| Subject: |
[Nova-Roma] Fwd: [Legion] "waylandisms" |
| From: |
"scott dolleck" <billgatesson@hotmail.com> |
| Date: |
Fri, 23 Aug 2002 17:54:17 -0600 |
|
Ave!
I thought some of you, and I mean"some"
Might find this kind of funny.
This is from my SCA Legion mailing list.
Lucius Avisius Seneca
>From: scott dolleck <sdolzg@yahoo.com>
>To: billgatesson@hotmail.com
>Subject: Fwd: [Legion] "waylandisms"
>Date: Thu, 22 Aug 2002 20:06:21 -0700 (PDT)
>
>
>--- LrdWayland@aol.com wrote:
> > From: LrdWayland@aol.com
> > To: Legion@riverrock.org
> > Subject: [Legion] "waylandisms"
> > Date: Wed, 21 Aug 2002 02:53:00 EDT
> >
> > OK troops, here's the latest brain leaks of mine
> > that managed to come out
> > ungarbled
> >
> > "Vikings can lawfully murder anyone who starts
> > singing "99 bottles of beer"
> > while on a long voyage"
> >
> > "Singing Row, Row, Row your boat isn't so freakin
> > funny when you're chained
> > to an oar, now is it?"
> >
> > "Peace is a good thing, unless of course, you happen
> > to sell swords for a
> > living"
> > _______________________________________________
> > Legion mailing list
> > Legion@riverrock.org
> > http://riverrock.org/mailman/listinfo/legion
>
>
>__________________________________________________
>Do You Yahoo!?
>Yahoo! Finance - Get real-time stock quotes
>http://finance.yahoo.com
_________________________________________________________________
Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com
|
| Subject: |
[Nova-Roma] romanian noun cases |
| From: |
"brodrig22" <brodrig22@yahoo.co.uk> |
| Date: |
Sat, 24 Aug 2002 01:40:12 -0000 |
|
Firstly, i am romanian and speak the language, so i cant be
mistaking it for latin.
Secondly , i spent 6 hours today leafing throuh 3 separate
romanian grammar books.
The conclusion is the next :
Nominative and acusative have the same form ,except one or two
forms in the plural, depending on the case.
The difference is that the noun in nominative has always the
function of subject, and has NO preposition in front of it, and
answers to the question " who". The noun in acusative has always the
function of direct object , and has 2 situations : the first in wich
it has a preposition in front (90% of the cases), serves as a direct
object, and answers to the question " whom" ; second, in wich it has
no preposition, wich makes it resemble the nominative, but has the
function of direct object also, wich helps identify ,and answers to
the question "what".
So it's very easy to say when the noun is in acusative and when it
is in nominative.
Having said that the forms resemble in 4or even 5 cases out of 6
(singular 3 and plural 2 or 1), it's pointless to give examples, as i
admit they generally have a similar or identical form.
But they have different functions and are used in different
situation, expriming diferent things, so acusative and nominative
arent the same case. I should add that this is the official variant
of the romanian academy, and recognized throughout the country.
The situation with dative and genitive is similar, with the notice
that genitive has always an "al" in front of the noun. The noun in
genitive functions as an atribute,determins another noun, and answers
to the question "al cui" meaning "whose". The noun in dative
determins the verb, and not another noun, and answers to the
question "cui"( so no "al") meaning to whom, and serves as an
indirect object.
So both dative and genitive express possesion, granted,but they do
it differently, the genitive directly to the noun, and the dative
indirectly through the verb, thus they have different syntactic
functions.Once again, dative and genitive are very easily to spot,
and can in no way be taken one for another.
The fifth case is the vocative, wich is used " to express a call
adressed to someone in order to attract his attention regarding some
form of communication", quote directly from the book.
The vocative is very easy to spot, because it is always separated
from the rest of the sentence or pharase by ",", wheter it is in
front or after , or both, and generally has the form of an
adressation. Ex: Ovidiu, deschide usa! - Ovidiu, open the door!
Omule, aprinde lumina! Man, turn the light on!
i should mention that in vocative the noun is either
used in his normal form, like in nominative, but in very few cases,
or it is used with specific termination. ex Ovidiu being a name has
the same form as in nominative, but "om", " omul" meaning man- the
man gets an "le" in the end to properly express adresation.
The confusion that most foreigners make is because they cant
distinguish between differen forms, or because of the tendency to
lump cases together to make them easier to learn.
Hoping i cleared things up,
Brodrig.
|
| Subject: |
[Nova-Roma] Re: Romanian |
| From: |
"Nenad" <nenadkne@EUnet.yu> |
| Date: |
Sat, 24 Aug 2002 08:10:59 +0200 |
|
"...according to my information Romanian has only 2 cases. Nominative-Accusative and Genetive-Dative:..."
It does have 5 cases, but Nominative-Accusative-Vocative have same endings, as do Genitive-Dative, so basically you are both right.
Gaius Genucius Anelpistus
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
|
| Subject: |
Re: [Nova-Roma] about romanian noun cases |
| From: |
"G. Noviodunus" <Gaius.Noviodunus@iseli.org> |
| Date: |
Sat, 24 Aug 2002 08:43:00 +0200 |
|
brodrig22 wrote:
>
> Gaius Novidunus, wrong, Romanian has 5 noun cases
> The nominative is different from the accusative , and the dative
> from the genitive, and there is also the vocative.
Salve,
Yep, if you take it this way, you are right. However, I should have been
more clear by saying that I ment the forms. The nominative and the
accusative are _always_ the same form. Having a "pe" in front of the
accusative doesn't mean the noun form is not identical to the
nominative. Same for genitive and dative. As for the nominative, in 1
out of 2 cases, it's the same form as the nominative. Exeptions include
names ending in -a change the ending in -o, -ul becomes -ule, -ii
becomes -iilor and so on. But anyways, you don't use the vocative as
much as the other case, because you only can "call" persons, and not things.
Romanian has therefore more or less the same situation as had French 700
years ago: the "cas sujet" (subject case) and the cas oblique (no idea
how you translate this).
So, Cl. Salix Davianus is absolutely right when saying this:
N-A. sing. <fiul> 'son' / pl. <fiii> 'sons'
G-D. sing. <fiuliu> 'of/to son' / pl. <fiilor> 'of/to sons'
This is the same thing I find in the "Dictionarul ortografic, ortoepic
si morfologic" of the Academy.
A final word: of course, if you know latin and know what nominative and
what accusative is, it's absolutely clear you can differenciate these
cases. But is every Romanian aware of the difference between nominative
and accusative? I know the answer is no. But when I say, in English "I
see him" I _know_ "him" is an accusative. And when I say "whose house is
this?" I also _know_ "whose" is a genitive. But if you ask an average
Englishman or American, I doubt they have the "case" feeling.
Anyway, I think having the case feeling is a big help to learn other
languages. In a completely different language, the Korean, which is
_not_ a case language (it's rather agglutinative like Hungarian), you
also have "nominative" endings (which are just called "subject particle"
and so on.
"jibeun isseumnida" = "there's a house"
"jibeun bomnida" = "he watches the house"
"jibe isseumnida" = "he's in the house"
...
But there are many many endings, for nearly every proposition you have
in English, you have a different ending.
Valete bene
|
| Subject: |
[Nova-Roma] Intro |
| From: |
"Nenad" <nenadkne@EUnet.yu> |
| Date: |
Sat, 24 Aug 2002 08:15:21 +0200 |
|
Salvete! I've become a citizen almost a year ago, but I've recently decided to get more active, so I've just joined the mailing list. I'm Gaius Genucius Anelpistus from Belgrade, Yugoslavia (provincia Pannonia, near Roman settlement of Taurunum). I'm 23 and I study Classics. Looking forward to get to know more about Nova Roma and my fellow citizens!
Valete!
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
|
| Subject: |
Re: [Nova-Roma] New PC game |
| From: |
"G.Porticus Brutis" <celtic4usa@yahoo.com> |
| Date: |
Sat, 24 Aug 2002 01:39:44 -0700 (PDT) |
|
Please send me some more Info.on this game I've never seen it at the stores and sound pretty good
Brutis
Gaius Vipsanius Agrippa wrote:Salvete
I just read the new issue of PC Gamer and it appears there is going to be an
MMORPG called Imperator. It is set in an alternate future where the Roman
Empire never fell.
C.Vipsanius Agrippa
_________________________________________________________________
MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos:
http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx
|
| Subject: |
Re: [Nova-Roma] Intro |
| From: |
"A.J. Jones" <postumius@gmx.net> |
| Date: |
Sat, 24 Aug 2002 11:06:53 -0400 |
|
Pro. Postumius Nero C. Genucio Anelpisto S.P.D.
Salve!
I'm glad you've decided to add some Nova Roman activity to your days. I'm not too knowledgeable of things about Belgrade (or the entire country, for that matter), but at least we can all talk about Classics... I hope. But if you really want to learn more about Nova Roma, my best suggestion would be to read the website, because as I've found, there's a lot of very useful information there, or if all else fails, send something to the list, and someone will probably get back to you, sooner or later.
Anyway, have fun and enjoy your stay.
Bene Vale,
Pro. Postumius Nero Drusus Sepulchratus
--
Scriba Curatoris Aranei
Discipolus Anno Tertio Linguae Latinae
Civis Lacuum Magnorum Provinciae
Civis Patriae Novae Romae, Optima Maxima
"Vivo!"
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
|
| Subject: |
[Nova-Roma] MVNDVS PATET/DIES RELIGIOSVS TODAY! |
| From: |
GAIVS IVLIANVS <ivlianvs309@yahoo.com> |
| Date: |
Sat, 24 Aug 2002 09:36:30 -0700 (PDT) |
|
SALVETE OMNES! Many of our Romani are surely aware, or
if not that today, August 24th is a dark day in our
calendar of misfortune! It is the "Mundus Patet" and
"Dies Religiosus." On this day Vesuvius destoryed
Pompeii. The Goths sacked Roma in 410. Our ancient
Pontifexs tell us it is a day of caution. The Manes as
well as the Lemures come up from the Mundus and freely
roam the streets and enter the world of the living. No
rites should be performed today, and no serious
undertakings should be done. VALETE! Frater Gaivs
Ivlianvs, PGI.
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance - Get real-time stock quotes
http://finance.yahoo.com
|
| Subject: |
Re: [Nova-Roma] MVNDVS PATET/DIES RELIGIOSVS TODAY! |
| From: |
"Pro. Postumius Nero Drusus Sepulchratus" <postumius@gmx.net> |
| Date: |
Sat, 24 Aug 2002 15:18:12 -0400 |
|
Pro. Postumius Nero C. Iuliano S.P.D.
Salve,
Thanks for the notice. I'll have to keep a black mark on my calendar for
years to come. But I'll certainly be careful in what I do handle today.
Bene Vale,
Pro. Postumius Nero Drusus Sepulchratus
--
Scriba Curatoris Aranei
Discipolus Anno Tertio Linguae Latinae
Civis Lacuum Magnorum Provinciae
Civis Patriae Novae Romae, Optima Maxima
"Vivo!"
|
| Subject: |
[Nova-Roma] ATTN. ARGENTINOS Latin/Spanish/English |
| From: |
"luciuspompeius" <danielovi@ciudad.com.ar> |
| Date: |
Sat, 24 Aug 2002 19:51:33 -0000 |
|
Message in Latin, Spanish & English.
Mensaje en Latín, Español e Inglés.
Epistula Latine , Hispanice Angliceque scripta est.
Latín /Latin /Latine
Salvete cives argentini Novæ Romæ.
Si macronationem nostram aberitis (aut si iam profecti sitis), quæso
scribite censoribus Novæ Romæ et date eos domicilium novum vestrum
atque tempus profectionis vestræ.
Quæso quoque ut mihi scribatis ad profectiones vestras sciendum.
Iam duo cives nostri patria nostra absunt.
Fortunam optimam et itinerem optimum vobis omnibus exopto!!
Curate ut valeatis
Lucius Pompeius Octavianus
Proprætor provincialis Argentinæ
Español / Spanish / Hispanice
Salvete cives argentini Novæ Romæ.
Si se van de nuestra macronación ( o si ya lo hicieron), les pido por
favor que escriban a los censores de Nova Roma indicándoles la nueva
dirección y fecha de partida. Me gustaría que me escribieran a mí
también para saber quienes se van. Dos ciudadanos novaromanos
argentinos ya partieron.
Les deseo a todos la mejor de las suertes y un excelente viaje a sus
nuevos destinos!
Curate ut valeatis
Lucius Pompeius Octavianus
Proprætor provincialis Argentinæ
Inglés / English / Anglice
Salvete cives argentini Novæ Romæ.
If you leave (or if you already had done so) our macronation, please
write the censors of Nova Roma telling them your new address and time
of your departure. I would like that you also write to me in order to
know your departure. Two of our citizens already left our fatherland .
I wish you all a very good luck and an excellent trip to your new
destination!!.
Curate ut valeatis
Lucius Pompeius Octavianus
Proprætor provincialis Argentinæ
|
| Subject: |
[Nova-Roma] Re: about romanian noun cases |
| From: |
"brodrig22" <brodrig22@yahoo.co.uk> |
| Date: |
Sat, 24 Aug 2002 20:30:51 -0000 |
|
--- In Nova-Roma@y..., "G. Noviodunus" <Gaius.Noviodunus@i...> wrote:
> brodrig22 wrote:
> >
> > Gaius Novidunus, wrong, Romanian has 5 noun cases
> > The nominative is different from the accusative , and the
dative
> > from the genitive, and there is also the vocative.
>
>
> Salve,
>
> Yep, if you take it this way, you are right. However, I should have
been
> more clear by saying that I ment the forms. The nominative and the
> accusative are _always_ the same form. Having a "pe" in front of
the
> accusative doesn't mean the noun form is not identical to the
> nominative. Same for genitive and dative. As for the nominative, in
1
> out of 2 cases, it's the same form as the nominative. Exeptions
include
> names ending in -a change the ending in -o, -ul becomes -ule, -ii
> becomes -iilor and so on. But anyways, you don't use the vocative
as
> much as the other case, because you only can "call" persons, and
not things.
>
> Romanian has therefore more or less the same situation as had
French 700
> years ago: the "cas sujet" (subject case) and the cas oblique (no
idea
> how you translate this).
>
> So, Cl. Salix Davianus is absolutely right when saying this:
>
> N-A. sing. <fiul> 'son' / pl. <fiii> 'sons'
> G-D. sing. <fiuliu> 'of/to son' / pl. <fiilor> 'of/to sons'
>
> This is the same thing I find in the "Dictionarul ortografic,
ortoepic
> si morfologic" of the Academy.
>
> A final word: of course, if you know latin and know what nominative
and
> what accusative is, it's absolutely clear you can differenciate
these
> cases. But is every Romanian aware of the difference between
nominative
> and accusative? I know the answer is no. But when I say, in
English "I
> see him" I _know_ "him" is an accusative. And when I say "whose
house is
> this?" I also _know_ "whose" is a genitive. But if you ask an
average
> Englishman or American, I doubt they have the "case" feeling.
>
> Anyway, I think having the case feeling is a big help to learn
other
> languages. In a completely different language, the Korean, which is
> _not_ a case language (it's rather agglutinative like Hungarian),
you
> also have "nominative" endings (which are just called "subject
particle"
> and so on.
>
> "jibeun isseumnida" = "there's a house"
> "jibeun bomnida" = "he watches the house"
> "jibe isseumnida" = "he's in the house"
> ...
> But there are many many endings, for nearly every proposition you
have
> in English, you have a different ending.
>
> Valete bene
Yes, any romanian can tell between acusative/nominative or
dative/genitive.
And regarding vocative, you can call any noun, not just names.
As for the foreigners, i dont expect there are many who can tell
wich is wich, of course. Maybe the ones who studied romanian
thoroughly. But if you speak romanian very good, you definetly can
tell acusative apart from nominative, there is no way you can mistake
one for another.
In conclusion ,there definetly are 5 cases, doesnt matter they are
not clearly distinct for foreigners :P
|
| Subject: |
[Nova-Roma] absentia - trip to Berlin |
| From: |
"mcserapio" <mcserapio@yahoo.it> |
| Date: |
Sat, 24 Aug 2002 21:21:59 -0000 |
|
AVETE OMNES
I inform you that finally I will have my holyday in London from
next monday, 26th August, to 3rd September.
Then I will probably be absent from 6th september to 11th, because of
my work: during this period I will be in Berlin. If anybody in that
area is willing to meet me, I shall be glad of meeting him/her! (I
speak german)
VALETE BENE
Manius Constantinus Serapio
-------------------
Legatus Externis Rebus Provinciae Italiae
Dominus Praefectus Sodalitatis Egressus
Scriba Aedilis Plebis Cicatricis
-------------------
PROVINCIA ITALIA
http://italia.novaroma.org
-------------------
ADMINISTRATIO AEDILIS PLEBIS
http://www.geocities.com/mcserapio/aediliscicatrix.html
|
| Subject: |
Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Psychology of Reenacting |
| From: |
PADRUIGTHEUNCLE@aol.com |
| Date: |
Sat, 24 Aug 2002 18:08:08 EDT |
|
No, I won't be going to Antietam. I rarely participate in Eastern Theater
events but am planning to go to 140th Gettysburg. Over the next three
months, I'll be at Tunnel Hill, Perryville, Mosheim, and Franklin. Vale.
F. Galerius Aurelianus Secundus
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
|
