could get a group of
translators
> to rewrite messages into English it would open up a huge flood of
languages.
> I believe this would be a big pain.
>
> The only way I can see this working is if our moderators are
language
> geniuses, or purchase a computer program to roughly translate
messages into
> other languages they could understand. Again, is it worth the
hassle?
>
> Valete,
>
> "Quamquam cupido sit delictum ab suis crebro est mater virtutum"
> "Though ambition may be a fault in itself it is often the mother of
virtues"
>
> --
> Amulius Claudius Petrus
> Candidate for Aediles Curules
> Provincia Legatus Canada Orientalis
> Retarius Officium Canada Orientalis
> Retarius Officium Gens Claudia
> Canada Orientalis Provincia
>
> Please visit my campaign website at:
> http://www.virtue.nu/amclaudius/index.htm
>
> Canada Orientalis Website:
> www25.brinkster.com/canorien/
>
> Gens Claudia Website:
> www.freehost.nu/members/gensclaudia/
> --
|
| Subject: |
[novaroma] Re: Languages |
| From: |
kinneret_sp@-------- |
| Date: |
Sun, 02 Dec 2001 03:06:35 -0000 |
|
Salve
I'm glad to hear it, I think that it can be a good solution.
But, excuse me Consul, the problem exist now, the solution is there,
so you know that there was a problem and it need a solution, then
nobody make a problem where none exist....
If there is a solution, the solution is for a problem, I think...
Perhaps, "certain people" saw a real problem...
Vale
Durmia Cintia Domna
--- In novaroma@--------, "Flavius Vedius Germanicus" <germanicus@n...>
wrote:
> Salve;
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: kinneret_sp@-------- [mailto:kinneret_sp@--------]
> > Sent: Saturday, December 01, 2001 9:19 PM
> >
> > Of course for you it is not worth yo can speak English, but for
the
> > citizens of Novaroma that cannot do it, yes it is a problem and
they
> > want a solution.
>
> Actually, at the risk of speaking on behalf of our Curatrix Sermo,
they
> already have a solution. There stand ready, even as I type this,
several
> cives who have voluntered to translate posts into (and from)
English. No
> effort is required on the part of non-English-speakers other than
forwarding
> their posts to a third party. To date, I understand no one has
availed
> themselves of this service.
>
> The solution exists. It seems that certain people are trying to
make a
> problem where none exists...
>
> Vale,
>
> Flavius Vedius Germanicus,
> Consul
|
| Subject: |
[novaroma] Re: Languages |
| From: |
Amulius Claudius Petrus <pkkt@--------> |
| Date: |
Sat, 01 Dec 2001 23:33:10 -0500 |
|
Salve Honourable Durmia Cintia Domna,
> I see, you don't see like a important problem in Nova Roma that some
> of the citizens cannot express their opinions in the mail list, and
> that some of them cannot read the web, or to know the matters that
> they have to vote, becouse perhaps for you is more important the
> censorship in this main list.
I am saddened to see that you think that I don't believe in letting citizens
of this res publica voice their opinions. I do believe in letting all
citizens voice their opinions, although I also believe in retaining control
of the main list.
Manius Villius Limitanus believes in letting any language to be posted on
the main list without translation. I do not agree with this proposal.
Durmia, what good would this do you? The majority could not read these
posts, and moderation would be made impossible. I think that an official
team of translators should be established for any language can be spoken and
translated into English for the majority to read. Unfortunately, I am not
running for this position in our elections. Therefore my proposal will most
likely not become a reality.
>
> Of course for you it is not worth yo can speak English, but for the
> citizens of Novaroma that cannot do it, yes it is a problem and they
> want a solution.
> I know that the censors cannot be able to understand all the
> languages in the world, but then why all the people in the world have
> to be able that speak English???
>
> And the majority may can be able to understand the problem of these
> citizens and help them to that all the people can express theirs
> opinions here and the freedom be equal for all the citizens in Nova
> Roma although they dont be in majorities.
I hope from reading my response from above that you see this is untrue. I
support all of our citizens that don't speak English. I understand your need
to be able to post messages in your own language. I hope you understand our
need to be able to read these messages.
> I hope that you can understand me becouse my English is not good
> becouse is not my language, I can only speak a little it so
> frequently I cannot undestand some messages here, and now is very
> difficult to me to write these simple lines although with them I
> cannot express all that I´d like to tell.
I understand you perfectly. I hope you can now see that I am on your side.
Vale,
"Quamquam cupido sit delictum ab suis crebro est mater virtutum"
"Though ambition may be a fault in itself it is often the mother of virtues"
--
Amulius Claudius Petrus
Candidate for Aediles Curules
Provincia Legatus Canada Orientalis
Retarius Officium Canada Orientalis
Retarius Officium Gens Claudia
Canada Orientalis Provincia
Please visit my campaign website at:
http://www.virtue.nu/amclaudius/index.htm
Canada Orientalis Website:
www25.brinkster.com/canorien/
Gens Claudia Website:
www.freehost.nu/members/gensclaudia/
--
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
|
| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] Re: Languages |
| From: |
Amulius Claudius Petrus <pkkt@--------> |
| Date: |
Sat, 01 Dec 2001 23:49:51 -0500 |
|
Salve,
It¹s wonderful to see this solution being put into action. This will benefit
us all by being able to hear new opinions from citizen that have had
difficulty posting because of the language requirements. Out of curiosity,
will these translators start this service right away?
Vale,
"Quamquam cupido sit delictum ab suis crebro est mater virtutum"
"Though ambition may be a fault in itself it is often the mother of virtues"
--
Amulius Claudius Petrus
Candidate for Aediles Curules
Provincia Legatus Canada Orientalis
Retarius Officium Canada Orientalis
Retarius Officium Gens Claudia
Canada Orientalis Provincia
Please visit my campaign website at:
http://www.virtue.nu/amclaudius/index.htm
Canada Orientalis Website:
www25.brinkster.com/canorien/
Gens Claudia Website:
www.freehost.nu/members/gensclaudia/
--
>Flavius Vedius Germanicus at germanicus@-------- wrote:
>
> Actually, at the risk of speaking on behalf of our Curatrix Sermo, they
> already have a solution. There stand ready, even as I type this, several
> cives who have voluntered to translate posts into (and from) English. No
> effort is required on the part of non-English-speakers other than forwarding
> their posts to a third party. To date, I understand no one has availed
> themselves of this service.
>
> The solution exists. It seems that certain people are trying to make a
> problem where none exists...
>
> Vale,
>
> Flavius Vedius Germanicus,
> Consul
|
| Subject: |
RE: [novaroma] Re: Candidates for the office of Censor |
| From: |
"JusticeCMO" <justicecmo@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 2 Dec 2001 00:05:26 -0500 |
|
Salve,
>>I was sure my comments would elicit a reply from you, although I did not
necessariliy expect it turn into such an issue.>>
With respect, I merely addressed the issue you brought forth. No more, no
less.
>>I was merely stating that in order to highlight this particular aspect to
the voters - not, as you imply, to show that I thought Nova Roma was to be
seen as NR America/NR Europe (/NR Asia, etc.) - that is, seperate
entities.>>
I understand that you wished to bring out the issue that my opponent resides
in Europe and I reside in America. You went on to state that we are both
excellent candidates and yet the *reason* you implored Europeans to vote for
him over me is his location of residence. *That* is what I object to.
>>I never said anything to contradict that, and it is also my view.>>
When you stated that my opponent would best serve "(us) Europeans" that
seemed pretty straightforward in putting out the notion that he would better
serve the needs of European citizens than I, an American, would. I trust
you see how I saw an attempt at a Europe vs. America slant there. I am,
however, heartened to hear that you share my view that we are all one
people.......Nova Romans........regardless of where we happen to reside in
the macronational world.
>>Yet, as in ancient Rome - this one nation is made up of people from many
different cultural and geographical backgrounds that all, to an extent,
demand their due. However hard we may try - there will always be differences
between American/English/Protuguese/French (to name but a few) Nova Romans
and the individual way in which they view one and the same issue. There is
nothing wrong with this, it is natural and to be expected. Only if we do not
accept this will we run into trouble.>>
I do not accept that we are doomed to perpetual differences. Can you please
elaborate on what specific issues that pertain to the office of Censor you
feel will create/perpetuate the differences you see as "natural"? I would
genuinely be interested in hearing your views on this matter.
> > I would no more vote for or against a person due to where
> > they *live* than I would vote based on their gender, sexual
> > orientation or other irrelevant criteria.
>
> I think to compare the issues of 'location of residence' to 'gender
> or sexual orientation' is a bit far fetched.>>
Oh? Why is that? I am sincerely curious as to why you feel that a physical
location is of any greater importance than gender. Is it true you could
lobby for my opponent on the simple basis of "well, he is a European and it
would be nice to have a European Censor"? Of course. It would be just as
easy, and just as irrelevant, to lobby for me because it would be "nice" to
have a female Censor. Neither factor has the slightest impact on our
ability to do our job.
> > Where we seem to split views is that I do not feel that
> > my abilities are hampered or enhanced by my status as an
> > American and I find it rather distasteful that you seem to.
>
> Did I attack your nationality ? I don't think so. Please don't
overreact.>>
Hardly an overreaction. You stated the following: "I think this is,
especially for (us) European Cives a unique opportunity to come out in
support for a Censor who
actually resides on this side of the Atlantic." That implies that you see
my opponent's locale status as important not only to you but to all
Europeans.
>>You may have noticed I put the term 'us' in brackets: However, I will
readily admit that I see myself as a 'European civis of the international
community of Nova Roma'. Until the day the American and European continents
decide to merge and form one this will very likely remain so.>>
I am sorry to hear you say that. As for me, I consider myself a Nova Roman.
Period. The work I do, I do for *all* Nova Romans, with no regard for what
corner of the globe the citizen on the other end of my e-mail may happen to
reside.
> > I have made no attempt to factionalize this election and I
> > am deeply saddened that this seems to be your main agenda.
>
> Oh, are you really ?>>
Yes, very much so.
>>And as to my 'agenda' (a bit of a high-flying term, isn't it ?) - I have
none. I've got better and more productive things to do than to construct
'agendas' for political squabbling.>>
No, I do not think the term "agenda" is misplaced here. You state that my
opponent and I are both excellent candidates, and then you proceed to lobby
for him based on nothing more than the area he happens to live. That seems
like an agenda to me.
<SNIP>
> > However, my being a woman does not enhance *my* skills one
> > whit more than the my opponent's residency in Europe enhances
> > his skills.
>
> Caius Flavius' - and your - skills, are, as I said before, NOT subject to
geographical location. His skills, and yours, would remain untouched by my
consideration even if, geographically, you swapped places.>>
Then perhaps that is the problem. In your original message, you stated we
are both excellent candidates and yet the only factor you put forth for
voters to consider my opponent in favor of myself was his geographical
location. You can, I trust, see where this led to my concerns that you were
attempting to create a "European vs. American" line.
<SNIP>
> > Funny, that does not impeded our daily interaction or
> > our abilities to turn in excellent performance of our
> > duties on a daily basis.
>
> That may be so. But I am sure you will agree with me that the actual
physical presence of a high representative of the state in any one region -
in particular if it's somewhat removed from the central government - can do
a lot of good in terms of direct interaction of population and state.>>
As far as the office of Censor goes, actually no, I do not agree. I think
it is vastly more important to have a person in office who will do an
outstanding job than to have one in office who happens to reside in your
province. Once again, let us put the *job* above the location.
<SNIP>
> > I must confess, between the lines of what you wrote I
> > do see such a possibility, but I will leave it to you
> > to address that issue as you see fit.
>
> Maybe you should read less 'between the lines', as the lines themselves.
You are constructing an issue where there is none.>>
You raised the issue, not me.
> > Anyone who seeks such a vital position *must* by definition
> > NOT bow down to factions, whether they be philosophical, macro
> > national, religious, or any other reprehensible attempt to divide
> > our Nation and our people.
>
> I see you are attempting to pull Praetor Diocletianus into this. Now, let
me make it plain to you and all who read this that I am NOT speaking for
him, acting on his orders or that he in any way endorses my actions in
regard to my support for his candidacy. These are my words, my opinions -
nobody else's.>>
*I* am attempting to "pull" him in? You would do well to remember that I
was replying to *your* post endorsing him on the basis of nothing more than
his European citizenship.
> > If you, personally, do not feel that the provinces are given
> > their proper credit, I am genuinely sorry to hear that but I
> > strenuously disagree.
>
> Let's just acknowledge that our respective viewpoints are different,
which, as I mentioned above - is normal and also what makes our nation a
diverse and alive community and not a homogeneous multitude mouthing the
same words, opinions, sentiments.>>
We do indeed have different viewpoints. I do not see the provinces as in
any way "less than" or in need of "special" local representation. I feel
that way about Mediatlantica as well as Gallia. We are *one* nation. Where
you and I appear to diverge is in our thoughts regarding differences being
"natural". Once again, in terms of Nova Roma I simply do not accept the
inevitability of remaining at odds.
<SNIP>
> > You appear, and please correct me if I am wrong, to be
> > advocating "get a European into the position of Censor"
> > as your entire agenda.
>
> I am advocating 'why not get a European into the position of Censor ?' -
and this not, I hate to repeat this, as part of my mysterious 'agenda'. It
is merely a suggestion to give thought to, nothing more.>>
It is, in my opinion, as worthy as "why not get a woman into the position of
Censor"? It does a disservice to both myself and my opponent to pigeonhole
us in such a way. Let he and I address our actual concrete plans if
elected. Let us give the voters something to sink their teeth and minds
into above and beyond our location or gender. The latter are
inconsequential, the former are the lifeblood of this election. No matter
how much a voter may like either of us, isn't the core of this debate what
we will *do*? Let us move on to such important matters and leave the
physical addresses behind.
<SNIP>
>>'Unfair', as this term obviously piques you - in the case of you winning
both offices and perhaps, then, not being able to fulfill either position's
demands adequately. Unfairness, then, towards the citizens and their right
to the service they have voted for you to render them. It is no news that
the position of Censor is an extremely demanding one - and, frankly, I
cannot see how you (or anybody) would be able to juggle such a workload
successfully in concert with another office that also demands due
attention.>>
Yes, I do get "piqued" when *I* am singled out as being "unfair" when
numerous persons are running for multiple positions this year. As for the
time available, let me assure you I have more than adequate resources to the
tasks at hand. As an educator I am in the unique position to be home
relatively early each day and, in addition, have two months of the year free
to devote almost entirely to Nova Roma. I would not have run for Censor if
I felt I would be unduly burdened by the time element. Luckily, if elected
Curatrix I already have a fabulous scriba signed on and, over the course of
a year's duty., have that job down to a science. I appreciate your concern,
but rest assured I would never seek an office I would be unable to devote
adequate time to.
<SNIP>
>
> > Had another candidate stepped forward to oppose him,
> > I would have supported them wholeheartedly and done all
> > I could to see them elected.
>
> 'done all I could to see them elected' ?
Yes. As in , campaigned for them, endorsed them, encouraged them, given
them information on what to expect as a Curator. In short, I would have
given as much support as possible to an opponent of Limitanus. Read his own
words. He declares he will do *nothing* if elected. How any responsible
Nova Roman could support such a declaration is beyond me.
<SNIP>
>>I am sure the Gods (and the voters) will do as they see fit, Priscilla.>>
Of this, Diana, I have no doubt.
<SNIP>
Vale,
Priscilla Vedia Serena
> Optime vale,
> Diana Meridia Aurelia
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
|
| Subject: |
[novaroma] Against the Lex Vedia de Quaestors |
| From: |
Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix <alexious@--------> |
| Date: |
Sat, 01 Dec 2001 21:32:29 -0800 |
|
Avete Omnes,
I must voice my concern about this. According to recent discussion with
a magistrate who was looking into bonding our publicani, I was informed
that bonding would cost $750.00 for ONE individual. This means we would
have to spend at least $1,400 and potentially $3,500+ (if all the
quaestors were devoted to the collection of taxes).
If this lex passes we, in all likelyhood, still wont be able to bond any
Consular Quaestors (since they are most likely the ones to handle the
tax collection). Because we lack the financial resources to do so.
Instead, it has been suggested that we bond the individual who actually
writes the checks. I personally think that would be a better route at
this time and as Nova Roma starts growing and collecting more money then
it would be financially feasible to bond everyone who has any contact
with tax collection.
Let me assure the citizens of Nova Roma that I am not against this
proposed lex out of principle, but due to our current financial
constraints. When we are financially able to bond our publicani,
quaestors and other individuals who collect money we should do so.
According to the latest treasury report we only have $2076.85. With
that information available, I respectfully recommend voting against this
proposal.
Very Respectfully,
Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix
Candidate for Consul
I. Lex Vedia de Quaestores
This Lex Vedia de Quaestores is hereby enacted in order to require the
bonding of those magistrates empowered to handle the funds of Nova Roma.
I. All quaestores must be legally bonded to handle funds. Should an
elected
quaestor be denied bonding for any reason, he or she shall be considered
to
not hold the position, and an election for a suitable replacement shall
proceed according to those procedures established by law.
II. The Senate shall authorize the reasonable expenditure of funds from
the
central treasury to cover the administrative and other costs of bonding
elected Quaestores.
III. The Consules or their legally delegated subordinates shall handle
the
administrative and other details related to obtaining such bonding, in
conjunction with and with the cooperation of the various elected
Quaestores.
|
| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] Withdrawal Of Citizenship |
| From: |
Valerian75@-------- |
| Date: |
Sun, 2 Dec 2001 00:09:06 EST |
|
Salve,
I appreciate the replies I have received. They have given me other
alternatives to look into. I can assure everyone that I am taking this
decision seriously. As pointed out earlier, all things are not decided on a
whim. I didn't join NR on any kind of whim. I visited the site many times
before deciding to apply. I am very proud of my citizenship and will think
on it again. I thank those of you who provided input.
Vale and Many Blessings,
Lucia Ambrosia Valeria
Valerian75@--------
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
----------------------------------------------
> Ave,
>
> IMHO you should just go on digest mode or even no mail. However, giving
> up your citizenship is excessive. One does not give up your
> macronational citizenship in a whim. Why should NR be different? Just
> go to digest mode or go no mail then at your convenience you can keep
> yourself informed. Your Pater/Materfamilias can inform you if there is
> an upcoming vote or any events.
>
> Respectfully,
>
> Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix
> Censor
>
> Valerian75@-------- wrote:
> >
> > Salvete! Lucia Ambrosia Valeria sends Greetings To All!!
> >
> > Due to a busy schedule, I have no time to dedicate to Nova Roma and do
> > not
> > wish to sit back and just read through e-mails all day. I have
> > enjoyed my
> > time as a citizen and have tried to do what I can as Legatus to the DC
> > area.
> > I wish to thank Gens Ambrosia and the rest of Nova Roma for welcoming
> > me. My
> > thanks also to Consul Flavius Vedius Germanicus for the opportunity as
> >
> > Legatus. I hope to be able to join again when more time is
> > available. May
> > the Gods protect and guide each one of you.
> >
> > Many Blessings,
> > Lucia Ambrosia Valeria
> > Valerian75@--------
> >
>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
|
| Subject: |
[novaroma] I am Back |
| From: |
"Marcus Sentius Claudius" <msentius@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 2 Dec 2001 16:27:10 +1100 |
|
Ave Omnes
I am back after a long absence to the main list of the republic.
Vale
Marcus Sentius Claudius
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
|
| Subject: |
[novaroma] I am back |
| From: |
"Marcus Sentius Claudius" <msentius@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 2 Dec 2001 16:31:21 +1100 |
|
Ave all,
I am back after a long stay away. Here there are elections on, so here I am...
Marcus Sentious Claudius
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
|
| Subject: |
RE: [novaroma] Against the Lex Vedia de Quaestors |
| From: |
"C. Minucius Hadrianus" <shinjikun@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 2 Dec 2001 00:47:56 -0500 |
|
Salve,
You'll please excuse my ignorance, but as one of the candidates
currently running for Quaestor, I'm curious what exactly becoming bonded
entails?
Gratias!
Vale,
C. Minucius Hadrianus
Legate of Massachusetts
Scriba Propraetoris, Nova Britannia
Candidate for Quaestor
ICQ# 28924742
"Qui desiderat pacem, praeparet bellum." - Vegetius
-----Original Message-----
From: Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix [mailto:alexious@--------]
Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2001 12:32 AM
To: novaroma@--------
Subject: [novaroma] Against the Lex Vedia de Quaestors
Avete Omnes,
I must voice my concern about this. According to recent discussion with
a magistrate who was looking into bonding our publicani, I was informed
that bonding would cost $750.00 for ONE individual. This means we would
have to spend at least $1,400 and potentially $3,500+ (if all the
quaestors were devoted to the collection of taxes).
If this lex passes we, in all likelyhood, still wont be able to bond any
Consular Quaestors (since they are most likely the ones to handle the
tax collection). Because we lack the financial resources to do so.
Instead, it has been suggested that we bond the individual who actually
writes the checks. I personally think that would be a better route at
this time and as Nova Roma starts growing and collecting more money then
it would be financially feasible to bond everyone who has any contact
with tax collection.
Let me assure the citizens of Nova Roma that I am not against this
proposed lex out of principle, but due to our current financial
constraints. When we are financially able to bond our publicani,
quaestors and other individuals who collect money we should do so.
According to the latest treasury report we only have $2076.85. With
that information available, I respectfully recommend voting against this
proposal.
Very Respectfully,
Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix
Candidate for Consul
I. Lex Vedia de Quaestores
This Lex Vedia de Quaestores is hereby enacted in order to require the
bonding of those magistrates empowered to handle the funds of Nova Roma.
I. All quaestores must be legally bonded to handle funds. Should an
elected
quaestor be denied bonding for any reason, he or she shall be considered
to
not hold the position, and an election for a suitable replacement shall
proceed according to those procedures established by law.
II. The Senate shall authorize the reasonable expenditure of funds from
the
central treasury to cover the administrative and other costs of bonding
elected Quaestores.
III. The Consules or their legally delegated subordinates shall handle
the
administrative and other details related to obtaining such bonding, in
conjunction with and with the cooperation of the various elected
Quaestores.
|
| Subject: |
RE: [novaroma] Candidates for the office of Censor |
| From: |
"JusticeCMO" <justicecmo@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 2 Dec 2001 01:05:02 -0500 |
|
Salve,
>>Priscilla Vedia, it is you who makes the election of a Censor a USA vs.
Europe issue, not us.>>
I am afraid I have to dispute you. It was Diana who declared that "(us)
Europeans" would be better served by my opponent. I merely replied, I did
not raise the issue.
>>To us, the possibility to have one Censor in Northern America>>
Once again I will point out than when I use the term "us" *I* refer to Nova
Romans, not to any one group or province. That, it seems, is our main
difference.
<SNIP>
>>I was really surprised by your post, the tone is rash and saucy, so much
unlike the Priscilla Vedia Serena (!) I know from many postings on this
list. Right after Marcus Minucius Audens posted his laudatio and encomium of
the "mere citizen" I see a mere citizen using his right to raise his/her
voice to endorse a candidate, being cut short by the competitor candidate -
if I may say so, Prima Domina veneranda, there is no offence intended.>>
Saucy is it? Well now, I have been called many things in my time but
"saucy" has never been among them. :) However, no one was "cut short"
here. Diana made a post and I replied. I was direct and honest and pulled
no punches. I took offense to her assertion that my opponent could do any
good *simply* based on his geographical location, not to her desire to
support one candidate or another.
>>In the end, the voters will decide, the mere citizens. Please leave them
the right to raise their voice and express their opinions, stand their words
of praise as well as censure, and leave it to the voters, the mere citizens,
to decide.>>
If you are requesting that I stand silently during elections, I am sorry,
that is not something I think works in the favor of our citizens and voters.
Every citizen has the right to raise their voice as they see fit, but please
do not ask me to sit silently while they do so if it effects me and the
offices I seek.
>>You are right, Priscilla Vedia, another active woman in the senate would
be a boon. But this is a point like the one you generally opposed to in your
reply to Diana Meridia as "irrelevant criteria". To be a "woman" is a
general quality that does not make anyone a good or competent person by
itself. An appropriate candidate who accidentally is a woman at the same
time and equal in her qualities for the job and in her dignitas to her
competitor, will certainly be preferred by me.>>
On this we are agreed 100%. I do not see my possession of ovaries as of any
greater significance than my opponent's street address in Europe.
>>Priscilla Vedia Prima Domina veneranda, you are a Cives Privata jumping to
the position with the highest grade of Dignitas. This is conflicting with
ancient Roman habits - the candidate had to have hold a high magistrate -
usually a consulate. And it has nothing to do with sex or gender. I am sorry
to say this: the candacy of a homo privatus was completely out of question.
And no abilities, capabilities and merits could compensate for this
deficiency in ancient Rome.>>
Since my opponent has also not completed the Cursus Honorum, that will make
for a difficult choice. Neither of us have stepped from the shadows, we are
both well-known and hard-working cives. I, for one, do not attribute
dignitas to offices in any case, as much as I do associate it with the way
in which a person conducts themselves on a daily basis.
>>I am sorry, if I offend you, Priscilla Vedia>>
I have taken no offense at all to your words. Please do not mistake
disagreement for ill-will. They are different animals in my mind, I am more
than capable of disagreeing with you and yet respecting you as a person.
>>it is a historic fact and a matter of accuracy in reconstructing Roma to
keep to as many as possible of the basic habits of the Civitas Romana
Antiqua like the idea that dignitas is gained and increased through the
Cursus Honorum.>>
Neither I nor my opponent has passed the Cursus Honorum. I agree that
Dignitas is important, but neither of us fulfills the Cursus Honorum aspect
of your endorsement.
Vale,
Priscilla Vedia Serena
> Lucilla Cornelia Cinna
|
| Subject: |
RE: [novaroma] Candidates for the office of Censor |
| From: |
"JusticeCMO" <justicecmo@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 2 Dec 2001 01:27:29 -0500 |
|
Salve,
>>Diana Meridia Aurelia offered her thoughts and arguments, and Priscilla
Vedia answered, harshly. All who know Diana Meridia know that she is a
honest, but also open citizen.>>
Sorry Dio, I am not "harsh", I am honest. All who know me know that if you
ask me a question you will get the truth. I am not much for wrapping things
up in pretty packages, I am more interested in letting people know where
they stand.
>>Citizens, decide yourself: Was that harsh reaction correct? Last year
there was a candidate for Censor from Europe, too. He too argued that it
could be better for Nova Roma to have one Censor in Europe, and nobody
argued against this. I personally think that there's no factionalism in this
argument.>>
Had it been harsh, your question might be appropriate. The fact that no one
questioned a candidate last year is totally irrelevant. To create, falsely,
a NR Europe vs. NR America is factionalism at its core. As a candidate
seeking to represent *all* the people of Nova Roma, I am dismayed that you
don't see things more clearly.
<SNIP>
>>It´s not necessary to comment or remark the arguments from both sides, I
simpy invite you to respect each other,>>
Please do not mistake disagreement for disrespect.
Vale,
Priscilla Vedia Serena
> Valete
> Caius Flavius Diocletianus
>
|
| Subject: |
[novaroma] On gens names |
| From: |
"Sybil Leek" <PrimaRituliaNocta@--------> |
| Date: |
Sat, 01 Dec 2001 22:16:57 -0800 |
|
Salve Tiberius Annaeus Otho et M. Octavius Germanicus,
Thank you both for clarifying this point of conjugation up for me. I had
not known that familiea gens names were supposed to be conjugated to the
feminine, now I do J. May your days be well and your lives free of dispute.
Thanks again.
Prima Ritulia Nocta
>Salvete omnes,
>
>Just a further note for those who want to know exactly. gens has feminine
>grammatical gender and therefore the gens names are in feminine form.
>
>gens Annaea / Octavia etc.
>
>Valete, Tiberius Annaeus Otho
>
>-- Original-Nachricht --
>
> >Salve Prima Ritulia,
> >
> >This is as it should be. Gens names are feminine... Octavia, Cornelia,
>Claudia, etc., regardless of the gender of the paterfamilias or
>materfamilias. At the main Album Gentium page,
>http://www.novaroma.org/bin/view/gentes, the first column contains the
>always-feminine gens name, and the second column contains the PF or MF
>name, with appropriate word endings for that person's gender.
> >
> >Vale, O.
> >
> >> I went into NR’s citizens’ album today and noticed something odd about
>it. I do not know if the web master knows or not but the majority of the
>families names are conjugated to the feminine. I thought it might be good
>to let people know about this error. Unless I am missing something in the
>conjugation and they are in the plural or something.
> >
> >M. Octavius Germanicus
> >Curator Araneum et Senator
> >Candidate for Consul MMDCCLV
> >http://www.konoko.net/~haase/
_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp
|
| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] Curator Sermonem : a political choice |
| From: |
Fortunatus <labienus@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 02 Dec 2001 00:33:10 -0600 |
|
Salvete
> As for my stopping the Language debate, I must correct you. A veto
> was attempted, but came too late to be enforced. See post # 18790 in
> the archives.
A technical point, offered purely to set the record straight, and not
intended to imply any opinion on the part of this tribunus plebis
regarding the current debate between M' Villius and Priscilla Vedia:
The veto that was issued in the case Curatrix Vedia cites was, contrary
to her assertion, valid. The law cited to invalidate the intercessio
applies only to edicta, and the curatrix sermonis was incapable of
issuing edicta at the time. Both tribuni issued their intercessio in a
reasonably timely manner in accord with the constitution and leges of
Nova Roma.
Valete
T Labienus Fortunatus
--
Quicquid latine dictum sit, altum videtur.
|
| Subject: |
[novaroma] Endorsements of Lucius Cornelius Sulla |
| From: |
Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix <alexious@--------> |
| Date: |
Sat, 01 Dec 2001 22:50:17 -0800 |
|
Avete Omnes,
In the past few days I have been approached by quite a few citizens with
the interest of gaining my opinions on who I believe would be the best
candidates in the coming year. I have hesitated in making my opinions
known for two reasons. First, a few of my gens members are running for
office and there is a natural bent for me to support them. Second, in
some offices my good friends are running against each other, or my good
friends are running against my gens members and its extremely difficult
to pick the proper candidate when friendship and family are involved.
However, avoiding the issue is not an option. Elections are here and we
must decide who is the best to serve Nova Roma. With that in mind, I
hereby would like to endorse the following candidates.
Censor - I endorse Priscilla Vedia
Priscilla Vedia - Pro: I have a friendship with her. She has been
present and active in NR for the entire year. She has some experience
in promulgation of laws. I think she is easy to get along with and has
database experience and has a good amount of time to be able to give the
office of Censor the time and detail it needs. Knows quite a few
languages. Very quick in responding to correspondence.
Con: She is not a Senator, she has never held a higher magistracy. It
has NEVER been done in ancient Rome. It was totally unheard of for a
privatus to become a Censor without holding a Consulship, now we can say
that tradition has been broken with the Censor Suffectus of C. Marius
Merullus, but he was at least a Senator.
Gaius Flavius Diocletianus: Pro: He is Senator and a former Praetor.
He has some experience in promulgation of laws. He is active in the
ways of government this his prior experience. He probably knows quite a
few languages himself.
Con: Time necessary for the Censorship. On his statement he did not
mention anything about computer experience. While, I know he has been a
very good governor in Germania I am concerned about the lack of progress
of the Praetorship this year. He too is jumping the Cursus Honorum.
NOTE: If you have noticed I have NOT focused anything on Location.
While it is an issue we cannot escape, I feel we must think of our
selves as Nova Romans, not Europeans, not Australians, not Canadians and
not Americans but NOVA ROMANS. We are in this micronation together. We
can either build Her up together or we can tear her down by our
bickering and infighting. The choice of making location an issue is one
that each citizen must decide for him/herself. It is not an issue to
me, because I focus on the quality of the candidate.
_______________
Praetor:
Pomepia Cornelia Strabo: Yes, I know she is my gens member but I must
state that beyond that fact I believe she would make an excellent
Praetor. Here is why I come to this conclusion, Pomepia Cornelia has
served as assistant to many magistrates to date (M. Municius Audens, C.
Marius Merullus, Priscilla Vedia, and myself). She has been governor of
Eastern Canada for a year (December 5) where she has acquitted herself
honorable. She has assisted in the formation and supervisory role of a
few sodalitas (Militarum and Musarum). She has experience in
promulgation of laws and I believe she would bring a sense of humanity
and compassion when it comes to the preparation of a civil law code.
Quintus Fabius Maximus: Once again, I know many of you will say, he is
one of my best friends in NR and your right he is. But, I believe he
experience is invaluable and should not go to waste. We have a scholar
who specializes in Nova Roma, having been published. We also have a
magistrate who knows thoroughly how Ancient Rome worked and how Nova
Roma works. He is also a Consular and was Praetor last year. During
his tenure of Praetor I am certain that he has compiled many hours of
research and preparation and I believe we should all him the opportunity
of finishing his task. I believe that the balance between his knowledge
and Pompeia Cornelia's compassion we can get an excellent civil code
that would benefit all of Nova Roma.
_______________
List Moderator:
Priscilla Vedia: I believe Priscilla Vedia is the very best candidate
for the job. My Pro's that I listed above still apply and I hardly have
any negatives, if any that I can think of. Beyond that, I believe she
is competent, reliable and eminently more capable than Manius Villius.
So, who would best serve Nova Roma, hands down it would be Priscilla
Vedia.
Very Respectfully Submitted,
Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix
Candidate for Consul
|
| Subject: |
[novaroma] REH Roman Poem |
| From: |
Piparskeggr - Venator <catamount_grange@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 02 Dec 2001 01:12:26 -0600 |
|
Salus et Fortuna Omnes,
I found this in a search for other information on the American author Robert E. Howard (best
known for creating Conan). I think him quite a good poet.
-A Song of the Legions-
The crystal gong of the silence
Shivers in shattered shards;
And the marble hall re-echoes
To the tread of the crested guards.
Fingers pluck at the hangings,
White in the purple gloam;
Midnight lies with the sleepers
In the pulsing heart of Rome.
Rosy lips smile in slumber,
Arms nestle bodies white--
Rome in her silks and marbles
Sleeps through the soft-lipped night.
Echoing down the heather
The restless trumpets call,
Questioning each of the other
Down the line of the winding Wall.
Eyes strain hard in the darkness,
To the pulse of an echo blown--
Rome is of gold and iron
But a soldier is flesh and bone.
Fires in the hills are burning,
To the far off throb of a drum;
Through the ghostly waving heather
What phantom figures come?
Shadows or painted warriors?
The death drums never cease.
Stand to your watches, legion,
That Rome may sleep in peace.
Beacons burn in the towers,
Eyes straining hard beside,
Ears a-tune to the murmur,
The sigh of each changing tide.
Was that the shrill of a night bird
Where the waves are grey as steel,
Or the grind of a muffled oar-lock,
The wash of a prowling keel?
Drift wood or sword-fanged sea-wolves,
Not yours is rest or ease;
Stand to your watches, legion,
That Rome may sleep in peace.
- Robert E. Howard
--
=========================================
In Amicus sub Fidelis
- Piperbarbus Ullerius Venator
Cives Nova Romana et Paterfamilias
Domus Familias
http://www.geocities.com/gens_ulleria/index.html
Known as Stafngrímr Oxlegs by discerning Vikings,
somewhere ,-)
/}
€‡‡‡‡‡‡‡{X|:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::>
\}
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
|
| Subject: |
[novaroma] File - NovaRomaList.txt |
| From: |
novaroma@-------- |
| Date: |
2 Dec 2001 07:20:13 -0000 |
|
GUIDELINES FOR THE NOVA ROMA MAILING LIST
By Priscilla Vedia Serena
Curatrix Sermonem (List moderator)
(with thanks to Patricia Cassia for the original text)
This list is for you, and I see my role as trying to facilitate a place where we can all share information and get to know one another. These guidelines are open to change, and to your suggestions. Today the list has more than 350 people on it. As we've grown, we have had to adjust the way we communicate so as to make electronic "rooom" for everyone. This set of guidelines represents another effort in that direction. It is not a response to any one person or posting.
I.The list is set up so that replies will automatically be sent to the entire list. Please keep this in mind when replying. If your reply is only intended for one member, consider sending the reply privately and not to the list as a whole.
II.Agreement and support for one another are always welcome. However, if you are simply saying "yes!" or "me too," without adding more information to the thread, consider doing so in private e-mail.
III.If you must criticize another's post, consider doing so in private e-mail. If the person has made a genuine error, this allows him or her to save face and apologize for misbehavior or correct misinformation, rather than having misdeeds pointed out publicly.
IV.It is entirely appropriate to disagree publicly with another's stated views, or with the actions of Nova Roma's Senate, magistrates and other officials. Nova Roma is an organization of individuals from a wide variety of nations, religions, backgrounds and political viewpoints, and it is only reasonable that our views should differ.
V.When expressing disagreement, the following steps are recommended:
* Express respect for the person and faith in his or her good intentions.
* Point out any themes or ideas with which you do agree.
* Express your own opinion pleasantly, with respect for the rights of others to believe differently from you. On the Internet, strong language does not enhance the effectiveness of your communication. It simply makes you look strident and overbearing.
* Offer factual information where possible, backed up with sources. Quiet statements of fact win respect from others following your conversation.
* Offer sources of factual information (books, web links, etc.) that might be of interest to others interested in the topic.
* Use humor when appropriate (i.e. when it helps lighten the tone of a discussion without being aimed at other list members)
VI.If a thread or posting on the list makes you angry or sad, consider not responding at all, or doing so in private e-mail. If you do decide to respond to something that has pressed your emotional buttons, do not press Send right after writing your response. Let it sit in your Out box for 24 hours. Then look at it again, and consider whether this response is the one that best enhances your own honor and advances the knowledge of your fellow list members.
VII.Remember that there are people on this list who are under 18. Profanity is unnecessary and genrally unwelcome. Sexual references should be mild at worst.
VIII.Name-calling and personal attacks are inappropriate. Expressions of disagreement should be confined to criticizing the words or ideas of another, rather than the person. You are always free to disagree with an idea, but please do not turn an ideological debate into a personal fight.
IX.During the time leading up to elections (held each December, and occasionally at other times if offices become vacant), this list is also one of the public forums through which candidates express their views and present their qualifications to the populace. All of the above strictures governing appropriate behavior remain in place and apply to all candidates and their supporters.
X.Avoid giving out your home address and/or phone number on this list. You do not know all the people on here, and while it would be pleasant to believe we are all good-hearted and sane, you cannot trust in that.
XI. All posts to the list should be accompanied by an English translation if they are written in another language. If you are unable to write in English, or uncomfortable posting in English, please let me know and I will be more than happy to facilitate your pairing with a translator who can help you to do so. Posts in multiple languages are MORE than welcome, as long as an English translation is included somewhere therein. Please note there is no penalty for violating this policy on a "first time" basis, as it is assumed that anyone doing so is simply in need of assistance and not consciously choosing to violate list policy.
XII.The topic of this list is ancient Rome and Nova Roma. Off-topic postings include:
* Discussions of macronational politics, except when they shed light on an ancient Roman subject or in some way relate to Nova Roma.
* Bashing of any religion. It is OK to discuss your own disagreements with various faiths, but not to disrespect the rights of others to believe in those faiths.
* Personal attacks of any kind. Be mindful to keep disagreements on the issues and not on personalities.
* Arguments on certain well-worn issues that are contentious in modern society (examples: abortion, gun control), except as they relate to our topic.
* Jokes that aren't related to the topic or to current discussions on the list
* Virus warnings and other urban legends.
* All commercial postings, except from members of the Macellum, Nova Roma's marketplace (and even these should be "low-key" - see below).
XIII.The best postings include those which help us better understand some aspect of Roman history, or which offer ideas and energy to the furtherance of Nova Roma's goals. On-topic postings include, but are not limited to:
* Anything related to ancient history. This is broadly interpreted to include religion, cooking, gardening, family life, politics, military, costuming, medicine and many other topics.
* Anything that has the effect of building community among list members (announcements of local events, planning get-togethers, sharing occasional personal milestones).
* Information of interest to Nova Romans (links, news, tourism information for Roman sites, updates from political or religious bodies, regional or Sodalitas projects).
* Low-key advertisements for Macellum members. A low-key advertisement might include a signature file, a single announcement of a new business, or a mention of one's business in response to a relevant thread on the list.
XIV.The Curatrix Sermonem has imperium to govern this list, but prefers to encourage positive interaction rather than punish negative behavior. In the case of a poster whose actions violate these guidelines or otherwise disrupt the peace, the Curatrix Sermonem will choose from the following list of escalating actions:
i.General note to the list, not directed at anyone personally, but mentioning the behavior in question and suggesting alternate courses of action.
ii.Private note to the individual, warning him or her to stop.
iii.Placement of the individual on "moderated" status (the individual remains a member of the list, but all posts must be filtered by the Curatrix Sermonem).
iv.In extreme cases, the offender can and will be banned from the list. Further action may be taken by the Senate, but this step represents the limit of the Curatrix Sermonem's powers.
The vast majority of cases can be dealt with via the first two steps alone, and it is the Curatrix Sermonem's hope that these guidelines will reduce the necessity even of those steps.
In the further interest of maintaining order and civility on the list, all new subscribers (this includes former members who re-subscribe) are automatically placed on moderated status for their first few posts, after which they revert to normal "unmoderated" status. As this list has an open membership, this policy allows us to avoid the occasional "spam" posts and is intended solely to prevent abuses of the list on a "hit and run" basis. This policy is not intended as, nor will it ever be used as, a form of censorship. It is an unfortunately necessary precaution based on past abuses.
XV.If you are unhappy about someone's behavior on the list, and you do not feel comfortable dealing with him/her privately, do not tell the list about it. This often has the effect of adding further strife. Likewise, if a thread has "gone too far" in your opinion, please refrain from making public statements to cease discussion. Contact me and I will assess the situation and decide upon a course of action accordingly. Instead, e-mail me at justicecmo@-------- I welcome all concerns, questions and ideas for more effective list administration in private e-mail.
XVI.Finally, to all of you who make the Nova Roma list a pleasant and informative place, thank you.
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
|
| Subject: |
[novaroma] Sulla´s Endorsements |
| From: |
<3s@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 2 Dec 2001 02:11:33 -0600 (CST) |
|
Salvete, Quirites,
Salve, hon. Consul Luci Corneli Sulla.
Just as a short reply to your Endorsements:
Until I became Deputy Mayor, I was obliged with the whole business of information technologies. I was network administrator, I organized and run a user help desk for our computer users and websites. Furthermore, I was and I am able to install and maintain computers, both hard- and software. One of my favourite programs is Microsoft Access as database.
I think that makes my computer experiences more clearly.
Regarding the progress in Praetorship: We have some progress, due to my procedures edictum on lawsuits, published April 2, 2754 AUC. Some other projects need their time. E.g., a civil, public or criminal law code cannot be compiled on the hurry.
Valete
Caius Flavius Diocletianus
Praetor, Senator
Governor of Germania
Candidate for Censor
|
| Subject: |
AW: Re: [novaroma] Sulla´s Endorsements |
| From: |
<3s@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 2 Dec 2001 02:23:36 -0600 (CST) |
|
Salve iterum.
Thank you for your wishes. Good luck also for you and your gentiles!
Vale
Caius Flavius Diocletianus
-- Original Nachricht--
Von: Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix <alexious@-------->
An: "3s@--------" <3s@-------->
Senden: 09:09
Betreff: Re: [novaroma] Sulla´s Endorsements
Thanks for your response. I didn't have any idea how much computer
experience you had based on your announcement. I think you and Vedia
would be able to make a good Censor. Good luck on the elections.
Vale,
Sulla
3s@--------
wrote:
>
> Salvete, Quirites,
> Salve, hon. Consul Luci Corneli Sulla.
>
> Just as a short reply to your Endorsements:
>
> Until I became Deputy Mayor, I was obliged with the whole business of
> information technologies. I was network administrator, I organized and
> run a user help desk for our computer users and websites. Furthermore,
> I was and I am able to install and maintain computers, both hard- and
> software. One of my favourite programs is Microsoft Access as
> database.
>
> I think that makes my computer experiences more clearly.
>
> Regarding the progress in Praetorship: We have some progress, due to
> my procedures edictum on lawsuits, published April 2, 2754 AUC. Some
> other projects need their time. E.g., a civil, public or criminal law
> code cannot be compiled on the hurry.
>
> Valete
> Caius Flavius Diocletianus
> Praetor, Senator
> Governor of Germania
> Candidate for Censor
>
> Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> ADVERTISEMENT
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
|
| Subject: |
AW: RE: [novaroma] Candidates for the office of Censor |
| From: |
<3s@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 2 Dec 2001 02:42:37 -0600 (CST) |
|
Salve, Priscilla Vedia Serena.
>>Serena wrote:
Sorry Dio, I am not "harsh", I am honest. All who know me know that
if you
ask me a question you will get the truth. I am not much for wrapping
things
up in pretty packages, I am more interested in letting people know where
they stand.
CFD replies:
Serena, it seems that we disagree about the term "honest". Truth can be cruel somtimes, and it´s a sort of honesty to be friendly in the public. That´s by the way, also a form of respect, as it is the correct use of someones name.
Alas, you let people know, where they stand, that´s true. Almost behind you. Serena, I´m disappointed by your behaviour.
>> Serena wrote:
Had it been harsh, your question might be appropriate. The fact that no
one
questioned a candidate last year is totally irrelevant. To create,
falsely,
a NR Europe vs. NR America is factionalism at its core. As a candidate
seeking to represent *all* the people of Nova Roma, I am dismayed that you
don't see things more clearly.
CFD replies:
Perhaps it´s irrelevant, but it is a good example how one can argue in different situations.
Once again, you overreact. Factionalism is not the question here, you use old agruments from the campaing last year, too. You introduce facionalism here because you have no other arguments.
I´m quite sure that I see things more clearly than you believe. And our citizens too.
>>Serena wrote:
Please do not mistake disagreement for disrespect.
CFD replies:
I invite you to do the same.
Vale
Caius Flavius Diocletianus
Praetor, Senator
Candidate for Censor
|
| Subject: |
[novaroma] Re: Candidates for the office of Censor |
| From: |
"Diana Meridia Aurelia" <diana_h@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 02 Dec 2001 09:36:37 -0000 |
|
--- In novaroma@--------, "JusticeCMO" <justicecmo@g...> wrote:
> Salve, Priscilla Vedia Serena,
> I am as calm now as I was when replying to Diana.
> That is to say, perfectly in possession of my intellect and
> not working from any emotional core.
I am glad to hear it.
> She made some fairly strong insinuations and I confronted them
> head-on.
Indeed you did - a bit very; much like someone aiming a cannon at a
mosquito (and - insinuations ? oh, please ...)
> That does not, de facto, mean I was upset when I replied to her.
> I believe in meeting challenges in a straight forward way.
So do I.
> Perhaps not the most "lady-like" response, but it is the most
> honest one.
In this at least, I would hope, we feel the same.
> I will also note, for the record, that I did not fire off a
> "first draft" to Diana, I always draft, revise, and then send.
I can assure you that I do/did likewise.
Thank you for your time in replying to my 'wrong choice of words', as
Puteus so nicely put it - it's been an education for sure.
Optime vale,
Diana Meridia Aurelia
|
| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] re: Curator Sermonem : a political choice |
| From: |
Caeso Fabius Quintilianus <tjalens.h@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 2 Dec 2001 11:54:02 +0100 |
|
Honorable Manius Villius Limitanus!
>The system is nearly the same as the actual, the only difference is the
>translation (if needed by the already formed team) will be done AFTER
>the publication of the post. This will desinhibit the people who don t
>like to first send theit post to a translater.If you believe Vedia s
>system work, so does mine.
>
I think that your hope for people to voluntarily translate is a _weak_ one.
I put a lot of time into Nova Roma, but I have no more time, translation is
no hobby of mine. You also are forgetting that a list must be moderated (NR
has tried an unmoderated list). We already have had situations where some
people are getting to personal and rude, I am sure that the list will have
to be _actively_ moderated. If we are going to have a moderator, the
moderator must be able to read the posts, and that ends up in translations
_before_ the publishing of messages.
>First, the actual curatrix offered thsi translation service to
>non-english fluent speakers: the team already exists.
>Second, with the actual rules I dont know if somebody of the team was
>used to translate, I definitively was not.
>Third: I dont think there will be tons of posts in swedish or whatever
>which would compromise the activity of the translaters, I just hope
>there will be much more than with the actual rules (well more than none
>should not be difficult).
The team already exists, OK. How are You to guarantee that anyone of them
will take on their shoulder to translate? Your policy _could_ lead to a
list filled with hundreds of mails that I would have to check before
deleting because I don't understand them. That is unnecessary work.
I think we always will have to just be thankful if anyone is prepared to
translate, it is a lot of work. I know as I write lot of material in
English for Nova Roma. Have You seen my 30 edicta and 9 Renuntationes? It
is a lot of work, but I prefer to do the "translation" myself, that way I
can be sure that the translation will be correct. If I wasn't able to write
in English I think that I would prefer a friend to translate. This to be
sure that it would be correct and to give me a chance to check the
translation _before_ it hit the list. I would not be very interested in
getting my posts translated by possible strangers _after_ the publishing of
messages.
If there will not be noticeable more mails in "untranslated" languages, why
making a campaign out of it? If You do not intend to do the actual work of
a Curator Sermonem, why do You candidate? Why not just propose that we get
rid of the office?
I do not believe in your language policy! Remember that I am no
North-American and no native English-speaker, I don't even think that my
cultural basis is very close to our friends in North-America, but all cives
need a way to communicate, I think that way has to be English.
Vale
Caeso Fabius Quintilianus
Quaestor of Nova Roma
Propraetor of Thule
CANDIDATE FOR CURULE AEDILE 2755
The Opinions expressed are my own,
and not an offical opinion of Nova Roma
************************************************
Join the Main List for Nova Roma
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/novaroma
Join the List for the Thule Provincia in Nova Roma
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ThuleNovaRoma/join
************************************************
The homepage of the Nova Roma Provincia Thule:
http://thule.novaroma.org/
************************************************
Aut inveniam viam aut faciam
"I'll either find a way or make one"
************************************************
"Do not give in to hate. That leads to the dark side."
************************************************
Caeso, he who also is known as Christer Edling.
************************************************
Using a keyboard that doesn't want to make L! :-(
************************************************
PRIVATE PHONE: +90 - 10 09 10
DOG BOARDING HOUSE PHONE: +90 - 503 56
MOBILE: +70 - 643 88 80
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
|
| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] Sulla´s Endorsements |
| From: |
Antonius Corvus Septimius <antoniuscorvusseptimius@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 2 Dec 2001 01:14:52 -0800 (PST) |
|
--- 3s@-------- wrote:
> Salvete, Quirites,
> Salve, hon. Consul Luci Corneli Sulla.
>
>
> Just as a short reply to your Endorsements:
>
> Until I became Deputy Mayor, I was obliged with the
> whole business of information technologies. I was
> network administrator, I organized and run a user
> help desk for our computer users and websites.
> Furthermore, I was and I am able to install and
> maintain computers, both hard- and software. One of
> my favourite programs is Microsoft Access as
> database.
>
> I think that makes my computer experiences more
> clearly.
>
> Regarding the progress in Praetorship: We have some
> progress, due to my procedures edictum on lawsuits,
> published April 2, 2754 AUC. Some other projects
> need their time. E.g., a civil, public or criminal
> law code cannot be compiled on the hurry.
>
>
> Valete
> Caius Flavius Diocletianus
> Praetor, Senator
> Governor of Germania
> Candidate for Censor
>
A. Corvus Septimius C. Flavius Diocletianus
Pardon my intrusion. But isnt this a private
correspondance? I dont see why ones personal
correspondance would be posted on the main list.
Please enlighten me as to this purpose.
vale bene
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Buy the perfect holiday gifts at Yahoo! Shopping.
http://shopping.yahoo.com
|
| Subject: |
[novaroma] Re: Languages |
| From: |
antoniuscorvusseptimius@-------- |
| Date: |
Sun, 02 Dec 2001 09:49:03 -0000 |
|
Salvete Publicus Popoli Romani et amicum,
We must not loose sight of our goal. And that is to unite
those who have fallen in love with this most magnificent culture.
Any one of us (who are many) that are knowledgable of more than one
language. Can offer to translate a fellow cives' post. I feel (in my
humble opinion), that alienating someone based on their language,
would be counterproductive to what Nova Roma is here for. Reconsider
thoughts of keeping this "main list" English only. It would only cause
seperation, where it would be most painful.
valete, A. Corvus Septimius
|
| Subject: |
RE: [novaroma] Against the Lex Vedia de Quaestors |
| From: |
"Flavius Vedius Germanicus" <germanicus@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 2 Dec 2001 09:43:21 -0500 |
|
Salve;
> -----Original Message-----
> From: C. Minucius Hadrianus [mailto:shinjikun@--------]
> Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2001 12:48 AM
>
> You'll please excuse my ignorance, but as one of the candidates
> currently running for Quaestor, I'm curious what exactly becoming bonded
> entails?
Bonding is, essentially, an insurance policy against theft. Since the
Quaestores are the ones with control over the treasury (i.e., the bank
accounts), it has been felt to be a good thing to get them legally bonded.
In that way, should a quaestor skip off with some funds, we could recover
them.
This is obviously not directed at any current quaestor, or candidate, but
seems a prudent thing to have in place. It would, for example, have been
useful earlier this year when the governor of Britannia decided to keep
funds raised in that province when he resigned.
Vale,
Flavius Vedius Germanicus,
Consul
|
| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] Endorsement |
| From: |
Gnaeus Salix Astur <salixastur@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 2 Dec 2001 07:02:31 -0800 (PST) |
|
Salvete Quirites; et salve, amice Rufe.
--- Marcus Minicius Rufus <xperiko@--------> wrote:
> I must admit I don't know much about the other candidates, but as far
> as I
> know I deeply encourage you to vote Gn Salix Astur. He is one of the
> master
> pieces of Hispania's strength and his availability makes him the
> right
> choice. Let me explain all this feelng in just one sentence: He
> believes in
> Rome and Romans and he will support this feeling by heart.
Thank you very much, amice Rufe. Although I am not completely sure of
what you mean by "availability" :-). I will take it as a compliment
:-).
=====
Bene Valete in Pace Deorum!
Gnaeus Salix Astur.
Legatus Externis Rebus Provinciae Hispaniae
Triumvir Academiae Novae Romae in Thule
Scriba ad Res Externas Academiae Novae Romae in Thule.
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Buy the perfect holiday gifts at Yahoo! Shopping.
http://shopping.yahoo.com
|
| Subject: |
RE: [novaroma] The Comitia Populi Tributa is called to order |
| From: |
"Flavius Vedius Germanicus" <germanicus@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 2 Dec 2001 10:17:20 -0500 |
|
Salvete;
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Flavius Vedius Germanicus [mailto:germanicus@--------]
> Sent: Saturday, December 01, 2001 10:58 PM
>
> Under the authority vested in me by the Constitution of Nova Roma, with
the
> auspices having been sought and found to be favorable, I hereby call the
> Comitia Centuriata to order.
This was obviously a typographical error. The edictum refers to the calling
of the Comitia Populi Tributa to order, not the Comitia Centuriata. My
thanks to Gnaeus Octavius Noricus for pointing out the error.
Valete,
Flavius Vedius Germanicus,
Consul
|
| Subject: |
[novaroma] Re: The Comitia Centuriata is called to order |
| From: |
danedwardsuk@-------- |
| Date: |
Sun, 02 Dec 2001 15:18:19 -0000 |
|
Just wondering - Given that the results of the vote on changing the
voting rules for the Comitia Centuriata are not yet either known nor
ratified, does this mean that now the centuries have been called to
order the original system still applies for the forthcoming elections
(ie. 97 out of 193 centuries required)?
Valete
Decimus Iunius Silanus
--- In novaroma@--------, "Flavius Vedius Germanicus" <germanicus@n...>
wrote:
> Flavius Vedius Germanicus novaromanis S.P.D.
>
> Under the authority vested in me by the Constitution of Nova Roma,
with the
> auspices having been sought and found to be favorable, I hereby
call the
> Comitia Centuriata to order.
>
> The timing of the vote shall be as follows (all times are official
Nova Roma
> time; subtract 1 hour for GMT, 6 hours for Eastern Time):
>
> * Contio (discussion): 6 PM November 30th through 6 PM December
8th
> * Voting: 6 PM December 8th through 6 PM December 16th
>
> The following individuals stand for the offices indicated:
>
> Censor (1 vacancy):
> Caius Flavius Diocletianus
> Priscilla Vedia Serena
>
> Consul (2 vacancies):
> Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix
> Marcus Octavius Germanicus
>
> Praetor (2 vacancies):
> Pompeia Cornelia Strabo
> Quintus Fabius Maximus
> Titus Labienus Fortunatus
>
> In addition, the following leges will also be voted on by the
Comitia
> Centuriata:
>
> -----
>
> ITEM I: Lex Vedia de Tribuni
>
> I. This lex is hereby enacted to bring the institution of the
Tribunate as
> it is realized in Nova Roma closer to that of Roma Antiqua, and to
alter the
> Constitution and other official documents accordingly.
>
> II. Paragraph IV.A.7. of the Constitution is hereby altered to read
as
> follows:
>
> ] 7. Tribuni Plebis (Tribune of the Plebs). Five tribunes of the
> ] plebs shall be elected by the comitia plebis tributa to
> ] serve a term lasting one year. They must all be of the
> ] plebeian order, and shall have the following honors,
> ] powers, and obligations:
> ] a. To pronounce intercessio (intercession; a veto) against
> ] the actions of any other magistrate (with the exception
> ] of the dictator and the interrex), Senatus consulta,
> ] magisterial edicta, religious decreta, and leges passed
> ] by the comitia when the spirit and/or letter of this
> ] Constitution or legally-enacted edicta or decreta,
> ] Senatus Consulta, or leges are being violated thereby;
> ] 1. Once a pronouncement of intercessio has been made,
> ] the other Tribunes may, at their discretion, state
> ] either their support for or their disagreement with
> ] that intercessio.
> ] i. Each Tribune may issue only one such declaration
> ] of support or disagreement, but may change their
> ] declaration from one to the other, should they wish
> ] to do so.
> ] ii. The initial pronouncement of intercessio by a
> ] Tribune shall count as that Tribune's declaration
> ] of agreement.
> ] iii. Should the number or the Tribunes who choose to
> ] disagree with an intercessio equal or exceed
> ] the number of Tribunes who choose to support it,
> ] the intercessio shall be revoked.
> ] 2. Intercessio may not be imposed against statements of
> ] support for or disagreement with a use of intercessio
> ] that are issued pursuant to the preceding paragraph.
> ] 3. The issuance and function of Intercessio shall be defined
> ] according to procedures described by legislation passed
> ] by Comitia.
> ] b. To pronounce intercessio (intercession; a veto) against
> ] another Tribune using the same mechanism as described in
> ] paragraph IV.A.7.a.1. above;
> ] c. To be immune from intercessio pronounced by other
> ] magistrates, except as described in paragraphs IV.A.7.a.
> ] and IV.A.7.b. above;
> ] d. To be privy to the debates of the Senate, and keep the
> ] citizens informed as to the subjects and results thereof,
> ] in such manner and subject to such restrictions as may be
> ] defined by law;
> ] e. To call the Senate to order;
> ] f. To call the comitia plebis tributa to order, except when the
> ] Patrician order shall constitute more than 10% of the total
> ] population, in which case the power shall be altered to
> ] calling the comitia populi tributa to order;
> ] g. To administer the law;
> ] h. To appoint scribae (clerks) to assist with administrative
> ] and other tasks, as they shall see fit.
>
>
> III. Upon ratification of the Amendment to the Constitution by the
Senate,
> any leges, magisterial edicta, or other official documents which
refer to
> there being only two Tribunes are hereby amended to reflect the
increased
> number.
>
> -----
>
> ITEM II: Lex Vedia de Liberus Civium
>
> I. This lex is hereby enacted to amend the Constitution of Nova
Roma in such
> manner as to extend certain rights of Citizenship to children of
Citizens
> who are not sui juris in their domicile, and to undertake
alterations to
> Constitutional mechanisms and institutions appropriate to such a
change.
>
> II. Paragraph II.A. of the Constitution is hereby altered to read as
> follows:
>
> ] A. Citizenship
> ] 1. Any person 18 years old or older may apply for Citizenship.
> ] 2. Citizens may apply for Citizenship on behalf of their
children
> ] or legal wards (as defined by relevant macronational law)
> ] under the age of 18. Such Citizens shall be known as
impuberes.
> ] 3. Citizenship is open to anyone regardless of ethnic heritage,
> ] gender, religious affiliation, or sexual orientation.
> ] 4. Citizenship may be involuntarily revoked by those means that
> ] shall be established by law, or may be voluntarily
relinquished
> ] by notification of the censors or by public statement before
> ] three or more witnesses.
> ] 5. Impuberes may have their Citizenship relinquished on their
> ] behalf by their parent or legal guardian (as defined by
relevant
> ] macronational law) by notification of the censors or by
public
> ] statement before three or more witnesses.
>
> III. Paragraph II.B. of the Constitution is hereby altered to read
as
> follows:
>
> ] B. The following rights of the Citizens who have reached the age
of
> ] 18 shall be guaranteed, but this enumeration shall not be taken
> ] to exclude other rights that citizens may possess:
>
> IV. Paragraph II.D.3. of the Constitution is hereby altered to read
as
> follows:
>
> ] 3. Each gens shall, through whatever means it may determine
> ] appropriate, have a paterfamilias (fem. materfamilias) who
> ] shall act as the leader of the gens and speak for it when
> ] necessary. The holder of this position must be registered
> ] as such with the censors. The paterfamilias may, at his or
> ] her discretion, expel members of their gens, or accept new
> ] members into it.
> ] a. The paterfamilias may, at his discretion, exercise the
> ] rights ennumerated in paragraph II.B. of this
Constitution
> ] on behalf of impuberes in their gens, with the exception
> ] of the right to vote (paragraph II.B.3.) and the right to
> ] join the Ordo Equester (paragraph II.B.8.).
> ] b. No impuberes may become paterfamilias of a gens.
>
> -----
>
> Valete,
>
> Flavius Vedius Germanicus,
> Consul
|
| Subject: |
RE: [novaroma] Re: The Comitia Centuriata is called to order |
| From: |
"Flavius Vedius Germanicus" <germanicus@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 2 Dec 2001 10:22:15 -0500 |
|
Salve;
> -----Original Message-----
> From: danedwardsuk@-------- [mailto:danedwardsuk@--------]
> Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2001 10:18 AM
>
> Just wondering - Given that the results of the vote on changing the
> voting rules for the Comitia Centuriata are not yet either known nor
> ratified, does this mean that now the centuries have been called to
> order the original system still applies for the forthcoming elections
> (ie. 97 out of 193 centuries required)?
If the lex was passed, the new rules will apply to the current election. We
should know any time now whether it was or not.
Vale,
Flavius Vedius Germanicus,
Consul
|
| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] Re: The Comitia Centuriata is called to order |
| From: |
"Decimus Iunius Silanus" <danedwardsuk@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 2 Dec 2001 15:38:04 -0000 |
|
I understand and appreciate the need for the forthcoming elections to take place under the revised rules but given that the comitia centuriata has been called to order prior to the lex being passed (assuming it does pass), should not the original rules apply. Otherwise we seem to be talking about retroactive legislation, which although is probably a good thing in this case, is still surely an undesirable precedent to set.
Vale
Decimus Iunius Silanus
>> Just wondering - Given that the results of the vote on changing the
>> voting rules for the Comitia Centuriata are not yet either known nor
>> ratified, does this mean that now the centuries have been called to
>> order the original system still applies for the forthcoming elections
>> (ie. 97 out of 193 centuries required)?
>
> If the lex was passed, the new rules will apply to the current election. We
> should know any time now whether it was or not.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
|
| Subject: |
RE: [novaroma] Re: The Comitia Centuriata is called to order |
| From: |
"Flavius Vedius Germanicus" <germanicus@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 2 Dec 2001 11:04:29 -0500 |
|
Salve;
If the actual voting were taking place, I might agree. However, we are only
in the contio phase of the process. Since no votes have been cast, I don't
see this as a problem.
Vale,
FVG
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Decimus Iunius Silanus [mailto:danedwardsuk@--------]
> Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2001 10:38 AM
> To: novaroma@--------
> Subject: Re: [novaroma] Re: The Comitia Centuriata is called to order
>
>
> I understand and appreciate the need for the forthcoming
> elections to take place under the revised rules but given that
> the comitia centuriata has been called to order prior to the lex
> being passed (assuming it does pass), should not the original
> rules apply. Otherwise we seem to be talking about retroactive
> legislation, which although is probably a good thing in this
> case, is still surely an undesirable precedent to set.
>
> Vale
>
> Decimus Iunius Silanus
>
>
> >> Just wondering - Given that the results of the vote on changing the
> >> voting rules for the Comitia Centuriata are not yet either known nor
> >> ratified, does this mean that now the centuries have been called to
> >> order the original system still applies for the forthcoming elections
> >> (ie. 97 out of 193 centuries required)?
> >
> > If the lex was passed, the new rules will apply to the current
> election. We
> > should know any time now whether it was or not.
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
|
| Subject: |
[novaroma] Re: [novaroma_europe] Endorsement |
| From: |
"Franciscus Apulus Caesar" <sacro_barese_impero@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 2 Dec 2001 15:08:20 +0100 |
|
Franciscus Apulus Caesar Gnaeo Salix Astur S.P.D.
> I have to thank you for your extremely kind words, Francisce. I will
> try to help the provincia Italia more, if I find the right way.
My endorsements are the minimum for your good work for our Provincia Italia.
I hope to work with you for many time.
> But I have to correct you in a small detail... I am not Italian! :-).
Ohh.... sorry I even thought you was italian ... i'm displeasing for my
error!
> I do speak Italian pretty well, but I am a Spaniard. Sorry about that
> :-).
You speak italian very weel. This confused me and I ask you sorry.
Congratulation for your knowledge of our language.
> However, it is true that I have a personal "special relationship"
> with Italia, and I consider it my second homeland. Italia has always
> been, and will always be, very close to my heart.
.. and we (me of course) consider you an italico cives.
This doesn't change our relationships...!
Franciscus Apulus Caesar
-------------------------------------------
Provincia Italia
Paterfamilias Gens Apula
www.gensapula.too.it
----------------------------------------
Alme Sol ... Possis Nihil Urbe Roma Visere Maius
|
| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] Re: [novaroma_europe] Endorsement |
| From: |
Gnaeus Salix Astur <salixastur@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 2 Dec 2001 08:35:22 -0800 (PST) |
|
Salvete Quirites; et salve, Francisce.
--- Franciscus Apulus Caesar <sacro_barese_impero@--------> wrote:
> Franciscus Apulus Caesar Gnaeo Salix Astur S.P.D.
>
> > I have to thank you for your extremely kind words, Francisce. I
> will
> > try to help the provincia Italia more, if I find the right way.
>
> My endorsements are the minimum for your good work for our Provincia
> Italia.
> I hope to work with you for many time.
Thank you once more. I also hope that we can continue collaborating.
> > But I have to correct you in a small detail... I am not Italian!
> :-).
>
> Ohh.... sorry I even thought you was italian ... i'm displeasing for
> my
> error!
No problem. It certainly is a compliment :-).
> > I do speak Italian pretty well, but I am a Spaniard. Sorry about
> that
> > :-).
>
> You speak italian very weel. This confused me and I ask you sorry.
> Congratulation for your knowledge of our language.
Thank you once more. I learnt it when I was a child, so it is not my
own merit. I will try to improve, though :-).
> > However, it is true that I have a personal "special relationship"
> > with Italia, and I consider it my second homeland. Italia has
> always
> > been, and will always be, very close to my heart.
>
> .. and we (me of course) consider you an italico cives.
> This doesn't change our relationships...!
Of course it doesn't. Thank you for the consideration. It is a true
honour to be counted among the Italici.
=====
Bene Valete in Pace Deorum!
Gnaeus Salix Astur.
Legatus Externis Rebus Provinciae Hispaniae
Triumvir Academiae Novae Romae in Thule
Scriba ad Res Externas Academiae Novae Romae in Thule.
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Buy the perfect holiday gifts at Yahoo! Shopping.
http://shopping.yahoo.com
|
| Subject: |
[novaroma] [Fwd: [NovaromaVizantia] Censored Messages on the mail list] |
| From: |
Michel Loos <loos@--------> |
| Date: |
02 Dec 2001 10:27:50 -0200 |
|
Salvete,
since our current Curatrix sermonem ask for me to show censored messages
here comes o forward of an old matter.
Manius Villius Limitanus
-----Forwarded Message-----
From: Michel Loos <loos@-------->
To: NovaromaVizantia@--------
Subject: [NovaromaVizantia] Censored Messages on the mail list
Date: 24 Jun 2001 11:25:01 -0300
Salvete,
the curatrix sermonem censores systematically all my messages on the
main-list
I send here a copy of the last 2 messages that were censored.
Vale,
Vediorum amandandorum est
Manius Villius Limitanus
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
----
>From - Sun Jun 24 11:14:35 2001
Return-Path: <justicecmo@-------->
X-Sieve: cmu-sieve 2.0
Received: from mail1.registeredsite.com (mail1.registeredsite.com [64.224.9.10])
by qt1.iq.usp.br (8.12.0.Beta10/8.12.0.Beta10) with ESMTP id f5N3mwXC020807
for <loos@-------->; Sat, 23 Jun 2001 00:48:59 -0300
Received: from mail.goldenfuture.net (mail.goldenfuture.net [209.35.92.81])
by mail1.registeredsite.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id f5N3mti17541;
Fri, 22 Jun 2001 23:48:55 -0400
Received: from computer [209.35.92.81] by mail.goldenfuture.net
(SMTPD32-6.04) id A19C109A012E; Fri, 22 Jun 2001 23:48:44 -0400
From: "JusticeCMO" <justicecmo@-------->
To: <loos@-------->
Cc: <trog99@-------->
Subject: Message not approved: The Comitia Plebis Tributa and The Tribunes
Date: Fri, 22 Jun 2001 23:43:59 -0400
Message-ID: <LOBBKOACDNNCMDHLDHLHMEPHGAAA.justicecmo@-------->
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3 (Normal)
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0)
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300
Importance: Normal
Pending
To: "michel" <loos@-------->
From: justicecmo@--------
Date: Fri Jun 22, 2001 11:43 pm
Salve,
Until the offensive tag line, and any/all other personal attacks, are
reomved from this post it cannot be approved. Please be advised that once
all offensive material is removed it will be reviwed without prejudice.
Priscilla Vedia Serena
Curatrix Sermonis
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Flavius Vedius Germa--------s" <germa--------s@-------->
> To: <novaroma@-------->
> Sent: Friday, June 22, 2001 7:49 PM
> Subject: RE: [novaroma] The Comitia Plebis Tributa and The Tribunes
>
>
> > Salve
> >
> > > -----Original Message-----
&g--------g--------g--------rom: labienus@-------- [mail--------abienus@--------]
> > > Sent: Friday, June 22, 2001 9:25 AM
> > >
> > > While I am certainly no special authority on Roman history, it seems
to
> me
> > that
> > > none of the above necessarily points to the tribuni having to
> collegially
> > agree
> > > upon a veto, though there is ample implication to make an argument for
> it.
> > If
> > > we choose to go this route, it does appear that the tribuni did not
have
> > to
> > > specifically agree on a veto, but rather simply had not to disagree
> > explicitly.
> >
> > I agree. Indeed, one of the passages you quoted seems to specifically
> > support the view that a single Tribune could "bollux the works" by
> > nullifying a tribunicial intercessio:
> >
> > > For there would never be wanting a tribune who would be
> > > glad to triumph over his colleague and secure the favour of the better
> > party
> > > for the good of the State. If more were needed, more were ready to
come
> to
> > the
> > > assistance of the consuls, even one was sufficient, against the rest.
> >
> > The "If more were needed" seems simply to represent the desire to look
> good,
> > with a number of tribunes supporting the nullification, as opposed to
> simply
> > having a single obstinant tribune blocking the will of the others; this
> > could also have something to do with the previously-discussed method of
> > getting rid of a recalcitrant tribune; the Patricians weren't the only
> > people who could lop off a head, you know... I think we should start
> looking
> > away from the majority-of-Tribunes idea, and back to the original
proposal
> > (or rather, the new draft). That is:
> >
> > * Any tribune can pronounce intercessio
> > * Any other tribune, even one, can deny it
> > * Lack of nullification represents tacit approval of the intercessio
> >
> Salve,
>
> I agree (sic) with consul Vedius on this point. It seems to me this was
the
> ancient way,
> and still is the most adapted to our nation.
>
> Vediorum amandadorum est
>
> Vale,
>
> Manius Villius Limitanus
>
> > Vale,
> >
> > Flavius Vedius Germanicus,
> > Consul
> >
> > email: germa--------s@--------
> > AIM: Flavius Vedius
> > www: http://mediatlantica.novaroma.org
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> >
> >
----
>From - Sun Jun 24 11:13:58 2001
Return-Path: <justicecmo@-------->
X-Sieve: cmu-sieve 2.0
Received: from mail3.registeredsite.com (mail3.registeredsite.com [64.224.9.12])
by qt1.iq.usp.br (8.12.0.Beta10/8.12.0.Beta10) with ESMTP id f5O3tTXC026799
for <loos@-------->; Sun, 24 Jun 2001 00:55:30 -0300
Received: from mail.goldenfuture.net (mail.goldenfuture.net [209.35.92.81])
by mail3.registeredsite.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id f5O3tOs19202;
Sat, 23 Jun 2001 23:55:24 -0400
Received: from computer [209.35.92.81] by mail.goldenfuture.net
(SMTPD32-6.04) id A4A229FD0090; Sat, 23 Jun 2001 23:55:14 -0400
From: "JusticeCMO" <justicecmo@-------->
To: "Michel Loos" <loos@-------->
Cc: <trog99@-------->
Subject: RE: [novaroma] Re: For the record....
Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2001 23:47:33 -0400
Message-ID: <LPBBIONJOJKKCJACFMKMEEBOCMAA.justicecmo@-------->
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3 (Normal)
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0)
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300
Importance: Normal
In-Reply-To: <3B34D999.A062F65A@-------->
Salve,
Your message is being rejected as per the post you were sent yesterday
(6/22/01) explaining your current status. Until your post meets the
requirements it will not be approved.
Vale,
Priscilla Vedia Serena
Curarix Sermonem
-----Original Message-----
From: loos [mailto:loos]On Behalf Of Michel Loos
Sent: Saturday, June 23, 2001 2:02 PM
To: novaroma@--------
Subject: Re: [novaroma] Re: For the record....
Robert Woolwine wrote:
>
> Ave,
>
> I also posted his technical difficulties earlier this week. The
> problem is entirely on his end. He needs a new ISP.
>
Salve,
I use no ISP, like other universities mine is on the backbone.
The yahoo mail is faulty in 2 different areas:
the header mangling is badly done and many mails have carecteristics of
being forged mails, that means they are rejected by any reasonably
secure MTA
(the USP one being secure), I removed this security from my private
computer
and the rejected mails dropped from 50% to ~10%.
The remaining 10% come from the fact that yahoo fails to produce unique
IDs for their e-mails the duplicate ids are rejected on the server since
it appears the message have already been received, removing this feature
from the MTA would result in each mail being received n times through
the various possible secondary MXs and obviously will not be done.
I have absolutely no problems in receiving mails from other sources
(including much heavier trafic from the ccl list for instance.)
The alledged mail disappearance is the first such case I hear of and I
use to send some 30 mails/day. This has nothing to do with mail
reception.
I am still trying to understand would could have possibly went wrong and
until
I reach a conclusion I abstain to decide wether it was or not censored.
Vale,
Vediorum amandandorum est,
in vernacular: "besides I think that the Vedii should be removed from
office"
Manius Villius Limitanus
> He is one two lists that I moderate, NovaRomaVizantia and
> NovaRomaLaws.
>
> Respectfully,
>
> Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix
>
> --- In novaroma@--------, "JusticeCMO" <justicecmo@g...> wrote:
> > Salve,
> >
> > I have been waiting for Limitanus to clear up the false accusation
> he made
> > the other day, as it was quite a serious charge with no basis in
> truth. He
> > has chosen not to recant his accusation, nor has he chosen to
> apologize for
> > it, so it falls to me to clear the record of both myself and my
> scribe
> > Pompeia. Without further ado, here are the facts of Limitanus'
> account <all
> > information below can be independently verified by three other
> sources if
> > need be>:
> >
> >
> > >>Account Status
> >
> > Bounce History: Weekly summary
> > Week of 6/16/2001 18 bounce(s)
> > Week of 6/9/2001 25 bounce(s)
> > Week of 6/2/2001 46 bounce(s)
> > Week of 5/26/2001 32 bounce(s)
> >
> > Most recent messages
> > Date Type of message sent Date Bounce Type
> > 6/19/2001 Message#23655 6/21/2001 Soft Bounce
> > 6/17/2001 Message#23617 6/19/2001 Soft Bounce
> > 6/17/2001 Message from another group 6/19/2001 Soft Bounce
> > 6/16/2001 Message#23603 6/18/2001 Soft Bounce
> > 6/15/2001 Message#23578 6/17/2001 Soft Bounce
> >
> > Last Bounce Message:
> >
> > 'Mail server for "qt1.iq.usp.br" unreachable for too long'>>
> >
> > As is now clear to all, there has been no *censorship* of
> Limitanus. He has
> > only his own technical difficulties to blame for any lack of
> postings. I
> > would call again publicly for his apology, and indeed I hope he
> finds the
> > dignitas to do so. Alas, he seems content to let the lie fester.
> No
> > matter, the truth is now out for all to see. I thank you for your
> time and
> > attention.
> >
> > Vale,
> > Priscilla Vedia Serena
> > Curatrix Sermonis
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
|
| Subject: |
[novaroma] T. Apollonius Cicatrix for Aedilis Plebis |
| From: |
"Marcus Apollonius" <m_apollonius@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 2 Dec 2001 17:17:01 +0100 |
|
Salve,
I would like to recommend T. Apollonius Cicatrix to all of you for the post of Aedilis Plebis. He's a marvelous man with democratic ideas. His interests in Roman society are huge and his university studies are about the Roman Civilisation. He's a loyal man, and has been always a huge support to help everybody with new ideas in this society. He won't disappoint any of you.
Tiberius Apollonius Cicatrix for Aedilis Plebis!
Vale bene,
Marcus Apollonius Tacitus
Get Your Free E-mail at http://www.blackspirit.yucom.be
________________________________________________________________
Ontvang uw eigen Web-based E-mail service bij http://www.zzn.com
|
| Subject: |
[novaroma] Lex Vedia de Quaestors |
| From: |
trog99@-------- |
| Date: |
Sun, 02 Dec 2001 18:04:06 -0000 |
|
Salvete Honoured Consul et Omnes:
I cannot say that I like this lex at this time. It is ideal to have
all Quaestors bonded, but I fear, with even the best rates, it is
financially unrealistic right now.
Such legislation will put us in a marginal profit margin after the
cost of bonding is deducted, and it is possible, without accurate
revenue projections that we may be looking at a deficit.
I am not sure about the cost of bondability in Europe, but I would
imagine it is not any more nominal than in this Continent.
As a start, to bond one or two Quaestors who are handling the largest
sums of money would be a prudent measure, and as our revenues
increase, we could eventually bond all quaestors.
The Senatus Consultum on the issue does not recommend Quaestors be
bonded, but rather publicani appointed by them or by Governors to be
bonded.
We must remember, this is a PILOT YEAR for taxation; we will likely
have more wrinkles to iron out of the system than we anticipate.
We do not need legislation, with due respect, which could prove a
major additional stumbling block in this effort.
Bene valete,
Pompeia Cornelia Strabo
Propraetrix Canada Orientalis
Candidate Praetor Urbanus
Nova Roma
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
|
| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] =?iso-8859-1?Q?Sulla=B4s?= Endorsements |
| From: |
Matthias Stappert <3s@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 02 Dec 2001 18:20:43 +0100 |
|
Salve, A. Corve Septimi.
There´s nothing to pardon here. Your question is completely legitim.
Censor Lucius Cornelius Sulla asked something which is also interesting
to know for the voters: My experiences in computers. He asked me using a
private address, so did I. On the first view, the correspondence seems
to be private, I agree. But our voters has a right to hear something
about my experiences in this field.
Vale bene
Caius Flavius Diocletianus
> A. Corvus Septimius C. Flavius Diocletianus
>
> Pardon my intrusion. But isnt this a private
> correspondance? I dont see why ones personal
> correspondance would be posted on the main list.
> Please enlighten me as to this purpose.
>
> vale bene
|
| Subject: |
RE: [novaroma] Against the Lex Vedia de Quaestors |
| From: |
Marcus Octavius Germanicus <haase@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 2 Dec 2001 13:11:42 -0600 (CST) |
|
Salvete Quirites,
As I made my way to the Forum this morning, I was expecting to see
nothing more than the usual campaigning going on. I was somewhat
surprised, and concerned, to see that three proposed new laws have
been put forth for consideration by the people.
One of these proposals, the Lex Vedia de Quaestores, will have a
significant impact on our Republic: it will cause a significant
drain of our treasury, and will more than negate the benefits of
the taxation that we voted into law last summer.
The Lex Vedia de Quaestores requires that all Quaestores be "bonded".
Bonding is insurance against fraud or theft on the part of an
employee. We would be required to pay a fee to a company, which
would then guarantee to make good the stolen amount, if we can
successfully make a claim. Substantial evidence of the wrongdoing
would be required in order for the claim to be paid.
The fee that we would be required to pay for this bonding may be
significant. Estimates have ranged from $100 to $750 per Quaestor.
Even if we were able to obtain coverage at the low end of this
range, the $800 required would be a significant bite out of our
treasury.
We don't know that it will be $100 per Quaestor. What if the higher
estimate holds true? Consider that we are an international
organization - the insurance companies would undoubtedly charge
extra for protection of international transactions.
At $750 per Quaestor, the cost of bonding them all would be $6000.
$6000 is more than our entire budget for next year. It is more
than double what we anticipate taking in in membership dues or
"taxes" throughout the coming year.
If this proposed lex passes, forcing us to bond all Quaestores;
and if the rate of $750 each that one Senator obtained a few months
ago is the best we can do; then Nova Roma will have no money at
all for any of our projects. Every dollar taken in in the form of
taxes shall go directly to the bonding company.
Would you not rather see that money going to archaeological projects
such as Vindolandia, or scholarships for students of history, or
a land fund, or paying back our loan debt, or funding the next coin
or flag project? I know I certainly would.
Only the two Quaestores assigned to the Consuls are required to
handle tax payments from citizens. Neither I nor my probable future
Consular colleague have plans to require or allow the other Quaestores
to handle payments from citizens. Bonding any Quaestores other
than the Consuls' Quaestors is absolutely unnecessary, and it is
a wasteful expenditure of our limited resources.
Additionally, this lex, if passed, would shorten the amount of time
available for payment of taxes. Since no elected Quaestor would
be considered a Quaestor until they have been bonded, we cannot
publish an address for the sending of payments (or even accept
Paypal payments) until the bonding is complete.
The Lex requires the Senate to authorize funds for bonding of
Quaestores; the Consuls cannot simply take money directly from the
treasury and do so without authorization. Thus, even if the
Consuls-elect obtain price quotes for bonding prior to taking office
on January 1st, we would still have to place the item before the
Senate for voting the required funds. This would take at least a
week or two.
To make it worse, on January 1st we may not have the full set of
Quaestores elected! The rule requiring a majority of votes (in
Tribes as well as Centuries) means that there will almost certainly
have to be a "run-off" election shortly after this one, and possibly
another one after that, to fill the remaining Quaestor offices. Unless
the present Consuls call for a run-off election in late December
(the edict for this would have to be published before or during the
initial election, in order that the Contio period be satisfied), it will
not be until about January 18th before the second round of selecting
Quaestores is complete.
Thus, in early January, the Consuls will be forced to ask the Senate
for a large amount of money to seek bonding for a group of people
who have not yet been elected! (And, if the Senate feels the amount
is ridiculously high and votes "no", then the Quaestores-elect will
not be considered Quaestores until the Senate does eventually
authorize the payment).
Tax payments are due at the end of February. We cannot publish
addresses for the handling of these payments until the identities
of the Quaestores are known. Since this is likely to happen in
late January, and the authorization of funds by the Senate is likely
to happen at about the same time, the bonding will probably not be
obtained until, at best, the first week of February.
Citizens, this reduces your time to make tax payments to *three
weeks*. Previously, you had two months. But now, you won't even
know who to send payments to until three weeks before the deadline!
(and what if your payment is lost in the mail? Welcome to Century
#193!)
Quirites, this law cannot be allowed to pass. If it does, your
time for making tax payments will shrink from two months to three
weeks; and Nova Roma will be sending all of your tax payments to
an insurance company, leaving little (if anything) left for those
purposes we had initially intended it for.
Please, citizens, vote NO on the Lex Vedia de Quaestores.
Vale, M. Octavius Germanicus,
Candidate for Consul
--
M. Octavius Germanicus
Curator Araneum et Senator
Candidate for Consul MMDCCLV
http://www.konoko.net/~haase/
|
| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] Against the Lex Vedia de Quaestors |
| From: |
Amulius Claudius Petrus <pkkt@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 02 Dec 2001 14:58:54 -0500 |
|
Salvete cives et amici,
Judging from the cost we obviously cannot consider bonding an option. We
might as well kiss all of our treasury goodbye. It would be ironic if we had
to give away a huge amount of the treasury in order to receive money that
was supposed to make it grow.
This proposal is premature and am shocked that it was even considered an
option with the prices we are looking at. Was this even researched before
being put in front of the people of Nova Roma? Does anyone actually support
the Lex Vedia de Quaestores? If so, I would be curious to hear their point
of view.
Valete,
"Quamquam cupido sit delictum ab suis crebro est mater virtutum"
"Though ambition may be a fault in itself it is often the mother of virtues"
--
Amulius Claudius Petrus
Candidate for Aediles Curules
Provincia Legatus Canada Orientalis
Retarius Officium Canada Orientalis
Retarius Officium Gens Claudia
Canada Orientalis Provincia
Please visit my campaign website at:
http://www.virtue.nu/amclaudius/index.htm
Canada Orientalis Website:
www25.brinkster.com/canorien/
Gens Claudia Website:
www.freehost.nu/members/gensclaudia/
--
|
| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] Against the Lex Vedia de Quaestors |
| From: |
"Caius Puteus Germanicus" <puteus@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 2 Dec 2001 20:29:58 +0100 |
|
Caius Puteus Germanicus omnibus salutem!
Please let us first take a look at the real income Nova Roma will generate from the taxes before spending it all to 'binding' or quaestores. If we would be honest, it would all not be worth while.
First of all, when we have the central taxation system very well organised, what do we do with the decentral taxes? A lot of provinciae are talking about generating their own 'income' for local use at festivals etc. We can't bind every civis that will have something to do with organising something, can we?
Secondly, we have 8 quaestores. When we divide the money over all these people, the highest risk we take is losing 1/8 of it when one person leaves us or cheats on us. But the cost would still be lower! I think it is indeed necessary to bring a system into place, that makes quaestores sign a 'contract' with our organisation in which they declare that they will manage the finances without any personal profit. These contracts can be binding for the law as well! We can have such a standard contract made up by the appropriate magistrates and than use it for both the central and provincial authorities.
There is of course the other possibility in which there are always two signatures required to get some money transfer, but this would be quite difficult given the fact that we are a global organization!
Vale optime in pace deorum!
Caius Puteus Germanicus
Civis Provinciae Novae Romae Galliae / Germaniae Inferioris
Rogator MMDXXIV AUC
Praefectus Sodalitatis Egressi Germaniae Inferioris Europaeque Occidentalis
http://www.geocities.com/germania_inferior/
http://www.geocities.com/caius_puteus_germanicus/
----- Original Message -----
From: Marcus Octavius Germanicus
To: novaroma@--------
Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2001 8:11 PM
Subject: RE: [novaroma] Against the Lex Vedia de Quaestors
Salvete Quirites,
As I made my way to the Forum this morning, I was expecting to see
nothing more than the usual campaigning going on. I was somewhat
surprised, and concerned, to see that three proposed new laws have
been put forth for consideration by the people.
One of these proposals, the Lex Vedia de Quaestores, will have a
significant impact on our Republic: it will cause a significant
drain of our treasury, and will more than negate the benefits of
the taxation that we voted into law last summer.
The Lex Vedia de Quaestores requires that all Quaestores be "bonded".
Bonding is insurance against fraud or theft on the part of an
employee. We would be required to pay a fee to a company, which
would then guarantee to make good the stolen amount, if we can
successfully make a claim. Substantial evidence of the wrongdoing
would be required in order for the claim to be paid.
The fee that we would be required to pay for this bonding may be
significant. Estimates have ranged from $100 to $750 per Quaestor.
Even if we were able to obtain coverage at the low end of this
range, the $800 required would be a significant bite out of our
treasury.
We don't know that it will be $100 per Quaestor. What if the higher
estimate holds true? Consider that we are an international
organization - the insurance companies would undoubtedly charge
extra for protection of international transactions.
At $750 per Quaestor, the cost of bonding them all would be $6000.
$6000 is more than our entire budget for next year. It is more
than double what we anticipate taking in in membership dues or
"taxes" throughout the coming year.
If this proposed lex passes, forcing us to bond all Quaestores;
and if the rate of $750 each that one Senator obtained a few months
ago is the best we can do; then Nova Roma will have no money at
all for any of our projects. Every dollar taken in in the form of
taxes shall go directly to the bonding company.
Would you not rather see that money going to archaeological projects
such as Vindolandia, or scholarships for students of history, or
a land fund, or paying back our loan debt, or funding the next coin
or flag project? I know I certainly would.
Only the two Quaestores assigned to the Consuls are required to
handle tax payments from citizens. Neither I nor my probable future
Consular colleague have plans to require or allow the other Quaestores
to handle payments from citizens. Bonding any Quaestores other
than the Consuls' Quaestors is absolutely unnecessary, and it is
a wasteful expenditure of our limited resources.
Additionally, this lex, if passed, would shorten the amount of time
available for payment of taxes. Since no elected Quaestor would
be considered a Quaestor until they have been bonded, we cannot
publish an address for the sending of payments (or even accept
Paypal payments) until the bonding is complete.
The Lex requires the Senate to authorize funds for bonding of
Quaestores; the Consuls cannot simply take money directly from the
treasury and do so without authorization. Thus, even if the
Consuls-elect obtain price quotes for bonding prior to taking office
on January 1st, we would still have to place the item before the
Senate for voting the required funds. This would take at least a
week or two.
To make it worse, on January 1st we may not have the full set of
Quaestores elected! The rule requiring a majority of votes (in
Tribes as well as Centuries) means that there will almost certainly
have to be a "run-off" election shortly after this one, and possibly
another one after that, to fill the remaining Quaestor offices. Unless
the present Consuls call for a run-off election in late December
(the edict for this would have to be published before or during the
initial election, in order that the Contio period be satisfied), it will
not be until about January 18th before the second round of selecting
Quaestores is complete.
Thus, in early January, the Consuls will be forced to ask the Senate
for a large amount of money to seek bonding for a group of people
who have not yet been elected! (And, if the Senate feels the amount
is ridiculously high and votes "no", then the Quaestores-elect will
not be considered Quaestores until the Senate does eventually
authorize the payment).
Tax payments are due at the end of February. We cannot publish
addresses for the handling of these payments until the identities
of the Quaestores are known. Since this is likely to happen in
late January, and the authorization of funds by the Senate is likely
to happen at about the same time, the bonding will probably not be
obtained until, at best, the first week of February.
Citizens, this reduces your time to make tax payments to *three
weeks*. Previously, you had two months. But now, you won't even
know who to send payments to until three weeks before the deadline!
(and what if your payment is lost in the mail? Welcome to Century
#193!)
Quirites, this law cannot be allowed to pass. If it does, your
time for making tax payments will shrink from two months to three
weeks; and Nova Roma will be sending all of your tax payments to
an insurance company, leaving little (if anything) left for those
purposes we had initially intended it for.
Please, citizens, vote NO on the Lex Vedia de Quaestores.
Vale, M. Octavius Germanicus,
Candidate for Consul
--
M. Octavius Germanicus
Curator Araneum et Senator
Candidate for Consul MMDCCLV
http://www.konoko.net/~haase/
|
| Subject: |
[novaroma] Against the Lex Vedia de Oratio |
| From: |
Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix <alexious@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 02 Dec 2001 12:29:06 -0800 |
|
Avete Omnes,
I come before the Rostra to speak out AGAINST the Lex Vedia de Oratio.
I think this law is completely unnecessary. We should keep the language
policy just that...a policy. Not a law. Policies can be easily
adapted, changed based on the growing demographics of Nova Roma. Laws
require time to revise, preparation to bringing them to a vote and then
campaigning for the law to be passed....defended against to those who
are against it.
In addition to this, I must add that this law runs counter to the will
of the Senate. Recently the Senate of Nova Roma passed a unanimous
Senatus Consulta. I believe this proposed lex runs counter to the
wishes of the Senate. Specifically IV. where the Senatus Consulta
states, "The Curator Sermo shall have the authority to set language]
policy for those communications fora under his administration."
Quirites, there is no reason this law should be passed. The ML has been
operating on a smooth sail since our Curaeto Sermo published the
language policy. So why corner the list moderator? I wont come to any
conclusions, I leave that to citizens of Nova Roma.
I hope you will all join me in voting down this unnecessary and stifling
law.
Very Respectfully,
Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix
Candidate for Consul
II. Lex Vedia de Oratio
This Lex Vedia de Oratio is hereby enacted in order to define the policy
for
language use on those official fora for communications administered by
the
Curator Sermo.
I. Whereas, the essential purpose of the email list(s) administered by
the
Curator Sermo is to foster communication, dialog, and understanding
among
the Cives of Nova Roma, and,
II. Whereas, English is at the present time that language which is best
understood by the majority of Nova Roman citizens, either as a first or
second language;
III. Is it hereby mandated that all posts to those electronic mail lists
and
other communications fora adminstrated by the Curator Sermo may be made
in
any language the poster may find convenient and/or appropriate, but must
also be accompanied and/or followed by a suitable and accurate
translation
into English.
IV. The Curator Sermo shall arrange, as available and practical, to make
available voluntary translators to assist those cives who might not have
the
knowledge and/or resources to make their own translations.
V. Failure of the Curator Sermo to enforce this measure shall be
considered
grounds for removal from office.
|
| Subject: |
[novaroma] Languages |
| From: |
"S. Apollonius Draco" <hendrik.meuleman@--------> |
| Date: |
Sat, 1 Dec 2001 05:01:28 +0100 |
|
Salvete omnes,
The debate on the language policy is as tedious as it was when the policy
was instituted. Both sides keep rehashing the same arguments, and I'm afraid
that I might say some things which are not very original either, but may
nevertheless be of some help. In any case, that is the way they're intended.
For the sake of clarity, I divided this e-mail into several numbered
paragraphs.
(1) We will all have to agree that on the internet, and within the largest
part of newsgroups, English is the de facto standard language. Even in order
to become a citizen of Nova Roma, a basic amount of knowledge of English is
necessary. For that reason alone, to equal its status to all other languages
on this forum would be absurd - even if such other language would be Latin.
(2) As extension to my thoughts on Latin, I must balance my first opinion
somewhat. Since it has been established as a second official language of
Nova Roma through a Senatus Consultum, one might expect that in the future,
there will be made more frequent use of it. Up until now, most citizens'
Latin is of an abominable quality. A growing group of people does an
excellent effort at at least learning the basics, which is laudable, but
there is a lot of work to be done. Even among the highest magistrates,
mistakes are still frequent, and it is generally not appreciated if those
mistakes are corrected. This bad habit should change, in my humble opinion.
(3) About half of NR's citizens are not anglophonic by nature. So, roughly,
the same composition will be found among the main list members. If, for
example, a Russian citizen would have an interesting idea, but lacks
proficiency in English, it will become very hard for that person to
communicate his or her ideas. Therefore, making use of language scribes of
the Curator / Curatrix Sermonis is an excellent idea. However, this should
not be made mandatory. If we go back to that same example, this Russian
citizen can write in Russian, knowing that he or she will most likely not be
understood by the majority of listmembers. So be it. I believe in free
choice. If a citizen does not wish to make use of the language scribes, that
is his or her choice.
(4) The Curator / Curatrix Sermonis should be able to understand all
incoming messages. Now, the question has frequently brought up, that what if
we allow the free use of all languages, and that for example a citizen
starts posting the most vulgar of insults in Swahili on the main list. A
first immediate counter-question could be: how likely is that to happen -
and if it does, how likely is it to be found out by a governmental network?
The second question, which contains the actual answer to the hypothetical
situation: who will care? If someone understands Swahili, this matter will
be brought to attention. If only the offender knows Swahili, one might
wonder by what perverse motivations he or she is driven to post insults in a
language nobody understands.
In other words, my personal conclusion is that we should accept English as
our de facto standard language but not impose it, and, improve the general
quality of Latin in Nova Roma.
Valete bene,
S. Apollonius Draco
<< PETITOR AEDILIS PLEBIS >>
|
| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] Against the recent Leges Vediae |
| From: |
Matthias Stappert <3s@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 02 Dec 2001 22:08:11 +0100 |
|
Caius Flavius Diocletianus Quiritbus S.P.D.
Citizens, I raise my voice to concur to our honored Censor Lucius
Cornelius Sulla, a man who surely will be Consul next year, together
with his esteemed Collega, Curator Aranae Marcus Octavius Germanicus.
Two Senatores with a lot of experiences.
Two leges are proposed: One for bonding all Quaestors, on for fixing the
language policy.
Senatores Sulla and Octavius Germanicus made considerable remarks
against the Lex Vedia de Quaestores. There is nothing to add. The Lex
would make all attempts to construct a healthy monetary basis for our
res Publica to a farce. Too much funds would be spended - for an
insurance. Is it that why we proposed Taxes? I think not. There is only
one vote: AGAINST the Lex Vedia de Quaestores.
The Lex Vedia de Oratio is another law which is completely unnecessary.
Language policy means policy, no less, no more. The Curator Sermonem is
responsible to adapt the policy. If we had such a law, why we would need
a Curator Sermonem as elected magistrate? This task could be done by a
Scriba, attached to a senior magistrate like a Consul or Praetor, or to
the Curator Aranae. Especially in the language question we need
flexibility. The Senatus Consultum mentioned by Senator Sulla was issued
because of that. We have a magistrate with a specific task: To set the
policy. Because this he is elected.
A law for language policy would mutate the Curator Sermonem from an
important magistrate to a simple official to execute the law. Here too
only one vote is right: AGAINST the Lex Vedia de Oratio.
Valete
Caius Flavius Diocletianus
Praetor, Senator
Candidate for Censor
|
| Subject: |
Demographics Correction Re: [novaroma] Languages |
| From: |
Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix <alexious@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 02 Dec 2001 13:26:12 -0800 |
|
Avete Omnes,
I just have a slight correction in the post made by Sextus Apollonius:
<SNIP>
>
> (3) About half of NR's citizens are not anglophonic by nature. So,
> roughly,
> the same composition will be found among the main list members.
This is incorrect Sextus Apollonius. Earlier in the year I published a
demographic study. It is in the archives of the main list, if you would
like to see it. However, earlier today, I requested a demographic study
again to see just how much our demographics have changed. Well, here is
the result:
country |count
---------------------+-----
United States | 608
Canada | 67
Australia | 35
Italy | 65
Brazil | 42
Spain | 35
Germany | 28
United Kingdom | 45
Argentina | 15
Poland | 13
Belgium | 12
Portugal | 11
France | 10
Switzerland | 12
Mexico | 9
Norway | 7
Turkey | 6
Yugoslavia | 6
New Zealand | 6
Slovakia | 7
Austria | 5
Netherlands | 8
Russia | 4
Czech Republic | 5
Sweden | 7
South Africa | 4
Finland | 3
Croatia | 3
Denmark | 4
Hungary | 2
Israel | 2
Costa Rica | 2
Nigeria | 2
Bulgaria | 1
Colombia | 1
Iceland | 1
Ireland | 2
Japan | 1
Korea | 1
Malaysia | 1
Morocco | 1
Norge | 1
Romania | 2
Singapore | 1
Uruguay | 1
Respectfully submitted,
Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix
Censor of Nova Roma
|
| Subject: |
[novaroma] Against the Lex Vedia de Quaestors and the election of Quaestores |
| From: |
Caeso Fabius Quintilianus <tjalens.h@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 2 Dec 2001 23:10:10 +0100 |
|
Salve Quirites!
It is absolutely clear that we can't vote for Lex Vedia de Quaestores. I
think it is better that the new Consuls deal with this issue, when they
have had time to do some research. I look forward to hear about the new tax
system.
I also fear that the election of Quaestores will be a hassle, we may be
forced to have succesive elections to get all Quaestores elected. If no
problem will show up in this regard, I will be most happy. I think that we
may have to reform the whole election system during the next year.
It will be an interesting year and I wish the new Consuls good luck!
Vale
Caeso Fabius Quintilianus
Quaestor of Nova Roma
Propraetor of Thule
CANDIDATE FOR CURULE AEDILE 2755
The Opinions expressed are my own,
and not an offical opinion of Nova Roma
************************************************
Join the Main List for Nova Roma
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/novaroma
Join the List for the Thule Provincia in Nova Roma
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ThuleNovaRoma/join
************************************************
The homepage of the Nova Roma Provincia Thule:
http://thule.novaroma.org/
************************************************
Aut inveniam viam aut faciam
"I'll either find a way or make one"
************************************************
"Do not give in to hate. That leads to the dark side."
************************************************
Caeso, he who also is known as Christer Edling.
************************************************
Using a keyboard that doesn't want to make L! :-(
************************************************
PRIVATE PHONE: +90 - 10 09 10
DOG BOARDING HOUSE PHONE: +90 - 503 56
MOBILE: +70 - 643 88 80
|
| Subject: |
Re: [novaroma] Against the Lex Vedia de Oratio |
| From: |
Gnaeus Salix Astur <salixastur@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 2 Dec 2001 15:52:41 -0800 (PST) |
|
Salvete Quirites.
--- Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix <alexious@--------> wrote:
> Avete Omnes,
>
> I come before the Rostra to speak out AGAINST the Lex Vedia de
> Oratio.
> I think this law is completely unnecessary. We should keep the
> language
> policy just that...a policy. Not a law. Policies can be easily
> adapted, changed based on the growing demographics of Nova Roma.
> Laws
> require time to revise, preparation to bringing them to a vote and
> then
> campaigning for the law to be passed....defended against to those who
> are against it.
>
> In addition to this, I must add that this law runs counter to the
> will
> of the Senate. Recently the Senate of Nova Roma passed a unanimous
> Senatus Consulta. I believe this proposed lex runs counter to the
> wishes of the Senate. Specifically IV. where the Senatus Consulta
> states, "The Curator Sermo shall have the authority to set language]
> policy for those communications fora under his administration."
Censor Sulla is certainly right in this occasion. I will vote *against*
this proposal, and I urge everyone to do so.
I think that consul Germanicus has made an attempt to solve the
"language policy issue" once and for all. However, I think that this
soluion is slightly premature. We will need more input before we can
even think about setting an uniform language policy law. As Sulla has
stated, language policy has been handled by elected officials until
now. That can be changed, of course; but not in such a haste.
=====
Bene Valete in Pace Deorum!
Gnaeus Salix Astur.
Legatus Externis Rebus Provinciae Hispaniae
Triumvir Academiae Novae Romae in Thule
Scriba ad Res Externas Academiae Novae Romae in Thule.
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Buy the perfect holiday gifts at Yahoo! Shopping.
http://shopping.yahoo.com
|
| Subject: |
Re: Demographics Correction Re: [novaroma] Languages |
| From: |
Gnaeus Salix Astur <salixastur@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 2 Dec 2001 15:58:30 -0800 (PST) |
|
Salvete Quirites; et salve, censor Sulla.
A small correction, to add up to yours, censor :-):
--- Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix <alexious@--------> wrote:
<<snipped>>
> Norge | 1
The name "Norge" is more than correct... in Norwegian :-). The name of
the northernmost kingdom of Europe is "Norway" in English.
=====
Bene Valete in Pace Deorum!
Gnaeus Salix Astur.
Legatus Externis Rebus Provinciae Hispaniae
Triumvir Academiae Novae Romae in Thule
Scriba ad Res Externas Academiae Novae Romae in Thule.
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Buy the perfect holiday gifts at Yahoo! Shopping.
http://shopping.yahoo.com
|
| Subject: |
Re: Demographics Correction Re: [novaroma] Languages |
| From: |
Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix <alexious@--------> |
| Date: |
Sun, 02 Dec 2001 15:45:19 -0800 |
|
Ave,
I have been informed that is probably the case... thanks. I was
uncertain so I left it as it was.
Vale,
Sulla
Gnaeus Salix Astur wrote:
>
> Salvete Quirites; et salve, censor Sulla.
>
> A small correction, to add up to yours, censor :-):
>
> --- Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix <alexious@--------> wrote:
>
> <<snipped>>
>
> > Norge | 1
>
> The name "Norge" is more than correct... in Norwegian :-). The name of
> the northernmost kingdom of Europe is "Norway" in English.
>
> =====
> Bene Valete in Pace Deorum!
> Gnaeus Salix Astur.
> Legatus Externis Rebus Provinciae Hispaniae
> Triumvir Academiae Novae Romae in Thule
> Scriba ad Res Externas Academiae Novae Romae in Thule.
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Buy the perfect holiday gifts at Yahoo! Shopping.
> http://shopping.yahoo.com
>
> Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> ADVERTISEMENT
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
|
