Forum Romanum


Subject:	[Nova-Roma] EX DOMO PROPRAETORIS VIII PROVINCIAE LACUUM MAGNORUM
From:	Centurion M Bianchius Antonius <imperialreign@yahoo.com>
Date:	Sun, 25 Aug 2002 17:25:15 -0700 (PDT)

EX DOMO PROPRAETORIS PROVINCIAE LACUUM MAGNORUM
EDICTUM PROPRAETORIS VIII

Effective ante diem VIII Kal. SEPTEMBRES MMDCCLV
(25 August 2002), I, Marcus Bianchius Antonius,
Propraetor of the Provincia Lacus Magni,
issue this edict:

I, M. Bianchius Antonius, accept Marcus Octavius
Germanicus handing of the duties of the Official
Website of the Provincia Lacus Magni over to Proculus
Postumius Nero Drusus Sepulchratus.

I, then, so name Proculus Postumius Nero Drusus
Sepulchratus the new Retiarius of Provincia Lacus
Magni.

Proculus Postumius Nero Drusus Sepulchratus duty is to
ensure a quality website for the provincia. This
includes, but is not limited to, the maintenance and
design of the website as an official tool of the
provincia.

I expect his best effort, as he has already shown in
his period of assistance to Marcus Octavius
Germanicus, in keeping the website informative and
current as an effective communications tool for the
citizens of Lacus Magni and all of Nova Roma.

Signed,

=====
Marcus Bianchius Antonius
Propraetor, The Great Provincia Lacus Magni

__________________________________________________
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Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] romanian noun cases
From:	"Claudius Salix Davianus" <salixdavianus@terra.es>
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 02:39:46 +0200

Salve Bodrice,
[have you a Roman Name?]

Thank by your comments on Romanian. I understand that you are affirming that
nominative is a clearly distinctive case different form accusative because
the presence of preposition ... but when we count the nomber of
"morphological distinctive cases" we can not take into account the presence
of preposition. I find confussing your message in fact nominative and
accusative are syntactically distinguisable ... but can you cite nominative
and accusative forms (with or without posponed article) with different
ending?

>>Having said that the forms resemble in 4or even 5 cases out of 6
(singular 3 and plural 2 or 1), it's pointless to give examples, as i admit
they generally have a similar or identical form.<<

Well the identity of form accussative = nominative, justifies the noun
nominative-accusative case although one could distinguish them
syntactically.

>>But they have different functions and are used in different
situation, expriming diferent things, so acusative and nominative
arent the same case.<<

Give just an example please ...

>>Ovidiu, deschide usa! - Ovidiu, open the door!
Omule, aprinde lumina! Man, turn the light on!<<

What are the nominative form of <Ovidiu> and <omul-> ... perhaps <Ovidiu>
and <omul>??? I think the confusion is not in the foraigners that learn
Romania but in the distinction mophologically/syntactically distinguised
cases.

Cl. Salix Davianus

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Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Romanian
From:	"Claudius Salix Davianus" <salixdavianus@terra.es>
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 02:41:18 +0200

But, Anelpiste, with the same motivation on can said that for instance French has 5 cases, but Nominative-Accussative-Vocative-Genitive-Dative share the same endings, it seemps an absurdity to me.
"...according to my information Romanian has only 2 cases. Nominative-Accusative and Genetive-Dative:..."

It does have 5 cases, but Nominative-Accusative-Vocative have same endings, as do Genitive-Dative, so basically you are both right.

Gaius Genucius Anelpistus

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Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] about romanian noun cases
From:	"Claudius Salix Davianus" <salixdavianus@terra.es>
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 02:43:37 +0200

Gratias plurimas ago tibi, Noviodune, I think you did guess it!

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Subject:	[Nova-Roma] LETS DON'T LOSE OUR FOCUS HERE!
From:	GAIVS IVLIANVS <ivlianvs309@yahoo.com>
Date:	Sun, 25 Aug 2002 16:18:25 -0700 (PDT)

SALVETE OMNES! Instead of wasting time on petty
matters that should be discussed in private (when it
comes to inappropiate language etc...) we should be
discussing matters that pertain in a positive manner
pertaining to Nova Roma, the Religio Romana and the
DII IMMORTALES!!! Anyone have a interesting subject
of late to talk about?! There is SO MUCH GOOD IN NOVA
ROMA GOING ON AND HAPPENING! Fellow Romani, ROMA IS
RETURNING!!! VALETE! DII VOS BENE AMENT! Frater, GAIVS
IVLIANVS, PGI.

__________________________________________________
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Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Gods & Goddesses on the History channel
From:	"L. Sicinius Drusus" <lsicinius@yahoo.com>
Date:	Sun, 25 Aug 2002 18:44:56 -0700 (PDT)

Salvete Omnes,

The History Channel will be showing "Gods & Goddesses"
at 9 PM Eastern and Pacific time tomorrow. Here's the
write up from thier web site

"The world of the Ancient Greeks lives on today
through its mythology. For countless generations prior
to biblical times, tales of gods and goddesses were
passed down by storytellers and interwoven into
traditions and philosophies. Each city devoted itself
to particular gods. But these gods also had human
frailties. Where did the pantheon originate? Did any
of the stories in Greek mythology actually occur? We
look at new archaeological evidence that supports the
possibility. TV PG"

=====
L. Sicinius Drusus

"Quemadmodum gladius neminem occidit, occidentis telum est."
(A sword never kills anybody; it is a tool in the killer's hand.)
Seneca, Letters to Lucilius

__________________________________________________
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Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Oath of Office, Retiarius
From:	"Pro. Postumius Nero Drusus Sepulchratus" <postumius@gmx.net>
Date:	Sun, 25 Aug 2002 21:45:18 -0400

I, Proculus Postumius Nero Drusus Sepulchratus (Lester A. Jones) do hereby
solemnly swear to uphold the honor of Nova Roma, and to act always in the
best interests of the people and the Senate of Nova Roma.

As a magistrate of Nova Roma, I, Proculus Postumius Nero Drusus Sepulchratus
(Lester A. Jones) swear to honor the Gods and Goddesses of Rome in my public
dealings, and to pursue the Roman Virtues in my public and private life.

I, Proculus Postumius Nero Drusus Sepulchratus (Lester A. Jones) swear to
uphold and defend the Religio Romana as the State Religion of Nova Roma and
swear never to act in a way that would threaten its status as the State
Religion.

I, Proculus Postumius Nero Drusus Sepulchratus (Lester A. Jones) swear to
protect and defend the Constitution of Nova Roma.

I, Proculus Postumius Nero Drusus Sepulchratus (Lester A. Jones) further
swear to fulfill the obligations and responsibilities of the office of
Retiarius to the best of my abilities.

On my honor as a Citizen of Nova Roma, and in the presence of the Gods and
Goddesses of the Roman people and by their will and favor, do I accept the
position of Retiarius and all the rights, privileges, obligations, and
responsibilities attendant thereto.


Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Re: Gods & Goddesses on the History channel
From:	"pompeia_cornelia" <scriba_forum@hotmail.com>
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 02:13:28 -0000

---Salve Druse:

Excellent news! Thanks for sharing.

Pompeia

In Nova-Roma@y..., "L. Sicinius Drusus" <lsicinius@y...> wrote:
> Salvete Omnes,
>
> The History Channel will be showing "Gods & Goddesses"
> at 9 PM Eastern and Pacific time tomorrow. Here's the
> write up from thier web site
>
> "The world of the Ancient Greeks lives on today
> through its mythology. For countless generations prior
> to biblical times, tales of gods and goddesses were
> passed down by storytellers and interwoven into
> traditions and philosophies. Each city devoted itself
> to particular gods. But these gods also had human
> frailties. Where did the pantheon originate? Did any
> of the stories in Greek mythology actually occur? We
> look at new archaeological evidence that supports the
> possibility. TV PG"
>
>
> =====
> L. Sicinius Drusus
>
> "Quemadmodum gladius neminem occidit, occidentis telum est."
> (A sword never kills anybody; it is a tool in the killer's hand.)
> Seneca, Letters to Lucilius
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Finance - Get real-time stock quotes
> http://finance.yahoo.com


Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Ideas
From:	"Pro. Postumius Nero Drusus Sepulchratus" <postumius@gmx.net>
Date:	Sun, 25 Aug 2002 22:28:22 -0400

Salvete Omnes,

In response to the good C. Iulianus, I would like to mention that I have been considering a number of things recently which have to to more to the further advancement of Nova Roma as a nation and a moral group of people, the latter needing less attention than the first, being that, in my opinion, I have not met an immoral civis here. So then to the first.

I have found myself, on many occasions, thinking not of what Nova Roma is now, but more of what I have always dreamt her to be in the future. I must admit, I often consider how we might financially improve ourselves in short time, and though my thoughts which will be stated below are probably misplaced, and more probably belong on the Land Project list, I shall post them here for all to see and comment upon. That said, my ideas are as follows (though they may be vague):

Theatrical Performances -- Perhaps a showing of some of the plays of Terence or Plautus or even possibly some Greek plays, such as Oedipus Rex. Also, something I thought of this afternoon while I was "ordering" my younger sister to read "The Aeneid," perhaps a silent showing of the poem (by this I mean, a group of actors performing the poem, silently, with a narrator reading or even singing the poem either off to the side of the stage or somewhere out of view, you get the idea).

Historical Reenactments -- This is more toward the domain of Senator Audens, among others. But perhaps some reenactments of great battles (or even an entire war), we may even go so far as to simply reenact something more themed at "Daily Life in Ancient Rome". Don't laugh at me just yet, there's more.

Publication of Historical Research Papers et al. -- I've started an empty group at http://groups.yahoo.com/groups/ad_studia_et_investigandum, which will be, hopefully, a group of people dedicated (as their schedules may permit) to researching certain topics and publishing essays and other materials on their given topics. This came from an idea of the great Senators Audens and Cassia regarding what a child can do in Nova Roma, among other things. I thought I'd take it a bit farther.

Spaghetti Dinner (or Sow's Udder and Garum) -- From the brain of the Pater Patriae Cassius, something that sounds good. I've thought applying it to my provincia, as a project. A few of us may get together and work this out somehow. I haven't acted on it yet, but I may in the future. Anyway, I think this idea goes just fine without explanation.

Sale of Books -- I spoke to the Consul Sulla briefly about this in the Forum on a Market Day once. Basically, I had thought of printing Classical Latin literature in it's original or edited language, binding it in artificial leather and swine, engraving it, etc. It would be pretty well customizable. Again, another idea.

I think that's it for now, but if I come up with anything else, I'll send it around.

Optime Valete,

Pro. Postumius Nero
--
Scriba Curatoris Aranei
Retiarius Lacuum Magnorum
Discipolus Anno Tertio Linguae Latinae
Civis Lacuum Magnorum Provinciae
Civis Patriae Novae Romae, Optima Maxima

"Vivo!"

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Re: Ideas
From:	"miguelkelly15" <mjk@datanet.ab.ca>
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 05:44:21 -0000

Salve Postumi,

I think you have some great ideas here but for the moment our
citizens are spread from South Africa to Europe, America and
Australia. It would be difficult for many people to get to a play or
reenactment done in Nova Britannia for example. Here are a few ideas:

1 If we were to do the reenactments,plays, readings, parties etc.
would it not be a good idea to video tape them and put the tapes for
sale to all citizens or interested people.

2 Forgive me if I overlooked something but other than our flag, I
haven't seen any t-shirts, lapel pins, hats etc. that could be sold
to promote Nova Roma. I belong to a few societies and when I ware
such items I get a lot of questions and interest.

3 The 18.00 US contribution (tax) is too low. I belong to a few
other websites that put out 1/4 the info and services that NR does;
no academy, no courses, they are 75.00 US / YR. Even if you raised it
to 25.00 US 50,000 for 2000 citizens.

4 Maybe mint some NR coins as jewelry in gold on silver. I have an
authentic Roman coin of Nero, put it into a gold leaf ring and wear
it around my neck. Sure gets lots of attention, more than an
expensive watch or diamond ring.

5 Find some more musicians to create ancient music using replicated
Roman instruments. There was one guy mentioned last week who does
this in England. I sent him an email days ago regarding shipping
costs etc, still heard nothing yet so I won't risk 40.00 or more
to someone who dosen't respond or exist anymore in Cyberspace. Maybe
NR can handle this in future.

6 We have some talented teachers or professors like Tribune Davianus
and others who are good at languages and history. Maybe they or their
colleagues(for a fee) could coach students who are having
difficulties with the classics in either history or languages.

7 A lottery betting how long I can last in the streets before being
torn to pieces by the mob for suggesting no. 3!

I think that's it on my end, but if I think of anything else, I'll
send it around also like Postumius.
>
> Optime Valete,
>
> Quintus Lanius Paulinus> --


Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Legion
From:	"G.Porticus Brutis" <celtic4usa@yahoo.com>
Date:	Sun, 25 Aug 2002 23:33:03 -0700 (PDT)

HAIL ROMA
james I have seen this one in the stores but have not picked it up.If you say it's good then thats all I need I'll make sure to get it thanks!
G.Brutis Porticus

"James LaSalle, Esq." wrote:Salve:

I just bought this game "Legion" by Slitherine. The game allegedly provides huge realistic battles and "epic gameplay". Is tis true?

Vale

Gaius Vaglius Basilicatus Agricola

The Law Office of James L. LaSalle
417 East 13th Street
Kansas City, Missouri 64106
(816).471.2111
(816).510.0072(cell)
(816).471.8412(Fax)
The information contained in this e-mail message is attorney privileged and confidential information intended only for the use of the individual or entity named. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, or the employee or agent responsible to deliver it to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please immediately notify the sender by using the contact information in the "reply to" field above and return the original message to the sender. Thank you.

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Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] New PC game
From:	"G.Porticus Brutis" <celtic4usa@yahoo.com>
Date:	Sun, 25 Aug 2002 23:34:59 -0700 (PDT)

Hail Roma
thanks alot I'll wait to see it!
G.Porticus Brutis
Gaius Vipsanius Agrippa wrote:The game won't be out for quite a while. It's still in the development
phase. It is set ahead of our own time but I'm not sure how far. It was a
small article with few details. The game is by Mythic (same company that
did Dark Age of Camelot). In this alternate future the Roman Empire extends
into the far reaches of space.

C. Vipsanius Agrippa

>From: "G.Porticus Brutis" <celtic4usa@yahoo.com>
>Reply-To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com
>To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: Re: [Nova-Roma] New PC game
>Date: Sat, 24 Aug 2002 01:39:44 -0700 (PDT)
>
>
>Please send me some more Info.on this game I've never seen it at the stores
>and sound pretty good
>Brutis
>
> Gaius Vipsanius Agrippa wrote:Salvete
>
>I just read the new issue of PC Gamer and it appears there is going to be
>an
>MMORPG called Imperator. It is set in an alternate future where the Roman
>Empire never fell.
>
>C.Vipsanius Agrippa
>
>
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Subject:	[Nova-Roma] romanian noun cases
From:	"brodrig22" <brodrig22@yahoo.co.uk>
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 11:13:50 -0000

Ok,i've just checked my notebooks from the 6th grade; except for
very very few exceptions, the acusative/nominative are lumped
together, in grammar exercises.( i mean morfologically, when you one
writes their form, not when you make a gramatical analysis.

So if you want to consider them the same case, it's your business, i
guess compared to other languages it might seem so.
But the preposition and different sintactical functions are, i
believe, a difference big enough in order to consider them completely
different cases.
I really dont care, i just saw your message and i felt compelled to
reply , because probably you imagine acusative and nominative being
completely identical.


Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Re: romanian noun cases
From:	"brodrig22" <brodrig22@yahoo.co.uk>
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 11:00:41 -0000

--- In Nova-Roma@y..., "Claudius Salix Davianus" <salixdavianus@t...>
wrote:
> Salve Bodrice,
> [have you a Roman Name?]
>
> Thank by your comments on Romanian. I understand that you are
affirming that
> nominative is a clearly distinctive case different form accusative
because
> the presence of preposition ... but when we count the nomber of
> "morphological distinctive cases" we can not take into account the
presence
> of preposition. I find confussing your message in fact nominative
and
> accusative are syntactically distinguisable ... but can you cite
nominative
> and accusative forms (with or without posponed article) with
different
> ending?
>

> >>Having said that the forms resemble in 4or even 5 cases out of 6
> (singular 3 and plural 2 or 1), it's pointless to give examples, as
i admit
> they generally have a similar or identical form.<<
>
> Well the identity of form accussative = nominative, justifies the
noun
> nominative-accusative case although one could distinguish them
> syntactically.
>
> >>But they have different functions and are used in different
> situation, expriming diferent things, so acusative and nominative
> arent the same case.<<
>
> Give just an example please ...
>
> >>Ovidiu, deschide usa! - Ovidiu, open the door!
> Omule, aprinde lumina! Man, turn the light on!<<
>
> What are the nominative form of <Ovidiu> and <omul-> ... perhaps
<Ovidiu>
> and <omul>??? I think the confusion is not in the foraigners that
learn
> Romania but in the distinction mophologically/syntactically
distinguised
> cases.
>
> Cl. Salix Davianus
>
example: Ceata a acoperit muntii.
The fog covered the mountains.
the fog - ceata is in nominantive, "who"
covered the mountains? - the fog
the mountains is in acusative, "what" did the fog
cover? - the mountains.
And yes, in this example they have the same nominative
form, like in 80-90% of cases.

Casa este inalta. The house is tall. who is tall? - the
house - nominative.
Liviu s-a urcat pe casa. Liviu climbed on the house. where
did he climb? - on the house, or "on what" did he climb? - on the
house.

I looked up the terminations and it seems acusative and nominative
have the same forms, just that in nominative the articulated form is
used and in the acusative the unarticulated form.
So that leaves only the preposition and different sintactic
functions, but they are still considered different, i dont care you
dont agree with it. They just arent identical, and the academy
considered fit to separate them. Any 12 year old can tell between
them, in 6th grade grammar exercises. so i think it's pretty obvious
they are different, even if they have the same form.

> ---
> Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
> Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
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Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Ideas (My Short Comments)
From:	"Pro. Postumius Nero Drusus Sepulchratus" <postumius@gmx.net>
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 06:57:53 -0400

Salve Postumi,

I think you have some great ideas here but for the moment our
citizens are spread from South Africa to Europe, America and
Australia. It would be difficult for many people to get to a play or
reenactment done in Nova Britannia for example. Here are a few ideas:

1 If we were to do the reenactments,plays, readings, parties etc.
would it not be a good idea to video tape them and put the tapes for
sale to all citizens or interested people. (Something young Postumius didn't
even think about. But a better idea, nonetheless.)

2 Forgive me if I overlooked something but other than our flag, I
haven't seen any t-shirts, lapel pins, hats etc. that could be sold
to promote Nova Roma. I belong to a few societies and when I ware
such items I get a lot of questions and interest. (I've thought of this one
too. Perhaps this is something we should get to someone with more money than
myself.)

3 The 18.00 US contribution (tax) is too low. I belong to a few
other websites that put out 1/4 the info and services that NR does;
no academy, no courses, they are 75.00 US / YR. Even if you raised it
to 25.00 US 50,000 for 2000 citizens. (Very much agreed! This should go to
the Senate though.)

4 Maybe mint some NR coins as jewelry in gold on silver. I have an
authentic Roman coin of Nero, put it into a gold leaf ring and wear
it around my neck. Sure gets lots of attention, more than an
expensive watch or diamond ring. (So in other words, change the currency
into jewelry. If it works, go for it!)

5 Find some more musicians to create ancient music using replicated
Roman instruments. There was one guy mentioned last week who does
this in England. I sent him an email days ago regarding shipping
costs etc, still heard nothing yet so I won't risk 40.00 or more
to someone who dosen't respond or exist anymore in Cyberspace. Maybe
NR can handle this in future. (I believe this is best handled in the office
of K. Fabius, the Curule Aedile.)

6 We have some talented teachers or professors like Tribune Davianus
and others who are good at languages and history. Maybe they or their
colleagues(for a fee) could coach students who are having
difficulties with the classics in either history or languages. (I like this
one. We'll have to converse on this later.)

7 A lottery betting how long I can last in the streets before being
torn to pieces by the mob for suggesting no. 3! (HA HA HA! Nice!)

I think that's it on my end, but if I think of anything else, I'll
send it around also like Postumius.

(Optime Valete,

Postumius)


Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: romanian noun cases
From:	"James LaSalle, Esq." <jlasalle@kc.rr.com>
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 08:06:28 -0500

Salve:

I went on vacation for four days. When I came home there were over 350 emails stacked up in my box, the vast majority from this group, and mostly, and I mean no disrespect, of little interest to me. Can't we divide the group into smaller groups like "Language", "Religious Challenge and Critique", or some such thing? Then we could subscribe to specific groups of interest. This is ridiculous.

Vale

Gaius Vaglius Basilicatus Agricola

The Law Office of James L. LaSalle
417 East 13th Street
Kansas City, Missouri 64106
(816).471.2111
(816).510.0072(cell)
(816).471.8412(Fax)
The information contained in this e-mail message is attorney privileged and confidential information intended only for the use of the individual or entity named. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, or the employee or agent responsible to deliver it to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please immediately notify the sender by using the contact information in the "reply to" field above and return the original message to the sender. Thank you.
----- Original Message -----
From: brodrig22
To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, August 26, 2002 6:00 AM
Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: romanian noun cases

--- In Nova-Roma@y..., "Claudius Salix Davianus" <salixdavianus@t...>
wrote:
> Salve Bodrice,
> [have you a Roman Name?]
>
> Thank by your comments on Romanian. I understand that you are
affirming that
> nominative is a clearly distinctive case different form accusative
because
> the presence of preposition ... but when we count the nomber of
> "morphological distinctive cases" we can not take into account the
presence
> of preposition. I find confussing your message in fact nominative
and
> accusative are syntactically distinguisable ... but can you cite
nominative
> and accusative forms (with or without posponed article) with
different
> ending?
>

> >>Having said that the forms resemble in 4or even 5 cases out of 6
> (singular 3 and plural 2 or 1), it's pointless to give examples, as
i admit
> they generally have a similar or identical form.<<
>
> Well the identity of form accussative = nominative, justifies the
noun
> nominative-accusative case although one could distinguish them
> syntactically.
>
> >>But they have different functions and are used in different
> situation, expriming diferent things, so acusative and nominative
> arent the same case.<<
>
> Give just an example please ...
>
> >>Ovidiu, deschide usa! - Ovidiu, open the door!
> Omule, aprinde lumina! Man, turn the light on!<<
>
> What are the nominative form of <Ovidiu> and <omul-> ... perhaps
<Ovidiu>
> and <omul>??? I think the confusion is not in the foraigners that
learn
> Romania but in the distinction mophologically/syntactically
distinguised
> cases.
>
> Cl. Salix Davianus
>
example: Ceata a acoperit muntii.
The fog covered the mountains.
the fog - ceata is in nominantive, "who"
covered the mountains? - the fog
the mountains is in acusative, "what" did the fog
cover? - the mountains.
And yes, in this example they have the same nominative
form, like in 80-90% of cases.

Casa este inalta. The house is tall. who is tall? - the
house - nominative.
Liviu s-a urcat pe casa. Liviu climbed on the house. where
did he climb? - on the house, or "on what" did he climb? - on the
house.

I looked up the terminations and it seems acusative and nominative
have the same forms, just that in nominative the articulated form is
used and in the acusative the unarticulated form.
So that leaves only the preposition and different sintactic
functions, but they are still considered different, i dont care you
dont agree with it. They just arent identical, and the academy
considered fit to separate them. Any 12 year old can tell between
them, in 6th grade grammar exercises. so i think it's pretty obvious
they are different, even if they have the same form.

> ---
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Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Ideas
From:	"James LaSalle, Esq." <jlasalle@kc.rr.com>
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 08:18:44 -0500

Salve

Oedipus, Oedipus Rex, and Oedipus at Colonus I thought were horribly boring, either in English or the original. If we want to gain wide public support for our group, put on plays like "Lysistrata" or "The Bees". While we all may be able to suffer thru Titus Lucretius Carus' De Rerum Natura because of our want for a deeper knowledge into the mind Romans, I would not reccomend it to a friend to get him interested in all thing Roman. Do a reading on Gaius Caligula from The Twelve Caesers, something like that.

Vale

Gaius Vaglius Basilicatus Agricola

The Law Office of James L. LaSalle
417 East 13th Street
Kansas City, Missouri 64106
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The information contained in this e-mail message is attorney privileged and confidential information intended only for the use of the individual or entity named. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, or the employee or agent responsible to deliver it to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please immediately notify the sender by using the contact information in the "reply to" field above and return the original message to the sender. Thank you.
----- Original Message -----
From: Pro. Postumius Nero Drusus Sepulchratus
To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com
Cc: Land Project
Sent: Sunday, August 25, 2002 9:28 PM
Subject: [Nova-Roma] Ideas

Salvete Omnes,

In response to the good C. Iulianus, I would like to mention that I have been considering a number of things recently which have to to more to the further advancement of Nova Roma as a nation and a moral group of people, the latter needing less attention than the first, being that, in my opinion, I have not met an immoral civis here. So then to the first.

I have found myself, on many occasions, thinking not of what Nova Roma is now, but more of what I have always dreamt her to be in the future. I must admit, I often consider how we might financially improve ourselves in short time, and though my thoughts which will be stated below are probably misplaced, and more probably belong on the Land Project list, I shall post them here for all to see and comment upon. That said, my ideas are as follows (though they may be vague):

Theatrical Performances -- Perhaps a showing of some of the plays of Terence or Plautus or even possibly some Greek plays, such as Oedipus Rex. Also, something I thought of this afternoon while I was "ordering" my younger sister to read "The Aeneid," perhaps a silent showing of the poem (by this I mean, a group of actors performing the poem, silently, with a narrator reading or even singing the poem either off to the side of the stage or somewhere out of view, you get the idea).

Historical Reenactments -- This is more toward the domain of Senator Audens, among others. But perhaps some reenactments of great battles (or even an entire war), we may even go so far as to simply reenact something more themed at "Daily Life in Ancient Rome". Don't laugh at me just yet, there's more.

Publication of Historical Research Papers et al. -- I've started an empty group at http://groups.yahoo.com/groups/ad_studia_et_investigandum, which will be, hopefully, a group of people dedicated (as their schedules may permit) to researching certain topics and publishing essays and other materials on their given topics. This came from an idea of the great Senators Audens and Cassia regarding what a child can do in Nova Roma, among other things. I thought I'd take it a bit farther.

Spaghetti Dinner (or Sow's Udder and Garum) -- From the brain of the Pater Patriae Cassius, something that sounds good. I've thought applying it to my provincia, as a project. A few of us may get together and work this out somehow. I haven't acted on it yet, but I may in the future. Anyway, I think this idea goes just fine without explanation.

Sale of Books -- I spoke to the Consul Sulla briefly about this in the Forum on a Market Day once. Basically, I had thought of printing Classical Latin literature in it's original or edited language, binding it in artificial leather and swine, engraving it, etc. It would be pretty well customizable. Again, another idea.

I think that's it for now, but if I come up with anything else, I'll send it around.

Optime Valete,

Pro. Postumius Nero
--
Scriba Curatoris Aranei
Retiarius Lacuum Magnorum
Discipolus Anno Tertio Linguae Latinae
Civis Lacuum Magnorum Provinciae
Civis Patriae Novae Romae, Optima Maxima

"Vivo!"

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Re: 2nd Annual Lacus Magni Roman Festival
From:	MVariusPM@aol.com
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 11:33:45 EDT

Salveto,

Sorry to say, Flaminia and I won't be able to make it that weekend. We'll
try to go to the next gathering available.

Valete,
M. Varius


Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Psychology of Reenacting
From:	MVariusPM@aol.com
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 11:53:30 EDT

In a message dated 8/21/02 10:26:42 AM Central Daylight Time,
gcassiusnerva@cs.com writes:

> Now don't reenactors pretty much like the same thing, in a vastly
> more sophisitcated {and expensive} form? Leaving the wife behind and
> going out to play with guns and swords....It's a guys dream!

Actually, I always took my wife with me. A person doesn't *have* to leave
their partner behind. In the reenactment groups I have been associated with
family participation has been encouraged and supported. If one person didn't
want to be a member that was their own choice. Although, I am sure there are
inconsiderate members of couples who do not consult with their spouse. There
will always be a certain percentage of very dysfunctional people no matter
what group is being discussed.

As for *why* people dress up and do reenactment. My understanding was, adults
need to play just as much as children do. The mythos that once you are an
"adult" you no longer need to do things strictly for enjoyment and pleasure
is silly. In my humble opinion I don't see much difference between
participating in a reenactment group and playing on a local baseball team or
going to the movies. All three are done for enjoyment. In fact, on the
baseball team you would even wear a uniform. Not much different from
"dressing up." The extra benefit within the reenactment setting is that most
of the people are also participating to do historical research.

Last, but not least, I realize that the majority of participants in Nova Roma
*do not* view the group as having anything to do with "reenactment." However,
there are elements to the organization which cannot avoid association with
the reenactment system. I am sure that statement won't sit well with some
members. It is my opinion, though.

Valate,
M. Varius

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Ideas
From:	"L. Sicinius Drusus" <lsicinius@yahoo.com>
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 10:13:09 -0700 (PDT)

--- "Pro. Postumius Nero Drusus Sepulchratus"
<postumius@gmx.net> wrote:
SNIP
>
> I have found myself, on many occasions, thinking not
> of what Nova Roma is now, but more of what I have
> always dreamt her to be in the future. I must admit,
> I often consider how we might financially improve
> ourselves in short time, and though my thoughts
> which will be stated below are probably misplaced,
> and more probably belong on the Land Project list, I
> shall post them here for all to see and comment
> upon. That said, my ideas are as follows (though
> they may be vague):
>
SNIP

Salve Omnes,

One of Divus Augustus favorite pastimes was gambling.
He was fond of dice games. Macronational laws (at
least in the United States) place restrictions on
using Dice games as a method of fund raising, but 49
of the 50 States do allow a different form of gambling
for raising funds for non profit organizations, Bingo.
Some years ago I was a member of a NP organization
that ran 2 Bingo games a week to raise funds. The
profits from these games was US $1500 to $2000 a week

A Bingo game would allow us to "Tax" non-citizens with
thier consent, and raise a lot more money than any
other sugestions I have seen.

=====
L. Sicinius Drusus

"Quemadmodum gladius neminem occidit, occidentis telum est."
(A sword never kills anybody; it is a tool in the killer's hand.)
Seneca, Letters to Lucilius

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance - Get real-time stock quotes
http://finance.yahoo.com


Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Ideas
From:	qfabiusmaxmi@aol.com
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 14:47:01 EDT

In a message dated 8/26/02 4:22:59 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
postumius@gmx.net writes:

> 3 The 18.00 US contribution (tax) is too low. I belong to a few
> other websites that put out 1/4 the info and services that NR does;
> no academy, no courses, they are 75.00 US / YR. Even if you raised it
> to 25.00 US 50,000 for 2000 citizens. (Very much agreed! This should go to
> the Senate though.)
>

Salvete
When I proposed dues (tax) I settled on 25.00 USD. However, people objected
to this amount as being too high. My view is the rate will be increased as
more people become comfortable with making the payment. Eighteen dollars is
too low.

Valete
Q. Fabius Maximus

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Ideas
From:	me-in-@disguise.co.uk
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 18:27:53 +0100 (BST)

-----Original Message-----
>From : �Pro. Postumius Nero Drusus Sepulchratus� <postumius@gmx.net>
>
>Sale of Books -- I spoke to the Consul Sulla briefly about this in the Forum on a Market Day once. Basically, I had thought of printing Classical Latin literature in it's original or edited language, binding it in artificial leather and swine, engraving it, etc. It would be pretty well customizable. Again, another idea.
>
But Classical books are available and to be authentic they would have to be scrolls. To be /really/ authentic, not on paper either. I suppose sewn codices might do but they would be awfully cumbersome.
And much as it may displease to admit it, the Romans were not greatly cultural people: the literary language of Rome is Greek, the theatre Atellan farce with plenty of obscenity. I doubt that the average Marco Falcone and Marcus Falco would find much different in their worlds except clothes and electricity.
Vib. Ambrosius Caesariensis.

--
Personalised email by http://another.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Ideas
From:	me-in-@disguise.co.uk
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 18:39:30 +0100 (BST)

-----Original Message-----
>From : miguelkelly15 <mjk@datanet.ab.ca>
Date : 26 August 2002 06:44:21
>
>5 Find some more musicians to create ancient music using replicated
>Roman instruments. There was one guy mentioned last week who >

Salve Quinte!
Any chance perhaps of recreating Nero's formidable hydraulic organ? That should at least pull some interest just to find what the noise is. I've heard Victorian steam organs and the pressure probably wasn't much lower. On a more serious note (ha!) how much is actually known about Roman music?
Vib. Ambrosius Caesariensis.

--
Personalised email by http://another.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Ideas
From:	me-in-@disguise.co.uk
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 18:48:07 +0100 (BST)

-----Original Message-----
>From : �James LaSalle, Esq.� <jlasalle@kc.rr.com>
Date : 26 August 2002 14:18:44
>
>Oedipus, Oedipus Rex, and Oedipus at Colonus I thought were horribly boring, either in English or the original. If we want to gain wide public support for our group, put on plays like �Lysistrata� or �The Bees�.

Plautus and Terence (and who else is there? even if they did copy it from Menander) went into A Funny thing happened on the Way to the Forum (and also Frankie Howard's Up Pompei, but Howard was a good sit-com, bad movie actor). Essentially they've been in every stock comedy since because they are the stock characters and situations. However, there's no denying Funny Thing was a raving success on stage and on film. Nor would its being a musical be at all out of place.
Aristophenes can certainly be funny but the Athenian democracy was not the Roman Republic of 300 years later. A lot of his personal slander might still be funny without knowing the background. Much of his obscenity could prove problematic for people who imagine the ancient world less, rather than more libertine than our own.
Vibius Ambrosius Caesariensis.

--
Personalised email by http://another.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Re: Psychology of Reenacting
From:	"corvus_cassius_taurusis" <corvus_cassius_taurusis@yahoo.com>
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 18:58:05 -0000

Bravo to getting the "feel"! I got the "feel" at my first reenactment
13 years ago and always strive to reclaim that feeling. I do ten
differnt era's as well as work at a living history museum as well as
classroom talks so I can say that it's a bit of an obsession. Much
more than simply dressing up and playing.Honestly if that first
reenactment had been simply playing war I don't think I would have
continued. (had enough of that in the real military) I think that
people would be a bit better ballenced if they took the time to let
themselves get away mentaly as well as phyiscaly more often.
Try to remember that reenacting in many cases is also a dangerous
thing and there is little time to just play when your there. A
mistake can easliy cost a person thier life. But with proper training
and experance it is an awsome thing to be a part of.

Corvus Cassius Taurusis
Optio Legio XIV Cohort I
aka
Lt. Timothy Vick
1st Wisconsin Cavalry Co.C

--- In Nova-Roma@y..., PADRUIGTHEUNCLE@a... wrote:
> I believe that the mind of the reenactor can be as complex and as
simple as
> you describe but there is another reason that you missed. Many of
us
> reenactors are also seeking to develop and achieve "the perfect
moment."
> This perfect moment is when you sink yourself so much into
first-person and
> the surroundings are just right that for a very, very brief period
of time,
> you feel like you are back in time.
>
> My perfect moment came at the 140th Anniversary of the Battle of
Shiloh in
> April of this year. It was very late in the evening and my comrades
and I
> had been sitting around the fire, sipping coffee (& a little
whiskey),
> smoking our pipes, and singing old songs. The sky was crystal clear
with
> myriad stars above us and the night very cold. A reenactor who
looked just
> like General Sherman walked by and we rose to salute him. He
returned our
> salute and passed on. There were no modern sounds in our hearing
and for
> just one "perfect moment" it was April 5th, 1862 and I was a private
soldier
> in the Army of the Republic.
>
> Valete,
>
> F. Galerius Aurelianus Secundus
> (aka Pvt. Patrick Owen, 9th KY Volunteer Infantry, Co. B)
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Re: Ideas - taxes
From:	"lafaustus" <lafaustus@yahoo.com.br>
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 19:28:18 -0000

Salvete!

Please, I am not complaining to anyone, but I must comment!

Quirites! What are we hearing?! In the name of Penia, the Poverty,
the goddess that spread her infausti influence over the whole world,
the sole Empress of our unfair civilization! US$ 12 is too low???
Only in the USA! Put the awful exchange rates on it and it will be
killing for all others countries, specially on the Third World! US$12
is R$36 for me, my bill of the market for three weeks! Who would pay
more to afford a cultural non-profit organization?

US$ 12 is too much! We must fight to LOWER the tax rate of Nova Roma,
the main cause of capite censi citizens, our MAJOR problem...

Remember the exchange rates...

L. Arminius Faustus

-- In Nova-Roma@y..., qfabiusmaxmi@a... wrote:
> In a message dated 8/26/02 4:22:59 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
> postumius@g... writes:
>
>
> > 3 The 18.00 US contribution (tax) is too low. I belong to a few
> > other websites that put out 1/4 the info and services that NR
does;
> > no academy, no courses, they are 75.00 US / YR. Even if you
raised it
> > to 25.00 US 50,000 for 2000 citizens. (Very much agreed! This
should go to
> > the Senate though.)
> >
>
> Salvete
> When I proposed dues (tax) I settled on 25.00 USD. However, people
objected
> to this amount as being too high. My view is the rate will be
increased as
> more people become comfortable with making the payment. Eighteen
dollars is
> too low.
>
> Valete
> Q. Fabius Maximus
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Ideas - taxes
From:	"L. Sicinius Drusus" <lsicinius@yahoo.com>
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 12:45:01 -0700 (PDT)

--- lafaustus <lafaustus@yahoo.com.br> wrote:
> Salvete!
>
> Please, I am not complaining to anyone, but I must
> comment!
>
> Quirites! What are we hearing?! In the name of
> Penia, the Poverty,
> the goddess that spread her infausti influence over
> the whole world,
> the sole Empress of our unfair civilization! US$ 12
> is too low???
> Only in the USA! Put the awful exchange rates on it
> and it will be
> killing for all others countries, specially on the
> Third World! US$12
> is R$36 for me, my bill of the market for three
> weeks! Who would pay
> more to afford a cultural non-profit organization?
>
> US$ 12 is too much! We must fight to LOWER the tax
> rate of Nova Roma,
> the main cause of capite censi citizens, our MAJOR
> problem...
>
> Remember the exchange rates...
>
> L. Arminius Faustus
>
>
The Current tax is barely worth the effort involved in
collecting it. I Would not only like to see it raised
to US $25, but would like to see that set as the base
ammount for the fifth class, with the tax increasing
by an additional US $5 for each class above the fifth,
except for the first which would be an additional US
$10. That would be
V Class US $ 25
IV Class US $ 30
III Class US $ 35
II Class US $ 40
I Class US $ 50

=====
L. Sicinius Drusus

"Quemadmodum gladius neminem occidit, occidentis telum est."
(A sword never kills anybody; it is a tool in the killer's hand.)
Seneca, Letters to Lucilius

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance - Get real-time stock quotes
http://finance.yahoo.com


Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Re: Ideas
From:	"miguelkelly15" <mjk@datanet.ab.ca>
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 19:48:04 -0000

> more people become comfortable with making the payment. Eighteen
dollars is
> too low.
>
> Valete
> Q. Fabius Maximus
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Salve Q Fabi,

I guess we are dealing with basic human nature. Here many of us are
sitting in front of our 2 - 3000 dollar computers and cannot cough up
an extra 7.00 dollars. This is much like our Mexican Association
where I live. We only asked 20.00 / year for a family membership and
we get compaints and howls of bitter disappointment from members
saying they can't afford it. They then arise quickly with their
1200.00 gold chain necklaces tinkling and go sulking back to their
200,000.00 homes and 10,000.00 entertainment centres and 2 cars. The
younger single members who can't afford 10.00 go off night clubing
looking for girlfriends, boyfriends or husbands and willingly pay
4.00 a drink and 8.00 a pack for smokes. I think its a question of
setting the order of your priorities, interests and dedication. I'll
bet that if I mistakenly advertised a authentic gold auries coin of
Augustus Caesar in NR(worth 10,000 dollars) for 500.00 the vast
majority of us would somehow be able to find even that amount of
money. I just got clobbered for heavy taxes this year and I'm
streched tight. Still, if I could find a full Roman Legionaires
outfit for 200.00, believe me I could find it. I know that the
monitary value of the things I mention has much to do with incentive,
but think a moment about the educational and social benifits one gets
from NR. That is a great value in itself.

Vale bene - Quintus Lanius Paulinus


Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Reenacting
From:	jmath669642reng@webtv.net
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 16:30:36 -0400 (EDT)

Gentlemen;

Pursuit of the "perfect moment" is often what serious reenactors hope
for when the "shoot-em-up-bang-bang" is finished. The "skirmish
scenario" draws the spectators and to a certain extent reenactors as
well, but the "perfect moment" is a valuable time, much sought after by
most serious reenactors -- though often fleeting. I have been fortunate
to experence such on several occasions in my 20 years of reenacting, and
I beleve those few moments have had more to do with my "sticking with
it" than a combination of other pleasurable aspects. I only reenact in
4 periods, and only 8 personas, so I cannot claim a real interest, in
reenacting but I can admit to a facination. Another aspect of
reenactment is the consistant challenge to be as good in the field as
the real life person whose persona you are playing. Recently, in an
event in Templeton, Mass, we experienced an unseasonable snowstorm and
mny reenactors left the encampment to seek motel rooms in surrounding
towns. However, I stayed at my desk, shielded my sketch pad against the
driving snow as best I could, and continued with my mapping project just
to see if I could complete the task set for e by the commander
satisfatorily and on time in spite of the storm.

I am pleased to say that I was successful, and that success was very
important to me, simply because I want to know that I am as able to
carry out my duties in inclement weather, as in excellent weather. I am
sure that the few spectators who came to camp in the storm, thought I
was crazy sitting under a fly,wrapped in an old wool blanket drawing a
map with a qill pen and and a bottle of very cold ink!!! That personal
drive for excellence in what you do, in turn make you valuable to other
reenactors and that valuable forms a strong bond, and usually some
binding responsibilities. Altogether a very good feeling. True, some
may call it "play" but it has it's edge to it certainly, in which you
must not only care for the fellow reenactors in a sfety aspect, but also
do your best not to diminish another's efforts by a failure in your own.
These aspects are important to a reenactor, and to those with whom he
reenacts. However, it is what we reenactors do, and has been often
said, as a group we tend to have some strange ideas (Grin!!!!!!!!!).

The Ludi Maximus Gladitori is a case in point. Our first activity was
at "Roman Days"in Maryland, and we were very much concerned with how our
fellow reenactors (Legio XX) would see us. As it turned out we were
well accepted and have gone on to put on several shows, each better than
the following, always drawing top numbers of people, and each person
working with the ohers to make the invovement ever more real and ever
more exciing at each event. The Ludi has been paid top dollar for it's
performance at a profssional ball game, and has appeared twice at "Roman
Days" and in several other aspects as well. The Ludi comes under the
cognizance of Commander Gallio Velius Marsallus of the XXIVth Legio, a
citizen of Nova Roma and a proud soldier, as well as a personal friend.

Yes, reenactment has much to recommend it, and when it is good it is
usually very good. I am pleased to be a part of it!!!!

Respectfully;

Marcus Minucius Audens

(aka: Brevet-Major Ian McKay, Chief Engineer,
New England Federal Brigade----Senator Marcus Minucius Audens, part
owner of the Ludi Maximus Gladitori----Ian McKay, Capt. Lt., 2nd
Battalion, 42nd Regiment of Foot (Black Watch) detached to the Crown
Forces Staff as an Assistant Engineer)

Fair Winds and Following Seas!!!

http://community.webtv.net/jmath669642reng/NovaRomaMilitary


Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Re: Psychology of Reenacting
From:	"corvus_cassius_taurusis" <corvus_cassius_taurusis@yahoo.com>
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 19:02:23 -0000


Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Re: Reenactments
From:	"corvus_cassius_taurusis" <corvus_cassius_taurusis@yahoo.com>
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 19:24:38 -0000

I'm not so certain that American Civil War is cheaper that doing Roman
reenacting.....
My cap was 35.
Jacket 200.
trowsers 75.
boots 250.
blouse 35.
haversack 20.
sabre belt 65.
holster 35.
cartrage box 50.
cap box 20.
sabre 135.
revolvers 150 ea. (cavalrymen usualy has three)
Carbine 600.
saddle and tack 1200.
tent 130.
horse 3000.

total 6100.

Mind you that was my first year. I also do artillary and infantray on
both sides so I have uniforms and gear to match all of the differnt
branches and sides.

Nope! Not a cheap hobby in the least. But all the era's I do seem to
be about the same in the end as far as costs go. Actualy my pre
colonial American era's are cheaper. My full plate armour for
instance was only 1200. A smart reenactor will shop around and find
the best bang for thier buck.

Corvus Cassius Taurusis
Optio Legio XIV Cohort I

--- In Nova-Roma@y..., "gcassiusnerva" <gcassiusnerva@c...> wrote:
> --- In Nova-Roma@y..., "miguelkelly15" <mjk@d...> wrote:
> <<Also the costs to the
> dedicated people must be staggering - I noticed that a Roman
> Legionaire's outfit with helmet, armour swords etc is over 2500.00
> US.>>
>
> Bingo. And my wife has decided to start looking for a townhouse!
>
> American Civil War gear is less expensive because there are lots of
CW
> reenators and several companies that manufacture the stuff, so the
> costs are lower. I got to visit L. Equitius Cincinnatus and the
Legio
> XX when they had a get-together, and they make a lot of their own
> items. If you don't have metal working or woodworking skills you
can
> buy the items from someone who will make it for you. They also have
> some "loner gear" for those who have not yet assembled a full kit.
>
> Nerva


Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Ideas - taxes
From:	"Paul Kershaw" <brighn@yahoo.com>
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 15:54:02 -0400

Salvete,

The exchange rate complaint is a valid one, though. In some areas, indeed, US$10 is an unreasonably high amount; for me, it's a pittance. Is it fair to break the financial backs of some citizens just because they live in a country which is significantly less well-to-do than the US? In contrast, though, if a "per country" or "per region" tax were instituted, would it be fair to charge someone $25 rather than $5 simply because they lived in a richer country? The truth is, neither solution is wholly fair to everyone, but I would sooner support a regional tax, sliding from US$5 for the poorer regions to US$25 for the richer ones (either that, or an honor-system percentage tax of 0.1% of annual pre-tax income -- which would make my household's tax well over US$25).

Vale,
Festus

----- Original Message -----
From: L. Sicinius Drusus
To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, August 26, 2002 3:45 PM
Subject: Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Ideas - taxes

--- lafaustus <lafaustus@yahoo.com.br> wrote:
> Salvete!
>
> Please, I am not complaining to anyone, but I must
> comment!
>
> Quirites! What are we hearing?! In the name of
> Penia, the Poverty,
> the goddess that spread her infausti influence over
> the whole world,
> the sole Empress of our unfair civilization! US$ 12
> is too low???
>
> L. Arminius Faustus
>
>
The Current tax is barely worth the effort involved in
collecting it.
=====
L. Sicinius Drusus

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Ideas
From:	"Paul Kershaw" <brighn@yahoo.com>
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 16:11:33 -0400

Salve Q Lanius Paulinus,

For some members of NR (not all, I know), Nova Roma has a religious function. Christian churches expect -- and often get -- a 10% contribution from their members. In my last post, I suggested a mere 0.1% contribution, which would be more for my household than a $25/person tax; our household is indeed a Religio Romana one. I've seen the phenomenon you talk about in several facets of my life... people willing to spend outrageous amounts for trinkets, but when a $25/year (usually less!) request is made, the wallets shrink up and can no longer be opened.

It is indeed a case of priorities. I do, as in my last post, empathize for citizens in areas where $25 is indeed a significant sacrifice, but for Americans? That's a dinner at a nice restaurant, or five trips to Taco Bell. It's a third of my monthly bill for gasoline, or six months of Newsweek.

Vale,
Festus

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Re: Ideas - taxes
From:	"lafaustus" <lafaustus@yahoo.com.br>
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 20:39:58 -0000

Gods Almight!

I pay a fortune to do not enter on a mail discussion, but in the name
of Penia I must adress on that subject and ask the help of all
Tribunes of the Plebs and Consuls to that discussion.

In what world does we live? If I�m complaining that US$ 12 is TOO
HIGH for a brazilian, you want to say US$25 for someone that almost
not participate (Class V)! See the economic news of the outside world!

But I would gladly pay R$25, the same efect on my pocket of US$ 25 to
an american - The tax rate must change from country to country,
reflecting its own situation. A tax US$ based is a great way NR
bounded. Multiply the taxes by 3 and you will see the disaster on our
pockets! R$ 75 is TOO MUCH MONEY, none will pay this, this is the
HALF of a salary here. A great way to remove we �latin-americans� of
NR.

I worked a lot on the translations for portuguese to get more and
more of my people involved. But since I am a citizen, I�m afraid with
that question about the taxes. We simple CAN NOT IGNORE the exchange
rates.

I make a public appeal to good sense and solidarity between we from
many different countries.

L. Arminius Faustus

- In Nova-Roma@y..., "L. Sicinius Drusus" <lsicinius@y...> wrote:
>
> --- lafaustus <lafaustus@y...> wrote:
> > Salvete!
> >
> > Please, I am not complaining to anyone, but I must
> > comment!
> >
> > Quirites! What are we hearing?! In the name of
> > Penia, the Poverty,
> > the goddess that spread her infausti influence over
> > the whole world,
> > the sole Empress of our unfair civilization! US$ 12
> > is too low???
> > Only in the USA! Put the awful exchange rates on it
> > and it will be
> > killing for all others countries, specially on the
> > Third World! US$12
> > is R$36 for me, my bill of the market for three
> > weeks! Who would pay
> > more to afford a cultural non-profit organization?
> >
> > US$ 12 is too much! We must fight to LOWER the tax
> > rate of Nova Roma,
> > the main cause of capite censi citizens, our MAJOR
> > problem...
> >
> > Remember the exchange rates...
> >
> > L. Arminius Faustus
> >
> >
> The Current tax is barely worth the effort involved in
> collecting it. I Would not only like to see it raised
> to US $25, but would like to see that set as the base
> ammount for the fifth class, with the tax increasing
> by an additional US $5 for each class above the fifth,
> except for the first which would be an additional US
> $10. That would be
> V Class US $ 25
> IV Class US $ 30
> III Class US $ 35
> II Class US $ 40
> I Class US $ 50
>
>
> =====
> L. Sicinius Drusus
>
> "Quemadmodum gladius neminem occidit, occidentis telum est."
> (A sword never kills anybody; it is a tool in the killer's hand.)
> Seneca, Letters to Lucilius
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Finance - Get real-time stock quotes
> http://finance.yahoo.com


Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Taxes
From:	jmath669642reng@webtv.net
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 16:58:00 -0400 (EDT)

In response to the determination that taxes are too low, I would make
the point that while there are those who certainly can afford more than
the present amount, there are also those in countries around the world
whose financial situation certainly do not reflect two cars, a $200,000
house or any of those things that go with such a luxerious view.

Early on the Tax debate it was suggested that the tax for Nova Romas
should be determined by the financil aspects of the country in which
that person lived. The idea was never ealt with seriously because of
the constant fluctuation of monetary values, and the inability of the
Nova Roma Magistrates to maintain those kinds of detailed records.

In a recent trip to Norway, I got a taste of what our European friends
are looking at. Norwegian economy is one of the highest in the world,
and as such the cost of meals and lodging, bus fare, tours, admission
prices, etc. are about 1/3 to 1/2 again as expensive as in the U.S. The
trip was simply magnificent, the people were great, and the sights were
so beautiful it amost hurt to look at it, but, we didn't drink much,
bring back many momentoes, were careful about what tours we really
wanted to take part in or indulge ourselves as we have in other trips
(say to India, Romania, Mexico, Columbia, etc.) simply because our
budget would not allow such.

I beleve that the same applies to those NR Citizes who do not live in
the U.S. I am not excited about denying my European friends the chance
to share in this micronation, and to an extent that is exactly what will
happen if we do not take care of those who have a different financial
base that we enjoy in the U.S.

The U.S. standards are not the end all in this micronation, we are one
of many countries participating in a great adventure. All participants
must be carefully considered in the differences in thier culture since
that is what in large part this micronation is all about. I have been
privaledged to meet many people of the first class through this
organization and I have no wish to cut any of them out of a full
participation because of a lack of consideration for thier situations,
views, and concerns.

Respectfully;

Marcus Minucius Audens

Fair Winds and Following Seas!!!

http://community.webtv.net/jmath669642reng/NovaRomaMilitary


Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Ideas
From:	qfabiusmaxmi@aol.com
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 17:28:27 EDT

In a message dated 8/26/02 12:50:09 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
mjk@datanet.ab.ca writes:

> I know that the
> monitary value of the things I mention has much to do with incentive,
> but think a moment about the educational and social benifits one gets
> from NR. That is a great value in itself.
>
> Vale bene - Quintus Lanius Paulinus
>
Salvete Q. Lanie et al:
I see it as a question of priorities. If you wish NR to succeed you are
willing to give more of your self. As I said before, as the new citizens get
into the swing of things, they will be willing to contribute more and
hopefully, this includes their wealth.
USD 20.00 for a Mexican Association? That seems reasonable.
Valete

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Taxes
From:	"L. Sicinius Drusus" <lsicinius@yahoo.com>
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 14:35:31 -0700 (PDT)

Salve Omnes,
I Made a sugestion on the Nova Roma Main list that
taxes be indexed by nations, or at the very least by
provinces. My sugestion was to use the CIA World
Factbook's purchasing power parity stastic as the
basis.

Some objected because of some of the political
activities the US CIA has engaged in in the past. The
US CIA is very good at gathering information, far
better than any other organization in the world. What
they may have done with that information in the past
is another point.

My Sugestion was and remains that a Tax be set up
based on The USA, that the tax be indexed by Class so
that higher classes pay a higher tax, and that these
base tax rates by Class be indexed by the CIA
purchasing power parity stastics.

These can be found at
http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/index.html

--- jmath669642reng@webtv.net wrote:
> In response to the determination that taxes are too
> low, I would make
> the point that while there are those who certainly
> can afford more than
> the present amount, there are also those in
> countries around the world
> whose financial situation certainly do not reflect
> two cars, a $200,000
> house or any of those things that go with such a
> luxerious view.
>
> Early on the Tax debate it was suggested that the
> tax for Nova Romas
> should be determined by the financil aspects of the
> country in which
> that person lived. The idea was never ealt with
> seriously because of
> the constant fluctuation of monetary values, and the
> inability of the
> Nova Roma Magistrates to maintain those kinds of
> detailed records.
>
> In a recent trip to Norway, I got a taste of what
> our European friends
> are looking at. Norwegian economy is one of the
> highest in the world,
> and as such the cost of meals and lodging, bus fare,
> tours, admission
> prices, etc. are about 1/3 to 1/2 again as expensive
> as in the U.S. The
> trip was simply magnificent, the people were great,
> and the sights were
> so beautiful it amost hurt to look at it, but, we
> didn't drink much,
> bring back many momentoes, were careful about what
> tours we really
> wanted to take part in or indulge ourselves as we
> have in other trips
> (say to India, Romania, Mexico, Columbia, etc.)
> simply because our
> budget would not allow such.
>
> I beleve that the same applies to those NR Citizes
> who do not live in
> the U.S. I am not excited about denying my European
> friends the chance
> to share in this micronation, and to an extent that
> is exactly what will
> happen if we do not take care of those who have a
> different financial
> base that we enjoy in the U.S.
>
> The U.S. standards are not the end all in this
> micronation, we are one
> of many countries participating in a great
> adventure. All participants
> must be carefully considered in the differences in
> thier culture since
> that is what in large part this micronation is all
> about. I have been
> privaledged to meet many people of the first class
> through this
> organization and I have no wish to cut any of them
> out of a full
> participation because of a lack of consideration for
> thier situations,
> views, and concerns.
>
> Respectfully;
>
> Marcus Minucius Audens
>
>
> Fair Winds and Following Seas!!!
>
>
>
http://community.webtv.net/jmath669642reng/NovaRomaMilitary
>
>

=====
L. Sicinius Drusus

"Quemadmodum gladius neminem occidit, occidentis telum est."
(A sword never kills anybody; it is a tool in the killer's hand.)
Seneca, Letters to Lucilius

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance - Get real-time stock quotes
http://finance.yahoo.com


Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Taxes
From:	Marcus Octavius Germanicus <haase@konoko.net>
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 16:39:55 -0500 (CDT)

Salve Luci Sicini,

> I Made a sugestion on the Nova Roma Main list that
> taxes be indexed by nations, or at the very least by
> provinces. My sugestion was to use the CIA World
> Factbook's purchasing power parity stastic as the
> basis.

I am in complete agreement with this, and will do my best to bring
this to the People for a vote this year.

Vale, Octavius.

--
Marcus Octavius Germanicus
Consul of Nova Roma, MMDCCLV a.u.c.
Curator Araneum et Senator


Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Ideas - taxes
From:	qfabiusmaxmi@aol.com
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 17:54:27 EDT

In a message dated 8/26/02 1:44:19 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
lafaustus@yahoo.com.br writes:

> But I would gladly pay R$25, the same efect on my pocket of US$ 25 to
> an american - The tax rate must change from country to country,
> reflecting its own situation. A tax US$ based is a great way NR
> bounded. Multiply the taxes by 3 and you will see the disaster on our
> pockets! R$ 75 is TOO MUCH MONEY, none will pay this, this is the
> HALF of a salary here. A great way to remove we �latin-americans� of
> NR.
>

Salvete L. Armini Fauste et al.

I understand your concern. However, we the Consuls, and the senate debated
this issue three years ago and we came up with this consensus:
I. If we made the tax (dues) based on a century qualification, too many
people would complain about the wealthy getting ahead in Nova Roma.
II. If we based this on personal income, how would we determine this, and
worse, what right did we have in demanding such information? (Sovereignty
Clause)
III. If we based it on participation in NR, it was discriminatory. I, Fabius
wanted people to pay to participate in NR. If not, you still got the
benefits of the citizenship to use our research, enjoy the forum, market
place the clubs, etc., but not the ability to have much say in our affairs.
In fact, none.
IV. If we based it on a province's macronational standard, that was filled
with problems. We had no monitoring facilities, no way to keep track of
world markets that fluctuated. We gave that up as unworkable. Still it is
the best way.
V. This was what was adopted. "Property" or non "propertied" citizens. One
can still vote as no propertied, but it not as significant due to the
position of that person in the centuries.

So you see we did study the problem before we adopted a solution.

Valete
Q. Fabius Maximus

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Taxes
From:	Kristoffer From <from@darkeye.net>
Date:	Tue, 27 Aug 2002 00:06:27 +0200

"L. Sicinius Drusus" wrote:
> My Sugestion was and remains that a Tax be set up
> based on The USA, that the tax be indexed by Class so
> that higher classes pay a higher tax, and that these
> base tax rates by Class be indexed by the CIA
> purchasing power parity stastics.

Salvete, Luci Sicini Druse et omnes.

When doing these computations, please factor in the expenses of actually
paying the taxes, i.e. forwarding the funds. These are, for me, about
$15 annually, and I'd guesstimate they're about the same elsewhere in
the world.

So, a citizen from Yemen (The land with the lowest purchasing power I
could easily find) would for his taxes pay 820/36200 * $25 = $0.57, or
57 cents. This would probably be reasonable to him. Then, to transfer
the funds, he'd have to pay another $15, or in US terms, $15 * 36200/820
= $662. 26 times the amount a US citizen would pay.

Well...I don't know, but something's wrong here. Keep in mind, when
we're setting the tax, we need to look to viable means of transferral.
And as there are none, unless we want some citizens to pay 26 times as
much as others for the same thing, those provincia where transferral of
funds would cost more, in some cases many times more, than the taxes
themselves...one option would be just to make such provincia exempt from
taxation.

If you've got an idea on how to collect taxation without it costing
overly much, I'd be delighted to hear it, and do my best to ensure that
it's implemented in next year's collection of taxes. But if there is
none...we need to somehow "cut 'em some slack". Perhaps organize local
bank accounts, and keep the money of those provincia there...no
international transfers, much cheaper...or any other idea. I don't know.

In short: Just think about the actual cost of fund transferral when
setting the taxes! (Please...)

Valete, Titus Octavius Pius.


Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Re: Romanian
From:	"Nenad" <nenadkne@EUnet.yu>
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 23:31:22 +0200

"But, Anelpiste, with the same motivation on can said that for instance French has 5 cases, but Nominative-Accussative-Vocative-Genitive-Dative share the same endings, it seemps an absurdity to me."

Well, I never said that modern linguistics is not an absurd matter, but speaking strictly linguistically, one should make a distinction between a morphological case (i.e. case denoted and defined by and with its ending, as Latin) and syntaxic case (i.e. clearly perceived shift of particular word's meaning throught its usage, as if it actually had endings for particular cases, as French might be). If a native speaker of Romanian perceives one same form as several cases, then several cases it is, despite the fact that it's basically the very same form. Syntaxic case is not any lesser than morphological case. It's just far more subtle, as it doesn't have outward appearance that could easily give it away to unskillfull eye. I suppose that in time native speakers of such languages lose the ability to find any distinction in meaning, as the archaic concept of cases fades away from their minds. Romanian, clearly, hasn't reached that point. Yet.

C. Genucius Anelpistus

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Taxes
From:	"L. Sicinius Drusus" <lsicinius@yahoo.com>
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 16:14:58 -0700 (PDT)

Salve,
Currently US Citizens pay no transfer fees so to
equalize the Yemani Taxes we would have to subtract
the US 15 from his 57 cent taxes leaving Nova Roma
paying him US $14.43 ;-(

We can never eliminate all the fund transfer problems,
but we can eliminate them for the second largest group
of citizens by collecting European Taxes in Euros and
having a second bank account set up in Europe that
would be the repository for European Taxes.

If we ever get the Families straightened out, the
Paterfamilis should be the person who pays the taxes
for all members of his family, as was the case in
Antiquita. The transfer fees (if any) would be the
same for sending in the taxes for a family as they
would be for sending in a single citizens taxes.

--- Kristoffer From <from@darkeye.net> wrote:
> "L. Sicinius Drusus" wrote:
> > My Sugestion was and remains that a Tax be set up
> > based on The USA, that the tax be indexed by Class
> so
> > that higher classes pay a higher tax, and that
> these
> > base tax rates by Class be indexed by the CIA
> > purchasing power parity stastics.
>
> Salvete, Luci Sicini Druse et omnes.
>
> When doing these computations, please factor in the
> expenses of actually
> paying the taxes, i.e. forwarding the funds. These
> are, for me, about
> $15 annually, and I'd guesstimate they're about the
> same elsewhere in
> the world.
>
> So, a citizen from Yemen (The land with the lowest
> purchasing power I
> could easily find) would for his taxes pay 820/36200
> * $25 = $0.57, or
> 57 cents. This would probably be reasonable to him.
> Then, to transfer
> the funds, he'd have to pay another $15, or in US
> terms, $15 * 36200/820
> = $662. 26 times the amount a US citizen would pay.
>
> Well...I don't know, but something's wrong here.
> Keep in mind, when
> we're setting the tax, we need to look to viable
> means of transferral.
> And as there are none, unless we want some citizens
> to pay 26 times as
> much as others for the same thing, those provincia
> where transferral of
> funds would cost more, in some cases many times
> more, than the taxes
> themselves...one option would be just to make such
> provincia exempt from
> taxation.
>
> If you've got an idea on how to collect taxation
> without it costing
> overly much, I'd be delighted to hear it, and do my
> best to ensure that
> it's implemented in next year's collection of taxes.
> But if there is
> none...we need to somehow "cut 'em some slack".
> Perhaps organize local
> bank accounts, and keep the money of those provincia
> there...no
> international transfers, much cheaper...or any other
> idea. I don't know.
>
> In short: Just think about the actual cost of fund
> transferral when
> setting the taxes! (Please...)
>
> Valete, Titus Octavius Pius.
>

=====
L. Sicinius Drusus

"Quemadmodum gladius neminem occidit, occidentis telum est."
(A sword never kills anybody; it is a tool in the killer's hand.)
Seneca, Letters to Lucilius

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance - Get real-time stock quotes
http://finance.yahoo.com


Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Ideas - taxes
From:	Michel Loos <loos@qt1.iq.usp.br>
Date:	26 Aug 2002 20:18:37 -0300

Em Seg, 2002-08-26 �s 17:39, lafaustus escreveu:
> Gods Almight!
>
> I pay a fortune to do not enter on a mail discussion, but in the name
> of Penia I must adress on that subject and ask the help of all
> Tribunes of the Plebs and Consuls to that discussion.
>
> In what world does we live? If I�m complaining that US$ 12 is TOO
> HIGH for a brazilian, you want to say US$25 for someone that almost
> not participate (Class V)! See the economic news of the outside world!
>
> But I would gladly pay R$25, the same efect on my pocket of US$ 25 to
> an american - The tax rate must change from country to country,
> reflecting its own situation. A tax US$ based is a great way NR
> bounded. Multiply the taxes by 3 and you will see the disaster on our
> pockets! R$ 75 is TOO MUCH MONEY, none will pay this, this is the
> HALF of a salary here. A great way to remove we �latin-americans� of
> NR.
>
> I worked a lot on the translations for portuguese to get more and
> more of my people involved. But since I am a citizen, I�m afraid with
> that question about the taxes. We simple CAN NOT IGNORE the exchange
> rates.

Not only the exchange rate, but the mean income of the citizens in each
country.
$75 for a US citizen does not represent the same fraction of income as
R$75 for us. As you said this is half the monthly income for many
brazilians.

The difference is much higher as just the rate exchange
For example: GNI/capita
USA: US$ 34870
France: US$ 22690
Brazil: US$ 3060

That is over a factor 10.

Source: Worldbank, 2001 statistics for over 200 countries

http://www.worldbank.org/data/quickreference/quickref.html

Vale

Manius Villius Limitanus


Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Ideas
From:	"Pro. Postumius Nero Drusus Sepulchratus" <postumius@gmx.net>
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 19:18:17 -0400

Pro. Postumius Nero C. Vaglio Basilicato Agricolae S.P.D.

Salve,

I'll definately take this into consideration. I haven't quite gotten to reading any of the Oedipus series yet, but it's making it's way up my reading list, I just have to keep reading. But I'll consider everything you said.

Optime Vale,

Pro. Postumius Nero Drusus Sepulchratus
--
Scriba Curatoris Aranei
Discipolus Anno Tertio Linguae Latinae
Civis Lacuum Magnorum Provinciae
Civis Patriae Novae Romae, Optima Maxima

"Vivo!"

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Ideas
From:	"Pro. Postumius Nero Drusus Sepulchratus" <postumius@gmx.net>
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 19:21:08 -0400

Pro. Postumius Nero L. Sicinio Druso S.P.D.

Salve,

Just as a thought: What's the 50th state that doesn't allow it? I'm almost certain I could organize something like that where I live, but I can't officially be a part of it...yet (I'm not yet legal to gamble, not that it's ever stopped me before). But I'll have to keep this in the thought box for when I can get this together.

Optime Vale,

Pro. Postumius Nero Drusus Sepulchratus
--
Scriba Curatoris Aranei
Discipolus Anno Tertio Linguae Latinae
Civis Lacuum Magnorum Provinciae
Civis Patriae Novae Romae, Optima Maxima

"Vivo!"

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Ideas
From:	"Pro. Postumius Nero Drusus Sepulchratus" <postumius@gmx.net>
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 19:23:16 -0400

Pro. Postumius Nero Q. Fabio Maximo Senatori Consulari S.P.D.

Salve,

I agree. But like you said, the increase will rise with time. Hopefully we can get it to an amount where we can actually make twice what we make now, whatever that is.

Optime Vale Consularis,

Pro. Postumius Nero Drusus Sepulchratus
--
Scriba Curatoris Aranei
Discipolus Anno Tertio Linguae Latinae
Civis Lacuum Magnorum Provinciae
Civis Patriae Novae Romae, Optima Maxima

"Vivo!"

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Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Ideas
From:	"Pro. Postumius Nero Drusus Sepulchratus" <postumius@gmx.net>
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 19:27:15 -0400

Pro Postumius Nero V. Ambrosio Caesariensi S.P.D.

Salve,

For the responses you directed to me, I thank you. Again, I'll be adding them to the thought pot, and hopefully I can act on them before I'm to old to move. But I hope I can get a lot done before that time, if it ever happens. So for what you added, I thank you.

Optime Vale,

Pro. Postumius Nero Drusus Sepulchratus
--
Scriba Curatoris Aranei
Discipolus Anno Tertio Linguae Latinae
Civis Lacuum Magnorum Provinciae
Civis Patriae Novae Romae, Optima Maxima

"Vivo!"

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Ideas - taxes
From:	"Pro. Postumius Nero Drusus Sepulchratus" <postumius@gmx.net>
Date:	Mon, 26 Aug 2002 19:30:23 -0400

Pro. Postumius Nero L. Arminio Fausto S.P.D.

Salve,

Before I tend to the rest of my Inbox, which is almost full, let me admit this: I didn't even stop to think about the exchange rates and countries whom are more impoverished than mine, so for that I apologize. But let me also mention that the tax rate of Nova Roma, by my last check, is not mandatory. Just as a note.

Optime Vale,

Pro. Postumius Nero Drusus Sepulchratus
--
Scriba Curatoris Aranei
Discipolus Anno Tertio Linguae Latinae
Civis Lacuum Magnorum Provinciae
Civis Patriae Novae Romae, Optima Maxima

"Vivo!"

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]