Subject:	[novaroma] Revelations
From:	jmath669642reng@--------
Date:	Wed, 19 Dec 2001 19:28:30 -0500 (EST)

Whooooo Boy!!! I think that I am in real trouble!!!

I did not disclose my other associations before standing for Magistrate
in Nova Roma. I will do so now, but I'm really worried that my
non-disclosure of these obviously strange organizations may interfere
with how NR citizens see my loyalty to NR:

Legion XXIV--Tribune Militum Laticlavius;

Legion VI--Honorary Legate;

Gladiator School--Co-Owner and Senator;

Legion XX--Milles Immunes--Gromaciti;

42nd Regt. of Foot (Rev War-Brit.) -- Adjutant and Capt. Lt.;

British Crown Engineers (Rev War)--Assistant Engineer and Capt. Lt.;

6th Regiment of the Continental Line--Brevet-Major of Continental
Engineers;

British Crown Engineers (F & I)--Associate Engineer and Capt. Lt.;

British Royal Engineers (CW-Mil. Observer)--Brevet-Major;

Quoketaug Rangers (Black Powder Shooting Club / Reenactors
(1745-1865)--President;

Commander Topographical Enginners (Civil War)--Brevet-Major and Chief
Engineer of the New England Federal Brigade;

Naval Landing Party (CW)--Commander, USN and Flag Captain, North Atantic
Blockading Squadron;

Fort Engineer, Fort Nathan Hale Restoration Committee;

Commission Chairman, Ledyard, CT Zoning Board of Appeals;

Council Commissioner Staff and Silver Beaver Holder, Connecticut Rivers
Council, BSA;

Corresponding Secretary, Connecticut Colonial Military Association;

In addition I am currently the Head of two Sodalitas' within Nova Roma
(Militarium and Egressus)and hold down two positions within the
Militarium (Legates de Auxila and Architecturas), as well as being a
Senator and ProConsul of the Nova Britannia Province, and a Lictor.

In addition to the above, I am a dedicated black=powder shooter and an
archery affectionado having a small archery and pistol range in my
basement.

Having revealed all of my interests outside of Nova Roma, I hope that
no-one will question my loyalty to Nova Roma, or will question me in
regard to how well I do my tasks within Nova Roma in comparison to my
tasks outside of Nova Roma. Frankly, in order to do so. anyone will
have to have proof of any charge brought against me which will stand up
to a Praetor's review.

Having said all that, I would ask those who have in thier messages cast
doubt on others in Nova Roma who did not reveal all thier affiliations
prior to thier election to either provide proof of wrongdoing within
Nova Roma, or to cease and desist. We have had a deplorable loss of
citizens in the last week, who were in many ways those people who caused
us to look critically at ourselves (even though some have done so rather
bluntly). Must we be suspicious of every individual because he or she
does not measure up to our personnal critical standards??

Because my friends I tell you now, that if any of you ever heard me at a
Reenactment, you would swear that the British had won the War of
Rebellion (1776-1783) and you would not like at all what this fat,
loud-mouthed, kilted, red coated, sword, dirk, pistol carrying British
Officer has to say about these miserable provinces of North America or
the miserable provincials within them!! However, I have served my time
in my nation's Submarine Force for 20 years, so it will be a tad
difficult to define me as being subversive. Just as I am one of two
Magistrates in Nova Roma who has earned the Cursus Honorium, and again
it may be a tad difficult on the eve of the election to my third term
as Quaestor in NR to accuse me of being disloyal to NR because of my
extensive involvement in reenactment!!! Think about that, when next you
post to the list without solid proof bringing into question those who
have served NR long and well. Innuendo, suspicion, and baseless
accusation have caused this micronation some grievous losses in the
past, and I would ask that we not add to the list, anyone who will
honestly labor to build this micronation. I have in my capacity as
Praetor, Consul, and Senator been party to severe accusations against
several serving Magistrates, but in the final analisys nothing could be
proven. Without proof the problem merely becomes dislike, which while
it can be annoying, is not against the law in this or any other
Republic.

Respectfully Submitted;

Marcus Minucius Audens


Fair Winds and Following Seas!!!


http://community.webtv.net/jmath669642reng/NovaRomaMilitary

Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Revelations
From:	"L. Sicinius Drusus" <lsicinius@-------->
Date:	Wed, 19 Dec 2001 18:12:54 -0800 (PST)

Salvete Senator Audens et Omnes,

Senator you have revealed many of these organizations
in the past. During the summer a regular "feature" on
the Main List was an announcement that you would be
attending an event staged by one or another of the
groups that you have mentioned. Everyone who was
subscribed to this list is well aware of your many
intrests in reenactments.

On the other hand most reasonable people would
consider the formation of a new ROMAN group to be a
newsworthy item, one that would intrest the vast
majority of readers of this list, yet for a full 7
months most readers of Nova Roma's mainlist were
unaware of this new group, and remained unaware until
a former citizen let it out of the bag as part of a
resignation letter that was full of hatred towards
many of the leaders of Nova Roma.

You state that "Innuendo, suspicion, and baseless
accusation have caused this micronation some grievous
losses". I will remind you that the former citizen who
was the source of most of the "Innuendo, suspicion,
and baseless accusations" , who played a prominant
role in keeping the contraversies alive that led to
the staged mass resignations on the Ides of March is
now one of the two Consuls of the SVR. Lest any accuse
me of "Innuendo" I'm talking about Brady Moore Nee
Formosanus.

In addition to Formosanus who made many posts on this
list insulting the magistrates and Senators of Nova
Roma (Despite Senator Auden's request NOT to use a
term he found insulting), Another member of this
organization, Skorkus, managed to get the First Nota
issused by the Censors because of the hatred he
displayed towards some of Nova Roma's Magistrates. The
SVR also includes a citizen who has managed to become
on what ammounts to permant modarated status because
of his attacks on the Senior Consul and the Modarator
of this list, and one of the culprits in the staged
resignations of the Ides of March, a man who abandoned
his office of Tribune on that date.

I have no problem with the fact that these people have
a different vision of what a Roman based group should
be, a vision that is different from that of a majority
of the citizens of Nova Roma. I have a major problem
with the methods that they employed. The insulting
posts directed at the Magistrates of Nova Roma, the
attempts at charachter assassination directed at Sulla
when he refused to knuckle under to their bidding, the
accusations that their losses in the Comitia were the
result of some plot by the "Ogrearchs", the storming
out like a spoiled child when they don't get their
way.

Frankly I'm glad to see 3 of the 4 citizens I
mentioned gone from our ranks, and I'll cry no tears
if the last decides to leave. I have NO problem if
they form their own little Roman group.

I do have a problem with a conflict of intrest. I
can't think of any major group that deems membership
in a rival organization a conflict of intrest for it's
officers.

There is NO doubt that the SVA contains some members
who have a very active dislike or hatred directed at
some of the Magistrates and Senators of Nova Roma.
That these men view the will of the Senate and People
of Nova Roma with disdain, and that these same members
members of the SVA play a prominant role in the
organization.

I maintain that membership in the SVA is very
different from membership in Non Roman organizations,
or in Roman organizations who's leaders do not display
the hostility towards Nova Roma that some members of
the SVA have shown on numerous occasions. The nature
of the SVA as a close mirror of Nova Roma, and the
hostility of some of it's members creates a conflict
of Intrest between being a SVA member and a Magistrate
of Nova Roma.

L. Sicinius Drusus.



--- jmath669642reng@-------- wrote:
> Whooooo Boy!!! I think that I am in real trouble!!!
>
> I did not disclose my other associations before
> standing for Magistrate
> in Nova Roma. I will do so now, but I'm really
> worried that my
> non-disclosure of these obviously strange
> organizations may interfere
> with how NR citizens see my loyalty to NR:
>
> Legion XXIV--Tribune Militum Laticlavius;
>
> Legion VI--Honorary Legate;
>
> Gladiator School--Co-Owner and Senator;
>
> Legion XX--Milles Immunes--Gromaciti;
>
> 42nd Regt. of Foot (Rev War-Brit.) -- Adjutant and
> Capt. Lt.;
>
> British Crown Engineers (Rev War)--Assistant
> Engineer and Capt. Lt.;
>
> 6th Regiment of the Continental Line--Brevet-Major
> of Continental
> Engineers;
>
> British Crown Engineers (F & I)--Associate Engineer
> and Capt. Lt.;
>
> British Royal Engineers (CW-Mil.
> Observer)--Brevet-Major;
>
> Quoketaug Rangers (Black Powder Shooting Club /
> Reenactors
> (1745-1865)--President;
>
> Commander Topographical Enginners (Civil
> War)--Brevet-Major and Chief
> Engineer of the New England Federal Brigade;
>
> Naval Landing Party (CW)--Commander, USN and Flag
> Captain, North Atantic
> Blockading Squadron;
>
> Fort Engineer, Fort Nathan Hale Restoration
> Committee;
>
> Commission Chairman, Ledyard, CT Zoning Board of
> Appeals;
>
> Council Commissioner Staff and Silver Beaver Holder,
> Connecticut Rivers
> Council, BSA;
>
> Corresponding Secretary, Connecticut Colonial
> Military Association;
>
> In addition I am currently the Head of two
> Sodalitas' within Nova Roma
> (Militarium and Egressus)and hold down two positions
> within the
> Militarium (Legates de Auxila and Architecturas), as
> well as being a
> Senator and ProConsul of the Nova Britannia
> Province, and a Lictor.
>
> In addition to the above, I am a dedicated
> black=powder shooter and an
> archery affectionado having a small archery and
> pistol range in my
> basement.
>
> Having revealed all of my interests outside of Nova
> Roma, I hope that
> no-one will question my loyalty to Nova Roma, or
> will question me in
> regard to how well I do my tasks within Nova Roma in
> comparison to my
> tasks outside of Nova Roma. Frankly, in order to do
> so. anyone will
> have to have proof of any charge brought against me
> which will stand up
> to a Praetor's review.
>
> Having said all that, I would ask those who have in
> thier messages cast
> doubt on others in Nova Roma who did not reveal all
> thier affiliations
> prior to thier election to either provide proof of
> wrongdoing within
> Nova Roma, or to cease and desist. We have had a
> deplorable loss of
> citizens in the last week, who were in many ways
> those people who caused
> us to look critically at ourselves (even though some
> have done so rather
> bluntly). Must we be suspicious of every individual
> because he or she
> does not measure up to our personnal critical
> standards??
>
> Because my friends I tell you now, that if any of
> you ever heard me at a
> Reenactment, you would swear that the British had
> won the War of
> Rebellion (1776-1783) and you would not like at all
> what this fat,
> loud-mouthed, kilted, red coated, sword, dirk,
> pistol carrying British
> Officer has to say about these miserable provinces
> of North America or
> the miserable provincials within them!! However, I
> have served my time
> in my nation's Submarine Force for 20 years, so it
> will be a tad
> difficult to define me as being subversive. Just as
> I am one of two
> Magistrates in Nova Roma who has earned the Cursus
> Honorium, and again
> it may be a tad difficult on the eve of the
> election to my third term
> as Quaestor in NR to accuse me of being disloyal to
> NR because of my
> extensive involvement in reenactment!!! Think about
> that, when next you
> post to the list without solid proof bringing into
> question those who
> have served NR long and well. Innuendo, suspicion,
> and baseless
> accusation have caused this micronation some
> grievous losses in the
> past, and I would ask that we not add to the list,
> anyone who will
> honestly labor to build this micronation. I have in
> my capacity as
> Praetor, Consul, and Senator been party to severe
> accusations against
> several serving Magistrates, but in the final
> analisys nothing could be
> proven. Without proof the problem merely becomes
> dislike, which while
> it can be annoying, is not against the law in this
> or any other
> Republic.
>
> Respectfully Submitted;
>
> Marcus Minucius Audens
>
>
> Fair Winds and Following Seas!!!
>
>
>
http://community.webtv.net/jmath669642reng/NovaRomaMilitary
>
>


__________________________________________________
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Subject:	Re: [novaroma] New Citizens and lists...
From:	Maximina Octavia <myownq@-------->
Date:	Wed, 19 Dec 2001 18:21:36 -0800 (PST)

>
> Salvete cives,
Petrus:
> > I also agree. Paters, and maters should take this
on
> as a responsibility of
> leading a gens. Unfortunately in reality I think
> very few do. Since I
> arrived in Nova Roma I have talked to my mater only
> a few times. I had to
> learn the ropes all by myself without any aide from
> my gens. Being an active
> mater/pater that's active within a gens is
> definitely reflected by the
> number of members. Look at the Cornelii empire we
> have in this nation, a
> perfect example of what an active leader can do to a
> gens. =)

MO.: I vote for you for Pater of your Gens. You are
very active and I think you would make a kind and
involved Pater. Why don't you just take over the
duties? You could be the self-designated
representative of your Familia! I am certain this
must be legal.
>
> I am not complaining about being a Claudii,

MO: You should complain!

I am
> honoured to be a member of
> this gens. I just feel as if I a missing out on a
> part of what it is to be
> Roman with having such a silent gens and mater. Oh
> well, I guess that's
> life. =)

MO: Life is only what we make it. Let's have some
support from the Consul in changing the way Familias
are operated. We all need to take a good hard look at
our respective families and each one of us take an
active roll.
>
> Valete,
>
> "Quamquam cupido sit delictum ab suis crebro est
> mater virtutum"
> "Though ambition may be a fault in itself it is
> often the mother of virtues"
>
> --
> Amulius Claudius Petrus
> Candidate for Aediles Curules
> Provincia Legatus Canada Orientalis
> Retarius Officium Canada Orientalis
> Retarius Officium Gens Claudia
> Canada Orientalis Provincia


__________________________________________________
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your unique holiday gifts! Buy at http://shopping.yahoo.com
or bid at http://auctions.yahoo.com

Subject:	[novaroma] elections
From:	Daniel Dreesbach <stakor2000@-------->
Date:	Wed, 19 Dec 2001 18:26:06 -0800 (PST)

Will the write ins be placed on ballots for those offices that are undecided?


Daniel Dreesbach

Tal Shiar RSE INC.

Gaius Geminius Germanus Nova Roma



---------------------------------
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Check out Yahoo! Shopping and Yahoo! Auctionsfor all of your holiday gifts!

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Subject:	Re: [novaroma] New Citizens and lists...
From:	Maximina Octavia <myownq@-------->
Date:	Wed, 19 Dec 2001 18:53:30 -0800 (PST)

--- Ave Gnaeus Salix Astur > >
Sulla: But there is NO reason that a patron
> cannot be all of those
> > things.
>
> A "master"? Like in "Uncle Tom's Cabin"? Are you
> sure?

MO: How inappropriate for you to imply a negative
connotation here. Master can mean many relationships.
Master painter, Master and disciple (Buddhism and
other religions), Master as a teacher, Master degree,
get the idea? I am quickly losing respect for you for
your overstating and twisting facts to suit your
agenda.
Continue to take things out of context and you breed
mischaracterization.
Vale, Maximina Octavia
>
> =====
> Bene Valete in Pace Deorum!
> Gnaeus Salix Astur.
> Legatus Externis Rebus Provinciae Hispaniae
> Triumvir Academiae Novae Romae in Thule
> Scriba ad Res Externas Academiae Novae Romae in
> Thule
> Lictor Curiatus.
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Check out Yahoo! Shopping and Yahoo! Auctions for
> all of
> your unique holiday gifts! Buy at
> http://shopping.yahoo.com
> or bid at http://auctions.yahoo.com
>


__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Check out Yahoo! Shopping and Yahoo! Auctions for all of
your unique holiday gifts! Buy at http://shopping.yahoo.com
or bid at http://auctions.yahoo.com

Subject:	Re: [novaroma] New Citizens and lists...
From:	Fortunatus <labienus@-------->
Date:	Wed, 19 Dec 2001 20:58:36 -0600

Salve Maximina Octavia

>>A "master"? Like in "Uncle Tom's Cabin"? Are you
>>sure?
>
> MO: How inappropriate for you to imply a negative
> connotation here. Master can mean many relationships.


You are making an erroneous assumption here. Cn Salix was the first
person in this conversation to mention the word master. Sulla then used
a definition that Cn Salix did not intend. The portion you quoted above
was Cn Salix' attempt to better define what he meant in the original
message.


> I am quickly losing respect for you for your overstating and twisting

> facts to suit your agenda.
> Continue to take things out of context and you breed
> mischaracterization.


I suggest that it is you taking things out of context, though not
deliberately. Note that if I chose your conversational tactics, I would
now suggest some kind of nefarious agenda on your part. Instead, I
think it was a simple misunderstanding. A little benefit of the doubt
goes a long way toward establishing civility on the list.

Vale
T Labienus Fortunatus
--
Quicquid latine dictum sit, altum videtur.

Subject:	Re: [novaroma] New Citizens and lists...
From:	Amulius Claudius Petrus <pkkt@-------->
Date:	Wed, 19 Dec 2001 22:07:03 -0500

Salve Maximina Octavia,

>Maximina Octavia at myownq@-------- wrote:
>
> MO.: I vote for you for Pater of your Gens. You are
> very active and I think you would make a kind and
> involved Pater. Why don't you just take over the
> duties? You could be the self-designated
> representative of your Familia! I am certain this
> must be legal.

I would of tried to form more interaction between members of my gens, but I
have very little to work from. Our family list is strictly moderated, by my
mater. It would be great if she was around often, but sadly many of my posts
fail to make it to the eyes of my family. Email addresses are also
confidential, and I cannot contact the majority of the members. Were can I
start?

I am proud of my gens, I would just like to see some family interaction. It
is awfully lonely, and it should not be with our size... =(

> MO: Life is only what we make it. Let's have some
> support from the Consul in changing the way Familias
> are operated. We all need to take a good hard look at
> our respective families and each one of us take an
> active roll.

I don't want to cause any problems for my mater. I respect her position as
leader of this great patrician gens. If she would like to hand the job over
then I would gladly accept. Although, that is her decision.

I am curious however if historically there is any evidence of any
paters/maters being replaced while still alive. If so, how did this come
about? Was it a legal issue, or personal family issue?

Vale,

"Quamquam cupido sit delictum ab suis crebro est mater virtutum"
"Though ambition may be a fault in itself it is often the mother of virtues"

--
Amulius Claudius Petrus
Aedile Curule Elect
Provincia Legatus Canada Orientalis
Retarius Officium Canada Orientalis
Retarius Officium Gens Claudia
Canada Orientalis Provincia

Canada Orientalis Website:
www25.brinkster.com/canorien/

Gens Claudia Website:
www.freehost.nu/members/gensclaudia/
--

Subject:	Re: [novaroma] New Citizens and lists...
From:	Fortunatus <labienus@-------->
Date:	Wed, 19 Dec 2001 21:12:36 -0600

Salve Amuli Claudi

> Email addresses are also confidential, and I cannot contact the majority of

> the members. Were can I start?


Perhaps one of the censores would be so kind as to send a message to all
members of your gens. It couldn't hurt to ask.


> I am proud of my gens, I would just like to see some family interaction. It
> is awfully lonely, and it should not be with our size... =(


Hopefully, this message of yours will serve as an advertisement, and you
will shortly receive greetings from your fellow Claudii.


> I am curious however if historically there is any evidence of any
> paters/maters being replaced while still alive. If so, how did this come
> about? Was it a legal issue, or personal family issue?


Historically, a paterfamilias held the position for life. In the case
of an incompetent pater--a male infant, a woman, or an infirm old
man--the closest agnate (relative on the male's side--always male) would
be appointed by the praetor as a 'tutor' who would exercise the
paterfamilias' auctoritas and, rarely, potestas on his/her behalf.

Vale
T Labienus Fortunatus
--
Quicquid latine dictum sit, altum videtur.

Subject:	[novaroma] Re: New Citizens and lists...
From:	"pompeia_cornelia" <trog99@-------->
Date:	Thu, 20 Dec 2001 03:28:06 -0000

---

Salve Amuli Claudi:

This situation troubles me greatly. You, of all people are a most
active member of our nation, yet you are subject to loneliness or a
general lack of comradry within your familia.

Our gens list is moderated as well, but Pater Sulla is quite active,
and is readily approachable. I am sorry that the materfamilias of
your gens is not, and does not leave anyone to moderate the list or
answer gens queries in her absence.

I believe that, in instances like this, where there is scant contact
with the mater/paterfamilias and gens members, you should feel morally
free to leave and seek another gens, if that is what you wish.

Although flippant *gens hopping* is frowned upon for obvious reasons,
there is nothing in the constitution prohibiting you from seeking
another gens.

Perhaps when civites seek alternate gens, the existing mater/pater
will reflect on why that is, and perhaps take steps to make wrongs
right with respect to their approach to their filiae.



Pompeia Cornelia
Propraetrix Canada Orientalis
Nova Roma

Bene vale,
Pompeia

In novaroma@--------, Amulius Claudius Petrus <pkkt@b...> wrote:
>
> Salve Maximina Octavia,
>
> >Maximina Octavia at m--------q@-------- wrote:
> >
> > MO.: I vote for you for Pater of your Gens. You are
> > very active and I think you would make a kind and
> > involved Pater. Why don't you just take over the
> > duties? You could be the self-designated
> > representative of your Familia! I am certain this
> > must be legal.
>
> I would of tried to form more interaction between members of my
gens, but I
> have very little to work from. Our family list is strictly
moderated, by my
> mater. It would be great if she was around often, but sadly many of
my posts
> fail to make it to the eyes of my family. Email addresses are also
> confidential, and I cannot contact the majority of the members. Were
can I
> start?
>
> I am proud of my gens, I would just like to see some family
interaction. It
> is awfully lonely, and it should not be with our size... =(
>
> > MO: Life is only what we make it. Let's have some
> > support from the Consul in changing the way Familias
> > are operated. We all need to take a good hard look at
> > our respective families and each one of us take an
> > active roll.
>
> I don't want to cause any problems for my mater. I respect her
position as
> leader of this great patrician gens. If she would like to hand the
job over
> then I would gladly accept. Although, that is her decision.
>
> I am curious however if historically there is any evidence of any
> paters/maters being replaced while still alive. If so, how did this
come
> about? Was it a legal issue, or personal family issue?
>
> Vale,
>
> "Quamquam cupido sit delictum ab suis crebro est mater virtutum"
> "Though ambition may be a fault in itself it is often the mother of
virtues"
>
> --
> Amulius Claudius Petrus
> Aedile Curule Elect
> Provincia Legatus Canada Orientalis
> Retarius Officium Canada Orientalis
> Retarius Officium Gens Claudia
> Canada Orientalis Provincia
>
> Canada Orientalis Website:
> www25.brinkster.com/canorien/
>
> Gens Claudia Website:
> www.freehost.nu/members/gensclaudia/
> --

Subject:	[novaroma] IMPORTANT ANNOUNCEMENT :)
From:	"pompeia_cornelia" <trog99@-------->
Date:	Thu, 20 Dec 2001 03:58:49 -0000

Pompeia Cornelia Strabo Quiribus Populesque Nova Roma S.P.D.

It has come to my attention that several items have been presented
over the course of 2754 A.U.C., as potential products to be advertised
in the Macellum.

After due proponderance, and *unofficial* permission, I have taken it
upon myself to *volunteer * to disclose these items, and offer my
sincere regrets at their having been given the unofficial *gong* :)

In keeping with a general attitude of *virtutis*, the names of the
petitioning individuals/groups shall not be disclosed, as this may
cause undue embarrassment and a feeling of rejection on their parts.
Consequently, only the products will be mentioned.

HOME ACCENTS

SPQR Red and Gold hand-crocheted toilet seat cozies

Vomitoriums ????

Magistarial "Damnit Dolls" (prices depending on demand)

Magistrates in the Corner Dolls (varying sizes, prices depending on
demand)

BOOKS

Tales from the Tullian Keep

Trolling, Spamming, Lurking and Hacking for Dummies

The Complete Guide to Understanding a Man
The Complete Guide to Understanding a Woman
(Notae: Although the presentation of the binding was beyond reproach,
there was not a shred of constructive advise in these volumes, so I am
told; in fact, every page was a blank...imagine!)

Virtual Roman Feasts on a Budget

GAMES AND NOVELTIES


Pin the Ass's Ears on Midas

Battery Operated Moving Medusa Wigs

SPQR Oozie Squirt Guns


BUT WAIT..........THERE'S MORE!!!!



MUSIC

"The Dixie Curatrices Greatest Hits" (DVD) featuring their smash hits,
"Lipstick on the Monitor, Told a Tale on YOU-U!" and "URL's Gonna
DiiiiiiiEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!"

Also..........


Recorders with free bonus parchment scroll containing words and music
to "God/Gods Save Our Gracious Consuls"

"Gne and De Sing the Best of Lawrence Welk........in Latin!!" (CD;
DVD)

Oh, how I hate to be the bearer of bad news.........alas, someone has
to do it.

Better success next time!!

P. Cornelia
Musea Thalia,
Sodalitas Musarum
NOVA ROMA

Subject:	[novaroma] A Welcoming for new gens member
From:	"Sybil Leek" <PrimaRituliaNocta@-------->
Date:	Wed, 19 Dec 2001 20:03:57 -0800

Salve Omnus,

I am very happy and pleased to announce a new member to my gens. Our new
family member is named Sextus Ritulus Tranquillus. We have spoken at great
length in the last few days and he is very interested in learning more about
the priesthood of the Flamen Volcanalis. If any of you could help him learn
more about this position and assist him with educational materials and
support, I would greatly appreciate any help in he personal quest.
Tranquillus can be contacted at the following email:
chandos_deborg@--------

He realizes that he cannot petition to enter the priesthood until he has
been a member for six months in NR, however he is very interested in using
that time to learn more about the office and its duties. During speaking
with him I have also discovered that he is learning how to build period
Roman armor and is hoping to go into business selling such. Thank you all
for any assistance you can give him it is greatly appreciated.

Vale Prima Ritulia Nocta


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Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Revelations
From:	mark zona <pitdog2002@-------->
Date:	Wed, 19 Dec 2001 20:40:15 -0800 (PST)

Snip:

> Because my friends I tell you now, that if any of
> you ever heard me at a
> Reenactment, you would swear that the British had
> won the War of
> Rebellion (1776-1783) and you would not like at all
> what this fat,
> loud-mouthed, kilted, red coated, sword, dirk,
> pistol carrying British
> Officer has to say about these miserable provinces
> of North America or
> the miserable provincials within them!!

UNsnip:

So what exactly is your point?

Marcus Antonius Zeno

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Subject:	Re: [novaroma] elections
From:	Marcus Octavius Germanicus <haase@-------->
Date:	Wed, 19 Dec 2001 23:06:38 -0600 (CST)

Salve Gai Gemini,

By law, only those candidates who declared during the period for doing so,
and whose names appeared on the edict that called for the election, can
be on the ballot. "write-in" candidates might still win, but only if they
can convince enough voters that they are worthy of election.

Vale, Octavius.

> Will the write ins be placed on ballots for those offices that are undecided?
>
>
> Daniel Dreesbach
>
> Tal Shiar RSE INC.
>
> Gaius Geminius Germanus Nova Roma
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
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> Check out Yahoo! Shopping and Yahoo! Auctionsfor all of your holiday gifts!
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>

Marcus Octavius Germanicus
Curator Araneum et Senator, Nova Roma
Senior Consul-Elect, MMDCCLV (2002)

Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Replies on SVR (sorry, long)
From:	"S. Apollonius Draco" <hendrik.meuleman@-------->
Date:	Thu, 20 Dec 2001 06:46:28 +0100

Salve Luci Corneli,

Ego scripseram:
> Why would it [matter]. Only political vultures, scandalmongers and
hysterics would
> make a fuss out of this. The matter of clientelism occured _within_ Nova
> Roma. What I do outside of Nova Roma is not really anyone's business.
>

Scripsisti:
> Sulla: Are you actually telling everyone on the Nova Roma main list that
it is not our concern as citizens of Nova Roma that you have chosen to
become involved in another organization that will drain your time and
resources instead of devoting your time to Nova Roma and to the People of
Nova Roma who elected you? Does conflict of interest mean NOTHING to you?
I say to you, Sextus Apollonius that if that is the case step down from your
newly elected position and give it to someone else who will devote the time
and energy necessary to the Aedileship. You, Sextus Apollonius, cannot have
your cake and eat it too. You should choose what organization you want to
serve and devote your time to it. If it is not Nova Roma, be man enough to
admit it and move on!
>

Sorry, this reasoning is flawed. If I would be an officer in a local darts
club, it would drain my time and resources as well. My studies, which are
quite heavy, are doing this, too. Even my social life is draining time and
resources. Should I quit all of this in order to become a Nova Roma
workaholic? Let me tell you that in my time of being here while SVR (and
that is the _only_ proper acronym for it) already existed, I was more active
than about 900 of our own citizens. This will continue to be that way. There
is no "conflict of interest".

Vale,
S. Apollonius Draco

Subject:	[novaroma] Gens reduction/ideas?
From:	"Sybil Leek" <PrimaRituliaNocta@-------->
Date:	Wed, 19 Dec 2001 23:45:14 -0800

Salve Omnes,

I would like to add my thoughts to this also.

Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2001 11:25:54 +0100
From: "Caius Puteus Germanicus" <puteus@-------->
Subject: Re: New Citizens and lists...

Ave Lucie Cornelie Sulla, ave Tite Labiene Fortunate et avete omnes!

After reading this thread, I have to make a few remarks. First of all, if
people join existing gentes, it is clear that the Claudii, Cornelii Julii
and other well known names will attract more than e.g. the Labieni or Putei.
This has little to do with what people know of the respective gentes, with
where they are located, what patron deities they have or whether the Pater
or Mater is very active.

Perhaps giving a basic outline of the gens could help new perspective
members make clearer choices. Thereby evening out the over all joining
ratio per family.

Nevertheless, I am with senator Sulla here when he says that the familia
needs to be the basis for NR. There are - I suppose - enough gentes by now,
so that the creation of new ones should be discouraged. But please remember
that the above criteria of having a well known name still apply. I am quite
sure that no matter the engagement Senator Fortunatus may have for his
gentiles, his gens is unlikely to grow at very high speed. Can't we have the
subscription form - and here I turn my eyes to Marcus Octavius - something
like this:

I do agree that the family must remain the focus to hold true to the ancient
ideas of Rome. Perhaps we should be limiting the number of members any give
family can have over all, ie a cap number.

Praenomen: - free to choose -
Nomen gentilis - suggested: gens Cassia -
Cognomen: - free to choose -

The suggested nomen is chosen automatically, out of all the gentes accepting
new members, so that all gentes can grow likewise and thus that the
mentorship will be a duty for all the patres and matrones.

To me this is both a good idea and also a bad one. Good because a new
person joining wouldn’t have to think about their options. However, it is
also bad for that same reason, as is it bad because that method may displace
members in one family all over the world making it difficult to become a
true family within NR. One of my main family focus’ is to bring people
physically together for rites and festal gathering, this would make it hard
for me to have a function family.

If the suggested nomen is not accepted, then a list appears with all the
available gentes. When the prospect still doesn't want to choose one of
them, there is a special button he can press in order to fill out a special
form in which he or she can specify the reasons for the creation of a new
gens.

I like this idea because it still allows the individual control over their
choice and desired personal goals.

Of course it is important to find out which gentes are 'dead', i.e. have no
active pater or mater anymore. This can simply be done, everyone who has
voted this elections is considered 'active'. Every pater or mater who is not
yet a civis for six months is excluded from accepting members (hey this
includes me!) because their experience in our republic is too little to
adequately answer the new member's questions.

I understand the importance of having active gentus in NR. Concerning the
question of knowledge of NR and the acceptance of new gens members by a new
mater or pater could be easily fixed by creating a simple page explaining
such things could solve this.

My suggestion is this, create a basic page that informs new maters and
paters of their rights and responsibilities and include other need
information. Needed information being things like what is involved in each
office (censor, preator, tribune, etc.) this information could include both
historic and what is expected within NR to perform the duties of the office.
The page could also include a simple overview of each priesthood and
contact information for each office. Yes, I know this sounds repetitive in
that most of this information is included on NR’s main web page, but I am
speaking of a boiled down and clarified review of the information in
question that could be sent in an informational email to the new mater or
pater.

I am also suggesting the overview because it would have helped me when I
first registered my gens with NR. I am still trying to figure out what the
modern duties are of some of our offices. If on one has the time or
interest in creating an informational page like this, I would be glad to try
to create it with a few questions being answered.

I hope these thoughts will help a bit!

Vale optime in pace deorum!

Caius Puteus Germanicus
Lictor
Rogator MMDXXIV AUC
Scriba Explorator Academiae Thules ad Studia Romana Antiqua et Nova
Praefectus Sodalitatis Egressi Germaniae Inferioris Europaeque Occidentalis
Civis Provinciae Novae Romae Galliae / Germaniae Inferioris
http://www.geocities.com/germania_inferior/
http://www.geocities.com/caius_puteus_germanicus/


Vale Prima Ritulia Nocta


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Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Replies on SVR (sorry, long)
From:	Antonius Corvus Septimius <antoniuscorvusseptimius@-------->
Date:	Thu, 20 Dec 2001 01:41:47 -0800 (PST)

Salve Drac.
>
> Sorry, this reasoning is flawed.

Septimius: If the Consul's reasoning is flawed, then
surely you can give a better discription of the
flaw(s) than this.



If I would be an
> officer in a local darts
> club, it would drain my time and resources as well.
> My studies, which are
> quite heavy, are doing this, too. Even my social
> life is draining time and
> resources.

Septimius: but you still find time to make (forgive)
rediculously long excuses for what you have brought
upon yourself.Do you honestly have that much of a
personal life outside the internet?





Should I quit all of this in order to
> become a Nova Roma
> workaholic?

Septimius: By the Gods, man! you have posted enough
times to have written volumes of your own
ideologies... So lets not pretend, shall we?




Let me tell you that in my time of being
> here while SVR (and
> that is the _only_ proper acronym for it) already
> existed, I was more active
> than about 900 of our own citizens.

Septimius: Active? Have you been "active"? In what way
have you been active?


This will
> continue to be that way. There
> is no "conflict of interest".

Septimius: There is. We do need a centralized form of
which to extend our culture into the real world.Seeing
as though Nova Roma has a tolerance level far beyond
of what I have read in SVR, I would venture to say
that Nova Roma and SVR do have conflicts of interests.



> Vale,
> S. Apollonius Draco



vale indeed----, Septimius


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Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Revelations
From:	Antonius Corvus Septimius <antoniuscorvusseptimius@-------->
Date:	Thu, 20 Dec 2001 01:43:59 -0800 (PST)

--- mark zona <pitdog2002@--------> wrote:
> Snip:
>
> > Because my friends I tell you now, that if any of
> > you ever heard me at a
> > Reenactment, you would swear that the British had
> > won the War of
> > Rebellion (1776-1783) and you would not like at
> all
> > what this fat,
> > loud-mouthed, kilted, red coated, sword, dirk,
> > pistol carrying British
> > Officer has to say about these miserable provinces
> > of North America or
> > the miserable provincials within them!!
>


Septimius: where's the love? :)


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Subject:	Re: [novaroma] What's this?
From:	Antonius Corvus Septimius <antoniuscorvusseptimius@-------->
Date:	Thu, 20 Dec 2001 01:46:49 -0800 (PST)

--- "S. Apollonius Draco" <hendrik.meuleman@-------->
wrote:
> Salve!
>
> > >
> > > I came across this:
> > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Aristocracy/
> > >
> > > Could anyone explain me what kind of group this
> is?
> >
> >
> > SEPTIMIUS: One that you will not be involved
> with..
>
> Oooh I feel soooo left out!
>
> Draco
>
> SEPTIMIUS: Then why ask in the first place, if you
resort to such response? :)

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Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Re: Bashing of the SVR (a little long)
From:	Michel Loos <loos@-------->
Date:	20 Dec 2001 13:18:35 -0200

On Wed, 2001-12-19 at 09:17, L. Sicinius Drusus wrote:
> Salve,
>
> Does the term "conflict of Intrest" mean any thing to
> you? It seems to mean something to the SVA which has
> the following in it's application.
>
> "Do you belong to any other Roman, Classical, Civic,
> Political, Professional, Religious, Artistic or
> Charitable organisations? If so, please list, together
> with any offices you may hold."
>
> That section IS marked as required information.
>
> One Member of the SVA is Bradius V. Maurus Nee
> Formosanus. I have been informed privatly that Gian G
> Reali Nee Piscinus is also a member of SVA. Limitanus
> is also listed as a member. These three men have shown
> a considerable level of hostility towards the
> Magistrates of Nova Roma in the past.
>

Salve,

yes I am a member of SVR, which is absolutely not surprising since
I am interested in Romanitas.
I am also a member of a large number of
other societies from football(soccer) to antique history, passing
through other sports, political parties and syndicates. I really don t
see how this could bring any "conflict of interrest".
In most of those societies I am an _active_ member (not simply paying my
contribution), I try to better them and to fortify them. Since I am
convinced that the Vedii are prejudicial to this micronation I took a
position, and of course I don t change it just because I am repressed by
one of them. Again nothing to do with any participation in other
societies.

Manius Villius Limitanus



> Bradius V. Maurus Nee Formosanus made this statement
> on April 13th in the CPlT mail list.
>
> " I am rather surprised, I must say, that you
> announced your clientship to Sulla *after* the
> election. It is possible that some of us would have
> liked to know about this liaison with such a
> controversial figure *before* voting."
>
> Yet we see his allies holding back on disclosing a
> "liaison" with at least THREE very "controversial
> figures" who have repeatadly shown disdain for the
> Senate and Magistrates of Nova Roma,and whom are
> condicting the "liaison" in an organization that lacks
> the open Forum that Nova Roma has.
>
> L. Sicinius Drusus
>
>
> --- curiobritannicus
> <marcusaemiliusscaurus@--------> wrote:
> > Salve Lucius Sicinius Drusus,
> >
> > > I do recall a post from Bradius V. Maurus earlier
> > this year voicing
> > > his displeasure that the winning canidate for
> > Tribune of the Plebs
> > > failed to disclose that he was a Client of another
> > Citizen, and Now
> > we
> > > find that Draco has also failed to disclose his
> > role in founding an
> > > alternative Roman group, something that could have
> > had an effect on
> > > people's desire to vote for him in the recent
> > election.
> >
> > To be a client of another civis could be important
> > in making
> > political decisions. I fail to see how being
> > involved with another
> > organisation could have the same impact. If so,
> > then all ye members
> > of the SCA declare yourselves! And you of the
> > re-enactment legions
> > too! Frankly, it just makes no difference, unless
> > the SVR were
> > trying to inflict damage on NR in some way.
> >
> > However, for those of you who are uneasy about
> > someone being in more
> > than one organisation: I, Marcus Scribonius Curio
> > Britannicus, am a
> > member of the Societas Via Romana.
> >
> > > I Also find it intresting that Bradius V. Maurus
> > Nee Formosanus is
> > > listed as a member since May the first, and I
> > wonder if he made his
> > > membershp in this alternative organization known
> > to the Senatus of
> > > Nova Roma when he was attempting to become a
> > Propraetor.
> >
> > Why would it matter?
> >
> > > I mentioned the duplicity that he had shown up to
> > that time as
> > reasons
> > > that he was unfit for an office of public trust,
> > since that time he
> > > has added his role in SVR, which he did NOT make
> > plain to the
> > citizens
> > > of Nova Roma, and which I have to reason to think
> > he made plain to
> > the
> > > Senate of Nova Roma when he was attempting to
> > become a Propraetor.
> > > Bradius V. Maurus Nee Formosanus has proven that
> > he is unfit to hold
> > > an office of public trust by his double dealing,
> > and SVR will rue
> > the
> > > day they entrusted this man.
> >
> > I think your face may be getting a little red, mi
> > Drusus. You're
> > making a great deal of fuss about the SVR, but
> > remember one thing;
> > Draco was the one who told the main list of the SVR.
> > If they were
> > planning some great plot to take over NR, do you
> > really think the
> > best strategy would be to tell everyone of the
> > conspirators'
> > existence? If we intended any harm to NR, do you
> > think we would have
> > told you of SVR's existence?
> >
> > > I have also noticed that SVR's rolls contain a
> > citizen from Brazil
> > > named Limitanus, which I doubt is mere chance, so
> > it seems we may
> > have
> > > yet another canidate who has been less than honest
> > with the voters
> > of
> > > Nova Roma,
> >
> > Had you decided to run for Tribune, would you have
> > told NR of every
> > small organisation that you belonged to? Every
> > charity org, every
> > political party, everything? No. Because they do
> > not affect what
> > sort of person you are, nor what talents you have,
> > within NR. And
> > nor does SVR.
> >
> >
> > Bene vale,
> > Marcus Scribonius Curio Britannicus.
> >
> >
>
>
> __________________________________________________
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>
>
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>
>
>

Subject:	[novaroma] Congratulations to all elected magistrates
From:	Michel Loos <loos@-------->
Date:	20 Dec 2001 13:28:17 -0200

Salve,

well the titles says it all:
Congratulations to all elected magistrate both plebeians and patricians.

For the run I was in, the elector choosed, my opponant and I were
opposed on three main points, on the 2 last points (freedom and
independance) the people made their choice, I ll try it again last year.
But on the first point (Universalism=language policy) there was also a
law in the ballot and the people decided against this law.
This for I appeal to the current and next Curatrix sermonis to
reevaluate her policy and to adapt it to the will expressed by the
people by voting against this law.

Vale

Manius Villius Limitanus

Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Foriegn Language Moderation
From:	Michel Loos <loos@-------->
Date:	20 Dec 2001 13:36:34 -0200

On Tue, 2001-12-18 at 21:03, jmath669642reng@-------- wrote:
> Citizens of Nova Roma;
>
> I know that you are probably sick to death of this topic, but I was
> speaking to a Senate Colleague tonight and in our discussion I was
> explaining that I did not understand the argument over the topic
> subject, and I explained my reasoning. After listening to my
> explanation he has askd me to put my reasoning on the Main List to
> insure that everyone understands where I am coming from.
>
> First let me say that I do not object to anyone posting to the NR Main
> List in thier native language. My problem is that the only real
> difference that I see in the two views here is in the immediacy of the
> English translation. The current rules require a translation up front,
> the other side of the street would have the translation come later, if
> at all after the fact, by a volunteer.
>
> The problem here is that as a Magistrate and a Senator, I have been
> elected to the position of a Magistrate and Senator by the people whom I
> represent. This means to me that the people of Nova Roma have appointed
> me to be their eyes and ears, and on occasion thier mouth where all
> cannot go. As their representative they expect me to make decisions
> based on thier ideas, concerns, comments, and complaints. To do that I
> must read he Main List Mail, and I must have the information in that
> mail immediately in order to do the job that the Citizens have taken the
> trouble to appoint me to do. I believe that this is my task in Nova
> Roma, and my belief is strongly supported by being returned to office in
> four consecutive elections by the people of Nova Roma.
>
> It is well known that I am an American, and is also well known that I
> have traveled the world over, and whereever I go, I have endeavored to
> try to speak the native language, at least a little bit / a few words.
> It should also be realized by most Nova Romans who have an interest in
> such hings that my ability in learning new languages is very poor, and
> so in order to do the job that the Citizens of Nova Roma have voted for
> me to do repeatedly, I must have the Main List information in English
> from which to make the decisions, formulate the plans, and make the
> suggestions, that my position given to me by the Nova Roma people
> demands. Such is my feeling that this is my responsibility, and that
> feeling is strongly supported by the people of NR in turn each year.
>
> Now, if any individual does not believe that a Senator and Magistrate
> has that responsibility, I refer you to the Magistrate's Oath and the
> NR Constitution. If anyone thinks that I speak foolish words, or words
> that are untrue , insincere, or just plain false, I can but refer you to
> the people who have elected me, and have continued to elect me in the
> past elections, and in addition, I refer you to my colleagues who are
> both Magistrates and Senators, even those with whom I have not always
> agreed.
>
> In order to do what you have honored me with the responsibility of
> doing, I must know up front what is being said on the NR Main List, in
> English. Such is my task, such is my belief, and such is the call of
> the Citizens of Nova Roma in my belief.
>
> My apologies for my late declaration of this, but I thought my past
> posts had made such quite clear. My colleague however thught that it
> necessary that I should spell it out even more plainly, and at his
> request I have done so.
>
> Respectfully Submitted;
>
> Marcus Minucius Audens
>
> Fair Winds and Following Seas!!!

Honorable Senator,

I perfectly understand your point of view, and agree that in order to be
understood by the vast majority of magistrates and senators the message
has to be ultimately in english.

Please consider that with todays politics, you never even get a chance
to hear the opinions of the number of citizens that are not fluent in
english. They write there messages in the local provincial lists in
portuguese, german, italian, various slavonic languages etc. and you don
t even know about it.
If it could exceptionnaly happen that a message would not be translated
in english after being published on the main list (which I consider
highly improbable), you would see at least most of them.
All this is not about writing in another vernacular language instead of
english, it is about giving the possibility to write for those which don
t today.

Vale,

Manius Villius Limitanus

Subject:	[novaroma] Warp Weighted Loom Woes
From:	Decimus Antoninius Aquitanius <romalist2@-------->
Date:	Thu, 20 Dec 2001 11:15:16 -0500 (EST)

Well, they aren't big woes, I still have some tricks
up my sleeve. However, I built a warp weighted loom
as many cultures have used, but my work pinches in at
the sides as I go. I was wondering if anyone has
experience with this problem or knows a solution. I
would appreciate any help!

Valete!

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Subject:	[novaroma] New (first) gens member!
From:	Decimus Antoninius Aquitanius <romalist2@-------->
Date:	Thu, 20 Dec 2001 11:13:11 -0500 (EST)

Ave Nova Roma!

I am extremely pleased to announce and present to our
Republic the first new member of my gens, Antoninia.

Gaia Antoninia Decemnia from Roma, Italia!

I am very excited that Gaia is part of my gens and I
hope she finds Nova Roma to be everything she hopes it
to be! (And I hope you are in this mail list to read
this, Gaia!)

Therefore,
Ave Gaia Antoninia Decemnia!
Ave Nova Roma!
Valete!

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Subject:	Re: [novaroma] New (first) gens member!
From:	"L. Cornelius Sulla Felix" <alexious@-------->
Date:	Thu, 20 Dec 2001 08:54:32 -0800

Ave,

CONGRATULATIONS!

Vale,

Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix
----- Original Message -----
From: Decimus Antoninius Aquitanius
To: novaroma@--------
Sent: Thursday, December 20, 2001 8:13 AM
Subject: [novaroma] New (first) gens member!



Ave Nova Roma!

I am extremely pleased to announce and present to our
Republic the first new member of my gens, Antoninia.

Gaia Antoninia Decemnia from Roma, Italia!

I am very excited that Gaia is part of my gens and I
hope she finds Nova Roma to be everything she hopes it
to be! (And I hope you are in this mail list to read
this, Gaia!)

Therefore,
Ave Gaia Antoninia Decemnia!
Ave Nova Roma!
Valete!

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Subject:	[novaroma] Re: Nuptial Congratulations!
From:	"Maia" <mjarc@-------->
Date:	Thu, 20 Dec 2001 16:57:01 +0100

Salvete omnes!

For your information: this message got censored when I sent it to your ML, and you might find it interesting. Although no longer a civis, I am still subscribed to the Novaroman mainlist (as are many non-citizens). The cur
atrix has not notified me of anything like putting me on moderated status or of stopping this particular letter for any reason. I realise the list of people to receive this message is somewhat random, but normally you wou
ld have got it in your NR mail anyway. I have gone to so much trouble, because, obviously, the matter is important to me.

Feel free to spread it further, especially if it doesn't make it to the ML again. (I am sending ten separate messages, as Pegasus will let me squeeze only that many addresses into the "to:" field.

Valete!
Maia Silvania Prima

===============================================
===============================================

From: Maia <mjarc@-------->
To: novaroma@--------
Subject: Re: Nuptial Congratulations!
Date sent: Tue, 18 Dec 2001 20:28:22 +0100

Maia Silvania Prima omnibus salutem dicit.

Wrong about the ages. ;-) And after this comment I would probably thank for Iulianus' congratulations (for whatever they are worth) and happily delete another NR digest, if not for one detail. I guess most of you have
noticed.

Surprise, M. Cassi Iuliane, I am a human being with a heart, mind and ability to take decisions. Respect that, even with a woman, even if she is only 22.

Btw, the SVR, not being a micronation, has members, not citizens; Florus has just been made consul under a fair one-man-one-vote system, which we unfortunately cannot say about you; and you are obviously assuming various
things about our Senate and patrician order without having read the Regula. Projecting from what you have here in NR I suppose

===============================================

I want to thank everybody who has expressed their best wishes or
congratulations to us, especially Pompeia Cornelia, who did that on
the list. :-))) And now that the news is out, do visit the URL
everybody. It is something to rejoice at, not attack.

Valete!

On 18 Dec 2001, at 13:37, novaroma@-------- wrote:

> Message: 15
> Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2001 07:53:37 EST
> From: cassius622@--------
> Subject: Nuptual Congratulations!
>
> Salvete,
>
> Although Nova Roma has no formal ties with the "Societas Via
> Romana" as yet, I would like to post my, um, congratulations to
> Formosanus, (a man of 50) who seems to (really!) have gotten
> married to Pica, a girl of but 19 years who is a Citizen of his
> Societas.
>
> It is both interesting to see such an ancient custom being
> revived, and satisfying indeed to see that Patrician, Senator,
> Consul, and Princeps Senatus Formosanus is not using his new
> egalitarian group for any sort of personal gain or self
> aggrandisement.
>
> Here's the URL:
>
http://www.svr.unitron.com.pl/Viaromana/Collegium_Religionis/nuptiae_t
ranscript.htm
>
> Valete,
>
> Marcus Cassius Julianus

Subject:	[novaroma] Re: Announcement of Runoff Elections
From:	Marcus Octavius Germanicus <haase@-------->
Date:	Thu, 20 Dec 2001 11:05:01 -0600 (CST)

Salvete Quirites,

The second election for next year's magistrates has begun, about five
minutes ago; we must elect two Praetores, two Quaestores, and
one Rogator.

http://www.novaroma.org/cursus_honorum/voting/

Valete, Octavius

--
Marcus Octavius Germanicus
Curator Araneum et Senator, Nova Roma
Senior Consul-Elect, MMDCCLV (2002)

Subject:	[novaroma] Re: Nuptial Congratulations!
From:	"justicecmo" <justicecmo@-------->
Date:	Thu, 20 Dec 2001 17:06:59 -0000

Salve,

>>For your information: this message got censored when I sent it to your ML,>>

That is not true. For your message to have been "censored" it would have needed to be *seen*. Neither I nor, to the best of my
knoweldge, Pompeia took any action to reject or delete any prior message by you.

Vale,
Priscilla Vedia Serena
Curatrix Sermonis
Lictor

Subject:	[novaroma] Re: Nuptial Congratulations!
From:	"pompeia_cornelia" <trog99@-------->
Date:	Thu, 20 Dec 2001 17:08:48 -0000

--- Salvete Maia et alii:

No, you are not being censored. It is policy that people who resign
are placed on moderated status, not *censored* . It has been the same,
policywise, since the spring.

You are probably wondering why the delay in your message appearing?
Uhh, I went back to bed for two hours, to be honest. There were no
pending messages at the time. And Priscilla, I believe, is working.

Bene vale,
Pompeia Cornelia
Scriba Curatrix Sermonen
Nova Roma



In novaroma@--------, "Maia" <mjarc@l...> wrote:
>
> Salvete omnes!
>
> For your information: this message got censored when I sent it to
your ML, and you might find it interesting. Although no longer a
civis, I am still subscribed to the Novaroman mainlist (as are many
non-citizens). The cur
> atrix has not notified me of anything like putting me on moderated
status or of stopping this particular letter for any reason. I realise
the list of people to receive this message is somewhat random, but
normally you wou
> ld have got it in your NR mail anyway. I have gone to so much
trouble, because, obviously, the matter is important to me.
>
> Feel free to spread it further, especially if it doesn't make it to
the ML again. (I am sending ten separate messages, as Pegasus will let
me squeeze only that many addresses into the "to:" field.
>
> Valete!
> Maia Silvania Prima
>
> ===============================================
> ===============================================
>
> From: Maia <mjarc@-------->
> To: novaroma@--------
> Subject: Re: Nuptial Congratulations!
> Date sent: Tue, 18 Dec 2001 20:28:22 +0100
>
> Maia Silvania Prima omnibus salutem dicit.
>
> Wrong about the ages. ;-) And after this comment I would probably
thank for Iulianus' congratulations (for whatever they are worth) and
happily delete another NR digest, if not for one detail. I guess most
of you have
> noticed.
>
> Surprise, M. Cassi Iuliane, I am a human being with a heart, mind
and ability to take decisions. Respect that, even with a woman, even
if she is only 22.
>
> Btw, the SVR, not being a micronation, has members, not citizens;
Florus has just been made consul under a fair one-man-one-vote system,
which we unfortunately cannot say about you; and you are obviously
assuming various
> things about our Senate and patrician order without having read the
Regula. Projecting from what you have here in NR I suppose
>
> ===============================================
>
> I want to thank everybody who has expressed their best wishes or
> congratulations to us, especially Pompeia Cornelia, who did that on

> the list. :-))) And now that the news is out, do visit the URL
> everybody. It is something to rejoice at, not attack.
>
> Valete!
>
> On 18 Dec 2001, at 13:37, novaroma@-------- wrote:
>
> > Message: 15
> > Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2001 07:53:37 EST
> > From: c--------us622@--------
> > Subject: Nuptual Congratulations!
> >
> > Salvete,
> >
> > Although Nova Roma has no formal ties with the "Societas Via
> > Romana" as yet, I would like to post my, um, congratulations to
> > Formosanus, (a man of 50) who seems to (really!) have gotten
> > married to Pica, a girl of but 19 years who is a Citizen of his
> > Societas.
> >
> > It is both interesting to see such an ancient custom being
> > revived, and satisfying indeed to see that Patrician, Senator,
> > Consul, and Princeps Senatus Formosanus is not using his new
> > egalitarian group for any sort of personal gain or self
> > aggrandisement.
> >
> > Here's the URL:
> >
>
http://www.svr.unitron.com.pl/Viaromana/Collegium_Religionis/nuptiae_t
> ranscript.htm
> >
> > Valete,
> >
> > Marcus Cassius Julianus

Subject:	[novaroma] Re: New (first) gens member!
From:	"pompeia_cornelia" <trog99@-------->
Date:	Thu, 20 Dec 2001 17:19:22 -0000

---Salve Decime:

I am so pleased for you! Ave!

And a warm welcome to Gaia Antoninia!

Pompeia Cornelia


In novaroma@--------, Decimus Antoninius Aquitanius <romalist2@-------->
wrote:
>
> Ave Nova Roma!
>
> I am extremely pleased to announce and present to our
> Republic the first new member of my gens, Antoninia.
>
> Gaia Antoninia Decemnia from Roma, Italia!
>
> I am very excited that Gaia is part of my gens and I
> hope she finds Nova Roma to be everything she hopes it
> to be! (And I hope you are in this mail list to read
> this, Gaia!)
>
> Therefore,
> Ave Gaia Antoninia Decemnia!
> Ave Nova Roma!
> Valete!
>
> ______________________________________________________
> Send your holiday cheer with http://greetings.yahoo.ca

Subject:	[novaroma] Re: Revelations
From:	"gaius_minucius_hadrianus" <shinjikun@-------->
Date:	Thu, 20 Dec 2001 17:20:24 -0000

Salvete!

<snipped>
There is NO doubt that the SVA contains some members
who have a very active dislike or hatred directed at
some of the Magistrates and Senators of Nova Roma.
That these men view the will of the Senate and People
of Nova Roma with disdain, and that these same members
members of the SVA play a prominant role in the
organization.

I maintain that membership in the SVA is very
different from membership in Non Roman organizations,
or in Roman organizations who's leaders do not display
the hostility towards Nova Roma that some members of
the SVA have shown on numerous occasions. The nature
of the SVA as a close mirror of Nova Roma, and the
hostility of some of it's members creates a conflict
of Intrest between being a SVA member and a Magistrate
of Nova Roma.

L. Sicinius Drusus.
</snipped>

"Are you or have you ever been a memeber of the communist party?"

-Senator "Joe" McCarthy

I think it's time for a reality check here.... We don't need a
McCarthy-esque witch-hunt in NR for SVA members. A citizens private
affiliations should be just that - private. If they want to reveal
them - fine, but we can hardly require it. What would be the
criteria? Every group or organization? Every Roman group or
organization? Or will we generate a "proscribed" list or
organizations? While I certainly didn't care much for the behavior of
some of the current SVA members on this list, it is hardly fair to
ascribe guilt by association. I treat every person I meet on thier
individual merits, not on a basis of thier affiliations, nationality,
etc., and I expect to be treated the same way in return, as I suspect
do the majority of our citizens. Let us please drop this before we
make a mountian from a mole hill?

Valete,

C. Minucius Hadrianus
Lictor Curiatus
Legate of Massachusetts
Scriba Propraetoris, Nova Britannia
Still a Canidate for Quaestor =)

ICQ# 28924742

"Qui desiderat pacem, praeparet bellum." - Vegetius

Subject:	[novaroma] Reply to Antonius Corvus
From:	"S. Apollonius Draco" <hendrik.meuleman@-------->
Date:	Thu, 20 Dec 2001 14:01:06 +0100

Ave Antoni Corve,

<< If the Consul's reasoning is flawed, then surely you can give a better
discription of the flaw(s) than this. >>

I'm not sure I understand what you are saying here. Could you clarify,
please?

<< But you still find time to make (forgive) rediculously long excuses for
what you have brought upon yourself.Do you honestly have that much of a
personal life outside the internet? >>

I do not make excuses. And I would ask you to leave your pointless
insinuations at home.

<< By the Gods, man! you have posted enough times to have written volumes of
your own ideologies... So lets not pretend, shall we? >>

Pretend what?

<< Active? Have you been "active"? In what way have you been active? >>

I have been a citizen of Nova Roma since summer 2753. During that time, I
have been a Censorial Scribe, an Aedilician Scribe, I co-founded the
Provincia Gallia, I am Coryphaeus of the Sodalitas Musarum, I am author of
the solar system series in that same Sodalitas, I am still writing the Nova
Roma science fiction novel, I co-organised two festivals this year (one of
which was cancelled), and helped some citizens out in their basic Latin
problems.

If I recall correctly, you, on the other hand, have been citizen since April
2754, and hold the high office of Legate. Other than that, you have done
nothing other than carving a part other people's postings, which is
bordering on the insulting and arrogant.

<< There is [a conflict of interest]. We do need a centralized form of which
to extend our culture into the real world.Seeing as though Nova Roma has a
tolerance level far beyond of what I have read in SVR, I would venture to
say that Nova Roma and SVR do have conflicts of interests. >>

Read our Regula, instead of trusting the opinion of a few scandalmongers
here. The only people we do not tolerate are fascists, terrorists or people
with a criminal record. We are intolerant of intolerance.

Vale,
S. Apollonius Draco

Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Re: Off topic - Lord of the Rings! :)
From:	"Marcus Traianus Valerius" <traiania@-------->
Date:	Thu, 20 Dec 2001 11:25:32 -0800

I am hoping for Friday night, that is a big maybe otherwise it will be Sunday...


----- Original Message -----
From: L. Cornelius Sulla Felix
To: novaroma@--------
Sent: Wednesday, December 19, 2001 8:52 AM
Subject: Re: [novaroma] Re: Off topic - Lord of the Rings! :)


UGH I have to wait til Sunday.....Damn I wish I could see it sooner!

Vale,

Sulla
----- Original Message -----
From: gaius_minucius_hadrianus
To: novaroma@--------
Sent: Wednesday, December 19, 2001 8:50 AM
Subject: [novaroma] Re: Off topic - Lord of the Rings! :)


Salvete!

I'm taking my GF to see it tonight, and I can't wait!!!! I feel like
a little kid waiting for christmas morning! I've been waiting for
this movie to come out since I was twelve! Yay!

Valete,

C. Minucius Hadrianus


--- In novaroma@--------, cassius622@a... wrote:
> Salvete,
>
> Sorry, but I couldn't help but post an off topic message. Patricia
Cassia and
> I have just come back from a pre U.S. opening of "Lord of the
Rings"...
>
> WOW.
>
> It's not exactly true to the books, but I can't wait to see it
again! Truly
> awe-inspiring stuff, and true to most of the spirit of Tolkien's
work, in my
> opinion.
>
> Valete,
>
> Marcus Cassius Julianus

Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Disclosure - T Labienus Fortunatus
From:	QFabiusMaxmi@--------
Date:	Thu, 20 Dec 2001 13:39:45 EST

In a message dated 12/19/01 2:56:26 PM Pacific Standard Time,
tjalens.h@-------- writes:


> The fact that Illustrus Titus Labienus Fortunatus sometimes is active at
> one or two lists organised by Societas Via Romana is absolutely irrelevant
> to his activities here in Nova Roma. I have the utmost trust for him and I
> recommend all cives to treat him fairly as I am sure that he will continue
> to be an asset to our beloved Res Publica.

Salvete.
I have to agree with kinsman Fabius here. Titus Labienus has friends he made
here in NR that are now part of the SVR. It is asking too much for man to
ignore his friends. Nor should he.
Besides he as his cognoname says is "fortunate." Unfortunately I have
nothing but enemies in the SVR.

Valete
Q. Fabius Maximus




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Congratulations All
From:	Maximina Octavia <myownq@-------->
Date:	Thu, 20 Dec 2001 12:19:28 -0800 (PST)

--- > Salvete Quirites,

Congratulations to all the newly elected!

I am certain that in your hearts all of you will work
to do the best you are able for Nova Roma.

I hope that all of us return to all of the virtues to
make Nova Roma our blessed and happy home.

Vale bene,
Maximina Octavia
>

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Check out Yahoo! Shopping and Yahoo! Auctions for all of
your unique holiday gifts! Buy at http://shopping.yahoo.com
or bid at http://auctions.yahoo.com

Subject:	[novaroma] out of connection
From:	"luciuspompeius" <danielovi@-------->
Date:	Thu, 20 Dec 2001 21:13:15 -0000

Salvete omnes.
Currently I am having technical problems with my Internet connection.
In fact now I am writing this post at an Internet café. So during
these days it will be difficult to contact me.

By the way, as soon as my conection is restored, I shall put the
provincial site in black temporarily due to the tragic and dramatic
moments provincia Argentina is currently suffering and in memory of
those people who died during the riots . For us it´s time to cry and
to mourn and we do not know how this crisis will end. I hope curatrix
sermonis will understand this off-topic post, but it´s a very
desesperating moment.
Thank you very much in advance for your comprehension.

Lucius Pompeius Octavianus
Propraetor provincialis Argentinae

Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Re: New Citizens and lists...
From:	Amulius Claudius Petrus <pkkt@-------->
Date:	Thu, 20 Dec 2001 16:14:08 -0500

Salve Pompeia Cornelia,

>pompeia_cornelia at trog99@-------- wrote:
>
> This situation troubles me greatly. You, of all people are a most
> active member of our nation, yet you are subject to loneliness or a
> general lack of comradry within your familia.

I am touched by your concern. In the future I hope to work things out...

>
> I believe that, in instances like this, where there is scant contact
> with the mater/paterfamilias and gens members, you should feel morally
> free to leave and seek another gens, if that is what you wish.

I have considered this on a few occasions, but I have always decided against
it. I am honoured to be a Claudii in this nation. Also it seems as if I am
the only member of my gens that is truly active. If I left gens Claudia
would be virtually dead. I think it is my duty as a loyal claudii to ride
this time of loneliness out, for the good of the gens.

Even before I was a citizen I have realised that our gentes system was
flawed. We must have some out side support in getting active citizens as
paters/maters in all gens. It would solve so many problems... I know it's
unhistorical, but this is a sacrifice that needs to be made in order to set
up a solid foundation for future development of the gentes. It just makes no
sense to have an inactive citizen holding the position of mater/pater...
They are supposed to be leaders and role models of active citizenship...
right?

Vale,

"Quamquam cupido sit delictum ab suis crebro est mater virtutum"
"Though ambition may be a fault in itself it is often the mother of virtues"

--
Amulius Claudius Petrus
Aedile Curule Elect
Provincia Legatus Canada Orientalis
Retarius Officium Canada Orientalis
Retarius Officium Gens Claudia
Canada Orientalis Provincia

Canada Orientalis Website:
www25.brinkster.com/canorien/

Gens Claudia Website:
www.freehost.nu/members/gensclaudia/
--

Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Re: Merry Meet and Merry Part...
From:	Maximina Octavia <myownq@-------->
Date:	Thu, 20 Dec 2001 13:20:31 -0800 (PST)

Avete Marcus Cassius Julianus,

> It is unfortunate that Gaia Cassia has chosen to
leave. I think this is merely a misunderstanding that
I am certain could have been ironed out if more open
discussion had been taken up by both parties.

As Nova Roma, I do think we need to be more sensitive
and tolerant of one anothers beliefs. This includes,
what I believe, to be a mischaracterization by Gaia
Cassia of the beliefs of some of our finest citizens.

To be fair, I believe that she was also ill treated by
Septimius when he invalidated and ridiculed her
beliefs. He was also in error in referencing mine.

I really think live chats in the Religio Romana would
give all of us a firmer foundation and more common
ground to stand on with one another. Even though my
personal beliefs are different, I support Religio and
have a special place in my heart for our Pantheon and
would happily join in our public rituals on line.

Vale, Maximina Octavia

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Check out Yahoo! Shopping and Yahoo! Auctions for all of
your unique holiday gifts! Buy at http://shopping.yahoo.com
or bid at http://auctions.yahoo.com

Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Rudeness and hate messages on this list
From:	Maximina Octavia <myownq@-------->
Date:	Thu, 20 Dec 2001 13:46:30 -0800 (PST)

---Ave G. Noviodunus Ferriculus ,

First of all, I agree completely with your points.

Sadly, religion seems to be the HOT button on this
list. I have said it before and I will say again and
again, we need to unify ourselves with the Religio
Romana the foundation by which, as I understand it,
this micronation began.

Those united upon this foundation may learn to respect
one another more. This works so well in our live
chats with my religion. There is good will and
learning and I have not yet seen unfriendly contention
of any kind. I believe it is up to the Pontifex
Maximus to lead our people in manners and remind them
of good virtues by holding regular, if not daily,
rituals.

Thank you for your kind and sound suggestions and
comments.

Vale bene,
Maximina Octavia





__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Check out Yahoo! Shopping and Yahoo! Auctions for all of
your unique holiday gifts! Buy at http://shopping.yahoo.com
or bid at http://auctions.yahoo.com

Subject:	[novaroma] Re: out of connection
From:	"radams36" <radams40@-------->
Date:	Thu, 20 Dec 2001 21:59:33 -0000

--- In novaroma@--------, "luciuspompeius" <danielovi@--------> wrote:
> Salvete omnes.
> Currently I am having technical problems with my Internet
connection.
> In fact now I am writing this post at an Internet café. So during
> these days it will be difficult to contact me.
>
> By the way, as soon as my conection is restored, I shall put the
> provincial site in black temporarily due to the tragic and dramatic
> moments provincia Argentina is currently suffering and in memory of
> those people who died during the riots . For us it´s time to cry
and
> to mourn and we do not know how this crisis will end. I hope
curatrix
> sermonis will understand this off-topic post, but it´s a very
> desesperating moment.
> Thank you very much in advance for your comprehension.
>
> Lucius Pompeius Octavianus
> Propraetor provincialis Argentinae

Condolences and best wishes to you and your countrymen, Lucie. Here's
hoping the crisis is resolved soon.

Salve,

Rufus Iulius Palaeologus

Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Thank you
From:	Maximina Octavia <myownq@-------->
Date:	Thu, 20 Dec 2001 14:06:27 -0800 (PST)

Ave Curatrix Sermonis,

Congratulations! I know you will do a wonderful job
this year just as you did last year.

Thank you for donating your time and efforts on our
behalf.

Vale bene,
Maximina Octavia

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Check out Yahoo! Shopping and Yahoo! Auctions for all of
your unique holiday gifts! Buy at http://shopping.yahoo.com
or bid at http://auctions.yahoo.com



Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Re: Merry Meet and Merry Part...
From:	"L. Cornelius Sulla" <alexious@-------->
Date:	Thu, 20 Dec 2001 14:16:06 -0800

Ave,

I must respectfully disagree with you on this one Maximina. I think the person with the chip on their schulder was clearly the ex-Gaia Cassia. While Antonius Corvus Septimus has been a very strong advocate of the Religio he has never insulted any other religious belief, unlike what Gaia Cassia did to my friend Venator. That was uncalled for and completely disrespectful. I think most Nova Romans are very tolerant, however there are clearly those who are not, and unfortuantely Gaia Cassia became one of those who was not. I do not place Corvus at blame at all in this, it was clearly Gaia Cassia's own religious hangups that provoked this situation.

Very Respectfully,

Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix
----- Original Message -----
From: Maximina Octavia
To: novaroma@--------
Sent: Thursday, December 20, 2001 1:20 PM
Subject: Re: [novaroma] Re: Merry Meet and Merry Part...


Avete Marcus Cassius Julianus,

> It is unfortunate that Gaia Cassia has chosen to
leave. I think this is merely a misunderstanding that
I am certain could have been ironed out if more open
discussion had been taken up by both parties.

As Nova Roma, I do think we need to be more sensitive
and tolerant of one anothers beliefs. This includes,
what I believe, to be a mischaracterization by Gaia
Cassia of the beliefs of some of our finest citizens.

To be fair, I believe that she was also ill treated by
Septimius when he invalidated and ridiculed her
beliefs. He was also in error in referencing mine.

I really think live chats in the Religio Romana would
give all of us a firmer foundation and more common
ground to stand on with one another. Even though my
personal beliefs are different, I support Religio and
have a special place in my heart for our Pantheon and
would happily join in our public rituals on line.

Vale, Maximina Octavia

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Check out Yahoo! Shopping and Yahoo! Auctions for all of
your unique holiday gifts! Buy at http://shopping.yahoo.com
or bid at http://auctions.yahoo.com

Subject:	Re: [novaroma] ELECTION RESULTS
From:	Maximina Octavia <myownq@-------->
Date:	Thu, 20 Dec 2001 14:17:46 -0800 (PST)

--Ave Brother,

I would just like to take a moment to publicly
congratulate you on being elected.

With your sharp intellect and big heart, I know you
will always be fair and just on this your first step
on the political road.

I wish you much future success and I am looking
forward to seeing you advance your career in NR
politics.

I am proud to be your "big" sister and may the gods be
with you!

Hugs and ***,
your sis Maximina Octavia

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Check out Yahoo! Shopping and Yahoo! Auctions for all of
your unique holiday gifts! Buy at http://shopping.yahoo.com
or bid at http://auctions.yahoo.com

Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Congratulations
From:	Maximina Octavia <myownq@-------->
Date:	Thu, 20 Dec 2001 14:22:57 -0800 (PST)

--- Ave Pater,

Congratulations Senior! As if you need more work!

I will be lucky to get two minutes of your time in the
future you will be so busy.

Nova Roma is the luckiest nation in the world to have
such a hard working and just man in office.

I wish you all the best and as your daughter I am very
proud of you and your accomplishments. We should all
be so productive.

Big Hug and ***
Maximina Octavia
P.S. Stop by and pick up more olive oil for the lamps
on your way back to the villa!

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Check out Yahoo! Shopping and Yahoo! Auctions for all of
your unique holiday gifts! Buy at http://shopping.yahoo.com
or bid at http://auctions.yahoo.com

Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Re: out of connection
From:	"Martins-Esteves" <esteves@-------->
Date:	Tue, 13 Dec 2011 18:41:34 -0200

Salvete Quirites
Salve Luci Pompei Octaviane


It cannot be off topic to demonstrate simpathy towards our cives in Provincia Argentina in this catastrophic moment.
Please, you Quirites, stay home safe a comfortable, and keep safe! We need you! : > )

Valete optime

Atticus
















[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Subject:	Re: [novaroma] out of connection
From:	Piparskeggr - Venator <catamount_grange@-------->
Date:	Thu, 20 Dec 2001 17:22:15 -0600

Ave Lucius Pompeius,

May the coming turn of the year see better days for you and the other fine people of Argentina.

Stay safe and well.

Please accept my wishes for Blessings upon Thee and Thine from That Which is Holy.

--
=========================================
In Amicus sub Fidelis
- Piperbarbus Ullerius Venator
Cives Nova Romana et Paterfamilias
Domus Familias
http://www.geocities.com/gens_ulleria/index.html

Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Thank you
From:	"Caius Puteus Germanicus" <puteus@-------->
Date:	Fri, 21 Dec 2001 00:29:18 +0100

Ave Curatrix Priscilla et Scriba Pompeia!

I can only second these words from Maximina. Thanks for the efforts!

Vale optime in pace deorum!

Caius Puteus Germanicus
Lictor
Rogator MMDXXIV AUC
Scriba Explorator Academiae Thules ad Studia Romana Antiqua et Nova
Praefectus Sodalitatis Egressi Germaniae Inferioris Europaeque Occidentalis
Civis Provinciae Novae Romae Galliae / Germaniae Inferioris
http://www.geocities.com/germania_inferior/
http://www.geocities.com/caius_puteus_germanicus/

----- Original Message -----
From: Maximina Octavia
To: novaroma@--------
Sent: Thursday, December 20, 2001 11:06 PM
Subject: Re: [novaroma] Thank you



Ave Curatrix Sermonis,

Congratulations! I know you will do a wonderful job
this year just as you did last year.

Thank you for donating your time and efforts on our
behalf.

Vale bene,
Maximina Octavia

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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Subject:	Re: [novaroma] Gens reduction/ideas?
From:	Amulius Claudius Petrus <pkkt@-------->
Date:	Thu, 20 Dec 2001 18:57:46 -0500

Salve,

I have taken part in discussions concerning this issue since my first days
of being a citizen. It's generally agreed that the gentes system needs to be
looked at. It's a shame to see that we are going into the new year without
any corrections. Maybe next year will be more promising...

>Prima Ritulia Nocta at PrimaRituliaNocta@-------- wrote:
>
>
> Perhaps giving a basic outline of the gens could help new perspective
> members make clearer choices. Thereby evening out the over all joining
> ratio per family.

I agree. I think we would have far less problems if new citizens knew what
the interests are of a particular gens. People with similar interests and
goals would naturally form closer family interactions.

>
> Nevertheless, I am with senator Sulla here when he says that the familia
> needs to be the basis for NR. There are - I suppose - enough gentes by now,
> so that the creation of new ones should be discouraged. But please remember
> that the above criteria of having a well known name still apply. I am quite
> sure that no matter the engagement Senator Fortunatus may have for his
> gentiles, his gens is unlikely to grow at very high speed. Can't we have the
> subscription form - and here I turn my eyes to Marcus Octavius - something
> like this:

I too strongly believe that the gens system **should** be the foundation of
all Nova Roman institutions. Although, if we continue to allow gens to be
opened by inexperienced, and inactive citizens this will only add to the
mess. We should put an end to the opening of new gens temporarily. Then we
should take the time to review current gens to find ones that are dead or
without leadership. By doing this we would establish a very solid and active
family system. Without active paters/maters a gens can't truly exist. Once
these necessary changes have been put into effect, guidelines for the
opening of gens etc. could be better defined to prevent future problems.
After this mess has been sorted out the creation of new gens could be
reopened under the new guidelines.

Our current gens system is a horrible mess. It all comes down to inactive
citizens. Unless measures are put in place to repair this flaw it will
continue to build up and get more unorganised. Something will eventually
need to be done if we are to **truly** have our gentes system as the basis
of Nova Roma.

The day something is done to fix this flaw will be a great step forward
towards our goals... Until then I will patiently wait for the day action is
taken.

Vale,

"Quamquam cupido sit delictum ab suis crebro est mater virtutum"
"Though ambition may be a fault in itself it is often the mother of virtues"

--
Amulius Claudius Petrus
Aedile Curule Elect
Provincia Legatus Canada Orientalis
Retarius Officium Canada Orientalis
Retarius Officium Gens Claudia
Canada Orientalis Provincia

Canada Orientalis Website:
www25.brinkster.com/canorien/

Gens Claudia Website:
www.freehost.nu/members/gensclaudia/
--