Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] The noblest Roman?
From:	=?iso-8859-1?q?Craig=20Stevenson?= <gaiussentius@yahoo.com.au>
Date:	Wed, 4 Jun 2003 14:54:38 +1000 (EST)

Salve,

In my opinion, Brutus was not the noblest Roman of
them all. If he was, he wouldn't have engaged in
money-lending practices and done what he did to
enforce collection of his debts. His "murder", and I
emphasise the word murder, was based on outdated
ideals and probably was based more on personal reasons
than actual ideological leanings.

Vale bene,

Gaius Sentius Bruttius Sura

--- Decimus Iunius Silanus <danedwardsuk@yahoo.co.uk>
wrote:
---------------------------------
Salvete,

I have just finished a book titled 'The Noblest
Roman', a biography of Marcus Iunius Brutus. The book
examines his life and his subsequant reputation
through the ages. I have two questions:

1, Was Brutus "the noblest Roman of them all" as
proclaimed by Shakespeare's Marc Anthony, or do you
have a less postitive opinion of this mans means and
motives?

2, If not Brutus, then who do you consider to be the
noblest Roman?

I'd be interested in your thoughts.

Valete

Decimus Iunius Silanus.

__________________________________________________
Yahoo! Plus - For a better Internet experience
http://uk.promotions.yahoo.com/yplus/yoffer.html

Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Vandals - Sack of Rome (Re: Attention Fabius)
From:	=?iso-8859-1?q?Craig=20Stevenson?= <gaiussentius@yahoo.com.au>
Date:	Wed, 4 Jun 2003 15:05:50 +1000 (EST)

Salve,

A while back now, a visitor posted a message on the
main site, calling himself King Gaiseric, and bragged
about having sacked Rome. I beleive that Quintus
Fabius Maximus replied that the Vandals and their
horses starved outside of Rome for ten days before
being let into the city. I was just wondering whether
it would be at all possible for you to tell me what
source you got this information from, as I am writing
a book on the Vandals.

Vale bene,

Gaius Sentius Bruttius Sura

http://mobile.yahoo.com.au - Yahoo! Mobile
- Check & compose your email via SMS on your Telstra or Vodafone mobile.

Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Bibliography on Astrology in the Graeco-Roman World
From:	=?iso-8859-1?B?R6VJVkxJVlOlU0NBVlJWUw==?= <gfr@intcon.net>
Date:	Wed, 04 Jun 2003 05:38:15 -0000

G. Iulius Scaurus S.P.D.

Avete, Quirites.

Here's a link to the portion of David Juste's bibliography on the
history of astrology in the west dealing with the Graeco-Roman world:

http://www.sas.ac.uk/warburg/institute/astro_bibliointro.htm

Juste's bibliography, which covers research on astrology in the west
from antiquity to the present, and his catalogue (with Alec
Vuijlsteke) of the astrological library of Franz Cumont at the
Academia Belgica are extraordinary works of scholarship.

Valete, Quirites.

G. Iulius Scaurus

Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Re: June listings on History Channel
From:	"christyacb" <bryanta003@hawaii.rr.com>
Date:	Wed, 04 Jun 2003 05:57:18 -0000

Salvete

Argh! Why don't I get History International way over here!? Anyone
going to tape it?

Valete,
Christy aka Still Nemo


--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, lanius117@a... wrote:
> Salvete omnes,
>
> Here are a few programs that you may want to view the first half of
June:
>
> June 5 11:00 pm EDST
> World Conflict. Foot Soldier: The Romans. Host Richard Karn looks
at the
> Roman legionnaires, who conquered and dominated most of the known
world for 500
> years, and left behind a legacy of language, culture, architecture,
and
> government.
>
> June 8 8:00 pm EDST
> Almanac. The Great Empire: Rome: The Republic of Rome. A sweeping
chronicle
> of one of history's most dynamic empires. Part 1 features the
city's founding
> by Romulus and Remus; overthrow of the Etruscan monarchy; and the
republic's
> formation and ultimate undoing with the rise of imperial Rome. Host
Joe Mantegna
> introduces Rome's great faces - Pompey, Cicero, Caesar, Antony, and
> Cleopatra.
>
> June 8 9:00 pm EDST
> Almanac. The Great Empire: Rome: Age of Emperors. After Caesar's
murder, his
> great-nephew Augustus was victorious in the civil wars that
followed, becoming
> the first emperor. Host Joe Mantegna explores this sensational
scandalous age
> when palace plots, hostile takeovers, and imperial family intrigues
were
> humdrum. Features Augustus, Caligula, Claudius, and Nero, among
others.
>
> June 8 10:00 pm EDST
> Almanac. The Great Empire: Rome: Building an Empire. Host Joe
Mantegna visits
> the vast territories conquered by the imperial army - by the 2nd
century AD,
> the empire spanned three continents. The over 4,000 Roman cities
were cultural
> melting pots, where diverse customs and beliefs blended. Features
life in
> Pompeii, the flamboyant emperor Hadrian, and religious revolts in
Judea.
>
> June 8 11:00 pm EDST
> Almanac. The Great Empire: Rome: The Enduring Legacy. The final
episode
> reveals the birth of Christianity and how this religion that the
emperors initially
> tried to destroy ultimately passed on the empire's legacy.
Highlights
> include: the crucifixion of Jesus; religious persecutions; rise of
Constantine, the
> first emperor to embrace Christianity; and Justinian, Rome's last
emperor.
>
> June 12 11:00 pm EDST
> World Conflict. Foot Soldier: The Greeks. Story of the brave Greek
warriors,
> who adorned themselves in gold, fought under Alexander the Great,
and became a
> virtually unstoppable ancient war machine. Host: Richard Karn.
>
>
> Valete,
>
> G. Lanius Falco
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Re: The noblest Roman?
From:	"deciusiunius" <bcatfd@together.net>
Date:	Wed, 04 Jun 2003 06:19:22 -0000

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, Craig Stevenson <gaiussentius@y...>
wrote:
> Salve,

Salve,

> In my opinion, Brutus was not the noblest Roman of
> them all. If he was, he wouldn't have engaged in
> money-lending practices and done what he did to
> enforce collection of his debts. His "murder", and I
> emphasise the word murder, was based on outdated
> ideals and probably was based more on personal reasons
> than actual ideological leanings.

Certainly the ancients considered him one of the most noble Romans
for killing Caesar. Plutarch naturally was laudatory about Brutus.

Whatever failings he might have had, and much of his personal
character is lost in the "myth of Brutus," his part alone in killing
Caesar makes him noble if only for the inspiration he gave to others
throughout the centuries. It's hard to deny Caesar had it coming.

One person recently said it wasn't noble to kill the man who spared
you. If a dangerous snake fails to strike and you later cut off its
head when the chance arises, is that ignoble?

In your last sentence you try to have it both ways. You say Brutus'
part in killing Caesar was based on outdated ideals (I assume you
mean republican ideals) but then say it was based more on personal
reasons. Which is it?

Vale,

Decius Iunius Palladius

Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Re: The noblest Roman?
From:	"Quintus Lanius Paulinus (Michael Kelly)" <mjk@datanet.ab.ca>
Date:	Wed, 04 Jun 2003 13:29:27 -0000

> Whatever failings he might have had, and much of his personal
> character is lost in the "myth of Brutus," his part alone in
killing
> Caesar makes him noble if only for the inspiration he gave to
others
> throughout the centuries. It's hard to deny Caesar had it coming.
>
> One person recently said it wasn't noble to kill the man who spared
> you. If a dangerous snake fails to strike and you later cut off its
> head when the chance arises, is that ignoble?
>
> In your last sentence you try to have it both ways. You say Brutus'
> part in killing Caesar was based on outdated ideals (I assume you
> mean republican ideals) but then say it was based more on personal
> reasons. Which is it?
>
>Salve Deci Iuni Palladi,

The problem I have with Brutus' nobility is that he seemed to have
the character of a turn coat. Had he survived the aftermath of
Caesar's assassination, I would never have trusted him had I been a
senator or senior Roman official. Please allow me to use a few
historical examples as an analogy:

Hitler Assassination Plot: Some consider people like General Rommel
and Count Staffenburg real heroes for their attempt on Hitler's life.
I never did because they were quite happy to take in their leader's
trust and reap the benefits of privelage while the Nazi party was
growing and the war went well. It was only after things went to crap
for Hitler's war plans and his temperemental problems that they
jumped ship. Evil though they were, many other Nazi leaders stayed
loyal to the end and one knew exactly how one stood with them. In
other words I see the motives of those in this plot opportunistic,
not moral.

Afrikaaners And British Attitudes: I remember taking a course in
South African history years ago. We had a discussion forum where I
met quite a few blacks and coloreds from that country. I explained to
them that I amongst the white South Africans, the English seemed to
be more progressive and concillitory in their attitudes towards the
blacks. Well their spokesman laughed and said, yep, thats what they
would tell you. He then went on to say that in reality, they much
preferred to deal with the Afrikaan leadership. He said that the
English would huff, puff and waiver, say many things and to nothing
on the race issues. Though the blacks and coloreds detested the
system, they preferred to face and deal with the Afrikaans who
said, "we will tolerate no equality between black, colored and
white!" They are our enemy but at least their perfectly clear in
their attitudes and policies towards us and we know how we stand.

I tend to put Brutus into these categories. A snake or predator
hasn't our brain development and when they attack they have nothing
against us personally. We're just something in the way or a food
source. They are incapable of showing mercy or reason as Caesar did
when he spared the life of Brutus, his greatest mistake of his career.


Regards,

Quintus Lanius Paulinus

Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Re: The noblest Roman? part two
From:	"Arnamentia Moravia Aurelia" <arnamentia_aurelia@yahoo.com>
Date:	Wed, 04 Jun 2003 16:47:14 -0000

Salve,

I'm curious, does anyone have a suggestion for a woman who would
deserve the title of the Noblest Roman?

Arnamentia Moravia


--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Quintus Lanius Paulinus (Michael
Kelly)" <mjk@d...> wrote:
> > Whatever failings he might have had, and much of his personal
> > character is lost in the "myth of Brutus," his part alone in
> killing
> > Caesar makes him noble if only for the inspiration he gave to
> others
> > throughout the centuries. It's hard to deny Caesar had it coming.
> >
> > One person recently said it wasn't noble to kill the man who
spared
> > you. If a dangerous snake fails to strike and you later cut off
its
> > head when the chance arises, is that ignoble?
> >
> > In your last sentence you try to have it both ways. You say
Brutus'
> > part in killing Caesar was based on outdated ideals (I assume you
> > mean republican ideals) but then say it was based more on
personal
> > reasons. Which is it?
> >
> >Salve Deci Iuni Palladi,
>
> The problem I have with Brutus' nobility is that he seemed to have
> the character of a turn coat. Had he survived the aftermath of
> Caesar's assassination, I would never have trusted him had I been a
> senator or senior Roman official. Please allow me to use a few
> historical examples as an analogy:
>
> Hitler Assassination Plot: Some consider people like General Rommel
> and Count Staffenburg real heroes for their attempt on Hitler's
life.
> I never did because they were quite happy to take in their leader's
> trust and reap the benefits of privelage while the Nazi party was
> growing and the war went well. It was only after things went to
crap
> for Hitler's war plans and his temperemental problems that they
> jumped ship. Evil though they were, many other Nazi leaders stayed
> loyal to the end and one knew exactly how one stood with them. In
> other words I see the motives of those in this plot opportunistic,
> not moral.
>
> Afrikaaners And British Attitudes: I remember taking a course in
> South African history years ago. We had a discussion forum where I
> met quite a few blacks and coloreds from that country. I explained
to
> them that I amongst the white South Africans, the English seemed to
> be more progressive and concillitory in their attitudes towards the
> blacks. Well their spokesman laughed and said, yep, thats what they
> would tell you. He then went on to say that in reality, they much
> preferred to deal with the Afrikaan leadership. He said that the
> English would huff, puff and waiver, say many things and to nothing
> on the race issues. Though the blacks and coloreds detested the
> system, they preferred to face and deal with the Afrikaans who
> said, "we will tolerate no equality between black, colored and
> white!" They are our enemy but at least their perfectly clear in
> their attitudes and policies towards us and we know how we stand.
>
> I tend to put Brutus into these categories. A snake or predator
> hasn't our brain development and when they attack they have nothing
> against us personally. We're just something in the way or a food
> source. They are incapable of showing mercy or reason as Caesar did
> when he spared the life of Brutus, his greatest mistake of his
career.
>
>
> Regards,
>
> Quintus Lanius Paulinus

Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: The noblest Roman? part two
From:	Gnaeus Equitius Marinus <gawne@cesmail.net>
Date:	Wed, 4 Jun 2003 12:53:49 -0400

Arnamentia Moravia Aurelia <arnamentia_aurelia@yahoo.com> writes:

> I'm curious, does anyone have a suggestion for a woman who would
> deserve the title of the Noblest Roman?

Cornelia, mother of the Grachii.

-- Marinus

Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Re: The noblest Roman? part two
From:	"Arnamentia Moravia Aurelia" <arnamentia_aurelia@yahoo.com>
Date:	Wed, 04 Jun 2003 17:17:46 -0000

I was thinking of Cloelia. This is from
http://dominae.fws1.com/paradigm/Index.html :

After the overthrow of the last Tarquin king, his ally Lars Porsenna,
king of Clusium, attempted his restoration and warred on Rome
(traditionally, 506 BC). During a truce, Porsenna took a group of
young Roman men and maidens as hostages. Cloelia, one of the female
hostages, escaped from the king's custody and led several other
female hostages to freedom by swimming the Tiber on her horse under a
hail of enemy spears. When the Clusian king protested that the truce
had been violated and threatened to renew hostilities, Cloelia
dutifully agreed to return to him as a hostage to preserve the peace.
Porsenna's admiration for her courage was so extreme that he
permitted her to choose further hostages and return safely to Rome.
Cloelia, realizing how desperately Rome needed its warriors, chose a
group of young men rather than her female companions. An equestrian
statue of the heroine was set up in Republican days at the top of the
Via Sacra, the first such honor ever accorded to a woman: she was to
be honored alike for her courage in escaping, her duty in returning
to the king when peace required it, and her pragmatic patriotism in
choosing to liberate young Roman soldiers rather than her own
friends.

Arnamentia

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, Gnaeus Equitius Marinus
<gawne@c...> wrote:
> Arnamentia Moravia Aurelia <arnamentia_aurelia@y...> writes:
>
> > I'm curious, does anyone have a suggestion for a woman who would
> > deserve the title of the Noblest Roman?
>
> Cornelia, mother of the Grachii.
>
> -- Marinus

Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: The noblest Roman? part two
From:	"Stephen Gallagher" <spqr753@msn.com>
Date:	Wed, 4 Jun 2003 14:23:41 -0400

Salve Arnamentia Moravia

"I'm curious, does anyone have a suggestion for a woman who would
deserve the title of the Noblest Roman? "


The Daughter of Scipio Africanus or the Mother of the Gracchi!!


No wait they are one and the same



Vale

Tiberius Galerius Paulinus


----- Original Message -----
From: "Arnamentia Moravia Aurelia" <arnamentia_aurelia@yahoo.com>
To: <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, June 04, 2003 12:47 PM
Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: The noblest Roman? part two


>
> Salve,
>
> I'm curious, does anyone have a suggestion for a woman who would
> deserve the title of the Noblest Roman?
>
> Arnamentia Moravia
>
>
> --- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Quintus Lanius Paulinus (Michael
> Kelly)" <mjk@d...> wrote:
> > > Whatever failings he might have had, and much of his personal
> > > character is lost in the "myth of Brutus," his part alone in
> > killing
> > > Caesar makes him noble if only for the inspiration he gave to
> > others
> > > throughout the centuries. It's hard to deny Caesar had it coming.
> > >
> > > One person recently said it wasn't noble to kill the man who
> spared
> > > you. If a dangerous snake fails to strike and you later cut off
> its
> > > head when the chance arises, is that ignoble?
> > >
> > > In your last sentence you try to have it both ways. You say
> Brutus'
> > > part in killing Caesar was based on outdated ideals (I assume you
> > > mean republican ideals) but then say it was based more on
> personal
> > > reasons. Which is it?
> > >
> > >Salve Deci Iuni Palladi,
> >
> > The problem I have with Brutus' nobility is that he seemed to have
> > the character of a turn coat. Had he survived the aftermath of
> > Caesar's assassination, I would never have trusted him had I been a
> > senator or senior Roman official. Please allow me to use a few
> > historical examples as an analogy:
> >
> > Hitler Assassination Plot: Some consider people like General Rommel
> > and Count Staffenburg real heroes for their attempt on Hitler's
> life.
> > I never did because they were quite happy to take in their leader's
> > trust and reap the benefits of privelage while the Nazi party was
> > growing and the war went well. It was only after things went to
> crap
> > for Hitler's war plans and his temperemental problems that they
> > jumped ship. Evil though they were, many other Nazi leaders stayed
> > loyal to the end and one knew exactly how one stood with them. In
> > other words I see the motives of those in this plot opportunistic,
> > not moral.
> >
> > Afrikaaners And British Attitudes: I remember taking a course in
> > South African history years ago. We had a discussion forum where I
> > met quite a few blacks and coloreds from that country. I explained
> to
> > them that I amongst the white South Africans, the English seemed to
> > be more progressive and concillitory in their attitudes towards the
> > blacks. Well their spokesman laughed and said, yep, thats what they
> > would tell you. He then went on to say that in reality, they much
> > preferred to deal with the Afrikaan leadership. He said that the
> > English would huff, puff and waiver, say many things and to nothing
> > on the race issues. Though the blacks and coloreds detested the
> > system, they preferred to face and deal with the Afrikaans who
> > said, "we will tolerate no equality between black, colored and
> > white!" They are our enemy but at least their perfectly clear in
> > their attitudes and policies towards us and we know how we stand.
> >
> > I tend to put Brutus into these categories. A snake or predator
> > hasn't our brain development and when they attack they have nothing
> > against us personally. We're just something in the way or a food
> > source. They are incapable of showing mercy or reason as Caesar did
> > when he spared the life of Brutus, his greatest mistake of his
> career.
> >
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> > Quintus Lanius Paulinus
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> Nova-Roma-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>

Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: The noblest Roman? part two
From:	Bill Gawne <gawne@cesmail.net>
Date:	Wed, 4 Jun 2003 15:10:44 -0400

Arnamentia Moravia Aurelia <arnamentia_aurelia@yahoo.com> writes:

[with respect to who might be the noblest Roman woman of them all]

> I was thinking of Cloelia. This is from
> http://dominae.fws1.com/paradigm/Index.html :

[snip amazing story of a courageous and resourceful young woman]

Indeed a worthy candidate for the title. I think that it's always
difficult to identify any *one* person who would clearly stand out
above all others in these things.

But, to make my case for Cornelia and why I think she's deserving
of the title "noblest" among Roman women...

Nobility, in the Roman sense, had to do with community leadership.
A family became ennobled when one of its members became consul.
The very essence of nobility lay in having others look to you for
advice and counsel. I think that in this, Cornelia clearly
excelled.

For a nice coverage (once you disable the infernal blinking) see

http://www.barca.fsnet.co.uk/cornelia-africanus.htm

Quoting from the very end of this page:

"Seneca, a Stoic philosopher of the first century CE, writes that she is an
example of a woman who deserves to be ranked among the greatest of men and a
statue was dedicated to her, bringing her closer to official status than any
other woman. Unlike many other famous Roman women of antiquity, Cornelia was a
major figure in her own right. She remains a paragon of virtue for the Roman
people and a model of wife and mother of her time."

Of course, I expect that were she somehow able to communicate with us
today, Cornelia herself would demonstrate her nobility by endorsing
Arnamentia's claim for Cloelia, and would assure us all that she had
only done what any proper Roman matron ought to have done. She did,
after all, live by the Virtues.

-- Marinus

Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Re: The noblest Roman? part two (ladies list)
From:	"Quintus Lanius Paulinus (Michael Kelly)" <mjk@datanet.ab.ca>
Date:	Wed, 04 Jun 2003 19:13:26 -0000

Salvete again omnes,

Here is a website on feminae Romanae, Roman women. It will put
everything in a nutshell for our conversation. Look through it and
we'll see what we think.

http://dominae.fws1.com/Introduction/Index.html

Regards,

Quintus Lanius Paulinus

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Stephen Gallagher" <spqr753@m...>
wrote:
> Salve Arnamentia Moravia
>
> "I'm curious, does anyone have a suggestion for a woman who would
> deserve the title of the Noblest Roman? "
>
>
> The Daughter of Scipio Africanus or the Mother of the Gracchi!!
>
>
> No wait they are one and the same
>
>
>
> Vale
>
> Tiberius Galerius Paulinus
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Arnamentia Moravia Aurelia" <arnamentia_aurelia@y...>
> To: <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, June 04, 2003 12:47 PM
> Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: The noblest Roman? part two
>
>
> >
> > Salve,
> >
> > I'm curious, does anyone have a suggestion for a woman who would
> > deserve the title of the Noblest Roman?
> >
> > Arnamentia Moravia
> >
> >
> > --- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Quintus Lanius Paulinus
(Michael
> > Kelly)" <mjk@d...> wrote:
> > > > Whatever failings he might have had, and much of his personal
> > > > character is lost in the "myth of Brutus," his part alone in
> > > killing
> > > > Caesar makes him noble if only for the inspiration he gave to
> > > others
> > > > throughout the centuries. It's hard to deny Caesar had it
coming.
> > > >
> > > > One person recently said it wasn't noble to kill the man who
> > spared
> > > > you. If a dangerous snake fails to strike and you later cut
off
> > its
> > > > head when the chance arises, is that ignoble?
> > > >
> > > > In your last sentence you try to have it both ways. You say
> > Brutus'
> > > > part in killing Caesar was based on outdated ideals (I assume
you
> > > > mean republican ideals) but then say it was based more on
> > personal
> > > > reasons. Which is it?
> > > >
> > > >Salve Deci Iuni Palladi,
> > >
> > > The problem I have with Brutus' nobility is that he seemed to
have
> > > the character of a turn coat. Had he survived the aftermath of
> > > Caesar's assassination, I would never have trusted him had I
been a
> > > senator or senior Roman official. Please allow me to use a few
> > > historical examples as an analogy:
> > >
> > > Hitler Assassination Plot: Some consider people like General
Rommel
> > > and Count Staffenburg real heroes for their attempt on Hitler's
> > life.
> > > I never did because they were quite happy to take in their
leader's
> > > trust and reap the benefits of privelage while the Nazi party
was
> > > growing and the war went well. It was only after things went to
> > crap
> > > for Hitler's war plans and his temperemental problems that they
> > > jumped ship. Evil though they were, many other Nazi leaders
stayed
> > > loyal to the end and one knew exactly how one stood with them.
In
> > > other words I see the motives of those in this plot
opportunistic,
> > > not moral.
> > >
> > > Afrikaaners And British Attitudes: I remember taking a course in
> > > South African history years ago. We had a discussion forum
where I
> > > met quite a few blacks and coloreds from that country. I
explained
> > to
> > > them that I amongst the white South Africans, the English
seemed to
> > > be more progressive and concillitory in their attitudes towards
the
> > > blacks. Well their spokesman laughed and said, yep, thats what
they
> > > would tell you. He then went on to say that in reality, they
much
> > > preferred to deal with the Afrikaan leadership. He said that the
> > > English would huff, puff and waiver, say many things and to
nothing
> > > on the race issues. Though the blacks and coloreds detested the
> > > system, they preferred to face and deal with the Afrikaans who
> > > said, "we will tolerate no equality between black, colored and
> > > white!" They are our enemy but at least their perfectly clear in
> > > their attitudes and policies towards us and we know how we
stand.
> > >
> > > I tend to put Brutus into these categories. A snake or predator
> > > hasn't our brain development and when they attack they have
nothing
> > > against us personally. We're just something in the way or a food
> > > source. They are incapable of showing mercy or reason as Caesar
did
> > > when he spared the life of Brutus, his greatest mistake of his
> > career.
> > >
> > >
> > > Regards,
> > >
> > > Quintus Lanius Paulinus
> >
> >
> >
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Whoops! Sorry Arnementia
From:	"Quintus Lanius Paulinus (Michael Kelly)" <mjk@datanet.ab.ca>
Date:	Wed, 04 Jun 2003 19:17:59 -0000

Sorry Arnementia,

I screwed up. You posted that list already. I'm brewing some fresh
coffee to wake myself up.

Regards,

Quintus

Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Re: The noblest Roman? part two
From:	"Arnamentia Moravia Aurelia" <arnamentia_aurelia@yahoo.com>
Date:	Wed, 04 Jun 2003 19:36:00 -0000

Gratias Marinus, what a wonderful biography. I especially respect her
reverence for education:

"She was praised for her devotion to her household and the education
of her children. Cicero details how carefully she sought out the
finest Greek tutors, such as the famous rhetorician Diophanes of
Mytilene and the Stoic Blossius of Cumae. He further states that her
children were nourished more by her conversation than her breast."

> Cornelia herself would demonstrate her nobility by endorsing
> Arnamentia's claim for Cloelia, and would assure us all that she had
> only done what any proper Roman matron ought to have done. She did,
> after all, live by the Virtues.

I do believe she would!
Arnamentia